Trent Williams

[Bowhunting Viking]

Very interesting trade proposal.

When I first read it, I thought we would be getting hammered. But I've learned that you have to pair any deal up with the NFL draft position points chart. When you do that, the deal gets REALLY interesting.

VIKINGS WOULD GET
Trent Williams
2600 draft points

REDSKINS WOULD GET
Reiff
2465 draft points (This assumes we draft in approximately the same position next year. Breakdown: 22nd pick (780); 25th pick (720), 89th pick (145), 25th pick next year (780).

Not sure where you're getting this from, but you've been dead-on with everything you've ever posted about Trent Williams, so I'm going with it. And besides, it makes sense because it's a win-win. Skins get something in return for Williams, who is never gonna play for them, and they get to stockpile draft picks, which a rebuilding franchise needs. We get an all-pro left tackle and someone who is likely to be really, really good at a position Zimmer values. The Skins come out behind on draft points, but not that far behind ... especially considering their lack of leverage with Williams. In the end, we essentially trade Diggs and Reiff for Williams and Young. Given Diggs' attitude (and the fact that, well, he's gone) I'd do that every day of the week and twice on Sundays.

I love this deal. Chase Young and Danielle Hunter ... Erin Rodgers would be pooping his pants. Hope we can get it done.

I hope we do not, Vikings have too many holes to fill to give up the farm

It is just a scenario that I saw on a website this morning of a few different options that they were saying Slick Rick could be looking at.
It isnt something that I was saying I was hoping he would do or was pushing for. Just an interesting point of view that's all.
Would I live to have Chase Young, only if I knew he was going to live up to the stud hype... but we all know that translates positively farther less than it does negatively.
That scenario that I quoted in the story sounds VERY RICH AND VERY RISKY for my liking. Haha.
Sorry if I made anyone think it was something in the works.

[Pondering Her Percy]

Very interesting trade proposal.

When I first read it, I thought we would be getting hammered. But I've learned that you have to pair any deal up with the NFL draft position points chart. When you do that, the deal gets REALLY interesting.

VIKINGS WOULD GET
Trent Williams
2600 draft points

REDSKINS WOULD GET
Reiff
2465 draft points (This assumes we draft in approximately the same position next year. Breakdown: 22nd pick (780); 25th pick (720), 89th pick (145), 25th pick next year (780).

I love this deal. Chase Young and Danielle Hunter ... Erin Rodgers would be pooping his pants. Hope we can get it done.

OK, I know the draft points work out in the Vikings favor, but if one views those high draft picks as lottery tickets instead of sure thing players, it looks a lot less in the Vikings favor, especially considering all the holes the team has to fill.

The Vikings are trading starting left tackles and get a single high 1st round pick. The Redskins get a starting left tackle who is perhaps a little less talented and 3 later first round picks and a 3rd rounder.

In your scenario, the Vikings use that high 1st rounder to get a "sure thing" defensive end, but how many times have sure thing prospects flamed out in the pros? Yeah, Chase Young is a stud. I don't think he's going to flame out. I still don't like the trade. Those 3 1st rounders can help bolster both the OL and DL over the next two seasons with players who might not be as potentially special as Young, but who won't be all that much worse and who can potentially contribute more to the overall team.

It's not a deal I would do.

I don’t like the deal either but Trent Williams is much more talented than Reiff. It’s not even close

[Pondering Her Percy]

Why would somebody pounce on Reiff very quickly? He is not that good

He's better than a lot of teams have and at that point he will probably come cheap.

Not only that but he’s simply a left tackle that would actually play. Washington has to look at this right now as if they have no left tackle. Literally nothing worthy of starting. It’s not like they can say, well we have Williams. No you technically don’t because he won’t play for you if you keep him. Reiff is much better than nothing. He’s at least a stop gap for them as they rebuild.

I’m not just saying this because I want Williams but if I’m Washington, I’m jumping all over Reiff and a 3rd or 4th. They get a middling left tackle that will actually play and a pick. It fills a hole on a rebuilding team and gives them an extra pick. And they give up someone that wasn’t going to play for them anyways. Essentially they get a starting left tackle and a pick for nothing because at this point Williams is mom-existent to them. Granted this all depends on if that’s what we’d actually offer and would another team send over a better deal.

But Washington is absolutely stupid if they just wait it out and think they’re going to get what they’re asking for. It’s not going to happen and they are going to be without Williams yet another year if they sit. They need to take what they can get at this point and move on. I would hope at least Rivera is smart enough to do that, because the old regime was not.

[J. Kapp 11]

I hope we do not, Vikings have too many holes to fill to give up the farm

It is just a scenario that I saw on a website this morning of a few different options that they were saying Slick Rick could be looking at.
It isnt something that I was saying I was hoping he would do or was pushing for. Just an interesting point of view that's all.
Would I live to have Chase Young, only if I knew he was going to live up to the stud hype... but we all know that translates positively farther less than it does negatively.
That scenario that I quoted in the story sounds VERY RICH AND VERY RISKY for my liking. Haha.
Sorry if I made anyone think it was something in the works.

Some people have expressed that Rick Spielman has a fondness for Notre Dame players. I can't read his mind, so I can't really comment with any certainty about what Rick Spielman thinks. But if there's any school that deserves recognition for producing defensive ends who excel in the NFL, it's Ohio State.

They've produced Will Smith, Vernon Gholston, Cameron Heyward, the Bosa brothers, Alonzo Spellman and even our own Jim Marshall. The list goes on and on. There are tons more.

That doesn't guarantee anything, I realize. You can't predict injuries. I remember when Jadaveon Clowney was drafted ... he tore up his knee on the first series of his career when he caught his foot in the seam of new sod. But if I had to bet on Chase Young actually being a flat-out bust, injuries aside ... I'd wager a lot of money that he won't.

It won't break my heart if this deal isn't made ... but it won't break my heart if it is, either. You guys keep talking about all these holes we have. How do we know that Oli Udoh and Dru Samia aren't ready to step up? Udoh, for example, had one start as a 7th-round draft pick last year, and that was against the Bears and Khalil Mack. Other than one holding penalty against Udoh, Mack did nothing in that game. He has all the height-weight-strength-agility measurables you'd ever want in a tackle, but he went to a small school and needed development. All reports are that he's progressing rapidly. One knock on him coming out of college was that he wasn't aggressive enough. The other penalty he got in that Bears game was for unnecessary roughness because he kept pounding a dude long after the whistle. None of us like 15-yard penalties, but that bodes well for him developing a mean streak. I'm also hearing very positive reports about Samia's progression. If those reports pan out, maybe we don't need to draft O-linemen high. (I know that's going to set the message board on fire, but so be it.) Obviously we'd still need corners, but a guy like Chase Young, paired up with Danielle Hunter, can make life easier for any defensive back.

Anyway, I'm good with Chase Young. And I'm good with drafting where we are. There are advantages to both.

[VikingsVictorious]

It is just a scenario that I saw on a website this morning of a few different options that they were saying Slick Rick could be looking at.
It isnt something that I was saying I was hoping he would do or was pushing for. Just an interesting point of view that's all.
Would I live to have Chase Young, only if I knew he was going to live up to the stud hype... but we all know that translates positively farther less than it does negatively.
That scenario that I quoted in the story sounds VERY RICH AND VERY RISKY for my liking. Haha.
Sorry if I made anyone think it was something in the works.

Some people have expressed that Rick Spielman has a fondness for Notre Dame players. I can't read his mind, so I can't really comment with any certainty about what Rick Spielman thinks. But if there's any school that deserves recognition for producing defensive ends who excel in the NFL, it's Ohio State.

They've produced Will Smith, Vernon Gholston, Cameron Heyward, the Bosa brothers, Alonzo Spellman and even our own Jim Marshall. The list goes on and on. There are tons more.

That doesn't guarantee anything, I realize. You can't predict injuries. I remember when Jadaveon Clowney was drafted ... he tore up his knee on the first series of his career when he caught his foot in the seam of new sod. But if I had to bet on Chase Young actually being a flat-out bust, injuries aside ... I'd wager a lot of money that he won't.

It won't break my heart if this deal isn't made ... but it won't break my heart if it is, either. You guys keep talking about all these holes we have. How do we know that Oli Udoh and Dru Samia aren't ready to step up? Udoh, for example, had one start as a 7th-round draft pick last year, and that was against the Bears and Khalil Mack. Other than one holding penalty against Udoh, Mack did nothing in that game. He has all the height-weight-strength-agility measurables you'd ever want in a tackle, but he went to a small school and needed development. All reports are that he's progressing rapidly. One knock on him coming out of college was that he wasn't aggressive enough. The other penalty he got in that Bears game was for unnecessary roughness because he kept pounding a dude long after the whistle. None of us like 15-yard penalties, but that bodes well for him developing a mean streak. I'm also hearing very positive reports about Samia's progression. If those reports pan out, maybe we don't need to draft O-linemen high. (I know that's going to set the message board on fire, but so be it.) Obviously we'd still need corners, but a guy like Chase Young, paired up with Danielle Hunter, can make life easier for any defensive back.

Anyway, I'm good with Chase Young. And I'm good with drafting where we are. There are advantages to both.

I would put the chances of that trade happening at 0.001%, but it is fun to contemplate.

[fiestavike]

It is just a scenario that I saw on a website this morning of a few different options that they were saying Slick Rick could be looking at.
It isnt something that I was saying I was hoping he would do or was pushing for. Just an interesting point of view that's all.
Would I live to have Chase Young, only if I knew he was going to live up to the stud hype... but we all know that translates positively farther less than it does negatively.
That scenario that I quoted in the story sounds VERY RICH AND VERY RISKY for my liking. Haha.
Sorry if I made anyone think it was something in the works.

Some people have expressed that Rick Spielman has a fondness for Notre Dame players. I can't read his mind, so I can't really comment with any certainty about what Rick Spielman thinks. But if there's any school that deserves recognition for producing defensive ends who excel in the NFL, it's Ohio State.

They've produced Will Smith, Vernon Gholston, Cameron Heyward, the Bosa brothers, Alonzo Spellman and even our own Jim Marshall. The list goes on and on. There are tons more.

That doesn't guarantee anything, I realize. You can't predict injuries. I remember when Jadaveon Clowney was drafted ... he tore up his knee on the first series of his career when he caught his foot in the seam of new sod. But if I had to bet on Chase Young actually being a flat-out bust, injuries aside ... I'd wager a lot of money that he won't.

It won't break my heart if this deal isn't made ... but it won't break my heart if it is, either. You guys keep talking about all these holes we have. How do we know that Oli Udoh and Dru Samia aren't ready to step up? Udoh, for example, had one start as a 7th-round draft pick last year, and that was against the Bears and Khalil Mack. Other than one holding penalty against Udoh, Mack did nothing in that game. He has all the height-weight-strength-agility measurables you'd ever want in a tackle, but he went to a small school and needed development. All reports are that he's progressing rapidly. One knock on him coming out of college was that he wasn't aggressive enough. The other penalty he got in that Bears game was for unnecessary roughness because he kept pounding a dude long after the whistle. None of us like 15-yard penalties, but that bodes well for him developing a mean streak. I'm also hearing very positive reports about Samia's progression. If those reports pan out, maybe we don't need to draft O-linemen high. (I know that's going to set the message board on fire, but so be it.) Obviously we'd still need corners, but a guy like Chase Young, paired up with Danielle Hunter, can make life easier for any defensive back.

Anyway, I'm good with Chase Young. And I'm good with drafting where we are. There are advantages to both.

If the vikings dont trade up, which I agree is unlikely, I would prefer they trade back with one or both of their 1st round picks. Every mock I do where either Kinlaw or Herbert isnt available at 22 seems to have about a dozen players with a similar ranking at that point in the draft. Dropping 9 or 10 spaces and picking up some extra 3rd rounders would be fantastic.

[VikingsVictorious]

Some people have expressed that Rick Spielman has a fondness for Notre Dame players. I can't read his mind, so I can't really comment with any certainty about what Rick Spielman thinks. But if there's any school that deserves recognition for producing defensive ends who excel in the NFL, it's Ohio State.

They've produced Will Smith, Vernon Gholston, Cameron Heyward, the Bosa brothers, Alonzo Spellman and even our own Jim Marshall. The list goes on and on. There are tons more.

That doesn't guarantee anything, I realize. You can't predict injuries. I remember when Jadaveon Clowney was drafted ... he tore up his knee on the first series of his career when he caught his foot in the seam of new sod. But if I had to bet on Chase Young actually being a flat-out bust, injuries aside ... I'd wager a lot of money that he won't.

It won't break my heart if this deal isn't made ... but it won't break my heart if it is, either. You guys keep talking about all these holes we have. How do we know that Oli Udoh and Dru Samia aren't ready to step up? Udoh, for example, had one start as a 7th-round draft pick last year, and that was against the Bears and Khalil Mack. Other than one holding penalty against Udoh, Mack did nothing in that game. He has all the height-weight-strength-agility measurables you'd ever want in a tackle, but he went to a small school and needed development. All reports are that he's progressing rapidly. One knock on him coming out of college was that he wasn't aggressive enough. The other penalty he got in that Bears game was for unnecessary roughness because he kept pounding a dude long after the whistle. None of us like 15-yard penalties, but that bodes well for him developing a mean streak. I'm also hearing very positive reports about Samia's progression. If those reports pan out, maybe we don't need to draft O-linemen high. (I know that's going to set the message board on fire, but so be it.) Obviously we'd still need corners, but a guy like Chase Young, paired up with Danielle Hunter, can make life easier for any defensive back.

Anyway, I'm good with Chase Young. And I'm good with drafting where we are. There are advantages to both.

If the vikings dont trade up, which I agree is unlikely, I would prefer they trade back with one or both of their 1st round picks. Every mock I do where either Kinlaw or Herbert isnt available at 22 seems to have about a dozen players with a similar ranking at that point in the draft. Dropping 9 or 10 spaces and picking up some extra 3rd rounders would be fantastic.

Brilliant minds thinking alike.

[Pondering Her Percy]

Some people have expressed that Rick Spielman has a fondness for Notre Dame players. I can't read his mind, so I can't really comment with any certainty about what Rick Spielman thinks. But if there's any school that deserves recognition for producing defensive ends who excel in the NFL, it's Ohio State.

They've produced Will Smith, Vernon Gholston, Cameron Heyward, the Bosa brothers, Alonzo Spellman and even our own Jim Marshall. The list goes on and on. There are tons more.

That doesn't guarantee anything, I realize. You can't predict injuries. I remember when Jadaveon Clowney was drafted ... he tore up his knee on the first series of his career when he caught his foot in the seam of new sod. But if I had to bet on Chase Young actually being a flat-out bust, injuries aside ... I'd wager a lot of money that he won't.

It won't break my heart if this deal isn't made ... but it won't break my heart if it is, either. You guys keep talking about all these holes we have. How do we know that Oli Udoh and Dru Samia aren't ready to step up? Udoh, for example, had one start as a 7th-round draft pick last year, and that was against the Bears and Khalil Mack. Other than one holding penalty against Udoh, Mack did nothing in that game. He has all the height-weight-strength-agility measurables you'd ever want in a tackle, but he went to a small school and needed development. All reports are that he's progressing rapidly. One knock on him coming out of college was that he wasn't aggressive enough. The other penalty he got in that Bears game was for unnecessary roughness because he kept pounding a dude long after the whistle. None of us like 15-yard penalties, but that bodes well for him developing a mean streak. I'm also hearing very positive reports about Samia's progression. If those reports pan out, maybe we don't need to draft O-linemen high. (I know that's going to set the message board on fire, but so be it.) Obviously we'd still need corners, but a guy like Chase Young, paired up with Danielle Hunter, can make life easier for any defensive back.

Anyway, I'm good with Chase Young. And I'm good with drafting where we are. There are advantages to both.

If the vikings dont trade up, which I agree is unlikely, I would prefer they trade back with one or both of their 1st round picks. Every mock I do where either Kinlaw or Herbert isnt available at 22 seems to have about a dozen players with a similar ranking at that point in the draft. Dropping 9 or 10 spaces and picking up some extra 3rd rounders would be fantastic.

I wouldn’t mind that either. I don’t see Kinlaw being there. But my ideal scenario would be:

Trade up to 14 from 22 for lamb or Jeudy. Or trade up to 17ish for CJ Henderson (who I think is the best CB in the draft, I’d even give him the nod over okudah who could very well go top 5).

Then trade down at 25 to gain some capital back and make our next pick in the back end of the 1st like 31st or 32nd. Take a CB or WR here. Maybe a DE if someone fell.

[cmoss84]

What are the chances things get crazy during draft week? Like, crazy crazy?
Like:
1) Dalvin gets traded. No extension. Vikes decide to invest elsewhere. Either goes to Bucs or Seachickens. We get a 1st rd pick.
2) We trade Reiff, and a 4th for Mr. Williams. 4/56 million extension.
3) Harris is traded for a 2nd and a 4th. No extension.
4) Swift...who's comp is...Cook...gets drafted with one of our 3 1st rd picks.

Semi-rebuild, semi-competitive moves.

[fiestavike]

What are the chances things get crazy during draft week? Like, crazy crazy?
Like:
1) Dalvin gets traded. No extension. Vikes decide to invest elsewhere. Either goes to Bucs or Seachickens. We get a 1st rd pick.
2) We trade Reiff, and a 4th for Mr. Williams. 4/56 million extension.
3) Harris is traded for a 2nd and a 4th. No extension.
4) Swift...who's comp is...Cook...gets drafted with one of our 3 1st rd picks.

Semi-rebuild, semi-competitive moves.

I would be in favor of each one of those moves individually except for spending a 1st on a RB. I'm also not 100 percent sure that Williams will be an immediate upgrade over Reiff. What kind of shape he'll be in, how injury prone he might be, etc.

In reality, I think Dalvin fetches a 2nd and Harris fetches a 3rd or a 4th. I'd still strongly consider making those moves to shed salary, avoid giving unwieldy contracts to a RB and a S, and get younger. Can we add Rudolph to the list?

At the end of the day, we have to decide whether we are putting all our eggs in the 2020 basket or not. If we acknowledge that we aren't we may as well take these guys who aren't going to be here next year anyway (Cook, Harris, Rudolph) and see what we can get for them. With Harris, it might just be worth rescinding the franchise tag and letting him walk. Teams are taking a risk just giving him the deal he wants. They aren't going to throw in a 2nd round pick to boot.

[Pondering Her Percy]

What are the chances things get crazy during draft week? Like, crazy crazy?
Like:
1) Dalvin gets traded. No extension. Vikes decide to invest elsewhere. Either goes to Bucs or Seachickens. We get a 1st rd pick.
2) We trade Reiff, and a 4th for Mr. Williams. 4/56 million extension.
3) Harris is traded for a 2nd and a 4th. No extension.
4) Swift...who's comp is...Cook...gets drafted with one of our 3 1st rd picks.

Semi-rebuild, semi-competitive moves.

At this point. you might as well trade the whole team away. I’m a hard no on trading cook and Harris

[cmoss84]

What are the chances things get crazy during draft week? Like, crazy crazy?
Like:
1) Dalvin gets traded. No extension. Vikes decide to invest elsewhere. Either goes to Bucs or Seachickens. We get a 1st rd pick.
2) We trade Reiff, and a 4th for Mr. Williams. 4/56 million extension.
3) Harris is traded for a 2nd and a 4th. No extension.
4) Swift...who's comp is...Cook...gets drafted with one of our 3 1st rd picks.

Semi-rebuild, semi-competitive moves.

I would be in favor of each one of those moves individually except for spending a 1st on a RB. I'm also not 100 percent sure that Williams will be an immediate upgrade over Reiff. What kind of shape he'll be in, how injury prone he might be, etc.

In reality, I think Dalvin fetches a 2nd and Harris fetches a 3rd or a 4th. I'd still strongly consider making those moves to shed salary, avoid giving unwieldy contracts to a RB and a S, and get younger. Can we add Rudolph to the list?

At the end of the day, we have to decide whether we are putting all our eggs in the 2020 basket or not. If we acknowledge that we aren't we may as well take these guys who aren't going to be here next year anyway (Cook, Harris, Rudolph) and see what we can get for them. With Harris, it might just be worth rescinding the franchise tag and letting him walk. Teams are taking a risk just giving him the deal he wants. They aren't going to throw in a 2nd round pick to boot.

This is definitely not what I think will happen...was just kind of a "what if" scenario. However, you made some excellent points. I would also like to add Rudolph to the list, but do not see it happening.

[cmoss84]

What are the chances things get crazy during draft week? Like, crazy crazy?
Like:
1) Dalvin gets traded. No extension. Vikes decide to invest elsewhere. Either goes to Bucs or Seachickens. We get a 1st rd pick.
2) We trade Reiff, and a 4th for Mr. Williams. 4/56 million extension.
3) Harris is traded for a 2nd and a 4th. No extension.
4) Swift...who's comp is...Cook...gets drafted with one of our 3 1st rd picks.

Semi-rebuild, semi-competitive moves.

At this point. you might as well trade the whole team away. I’m a hard no on trading cook and Harris

Seems like a lot on the surface, and it probably is. But another way to look at it is trading 2 guys in contract years that might be able to be replaced easier and more efficiently than people think...AND this could save us a good chunk of change. I love Cook, but RBs seem to be easily replaced, and $12 million/year can go a long way (Williams + Swift might equal close to Cook). Harris was awesome. But paying him $10/year probably isn't the recipe for success.

[VikingsVictorious]

I would be in favor of each one of those moves individually except for spending a 1st on a RB. I'm also not 100 percent sure that Williams will be an immediate upgrade over Reiff. What kind of shape he'll be in, how injury prone he might be, etc.

In reality, I think Dalvin fetches a 2nd and Harris fetches a 3rd or a 4th. I'd still strongly consider making those moves to shed salary, avoid giving unwieldy contracts to a RB and a S, and get younger. Can we add Rudolph to the list?

At the end of the day, we have to decide whether we are putting all our eggs in the 2020 basket or not. If we acknowledge that we aren't we may as well take these guys who aren't going to be here next year anyway (Cook, Harris, Rudolph) and see what we can get for them. With Harris, it might just be worth rescinding the franchise tag and letting him walk. Teams are taking a risk just giving him the deal he wants. They aren't going to throw in a 2nd round pick to boot.

This is definitely not what I think will happen...was just kind of a "what if" scenario. However, you made some excellent points. I would also like to add Rudolph to the list, but do not see it happening.

The team that plays in Washington has a big need for a TE. Rudolph could definitely be involved. I posted some messages back and forth with a Washington fan who said they held the leverage in any trade of Trent. I told him my proposed trade of Reiff and a third. He said that's better than a second and said he would gladly accept if he could be GM for a day.

[S197]

That's the kind of trade that can kill franchises. Especially for a pass rusher, I mean how many in the past decade have made that much of an impact to help a team become a contender? Von Miller? Even Mack wasn't enough to make the Bears a contender and he's a wrecking ball.

Young looks good but not generationally good. He could be another Clowney which simply isn't enough for the draft capital given up.