Week 7 Vs. Eagles

[CharVike]

I wouldn't say the defense sucked. The Eagles had one drive the first half otherwise our D shut them down. They held that team to 40 yards rushing. Our pass rush was bad. No secondary will hold up to that. Hurts was allowed to step into those deep throws. Letting Metellus try and cover A J Brown was a head sratcher. Don't we have any deep help from the safeties. The 79 yard bomb I think I saw safety Jackson moving towards the LOS as the WR raced downfield. I think having a weak pass rush was the biggest issue on D. Make Hurts move.

The Eagles offense was awful statistically up until this game, struggling to run the football and just move the ball in general. They were 30th in yards per drive before that game, averaging 25 yards per drive, and against us they averaged over 40 yards which would be the best in the NFL. I believe they were also at least in the top 5 in yards per play that game, averaging 7.4 yards every time they snapped the ball. Our D was hideous against the Eagles and Flores got owned yet again by them.

You bring up good points how bad the Eagles were all year on O. They didn't stamped us into the ground the 1st half. We gave up the first long drive and then shut the door. Our O did nothing but give them 7 points. I realize there are 2 half's but how long can a D hold up? The Eagles aren't some garbage team. They can play ball with the best of them. They have been bad all year and still had a good record. They find ways to win. Their O put up 21 points. Yes they fooled Flores with the deep ball. Still 21 points against the defending SB champion isn't horrible. If I'm giving blame our O would get about 70% of it.

[psjordan]

This game pretty much sums up what it’s like to be a Vikings fan. Ultimate frustration.

There are a lot of reactions to be had, and depending on your amount of frustration you might go off the ledge in several directions. I certainly have since the game ended. So in the big scheme, here are my second and third thoughts:

Frustratingly, we still don't know what McCarthy is, other than injury-prone. Sure he's sucked a bit out there, but he's about two games into his career. However, his inability to stay on the game and practice fields may be enough to cross him off the "let's just be patient here" list. His health has forced the waste of about 18 months of on-field development time. His prospects are slimmer and slimmer, but not yet zero.

I've been railing against BFlo's "bend and then break" scheme forever. Let this guy go, we can't afford such a high risk approach to defense. Not with the way Kwesi drafts.

Don't like the way Jets seems to disappear at crucial times in the "important" games. This team cannot afford its best player playing anything but lights out, all the time. Sorry man, your talent and paycheck demand it. Not sure what to make of his performances.

Addison is doing what he can - is it just me or does he produce in the spotlight more often than Jets? Get your act together off the field though man. Geez.

Hock is another conundrum. I have no idea what to make of his performances.

Wright is either the undisputed Pro-Bowl punter or a decent HS punter on any given gameday. Would love some freaking consistency from this guy.

Reichard produces, pretty much as he should. No squirmies when I see him have to go in for a 59 yarder that two plays ago was going to be a 39 yarder.

The OL I can't really chide. This wounded brigade is probably doing best it can.

Turner is quickly reaching "disaster" status for me. A complete non-factor for 95% of entire games. Again I will point out he is almost exactly size/weight of Micah Parsons. Turner just does not have it. Depressing. At this rate there is no way in creation we fifth-year option him.

KOC may be a QB whisperer, but he's slog for creative gameplans. Or even creative plays. Does no one in this organization compile, review and reverse engineer creative offensive plays from around the league? I'm not talking about wild willy nilly yell at the sidelines like Mahomes stuff, just creative misdirection. Sure you may not be able to put new stuff in the current playbook, but how about every offseason? Seems ridiculous to me for a several billion dollar company to seemingly not have this capability. Or if they do, they are slog at using it.

Is it a rule we have to run every play clock down to 6-7 seconds before we are lined up on the LOS? Or just a guideline? Seriously, after 57 games as head coach, I can't believe KOC is still effing around getting the plays in. Almost incredulous. And I cannot remember the last KOC game where I said "boy we were ready to play THIS game" after 10 minutes of game time. It is literally always "I can't believe we're not ready to play, AGAIN".

TL/DR: This team is on a fast train to mediocrity - and they have just enough talent to pull off a run of wins, maybe be one-and-done in the playoffs and screw us for an early draft pick. Again. Not that Kwesi would have a clue how to use a top-5 pick.

[VikingLord]

Yes they fooled Flores with the deep ball.

I don't think they fooled anyone with the deep ball. I just think they were unable to get to Hurts and that allowed his receivers time to get open downfield. The Vikings DBs were not defending the deep options.

While it is easy to blame Flores' scheme, I think the bigger problem was the failure to get pressure on Hurts. Part of the credit for that has to go to Hurts himself. He didn't panic and he kept his eyes downfield. He played very confidently and he was decisive and accurate when he threw it. Wentz, by contrast, was not.

It is frustrating to watch balls go over the top where the receiver is able to catch it in stride and there is no DB near enough to even contest the catch, but in my view it is more frustrating to watch the defensive line simply fail to force the QB's hand or even make him uncomfortable. That gave the plays time to develop and Hurts made them pay each time they failed to get home.Greenard was ineffective. Turner was ineffective. They didn't get pressure from the interior DL or LBs. That's a recipe for disaster when play a QB who keeps his cool and is accurate down the field.

[psjordan]

While it is easy to blame Flores' scheme, I think the bigger problem was the failure to get pressure on Hurts.

Actually recognizing that we are not getting pressure on the QB - and changing your defensive approach - is part of the "scheme". Or not a part of it, in BFlo's case.

If rushing 5 or 6 is not working pretty much all game long, well, changes should be made. If you don't have the players, or your players don't have it that day, you as DC must change your calls. BFlo runs a high risk D almost all of the time.

I also don't really blame the DB's in most of those cases. In fact, Isaiah Rodgers was about 2-3" from knocking that last long pass down and giving us another shot on O.

[CharVike]

Bottom 5 PFF grades on offense (min. 20 snaps)
1. Wentz — 45.9
2. Brandel — 51.1
3. Jackson — 53.1
4. Fries — 55.3
5. Hockenson — 56.5

Wentz had quite the rough day despite ending up with 341 total yards. His mistakes and inaccuracy hurt the Vikings numerous times. Brandel, the lone backup on the Vikings' offensive line, also had a poor day, which included a snap over Wentz's head and six pressures allowed, including a sack. It doesn't feel crazy to say the Vikings probably win that game if Ryan Kelly was out there.
Our new guards were graded below average. Jackson gets the rookie excuse. Fries can't get an excuse because he was a key FA signing. Hock there is no excuse.

[VikingLord]

Frustratingly, we still don't know what McCarthy is, other than injury-prone. Sure he's sucked a bit out there, but he's about two games into his career. However, his inability to stay on the game and practice fields may be enough to cross him off the "let's just be patient here" list. His health has forced the waste of about 18 months of on-field development time. His prospects are slimmer and slimmer, but not yet zero.

They put all their chips in on McCarthy so if he can't get back on the field and soon that is a huge problem pretty much regardless of how he plays. The mismanagement of the most important position on the team since KOC took over is criminal.

I've been railing against BFlo's "bend and then break" scheme forever. Let this guy go, we can't afford such a high risk approach to defense. Not with the way Kwesi drafts.

I don't think the scheme is the problem. It's the players. Maybe that is a result of drafting, injury, etc., but Ivan Pace didn't play a snap yesterday because he's been freelancing when he's out there. As you noted, Dallas Turner is a non-factor. I'm happy when he attempts to set the edge on run plays to his side of the field and at this point literally expect nothing else from him. I love the interior trio of Rodriguez, Redmond and Ingram-Dawkins. They're just not getting much out of the expensive free agents they signed. Greenard just hasn't been able to do much despite telling everyone more is required. The secondary isn't terrible but there isn't a single special player in the group. Harrison Smith is probably the best DB they have and he's at the very end of his career. Rodgers has been great at times but got badly dusted yesterday.

What I see when I watch the Vikings defense is 11 guys playing as individuals. They don't seem to trust one another. Not sure if that is the coaching or something else.

Don't like the way Jets seems to disappear at crucial times in the "important" games. This team cannot afford its best player playing anything but lights out, all the time. Sorry man, your talent and paycheck demand it. Not sure what to make of his performances.

Addison is doing what he can - is it just me or does he produce in the spotlight more often than Jets? Get your act together off the field though man. Geez.

Hock is another conundrum. I have no idea what to make of his performances.

My only comment here is the QB play has been at best spotty and yesterday was downright awful. Some of the throws Wentz made and some of the throws he didn't attempt (like the out to a wide open CJ Ham on one drive in the redzone) were terrible. The throw to Hockenson in the endzone required TJ to completely lay out to even have a chance at what should have been an easy completion for a TD. There was an early throw to a wide open Addison that had the ball been put on the money is probably a TD the other way (although with Addison's speed, who knows?). I just don't see how we can blame the receivers for anything at this point with the garbage passes that are literally being thrown at them, first by McCarthy and then by Wentz. I really do wonder if giving Brosmer a chance to see if he can throw accurately is warranted at this point.

The OL I can't really chide. This wounded brigade is probably doing best it can.

I thought they took a step back from how their replacements played against a much better overall defensive front when they faced the Browns. The Eagles won the battle at the line of scrimmage more often than not. Maybe KOC should have stuck with the backups...

Turner is quickly reaching "disaster" status for me. A complete non-factor for 95% of entire games. Again I will point out he is almost exactly size/weight of Micah Parsons. Turner just does not have it. Depressing. At this rate there is no way in creation we fifth-year option him.

Turner doesn't impact games. We're lucky if he sets the edge on outside runs to his side of the field.

TL/DR: This team is on a fast train to mediocrity - and they have just enough talent to pull off a run of wins, maybe be one-and-done in the playoffs and screw us for an early draft pick. Again. Not that Kwesi would have a clue how to use a top-5 pick.

I don't think this is a playoff team, not with how the rest of the NFC North is performing. The Vikings were very fortunate to get the win against the Bears, but I don't see this team beating either the Packers or the Lions and at this point the Bears look like they may have turned the corner. They're also heading into the meat of their schedule despite there being questions about how good those opponents really are at this point. I could easily see them lose their next 3 games though if they can't get better play out of their QB.

[psjordan]

They put all their chips in on McCarthy so if he can't get back on the field and soon that is a huge problem pretty much regardless of how he plays. The mismanagement of the most important position on the team since KOC took over is criminal.

Have to say it's killing me inside seeing all the other 2nd/3rd year QB's killing it out there, for the most part. Maybe we have the next Justin Fields on our hands.

As you noted, Dallas Turner is a non-factor. I'm happy when he attempts to set the edge on run plays to his side of the field and at this point literally expect nothing else from him.

This made me LOL.

[CharVike]

Yes they fooled Flores with the deep ball.

I don't think they fooled anyone with the deep ball. I just think they were unable to get to Hurts and that allowed his receivers time to get open downfield. The Vikings DBs were not defending the deep options.

While it is easy to blame Flores' scheme, I think the bigger problem was the failure to get pressure on Hurts. Part of the credit for that has to go to Hurts himself. He didn't panic and he kept his eyes downfield. He played very confidently and he was decisive and accurate when he threw it. Wentz, by contrast, was not.

It is frustrating to watch balls go over the top where the receiver is able to catch it in stride and there is no DB near enough to even contest the catch, but in my view it is more frustrating to watch the defensive line simply fail to force the QB's hand or even make him uncomfortable. That gave the plays time to develop and Hurts made them pay each time they failed to get home.Greenard was ineffective. Turner was ineffective. They didn't get pressure from the interior DL or LBs. That's a recipe for disaster when play a QB who keeps his cool and is accurate down the field.

That sums it up. I'll give Hurts a ton of credit. The guy threw the ball very well. When a QB gets on a roll sometimes they can't be stopped. In the end our D gave up 21 points. I thought the Eagles would score more. They have been in a slump so eventually they will break out. I'll give their OL credit for pass protection.

[CharVike]

One of Wentz's bonehead plays and I laughed at the announcers response was after his 2nd interception. He said it's ok to do an arm punt but wait until 3rd down. Tell the truth I didn't even realize it was 2nd down myself. But you would think a vet player would and/or the play calling HC.
Another for a chuckle. Saw this on redit. Kevin O'Connell is a QB "whisperer" who is regretting letting go of Sam Darnold. KOC is a QB whisperer, unfortunately Wentz is completely deaf.