Championship Roster

[CharVike]

What the media says means nothing. They place R Wilson as one of the best. All people need to do is look at last year. He was heading for MVP and then started playing really bad and turning the ball over. Talk about not being consistent he had his problems also. See below.
But starting in Buffalo in Week 9, everything started to unravel. Though Wilson threw for 390 yards in a 44-34 loss to the Bills, he threw a pair of costly interceptions and coughed up two fumbles that were recovered by the defense. The next week, he once again threw two critical picks and lost a fumble in a 23-16 road loss to the Rams, dropping the Seahawks to 6-3 and out of first place.
That's 7 turnovers in 2 games. He didn't play as well the last part of the season and crap the bed with his pick 6 in a playoff loss. He had problems but nobody sees it. The media don't report it either. That Hawk D improved greatly late in the year also. Wilson had 390 yards in a loss. If Cousins did that it would be garbage yards. It don't work the same for both players. Cousins came here but there were several teams offering huge cash. If we cut him he would get many offers again. Why is that? Because he sucks?

Yes, yes we know. You don't like R Wilson or Dak type of QBs. They don't fit the mold of what you feel a QB should be.

I didn't saying anything about fitting a mold or type or who I like. This was about the media coverage of players. The media paints Cousins out as a loser bum. They never say anything bad about those two I mentioned. Even if they play in spurts worse than Cousins ever did or will.

[StumpHunter]

Yes, yes we know. You don't like R Wilson or Dak type of QBs. They don't fit the mold of what you feel a QB should be.

I didn't saying anything about fitting a mold or type or who I like. This was about the media coverage of players. The media paints Cousins out as a loser bum. They never say anything bad about those two I mentioned. Even if they play in spurts worse than Cousins ever did or will.

Wilson is 2nd all time in passer rating, #1 in YPA and hasn't missed the playoffs since he entered the league. Maybe when Russel is inducted into the HOF and Cousins is still the punch line of every joke about overpaid QBs, you will finally look past whatever bias you have against him and realize he is one of the best of all time.

Dak isn't on the same level of Wilson, but he is 42-27 as a starter, while Cousins is 51-51-2. Simple math tells you why people don't rip Dak for being a loser. He isn't one.

Here is a thought, how about Cousins stops being a loser and THEN you can start complaining about the media's unfair representation of him. Until then he is what they say he is.

[Rhodes Closed]

https://twitter.com/DustBaker/status/14 ... 1929410562

Most TD Passes,
Score Margin of Gm Within 7pts,
Last 5 Seasons:

1. Russell Wilson (112)
t2. Tom Brady (99)
t2. Aaron Rodgers (99)
4. Matt Ryan (91)
5. Drew Brees (89)
6. Kirk Cousins (88)
7. Philip Rivers (84)

[VikingsVictorious]

https://twitter.com/DustBaker/status/14 ... 1929410562

Most TD Passes,
Score Margin of Gm Within 7pts,
Last 5 Seasons:

1. Russell Wilson (112)
t2. Tom Brady (99)
t2. Aaron Rodgers (99)
4. Matt Ryan (91)
5. Drew Brees (89)
6. Kirk Cousins (88)
7. Philip Rivers (84)

I don't quite understand this post. Is that the number of TD passes thrown by the QB in games that finished with a 7 point or less margin?

[VikingLord]

Dak isn't on the same level of Wilson, but he is 42-27 as a starter, while Cousins is 51-51-2. Simple math tells you why people don't rip Dak for being a loser. He isn't one.

Here is a thought, how about Cousins stops being a loser and THEN you can start complaining about the media's unfair representation of him. Until then he is what they say he is.

Technically according to your stats, Cousins isn't a loser either...

[VikingsVictorious]

Dak isn't on the same level of Wilson, but he is 42-27 as a starter, while Cousins is 51-51-2. Simple math tells you why people don't rip Dak for being a loser. He isn't one.

Here is a thought, how about Cousins stops being a loser and THEN you can start complaining about the media's unfair representation of him. Until then he is what they say he is.

Technically according to your stats, Cousins isn't a loser either...

It's so stupid to compare QB records when they play for different teams. It's comparing apples to oranges. Completion percentage, yards per attempt and QB rating makes more sense, but different teams so it's still flawed.

[CharVike]

Technically according to your stats, Cousins isn't a loser either...

It's so stupid to compare QB records when they play for different teams. It's comparing apples to oranges. Completion percentage, yards per attempt and QB rating makes more sense, but different teams so it's still flawed.

You are correct. Even the fact that they play in different divisions screws the whole comparison up. If our team played in the NFC East we would have a much better chance of winning that division than going against Rodgers. The Cowboy team was only one game out from winning the division without Dak. On the surface that team is loaded if a backup stiff can bring your team within one game of the title. In our division the Packers have won 13 games back to back. That's a much tougher road. Very few see this. That WFT won that division and didn't even play 500 ball. So yes Dak should win that easy and get home field through out the playoffs easily. Makes him look like a top flight QB. He's not that and his record against winning teams is terrible which proves it. If Goff and Grap can lead a team to a Super Bowl beating out Wilson for the division title then Cousins can also. I don't see Goff leading the Lions to a division title with Rodgers in it. Grap is on a short leash now. Once he gets hurt it's over for him in 49er town. Some Viking fans are down on Cousins which is OK that's there opinion. They will get what they are hoping for very shortly. I have been down that road since Fran retired. It's a road to nowhere.

[Rhodes Closed]

https://twitter.com/DustBaker/status/14 ... 1929410562

I don't quite understand this post. Is that the number of TD passes thrown by the QB in games that finished with a 7 point or less margin?

I believe it is at any time when the game is within 7 points.

[VikingsVictorious]

I don't quite understand this post. Is that the number of TD passes thrown by the QB in games that finished with a 7 point or less margin?

I believe it is at any time when the game is within 7 points.

The problem with so many stats being kept is that everybody can find some stat that will support what they've already chosen to believe. Just ignore the ones that you don't like and cherry pick the ones you do. Arguing stats has been rendered virtually useless.

[Rhodes Closed]

I believe it is at any time when the game is within 7 points.

The problem with so many stats being kept is that everybody can find some stat that will support what they've already chosen to believe. Just ignore the ones that you don't like and cherry pick the ones you do. Arguing stats has been rendered virtually useless.

Tbf, this stat I brought up was in response to the idea that Kirk Cousins does nothing but pad stats.

[StumpHunter]

The problem with so many stats being kept is that everybody can find some stat that will support what they've already chosen to believe. Just ignore the ones that you don't like and cherry pick the ones you do. Arguing stats has been rendered virtually useless.

Tbf, this stat I brought up was in response to the idea that Kirk Cousins does nothing but pad stats.

The quote was, "pad his stats against bad defenses", which your stat doesn't refute.

You got to be careful with Dusty stats. Cousins is indeed tied for 6th most TDs in that spot, but he also is one of only 6 QBs to start 78+ games during that time period. He is essentially 6th of 6. Yay.

[VikingsVictorious]

The problem with so many stats being kept is that everybody can find some stat that will support what they've already chosen to believe. Just ignore the ones that you don't like and cherry pick the ones you do. Arguing stats has been rendered virtually useless.

Tbf, this stat I brought up was in response to the idea that Kirk Cousins does nothing but pad stats.

I wasn't faulting your stat. It just gets frustrating discussing/debating performance due to stats being so easy to manipulate. As I said they've gotten to the point of virtually worthless. I believe Cousins has the 6th best passer rating of all time and I like that stat due to being a fan of Kirk, but then somebody will come back with some stat that on every 3rd Sunday and Blue moons he really sucks. Now all of the best passer ratings are from quite recently due to the way the NFL has changed, but 6th best ever is still darn good. Please nobody respond with your rebuttal stats that show he really sucks because I know you can find them.

[VikingsVictorious]

Tbf, this stat I brought up was in response to the idea that Kirk Cousins does nothing but pad stats.

The quote was, "pad his stats against bad defenses", which your stat doesn't refute.

You got to be careful with Dusty stats. Cousins is indeed tied for 6th most TDs in that spot, but he also is one of only 6 QBs to start 78+ games during that time period. He is essentially 6th of 6. Yay.

I looked at Stump's post just this once because I was almost certain he was going to have a perfect example of what I was saying and I was right. People can always find stats to support their predisposed beliefs. This renders any discussion based on stats virtually useless. Stump will of course believe that his stats are better than other stats and others will believe their stats are better than Stump's stats. On and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on.

[VikingsVictorious]

Great new........... NOT!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N_YTEzdhiM0

Pierce calf injury might not be ready for camp. This is the concern I had with him. Injuries.

[VikingLord]

The quote was, "pad his stats against bad defenses", which your stat doesn't refute.

You got to be careful with Dusty stats. Cousins is indeed tied for 6th most TDs in that spot, but he also is one of only 6 QBs to start 78+ games during that time period. He is essentially 6th of 6. Yay.

I looked at Stump's post just this once because I was almost certain he was going to have a perfect example of what I was saying and I was right. People can always find stats to support their predisposed beliefs. This renders any discussion based on stats virtually useless. Stump will of course believe that his stats are better than other stats and others will believe their stats are better than Stump's stats. On and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on.

Stats can be useful in an objective discussion where everyone involved is open to letting the evidence lead to the truth and where the relative weaknesses of that evidence are acknowledged.

There is evidence behind the stats that Stump posts, and those stats can have value in assessing Cousins as a player and his relative value at his position, both in the league overall and with the Vikings in particular.

It is also very likely that stats are the basis for Spielman and Zimmer signing Cousins in the first place, as well as extending him further.

So that right there says about all there is to say about the relative value of stats. Stump posts stats that suggest Cousins is not a QB who can get the team far into the playoffs, while Spielman and Zimmer must believe the opposite. Since it is almost impossible for them to be looking at different data points, then either one of them is objectively wrong in their interpretation of that data, or, more likely, one (or both, I suppose) is cherry-picking the stats that support their conclusions.

Of course, in terms of outcomes, there will be no debate. Stump isn't wrong per se, and he may in fact turn out right if the Vikings continue to under-perform in big games against better opposition with Cousins at the helm. Its just difficult to say with certainty until Cousins time with the Vikings has run its course.

Spielman and Zimmer have a lot more personally riding on the interpretation of those stats. I sincerely hope for the sake of both that they are not the ones introducing personal bias into their interpretations of them, because if they are both are likely to be out of a job at the end of this season.