Offseason Thread

[makila]

Guess it's time for this one, since we're already talking in multiple threads. : |

Lots of cap space. Let Sam walk unless he wants to come back on a super cheap team friendly deal with the understanding he's likely just the vet backup to a rookie. He can still have value on the right contract for the team. Don't think franchising him is going to make much sense now though. As I don't think anyone's trading for him. I believe they can remove the tag at some point, just not sure how that works.

We have to rebuild a lot of the defense (expiring contracts). Secondary almost completely. IOL has to have attention. I also have concerns about the reliability of Darrisaw now. O'Neill isn't getting younger either.

We have to fix our run game. We don't have to be Bal or Phi, because we won't be with our current HC, however we have to be able to run the ball in known situations, and in the redzone. I think a better IOL would help with this, I think it's a philosophical problem though with how much KOC values pass > run.

Do you guys think we have to look for a DC? I'm questioning how many are really going to come after Flores now. His defense got exposed at the end of the year, for the second season in a row.

Current players under contract (note this includes someone like Gillmore, who's purely a void year):
https://overthecap.com/salary-cap/minnesota-vikings

Our Free Agents and such:
https://overthecap.com/free-agency/minnesota-vikings

[Cliff]

Lots of cap space. Let Sam walk unless he wants to come back on a super cheap team friendly deal with the understanding he's likely just the vet backup to a rookie. He can still have value on the right contract for the team. Don't think franchising him is going to make much sense now though. As I don't think anyone's trading for him. I believe they can remove the tag at some point, just not sure how that works.

If they can bring Darnold back for 15-20m/yr I would be ok with that. If McCarthy can spend another season or even just a half season on the bench that may well be best for his development. I would much prefer the Vikings take the lead from the Packers as far as QB development goes. Plus Darnold took 9th most sacks of any QB this season. Meanwhile McCarthy was injured in limited snaps in the preseason.

I don't think they were ever going to tag Darnold and they definitely won't now.

We have to rebuild a lot of the defense (expiring contracts). Secondary almost completely. IOL has to have attention. I also have concerns about the reliability of Darrisaw now. O'Neill isn't getting younger either.

They're basically forced to rely on Darrisaw like it or not. He's the second highest paid LT in the league and his absence is a major reason the line took a step back. As far as linemen go, he's as close to a "super star" as it gets. They definitely need help on the offensive line though.

We have to fix our run game. We don't have to be Bal or Phi, because we won't be with our current HC, however we have to be able to run the ball in known situations, and in the redzone. I think a better IOL would help with this, I think it's a philosophical problem though with how much KOC values pass > run.

I would love for the Vikings to be able to pick up a good RB in the draft. That said, Aaron Jones has the 9th most rushing yards in the league and 7th most receiving yards among RBs so it's not like he was a bum. Though I do think his age started catching up with him by the end of the season. If they resign him I wouldn't cry about it but he definitely needs another RB paired with him and I think they can do better than Akers there.

Do you guys think we have to look for a DC? I'm questioning how many are really going to come after Flores now. His defense got exposed at the end of the year, for the second season in a row.

I do not think he'll get offered a head coaching job and I'm fine with him remaining the Vikings DC.

Current players under contract (note this includes someone like Gillmore, who's purely a void year):
https://overthecap.com/salary-cap/minnesota-vikings

Our Free Agents and such:
https://overthecap.com/free-agency/minnesota-vikings

They need to keep Murphy but otherwise I'm not particularly concerned. It would be nice for Harrison Smith to take a pay cut and play another season but perhaps not as the starter. Gillmore is 34, Smith is 35, Shaquill Griffin is 29. The starters need to get younger in the secondary.

[halfgiz]

I think I would sooner try and go with JJ and Jones “AKA Danny Dimes” next year.
It will be interesting to see where JJ is at next season as far as QB skills.

I still think some QB needy team could be interested in Sam. He had a great season except against the Rams and Lions.
Definitely need to fix the IOL. It should be fun to see how they go about that.
While we’re on the OL I would like them to try and find a better OL coach. Who has our current OL coach brought along?

Defense is all up in the air till we find out what Flores is doing

[J. Kapp 11]

Guess it's time for this one, since we're already talking in multiple threads. : |

Lots of cap space. Let Sam walk unless he wants to come back on a super cheap team friendly deal with the understanding he's likely just the vet backup to a rookie. He can still have value on the right contract for the team. Don't think franchising him is going to make much sense now though. As I don't think anyone's trading for him. I believe they can remove the tag at some point, just not sure how that works.

We have to rebuild a lot of the defense (expiring contracts). Secondary almost completely. IOL has to have attention. I also have concerns about the reliability of Darrisaw now. O'Neill isn't getting younger either.

We have to fix our run game. We don't have to be Bal or Phi, because we won't be with our current HC, however we have to be able to run the ball in known situations, and in the redzone. I think a better IOL would help with this, I think it's a philosophical problem though with how much KOC values pass > run.

Do you guys think we have to look for a DC? I'm questioning how many are really going to come after Flores now. His defense got exposed at the end of the year, for the second season in a row.

Current players under contract (note this includes someone like Gillmore, who's purely a void year):
https://overthecap.com/salary-cap/minnesota-vikings

Our Free Agents and such:
https://overthecap.com/free-agency/minnesota-vikings

I don’t think our defense got exposed against the Rams. They only scored 2 offensive TDs (one of those after KOC foolishly went for it on fourth down, and Darnold took a bad sack, leaving the Rams only 39 yards to go) and finished with less than 300 yards of total offense. And the Lions were stuck at 17 through 3 quarters before the Vikings offense completely imploded and left the defense on the field for the entire fourth quarter.

The defense punched above its weight all season. Flores is incredibly well respected by football people around the league. The question will be whether owners will let their GMs hire him.

Our cap space is encouraging. So, too, is the fact that the Vikings, as voted on by the players around the league, have the most desirable employment conditions in the NFL. The key will be to spend wisely. I think Kwesi has shown he can do that. Can he draft well? The jury’s out. How Dallas Turner and JJ McCarthy play next season will probably swing the vote either way.

Here’s my early free-agent wish list.
Trey Smith, OG — Don’t know if he’ll want to leave KC, but he’s by far the best available. Go after him. Hard.
DJ Reed, CB — Surely this guy wants out of the Woody Johnson 3-ring circus. Make a hard play for this guy.
Drew Dalman, C — Dude is a mauler. Could we pry him out of the ATL? They’ll be hurting for cap after Kirk disaster.
Brandon Scherff, OG — Surely he wants out of the dumpster fire that is Jacksonville. He’ll be 33 though. Anything in the tank?
Milton Williams, DT — Gonna be tough to pull him from Philly, but 13% pressure rate at DT warrants an effort.

[makila]

Guess it's time for this one, since we're already talking in multiple threads. : |

Lots of cap space. Let Sam walk unless he wants to come back on a super cheap team friendly deal with the understanding he's likely just the vet backup to a rookie. He can still have value on the right contract for the team. Don't think franchising him is going to make much sense now though. As I don't think anyone's trading for him. I believe they can remove the tag at some point, just not sure how that works.

We have to rebuild a lot of the defense (expiring contracts). Secondary almost completely. IOL has to have attention. I also have concerns about the reliability of Darrisaw now. O'Neill isn't getting younger either.

We have to fix our run game. We don't have to be Bal or Phi, because we won't be with our current HC, however we have to be able to run the ball in known situations, and in the redzone. I think a better IOL would help with this, I think it's a philosophical problem though with how much KOC values pass > run.

Do you guys think we have to look for a DC? I'm questioning how many are really going to come after Flores now. His defense got exposed at the end of the year, for the second season in a row.

Current players under contract (note this includes someone like Gillmore, who's purely a void year):
https://overthecap.com/salary-cap/minnesota-vikings

Our Free Agents and such:
https://overthecap.com/free-agency/minnesota-vikings

I don’t think our defense got exposed against the Rams. They only scored 2 offensive TDs (one of those after KOC foolishly went for it on fourth down, and Darnold took a bad sack, leaving the Rams only 39 yards to go) and finished with less than 300 yards of total offense. And the Lions were stuck at 17 through 3 quarters before the Vikings offense completely imploded and left the defense on the field for the entire fourth quarter.

The defense punched above its weight all season. Flores is incredibly well respected by football people around the league. The question will be whether owners will let their GMs hire him.

Our cap space is encouraging. So, too, is the fact that the Vikings, as voted on by the players around the league, have the most desirable employment conditions in the NFL. The key will be to spend wisely. I think Kwesi has shown he can do that. Can he draft well? The jury’s out. How Dallas Turner and JJ McCarthy play next season will probably swing the vote either way.

Here’s my early free-agent wish list.
Trey Smith, OG — Don’t know if he’ll want to leave KC, but he’s by far the best available. Go after him. Hard.
DJ Reed, CB — Surely this guy wants out of the Woody Johnson 3-ring circus. Make a hard play for this guy.
Drew Dalman, C — Dude is a mauler. Could we pry him out of the ATL? They’ll be hurting for cap after Kirk disaster.
Brandon Scherff, OG — Surely he wants out of the dumpster fire that is Jacksonville. He’ll be 33 though. Anything in the tank?
Milton Williams, DT — Gonna be tough to pull him from Philly, but 13% pressure rate at DT warrants an effort.

The big thing I liked about the defense this year, was how well the FA signings fit into the scheme. Showed me that coaching staff and the front office were on the same page with the moves they made. That's encouraging after years of Rick and Zimmer just doing whatever they wanted without communicating well, or at all.

[CharVike]

I don’t think our defense got exposed against the Rams. They only scored 2 offensive TDs (one of those after KOC foolishly went for it on fourth down, and Darnold took a bad sack, leaving the Rams only 39 yards to go) and finished with less than 300 yards of total offense. And the Lions were stuck at 17 through 3 quarters before the Vikings offense completely imploded and left the defense on the field for the entire fourth quarter.

The defense punched above its weight all season. Flores is incredibly well respected by football people around the league. The question will be whether owners will let their GMs hire him.

Our cap space is encouraging. So, too, is the fact that the Vikings, as voted on by the players around the league, have the most desirable employment conditions in the NFL. The key will be to spend wisely. I think Kwesi has shown he can do that. Can he draft well? The jury’s out. How Dallas Turner and JJ McCarthy play next season will probably swing the vote either way.

Here’s my early free-agent wish list.
Trey Smith, OG — Don’t know if he’ll want to leave KC, but he’s by far the best available. Go after him. Hard.
DJ Reed, CB — Surely this guy wants out of the Woody Johnson 3-ring circus. Make a hard play for this guy.
Drew Dalman, C — Dude is a mauler. Could we pry him out of the ATL? They’ll be hurting for cap after Kirk disaster.
Brandon Scherff, OG — Surely he wants out of the dumpster fire that is Jacksonville. He’ll be 33 though. Anything in the tank?
Milton Williams, DT — Gonna be tough to pull him from Philly, but 13% pressure rate at DT warrants an effort.

The big thing I liked about the defense this year, was how well the FA signings fit into the scheme. Showed me that coaching staff and the front office were on the same page with the moves they made. That's encouraging after years of Rick and Zimmer just doing whatever they wanted without communicating well, or at all.

Rick and Zim did communicate well in the beginning. It looked like they were building a team that both were on the same page with. They built the D, ground game and had a game manager, Teddy, as the QB for the long term. If Teddy didn't get hurt perhaps it would have ended differently.

[J. Kapp 11]

The big thing I liked about the defense this year, was how well the FA signings fit into the scheme. Showed me that coaching staff and the front office were on the same page with the moves they made. That's encouraging after years of Rick and Zimmer just doing whatever they wanted without communicating well, or at all.

Rick and Zim did communicate well in the beginning. It looked like they were building a team that both were on the same page with. They built the D, ground game and had a game manager, Teddy, as the QB for the long term. If Teddy didn't get hurt perhaps it would have ended differently.

I wonder, though, what would have happened from a contract standpoint if Teddy hadn’t gotten hurt.

Let’s say Teddy avoids the injury and goes on to have a really good 2016. Let’s say he gets named to the Pro Bowl. Not MVP or All-Pro spectacular, but really good. Now in 2017, he’s going into his fourth year. He can be extended, and he’s gonna want to get paid. But Mike Zimmer, as he so clearly demonstrated, doesn’t like having quarterbacks taking up a big chunk of the cap. Let’s say Teddy ends up getting the same $28 million that Kirk got. What happens to the relationship between Teddy and Zimmer? Does Zimmer lose his sh*t over the contract, like he did with Cousins? Does the defense begin to regress like it did with Cousins? Does anything change from what actually happened? I’m not so sure.

Rick and Zimmer communicated well as long as Rick did exactly what Zimmer wanted, which was to allocate cap to his beloved defense. A leopard never changes his spots, and Zimmer is the quintessential leopard. I believe Zimmer loved Teddy as a person — almost everybody does — but I also believe Zimmer loved Teddy as a QB mainly because he was cheap.

[J. Kapp 11]

I don’t think our defense got exposed against the Rams. They only scored 2 offensive TDs (one of those after KOC foolishly went for it on fourth down, and Darnold took a bad sack, leaving the Rams only 39 yards to go) and finished with less than 300 yards of total offense. And the Lions were stuck at 17 through 3 quarters before the Vikings offense completely imploded and left the defense on the field for the entire fourth quarter.

The defense punched above its weight all season. Flores is incredibly well respected by football people around the league. The question will be whether owners will let their GMs hire him.

Our cap space is encouraging. So, too, is the fact that the Vikings, as voted on by the players around the league, have the most desirable employment conditions in the NFL. The key will be to spend wisely. I think Kwesi has shown he can do that. Can he draft well? The jury’s out. How Dallas Turner and JJ McCarthy play next season will probably swing the vote either way.

Here’s my early free-agent wish list.
Trey Smith, OG — Don’t know if he’ll want to leave KC, but he’s by far the best available. Go after him. Hard.
DJ Reed, CB — Surely this guy wants out of the Woody Johnson 3-ring circus. Make a hard play for this guy.
Drew Dalman, C — Dude is a mauler. Could we pry him out of the ATL? They’ll be hurting for cap after Kirk disaster.
Brandon Scherff, OG — Surely he wants out of the dumpster fire that is Jacksonville. He’ll be 33 though. Anything in the tank?
Milton Williams, DT — Gonna be tough to pull him from Philly, but 13% pressure rate at DT warrants an effort.

The big thing I liked about the defense this year, was how well the FA signings fit into the scheme. Showed me that coaching staff and the front office were on the same page with the moves they made. That's encouraging after years of Rick and Zimmer just doing whatever they wanted without communicating well, or at all.

Great points.

Now let’s hope Kwesi and the coaching staff can repeat that success, only this time with $75 million in cap space to spend. This kind of room on the credit card is what Kwesi has worked toward for the past 3 years. Time to cash in.

[makila]

Good article RE interior offensive line. Includes a mention of the OG that Kapp mentioned. And the point that Cliff, and others have made about the domino effect Darrisaw going out had. I haven't dug into the FA class this year much yet.

Vikings’ collapse vs. Lions, Rams makes need for interior O-line help frustratingly clear
By Alec Lewis
5h ago

EAGAN, Minn. — It’s always wild how quickly an NFL season can end. The train hums for 18 weeks and then screeches to a halt. There is no warning, no alert telling us what’s about to happen. Only the abrupt finality and then the quick shift of the gaze to the future.

This is where the Minnesota Vikings find themselves: marinating in Monday night’s loss and regrouping to prepare for the offseason and opportunities to reshape the team.

The NFL Draft presents one avenue, and Dane Brugler, The Athletic’s draft expert, is already thinking about the options. In his latest mock draft, he projects Iowa running back Kaleb Johnson going to Minnesota with the 24th pick.

Brugler writes that this move makes sense only if the Vikings first fortify the interior of their offensive line in free agency. That’s the correct hierarchy. Before Minnesota considers adding a dynamic running back or even a stalwart defensive tackle, it must fix the three offensive line positions that have plagued the team for years.

“There’s no question,” coach Kevin O’Connell said. “We’ve got to find a way to solidify the interior of the pocket.”

Drafting a guard or center is one option. Alabama’s Tyler Booker could make sense in the first round. However, risk comes with the draft, and the Vikings can no longer afford to take risks with this group. It doesn’t matter if an experienced Sam Darnold is doing the quarterbacking or first-time starter J.J. McCarthy. Space to step up is paramount.

For years, the Vikings have cycled through failed early round picks, converted tackles and everything in between. Many of the names conjure cringes. Remember Joe Berger and Nick Easton? How about Josh Kline and Pat Elflein? Dakota Dozier, Mike Remmers, Oli Udoh, Tom Compton, Alex Boone, Brandon Fusco — the list goes on and on.

The 2024 team began the season with a starting trio of left guard Blake Brandel, center Garrett Bradbury and right guard Ed Ingram. By November, even after the Vikings had replaced Ingram with Dalton Risner, the lack of meaningful growth spurred this story: “Vikings’ middling run game makes it abundantly clear — they need help on the interior OL.”

To be clear, this was apparent even before the season. The Vikings coaches spoke of their faith in Brandel and Ingram, but what other choice did they have? Minnesota had only so much salary-cap space, having absorbed the dead cap hits after the departures of Kirk Cousins and Danielle Hunter. Using the available capital on interior offensive linemen would have meant holes that would need filling on the defensive side.

If the Vikings spent heavily on a guard or center, they likely would have had to do without edge rusher Jonathan Greenard, edge rusher Andrew Van Ginkel, linebacker Blake Cashman and cornerback Stephon Gilmore. Without those four, how many games would the Vikings have won? The Vikings also believed tackles Christian Darrisaw and Brian O’Neill could cover up for some of the interior pressure. That’s mostly what happened until Darrisaw tore his ACL in Week 8.

Acquiring Cam Robinson from the Jacksonville Jaguars provided the Vikings with a path forward, and even that vision mostly held over the back half of the season. Between weeks 10 and 17, Darnold maneuvered the pocket effectively and often overcame the muddiness.

Against the Detroit Lions in Week 18 and the Los Angeles Rams in the wild-card round, however, stunts and atypical blitzes caved in on Darnold. He often tried to sidestep and wiggle his way out the same way he had during his successful stretch, but it was like an action movie in that just when he thought he had uncovered an escape hatch, another blockade surfaced. Darnold was constantly under pressure and got sacked twice in Detroit, and he was taken down an astonishing nine times by the Rams in Arizona.

“It wasn’t good enough,” Risner said Monday night. “As men, sometimes you’ve just got to be able to take (the blame). You can’t always make excuses. We’ve got to take this one.”

Against the Rams, neither the early deficit nor the run blocking helped the pass protection’s cause. The Vikings attempted an outside toss on the first play. Risner could not climb to the second level quickly enough, and Rams linebacker Omar Speights took down running back Aaron Jones for a loss. Minnesota tried to begin the next series with an effective run utilizing double-teams to move interior defenders vertically. But Brandel could not create enough push, and Risner tumbled to the grass, leaving Jones little room to work with.

This was not an outlier, either. Minnesota has averaged 4.0 yards per carry over the past three seasons, ranking 29th in the NFL. The Vikings are averaging 1.30 yards before contact on those carries, 24th in the league.

The design of the run game — and whether O’Connell and the Vikings need to reassess their plan in this phase — is a question unto itself. Often, though, personnel dictates what is possible, and it doesn’t help that Minnesota’s receivers (and tight end T.J. Hockenson, for that matter) don’t compare to players like Cooper Kupp or Puka Nacua as blockers. These are ancillary subjects, magnified when the trench performance is as putrid as it was in the Vikings’ final two games.

Fortunately, some enticing free agents are due to hit the market this spring. Kansas City Chiefs right guard Trey Smith is the biggest name. The two-time Super Bowl champion and Pro Bowler checks almost every box: He is still young (25), has a winning pedigree and has been durable. He is destined to receive a top-of-the-market deal (around $21 million a season), and competition for his talent will test the Vikings’ recruiting pitch.

Another intriguing option is Will Fries of the Indianapolis Colts. He fractured his tibia in Week 5 and has endured numerous injuries throughout his four-year career. He will turn 27 in April. His price tag will likely reflect those data points, offering the Vikings a different road map if Smith signs elsewhere. Other less impactful but proven candidates include 25-year-old Mekhi Becton of the Philadelphia Eagles and soon-to-be 35-year-old Kevin Zeitler of the Lions.

At center, Bradbury remains under contract through the 2025 season, but the Vikings could recoup some salary-cap space by cutting him. The Atlanta Falcons’ Drew Dalman, Chicago Bears’ Coleman Shelton and Colts’ Ryan Kelly will be available via free agency if the Vikings go that route.

Of course, the Vikings could always supplement signings with draft picks or reconfigure this group with a combination of both. What’s obvious at this point is the need to do whatever is necessary to plug leaks that have persisted for far too long.

[Cliff]

Rick and Zim did communicate well in the beginning. It looked like they were building a team that both were on the same page with. They built the D, ground game and had a game manager, Teddy, as the QB for the long term. If Teddy didn't get hurt perhaps it would have ended differently.

I wonder, though, what would have happened from a contract standpoint if Teddy hadn’t gotten hurt.

Let’s say Teddy avoids the injury and goes on to have a really good 2016. Let’s say he gets named to the Pro Bowl. Not MVP or All-Pro spectacular, but really good. Now in 2017, he’s going into his fourth year. He can be extended, and he’s gonna want to get paid. But Mike Zimmer, as he so clearly demonstrated, doesn’t like having quarterbacks taking up a big chunk of the cap. Let’s say Teddy ends up getting the same $28 million that Kirk got. What happens to the relationship between Teddy and Zimmer? Does Zimmer lose his sh*t over the contract, like he did with Cousins? Does the defense begin to regress like it did with Cousins? Does anything change from what actually happened? I’m not so sure.

Rick and Zimmer communicated well as long as Rick did exactly what Zimmer wanted, which was to allocate cap to his beloved defense. A leopard never changes his spots, and Zimmer is the quintessential leopard. I believe Zimmer loved Teddy as a person — almost everybody does — but I also believe Zimmer loved Teddy as a QB mainly because he was cheap.

I think it was more than that between Zimmer and Bridgewater. I think he would have paid him because he fit so perfectly into what Zimmer wanted at QB. It certainly helped that he would probably never be a "top paid" type QB.

These are some quotes from the article Mike Zimmer, Teddy Bridgewater and the ‘forever’ bond that endures written in 2020.

“I never thought that I’d have another quarterback throughout my career other than him,” Zimmer said in 2018 and has since repeated multiple times.

It wasn’t just that Bridgewater was the leader of a team trying to defend their NFC North championship, but he had quickly become one of the few players that could draw a smile out of Zimmer on the practice field.

“Mike Zimmer is the biggest Teddy Bridgewater fan I think I’ve ever met in my life,” said Paul Allen, the play-by-play voice of the franchise. “Mike loved Teddy the person, and loved how Teddy played the game, where he’s not gonna kill the game, but he’s probably not gonna explode. But it’s going to let Zim’s defense dictate the tempo. Zim was downtrodden for days after the Teddy situation.”

“I always told him, ‘You and I are going to be together forever. My career is going to go as long as your career goes.’ But it just didn’t work out that way,” Zimmer said that morning in 2018. “I always remembered Teddy as the quarterback who went 11-5 and beat Green Bay up there for the division.”

[CharVike]

I think we all recognize that the IOL needs help. Unfortunately I don't think they will spend much cap on that particular position group. We already have plenty of cap in the OT position so they will try and get by with lesser cao on the interior. If we can draft that would be ideal but so far that hasn't been the case which forced the Risner signing who is a cheaper player. They gave Blake a 3 year cheap deal so he's in for 2 more seasons. Bradbury has another year on his deal and they drafted a guy last year. RG we have nothing signed except Ingram. Perhaps they go after a cheaper player to fill the void or another draft pick or cough cough Ingram after a year sitting. Rebuilding the secondary and getting some DL help will eat the space quickly. If we go after a top level guy then it will need to be an overpay in the auction process. KAM has shown he will overpay when needed. Davenport was the most recent example. Maybe he throws the farm at a G to replace Risner. That will take cap away from the secondary rebuild which isn't very smart.

[CharVike]

Rick and Zim did communicate well in the beginning. It looked like they were building a team that both were on the same page with. They built the D, ground game and had a game manager, Teddy, as the QB for the long term. If Teddy didn't get hurt perhaps it would have ended differently.

I wonder, though, what would have happened from a contract standpoint if Teddy hadn’t gotten hurt.

Let’s say Teddy avoids the injury and goes on to have a really good 2016. Let’s say he gets named to the Pro Bowl. Not MVP or All-Pro spectacular, but really good. Now in 2017, he’s going into his fourth year. He can be extended, and he’s gonna want to get paid. But Mike Zimmer, as he so clearly demonstrated, doesn’t like having quarterbacks taking up a big chunk of the cap. Let’s say Teddy ends up getting the same $28 million that Kirk got. What happens to the relationship between Teddy and Zimmer? Does Zimmer lose his sh*t over the contract, like he did with Cousins? Does the defense begin to regress like it did with Cousins? Does anything change from what actually happened? I’m not so sure.

Rick and Zimmer communicated well as long as Rick did exactly what Zimmer wanted, which was to allocate cap to his beloved defense. A leopard never changes his spots, and Zimmer is the quintessential leopard. I believe Zimmer loved Teddy as a person — almost everybody does — but I also believe Zimmer loved Teddy as a QB mainly because he was cheap.

Good points and read. Unfortunately I have no idea. Rick and Zim were on the same track but it came off the rails very quickly and lead to X number of years of nothing. Many things caused that including draft failures and signings that weren't agreed to. It could happen to this current group if JJM isn't the answer. Who knows if that's the guy both wanted. Perhaps it could have been a take this or nothing deal. I think Maye was KOC choice. But that's my guess.

[Cliff]

I wonder, though, what would have happened from a contract standpoint if Teddy hadn’t gotten hurt.

Let’s say Teddy avoids the injury and goes on to have a really good 2016. Let’s say he gets named to the Pro Bowl. Not MVP or All-Pro spectacular, but really good. Now in 2017, he’s going into his fourth year. He can be extended, and he’s gonna want to get paid. But Mike Zimmer, as he so clearly demonstrated, doesn’t like having quarterbacks taking up a big chunk of the cap. Let’s say Teddy ends up getting the same $28 million that Kirk got. What happens to the relationship between Teddy and Zimmer? Does Zimmer lose his sh*t over the contract, like he did with Cousins? Does the defense begin to regress like it did with Cousins? Does anything change from what actually happened? I’m not so sure.

Rick and Zimmer communicated well as long as Rick did exactly what Zimmer wanted, which was to allocate cap to his beloved defense. A leopard never changes his spots, and Zimmer is the quintessential leopard. I believe Zimmer loved Teddy as a person — almost everybody does — but I also believe Zimmer loved Teddy as a QB mainly because he was cheap.

Good points and read. Unfortunately I have no idea. Rick and Zim were on the same track but it came off the rails very quickly and lead to X number of years of nothing. Many things caused that including draft failures and signings that weren't agreed to. It could happen to this current group if JJM isn't the answer. Who knows if that's the guy both wanted. Perhaps it could have been a take this or nothing deal.

I think picking up Cousins was what caused the rift, period. It was really a boneheaded move by Spielman. I don't think he needed to completely listen to everything Zimmer said, but this caused a problem with the fundamental philosophy of how they had been building the team. Spielman sacrificed the long term to try to capitalize on the 2017 success and win a Superbowl thinking the only real problem was that Keenum was QB. Obviously he was wrong and the team went downhill from there.

[CharVike]

Good points and read. Unfortunately I have no idea. Rick and Zim were on the same track but it came off the rails very quickly and lead to X number of years of nothing. Many things caused that including draft failures and signings that weren't agreed to. It could happen to this current group if JJM isn't the answer. Who knows if that's the guy both wanted. Perhaps it could have been a take this or nothing deal.

I think picking up Cousins was what caused the rift, period. It was really a boneheaded move by Spielman. I don't think he needed to completely listen to everything Zimmer said, but this caused a problem with the fundamental philosophy of how they had been building the team. Spielman sacrificed the long term to try to capitalize on the 2017 success and win a Superbowl thinking the only real problem was that Keenum was QB. Obviously he was wrong and the team went downhill from there.

Didn't they also trade a 1st rounder for some guy who couldn't stay healthy. Zim wanted a team that didn't rely on the passing game. He lived in a long ago era. Play tight and keep it close and win on the last drive. His first playoff game with Teddy was a loss on a last second missed FG. How many times have I've seen that nonsense with Zim.

[Cliff]

I think picking up Cousins was what caused the rift, period. It was really a boneheaded move by Spielman. I don't think he needed to completely listen to everything Zimmer said, but this caused a problem with the fundamental philosophy of how they had been building the team. Spielman sacrificed the long term to try to capitalize on the 2017 success and win a Superbowl thinking the only real problem was that Keenum was QB. Obviously he was wrong and the team went downhill from there.

Didn't they also trade a 1st rounder for some guy who couldn't stay healthy. Zim wanted a team that didn't rely on the passing game. He lived in a long ago era. Play tight and keep it close and win on the last drive. His first playoff game with Teddy was a loss on a last second missed FG. How many times have I've seen that nonsense with Zim.

Don't get me wrong, I'm glad Zim is gone. He hasn't evolved. Though his 2017 team has been the closest to a superbowl since 2009 and from then to now. But if he is your head coach Cousins was a terrible pickup.