2024 NFL Draft

[VikingLord]

We need the next Marino an instant star who could throw any pass in the book and had a lighting quick release. Does that exists within this group of 6? I have no idea but it's highly unlikely.

I don't know if he's an instant star but Penix fits that description in terms of ability to throw any pass with a lightning quick release. I know you're not a fan of Penix, but watch some draft profile reviews of him on Youtube and you can see it.

Among the other top prospects all of them have good arms. None of them really stand out for their arms besides Penix, though. Williams is good at avoiding pressure and going off script. Daniels is electrifying as a runner. Maye is willing to make difficult throws. Nix is great under pressure. McCarthy has the leadership skills you want in a QB who has to have the confidence of his teammates.

Of this group of QB prospects, however, Penix is the guy who's going to rip off the 50 yard, hit-the-receiver-in-stride-down-the-sideline-throw-as-the-defense-is-about-to-get-to-him-with-the-blitz pass. He routinely did just that at Washington and in fact I've heard him criticized for doing it as some reviewers think he just finds single deep coverage and chucks it under pressure. Still, he finds the favorable matchup quickly and does try to hurt the defense for gambling, and it worked a lot of the time because he throws with such velocity and accuracy that his deep receiver usually had a very good chance to make the play. Penix gets criticized a lot for his footwork as well because he'll often throw without setting his feet and some feel it affects his accuracy. I'm not as sold on that. I think the guy is talented enough to play see-it, throw-it. In the split seconds another QB would have to flip his hips and set his feet to have a chance of altering where he wants to throw it, Penix has the ball out and very often on target there. Split seconds add up over the course of a game and are often the difference between an open and closed passing window. With Penix, if the window is open and he sees it he can exploit that opportunity. Consistently.

Not saying the other prospects are terrible at any of this. They often handle similar situations slightly differently or were asked to do other things that didn't put them in as many situations. But if you're looking for a QB who can make a defense pay with his arm, out of this group of prospects I'd put Penix at the top.

[VikingsVictorious]

We need the next Marino an instant star who could throw any pass in the book and had a lighting quick release. Does that exists within this group of 6? I have no idea but it's highly unlikely.

I don't know if he's an instant star but Penix fits that description in terms of ability to throw any pass with a lightning quick release. I know you're not a fan of Penix, but watch some draft profile reviews of him on Youtube and you can see it.

Among the other top prospects all of them have good arms. None of them really stand out for their arms besides Penix, though. Williams is good at avoiding pressure and going off script. Daniels is electrifying as a runner. Maye is willing to make difficult throws. Nix is great under pressure. McCarthy has the leadership skills you want in a QB who has to have the confidence of his teammates.

Of this group of QB prospects, however, Penix is the guy who's going to rip off the 50 yard, hit-the-receiver-in-stride-down-the-sideline-throw-as-the-defense-is-about-to-get-to-him-with-the-blitz pass. He routinely did just that at Washington and in fact I've heard him criticized for doing it as some reviewers think he just finds single deep coverage and chucks it under pressure. Still, he finds the favorable matchup quickly and does try to hurt the defense for gambling, and it worked a lot of the time because he throws with such velocity and accuracy that his deep receiver usually had a very good chance to make the play. Penix gets criticized a lot for his footwork as well because he'll often throw without setting his feet and some feel it affects his accuracy. I'm not as sold on that. I think the guy is talented enough to play see-it, throw-it. In the split seconds another QB would have to flip his hips and set his feet to have a chance of altering where he wants to throw it, Penix has the ball out and very often on target there. Split seconds add up over the course of a game and are often the difference between an open and closed passing window. With Penix, if the window is open and he sees it he can exploit that opportunity. Consistently.

Not saying the other prospects are terrible at any of this. They often handle similar situations slightly differently or were asked to do other things that didn't put them in as many situations. But if you're looking for a QB who can make a defense pay with his arm, out of this group of prospects I'd put Penix at the top.

No question that Penix is the most Marino like of the presumed top 6 QBs. Good call VikingLord.

[CharVike]

I don't know if he's an instant star but Penix fits that description in terms of ability to throw any pass with a lightning quick release. I know you're not a fan of Penix, but watch some draft profile reviews of him on Youtube and you can see it.

Among the other top prospects all of them have good arms. None of them really stand out for their arms besides Penix, though. Williams is good at avoiding pressure and going off script. Daniels is electrifying as a runner. Maye is willing to make difficult throws. Nix is great under pressure. McCarthy has the leadership skills you want in a QB who has to have the confidence of his teammates.

Of this group of QB prospects, however, Penix is the guy who's going to rip off the 50 yard, hit-the-receiver-in-stride-down-the-sideline-throw-as-the-defense-is-about-to-get-to-him-with-the-blitz pass. He routinely did just that at Washington and in fact I've heard him criticized for doing it as some reviewers think he just finds single deep coverage and chucks it under pressure. Still, he finds the favorable matchup quickly and does try to hurt the defense for gambling, and it worked a lot of the time because he throws with such velocity and accuracy that his deep receiver usually had a very good chance to make the play. Penix gets criticized a lot for his footwork as well because he'll often throw without setting his feet and some feel it affects his accuracy. I'm not as sold on that. I think the guy is talented enough to play see-it, throw-it. In the split seconds another QB would have to flip his hips and set his feet to have a chance of altering where he wants to throw it, Penix has the ball out and very often on target there. Split seconds add up over the course of a game and are often the difference between an open and closed passing window. With Penix, if the window is open and he sees it he can exploit that opportunity. Consistently.

Not saying the other prospects are terrible at any of this. They often handle similar situations slightly differently or were asked to do other things that didn't put them in as many situations. But if you're looking for a QB who can make a defense pay with his arm, out of this group of prospects I'd put Penix at the top.

No question that Penix is the most Marino like of the presumed top 6 QBs. Good call VikingLord.

What I was getting at is a guy that can come in play year one like a top level pro as Marino did. For more recent examples CJ Stroud, Brock Purdy. Using a QB as an example threw you two off which I understand how it would. My bad. Penix is probably that guy also because he has a ton of experience compared to the others in this class. But I have no idea how he handle the interviews. That's why I expect him to be the pick if all else was good. He's probably the most ready to plug in is what I was trying to ask. I would assume Bo Nix is next because he played 5 seasons. Plus 2 different schools so he's been through a change which will also help. Penix went through that also. Maybe a change means nothing but it does show the ability to adapt which is required at the next level.

[VikingLord]

No question that Penix is the most Marino like of the presumed top 6 QBs. Good call VikingLord.

What I was getting at is a guy that can come in play year one like a top level pro as Marino did. For more recent examples CJ Stroud, Brock Purdy.

Brock Purdy? I think he was taken with literally the last pick in the draft the year he came out. He was far from an obvious year one starter, much less a guy who could come in year one and perform at a top level.

If anything, Purdy illustrates just how difficult it is to evaluate rookie QBs. Brady is another example.

I think if one thing is clear about rookie QBs, however, it is that if they are going to be top-level QBs as pros, that becomes apparent very quickly. Once they get on the field they produce. The converse also seems to be true - the guys who will struggle tend to struggle right away. It seems to come down to whether the player fundamentally understands how to play the position, can read the field quickly and correctly pre- and post-snap, makes the right decisions and is accurate. If you find a player who has exceptional physical tools to go along with the above traits you have a star QB. If you find a player who has even average physical tools with the above traits you have at least a guy you can win with if the team around him is good enough.

He's probably the most ready to plug in is what I was trying to ask. I would assume Bo Nix is next because he played 5 seasons. Plus 2 different schools so he's been through a change which will also help. Penix went through that also. Maybe a change means nothing but it does show the ability to adapt which is required at the next level.

Nix or Penix have the most experience of this class of QBs as both have 5 college seasons under their respective belts. I believe Penix spent at least some of those years out due to injuries, while I believe Nix has played almost all of that time. And I think it shows in his play as he is generally considered the best at handling pressure and making decisions in the flow of the game. I consider Nix to be the QB equivalent of Justin Jefferson coming out. JJ was not considered exceptional physically, but he was widely regarded as the most pro-ready receiver the year he came out. He clearly understood route trees and ran routes with a level of sophistication that wasn't typical for a rookie WR.

Bo Nix will be similar to that player from this QB class IMHO.

The closer we get to the draft the more I prefer either Nix or Penix of the options at QB, which is ironic given both are generally not considered to be in the same tier as the guys projected to be drafted first. They have different strengths, but their overall experience coupled with what they can bring to the field gives both of them an edge over the other QB prospects as I see it. I think either one of them would make excellent picks for the Vikings and I'll be excited if either one of them ends up in purple next year. I honestly think either one of them will have a good chance of starting Day One and being that rookie QB who makes an immediate impact.

[Angels Wings]

Honestly, I would not be angry if the Vikings took Penix at 11 and filled a need at 23. I would prefer that over trading 3 possible 1sts to trade up for a reach at QB at say, 5. I would stomach it at 3 if Daniels is there, but even then I'd prefer them to trade a later round pick. Kwesi got the extra 1st for a reason, so i expect him to attempt to try and trade up first

[cmoss84]

Odunze at 11 and Penix slides to 23.

[VikingsVictorious]

Odunze at 11 and Penix slides to 23.

Most likely Odunze won't make it to 11 and even if he did I'd rather got an O or D lineman. I don't believe Penix or Nix makes it to 23.

[IIsweet]

So I keep seeing people complain about giving up 3 1st Rd picks... Let's not forget that if that's what it takes to move up, it technically cost us 2 1sts and 2 2nds, not 3 firsts. It is a lot though, but not 3 years of 1st Rd picks.
I can imagine the discussions in the War Room in the TCO Performance Center right now.
How many mock scenarios have they compiled ???

[Cliff]

https://www.nbcsports.com/nfl/profootba ... or-the-guy

“For a couple of years I’ve, you know, I’ve been kind of known as the ‘quarterback killer’ when it comes to the draft in Eagan, because the feeling that everybody that I feel from our fan base is when we get this next guy, he’s gonna be the guy. And I feel it. I know you guys all feel it. So I have had to in a lot of ways fight off some mistakes from being made, mainly because the evaluation process I go through, I think about the things that are fixable.

“I think about the things that are coachable and then you think about the things that you could coach another 15 years with the player, and you might not be able to fix and hope and faith are wonderful things. I do like them to not necessarily be strategies. So I do very much believe in certain principles of playing the quarterback position. I believe the footwork in the lower half of any quarterback can be fixed with the proper coaching and teaching. And I think that when you see the good things on tape, you see things that they can do better on tape. You’re looking for a lot of different things and to check a lot of boxes and ultimately when you feel like you find that guy then you got to hope that 31 other teams are complicit in making sure that they can become a Minnesota Viking, but we only need one team to be complicit and hopefully we find that team and that person’s on it.”

O’Connell then was asked about his connections to his original NFL team, the Patriots, who hold the third overall pick in the 2024 draft.

“You know, I may or may not have sent a nice bouquet of flowers to Robert Kraft the other day,” O’Connell said.

It’s going to take more than flowers to go from No. 11 to No. 3. The Vikings seem to be willing to do it for the right guy.

But here’s the most important takeaway. O’Connell — the quarterback killer — won’t just settle for whoever. He knows who he wants. We’ll find out in five days whether he gets him.

[psjordan]

Just a post about all the banter about this draft class of QB's (here and throughout fan bases), combined with (here) a pretty thorough examination of our "misses" at QB over recent history.

We all want our GM to be able to (with a reasonable sample size, i.e., over a few drafts) pick THE guy for our QB. When you compare that process league-wide, certainly a minority of the GM's actually get that right - and picking the right guy once can make your next five years as a GM.

This year, of the six first-round QB names bandied about, I'm guessing at least two and maybe up to four will be mediocre or busts, no matter where they go (although where they go is certainly important).

Point being, right off the bat our GM (and every GM) has highly diminished odds of getting The Guy.

Somebody somewhere is shouting to the rooftops that Joe Milton will be the best of the bunch. Or Spencer Rattler. Or Michael Pratt. Thing is, they may be right.

We want our GM to be top five at this job, just like we want our HC, QB, etc. to be. None of those guys are top five at their jobs yet, so there is no track record to have unbridled faith it will happen. In order to head in that direction, KAM (and KOC) have to beat pretty good odds with the QB selection this draft. That's a tough nut, odds-wise.

My feeling is that if they give up very high compensation for the guy they think is The Guy, I'll be disappointed. Just because that would be throwing a lot of chips at a low probability situation, which I'm rarely in favor of.

The Vikes first round scenario seems to involve WAY more moving parts than any other teams, so I hope our FO has mocked every scenario under the sun. And we aren't caught ... I can't even type this ... not getting our pick in on time. I could see the Pats saying "yes" to a trade for #3 with 10 seconds left on the clock and ... shudder.

Unfortunately, with all the banter - right up to Daniels supposedly not wanting to go to WAS, we all won't know until the draft unfolds. Lots riding on this one for KAM/KOC.

[cogitator]

The latest draft scuttlebutt I heard today is that Las Vegas has made JJ McCarthy the favorite to go to the Commanders at number 2. (yes,apparently you can bet on the draft too) They said Washington brought in 20 prospective draftees and McCarthy really impressed them. This may not mess up the Vikings plans, but it does mess up my plans for the Vikings (trade up and grab McCarthy at 5 or 6)

[CharVike]

Just a post about all the banter about this draft class of QB's (here and throughout fan bases), combined with (here) a pretty thorough examination of our "misses" at QB over recent history.

We all want our GM to be able to (with a reasonable sample size, i.e., over a few drafts) pick THE guy for our QB. When you compare that process league-wide, certainly a minority of the GM's actually get that right - and picking the right guy once can make your next five years as a GM.

This year, of the six first-round QB names bandied about, I'm guessing at least two and maybe up to four will be mediocre or busts, no matter where they go (although where they go is certainly important).

Point being, right off the bat our GM (and every GM) has highly diminished odds of getting The Guy.

Somebody somewhere is shouting to the rooftops that Joe Milton will be the best of the bunch. Or Spencer Rattler. Or Michael Pratt. Thing is, they may be right.

We want our GM to be top five at this job, just like we want our HC, QB, etc. to be. None of those guys are top five at their jobs yet, so there is no track record to have unbridled faith it will happen. In order to head in that direction, KAM (and KOC) have to beat pretty good odds with the QB selection this draft. That's a tough nut, odds-wise.

My feeling is that if they give up very high compensation for the guy they think is The Guy, I'll be disappointed. Just because that would be throwing a lot of chips at a low probability situation, which I'm rarely in favor of.

The Vikes first round scenario seems to involve WAY more moving parts than any other teams, so I hope our FO has mocked every scenario under the sun. And we aren't caught ... I can't even type this ... not getting our pick in on time. I could see the Pats saying "yes" to a trade for #3 with 10 seconds left on the clock and ... shudder.

Unfortunately, with all the banter - right up to Daniels supposedly not wanting to go to WAS, we all won't know until the draft unfolds. Lots riding on this one for KAM/KOC.

Well picking The Guy means many different things. It's the same as a QB having the It Factor I have no clue what either of those mean. IMO you have players ranked long before the draft starts. You watch guys years before the draft. Teams have local scouts. Right now the only thing we see are the media rankings. Caleb is the best on the planet. How that is possible I don't understand. He had some horrible games and acted like a drama queen. He's only 6'1". That's a short player. I think some teams get carried away with the athletic ability. Penix proved he can jump through the roof. Is that really relevant playing the position he does? I could see catching passes or blocking passes or kicks. Same with speed. That only helps if you can play the sport. The fastest people in the world can't play football so the speed means nothing. Strength is the same. You would think the worlds best at a bench press would destroy people at the LOS. The guy might be scared to face another person in a physical sport. Below is a good one.
Tony Mandarich, at 6'6" and 325 pounds, ran an official 4.65-second 40 time, meaning this beast of a man covered 40 yards faster than future HOF players Emmitt Smith and Jerry Rice at their respective workouts. Our team skipped Hamilton for a nothing pick. That's not setting a good track record. But the 49ers picked Lance No 3 and then Purdy with the last pick. They corrected a whiff. Lance was one of those guys who had one good season. I would never select that early. His game also revolved around his rushing ability. Again I wouldn't select that. Daniels is the same deal. One good season the rest garbage. He's also a runner.

[cogitator]

But the 49ers picked Lance No 3 and then Purdy with the last pick. They corrected a whiff. Lance was one of those guys who had one good season. I would never select that early. His game also revolved around his rushing ability. Again I wouldn't select that. Daniels is the same deal. One good season the rest garbage. He's also a runner.

Lance had one good season with somewhat limited stats and against second tier competition. I think it was more his size and speed and arm strength made everyone think he had potential (that word frequently not a positive). Daniels had 2 good seasons, the second season good enough to win the Heisman, and he played in the best conference. I don't know how he'll do in the NFL, but definitely more to go on than there was with Lance.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jayden_Daniels

[VikingLord]

https://www.nbcsports.com/nfl/profootba ... or-the-guy

“For a couple of years I’ve, you know, I’ve been kind of known as the ‘quarterback killer’ when it comes to the draft in Eagan, because the feeling that everybody that I feel from our fan base is when we get this next guy, he’s gonna be the guy. And I feel it. I know you guys all feel it. So I have had to in a lot of ways fight off some mistakes from being made, mainly because the evaluation process I go through, I think about the things that are fixable.

“I think about the things that are coachable and then you think about the things that you could coach another 15 years with the player, and you might not be able to fix and hope and faith are wonderful things. I do like them to not necessarily be strategies. So I do very much believe in certain principles of playing the quarterback position. I believe the footwork in the lower half of any quarterback can be fixed with the proper coaching and teaching. And I think that when you see the good things on tape, you see things that they can do better on tape. You’re looking for a lot of different things and to check a lot of boxes and ultimately when you feel like you find that guy then you got to hope that 31 other teams are complicit in making sure that they can become a Minnesota Viking, but we only need one team to be complicit and hopefully we find that team and that person’s on it.”

O’Connell then was asked about his connections to his original NFL team, the Patriots, who hold the third overall pick in the 2024 draft.

“You know, I may or may not have sent a nice bouquet of flowers to Robert Kraft the other day,” O’Connell said.

It’s going to take more than flowers to go from No. 11 to No. 3. The Vikings seem to be willing to do it for the right guy.

But here’s the most important takeaway. O’Connell — the quarterback killer — won’t just settle for whoever. He knows who he wants. We’ll find out in five days whether he gets him.

So if KOC is really doing what he says he's doing (which I have no doubt he is), then he also must know how difficult it is to find a single prospect with any certainty. Not to say he can't find a player who has more potential than another player, but so much at the QB position comes down not just to coachable fundamentals, but to intangibles that are much harder to properly assess in young players coming out of college. I'm talking about leadership. Guts. Field vision. Willingness to put in extra work above and beyond what is required of them.

Look at this upcoming QB class. People say it is a deep class at the top, but to me it looks like a pretty flat class with several players who don't really stand out relative to each other. All have notable strengths paired with notable question marks. So maybe KOC is better than most at reading the tea leaves with this group to find a guy who stands out from his peers in meaningful ways. I'd like to believe that he is. I just don't think this is an easy year to make that call. It's a deeper pool of QB prospects at the top, sure, but two factors still make it much harder for KOC to find the next GOAT at QB - he doesn't enjoy a top spot in the draft and even if he did he still couldn't draft the most obvious QB talent which is Caleb Williams. So he's got to find a less obvious talent and, barring KAM finding a willing trade partner, hope that talent falls to where he can select him.

Very tough task ahead of both KAM and KOC in this draft. I know some have pointed out that it would have been hard for KAM and KOC to have avoided being in this situation where their hand is forced at QB, but I still wish they were not forced.

[CharVike]

But the 49ers picked Lance No 3 and then Purdy with the last pick. They corrected a whiff. Lance was one of those guys who had one good season. I would never select that early. His game also revolved around his rushing ability. Again I wouldn't select that. Daniels is the same deal. One good season the rest garbage. He's also a runner.

Lance had one good season with somewhat limited stats and against second tier competition. I think it was more his size and speed and arm strength made everyone think he had potential (that word frequently not a positive). Daniels had 2 good seasons, the second season good enough to win the Heisman, and he played in the best conference. I don't know how he'll do in the NFL, but definitely more to go on than there was with Lance.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jayden_Daniels

You're right about Lance's size. Daniels size has to be a concern. He's listed anywhere between 185-220 depends on site. Who knows. Looks like a thin framed guy to me. Nix gets the same with his arm strength some say it's fine others say he can't drive the ball. Another all over the board. That's a question. I have no idea. It's getting boring. This athletic ability get's crazy. I read that Rodgers dropped because limited athletic ability. $hit he played college football at a big school. It wasn't some Valley st or other nothing school. Everyone of these players could be the next Lance and it wouldn't be a surprise. There not all the next Mahomes that's guaranteed.