The Real Chance that the Vikings Don't Address Offensive Line Early

[halfgiz]

And that is your opinion.
What exactly does the defense need that requires a first round pick?
The offensive needs a starting guard. Tier 2-3 lineman isn't going to cut it.

So drafting Chris Lindstrom in the 1st round is what we need to do but drafting Michael Jordan in the 2nd and taking a DT in the first doesn’t cut it? You’re missing the point, there isn’t a tier 1 guard in this draft. Quinton Nelson is a tier 1 guard. He went 6th overall. His caliber is not in this draft. You as well as others keep trying to push that point of not being able to pass on a “tier 1” guard. There isn’t one!!! Hence why you don’t see a guard in any mock going in the top 15. So yeah no matter what guard you pick, guess what? He’s a tier 2-3 guard. So they’re gonna have to cut it. And they will cut it. You don’t need to take a guard in the first in order to find a good one. There will be plenty of good guards in rounds 2-3. That’s not just my opinion. That’s just about every analyst and fan out there

The majority of the analysts from major networks have picked a Offensive guard\tackle.
Ford, Williams and Dillard seem to be the most popular with a few for Lindstrom. With a couple for Noah Fant But I think he will be gone by 18.

Just about every analyst out there huh
Zimmer is paying his defensive line. 40,110,457 and the offense is getting paid 23,304,039.
It's time the offense drafted some talent.

[Pondering Her Percy]

The closer we get to draft day, the more im sure Rick is going to trade the 18th (maybe even the 50th) to get more picks. I think we stand a good chance to get 2 real quality Olinemen with this method. I would be happy too with using the 18th and 50th on the Oline as well, if we didnt trade down. But by trading down, we might actually get 3 decent picks in the first 2 days. I think most people want 2 oline, and the best DT we can get. I doubt we go edge, or we wouldnt have resigned griff. Depends on how people look at BOA. Hughes was NOT BPA last season. But Rick let Zimmer have first pick. With Griffen and Barr re-signing, Rick/Kubiak (notice how no one is say Stef when talking about the draft?) may get the first 3 picks of the draft. At least thats what I am hoping. Too bad Hill had to be an idiot, or I dont think we would even look at a DB this year till the 7th.

I think the Vikes will look at this draft as hitting the needs we have right away. They have seen what happens when we get trash and hope they can be starters. I would rather get trash on the D, and see what Zimmer can do with them. But I am done with the idiot druggies, no matter how good they might be.

Hill being an idiot is funny. Yes I assume he's done. You can't count on that guy. So that's a hole that needs a plug. Adding an edge rusher would be ok. We need depth and can Griff be counted on? With that we better have a player ready. I don't think a 1st round OL talent will be there at our pick. Ford will be there and is a good player. But his block feet and girth don't fit the scheme so I don't see him even being on our board. It will be a smaller player that can move for the OL and that can be had later. Will be fun to watch.

Hill is going to miss time but he’s not done. Yet at least. I feel like behind the scenes we have a good support system to help with guys keeping their nose clean and on the straight and narrow

[Pondering Her Percy]

So drafting Chris Lindstrom in the 1st round is what we need to do but drafting Michael Jordan in the 2nd and taking a DT in the first doesn’t cut it? You’re missing the point, there isn’t a tier 1 guard in this draft. Quinton Nelson is a tier 1 guard. He went 6th overall. His caliber is not in this draft. You as well as others keep trying to push that point of not being able to pass on a “tier 1” guard. There isn’t one!!! Hence why you don’t see a guard in any mock going in the top 15. So yeah no matter what guard you pick, guess what? He’s a tier 2-3 guard. So they’re gonna have to cut it. And they will cut it. You don’t need to take a guard in the first in order to find a good one. There will be plenty of good guards in rounds 2-3. That’s not just my opinion. That’s just about every analyst and fan out there

The majority of the analysts from major networks have picked a Offensive guard\tackle.
Ford, Williams and Dillard seem to be the most popular with a few for Lindstrom. With a couple for Noah Fant But I think he will be gone by 18.

Just about every analyst out there huh
Zimmer is paying his defensive line. 40,110,457 and the offense is getting paid 23,304,039.
It's time the offense drafted some talent.

I have seen multiple analysts mock us taking Lawrence, Oliver, Wilkins, etc. The point is, I’m referring to a guard. A true guard like Quinton Nelson. Dillard isn’t a guard. And ford and Williams are guys that will be pushed inside. So there is no real tell if they would be good guards or not. Lindstrom is a true guard. And read my post again, When I was referring to every analyst out there, I was saying that every analyst out there is saying there is deep guard talent in this draft. Not a tier 1 guy like Nelson but a lot of good starters in the 2nd-4th round.

[halfgiz]

The majority of the analysts from major networks have picked a Offensive guard\tackle.
Ford, Williams and Dillard seem to be the most popular with a few for Lindstrom. With a couple for Noah Fant But I think he will be gone by 18.

Just about every analyst out there huh
Zimmer is paying his defensive line. 40,110,457 and the offense is getting paid 23,304,039.
It's time the offense drafted some talent.

I have seen multiple analysts mock us taking Lawrence, Oliver, Wilkins, etc. The point is, I’m referring to a guard. A true guard like Quinton Nelson. Dillard isn’t a guard. And ford and Williams are guys that will be pushed inside. So there is no real tell if they would be good guards or not. Lindstrom is a true guard. And read my post again, When I was referring to every analyst out there, I was saying that every analyst out there is saying there is deep guard talent in this draft. Not a tier 1 guy like Nelson but a lot of good starters in the 2nd-4th round.

Well I posted the names that most of the analysts are picking. Yeah some are tackles, but some could be moved to guards.
I'm saying get a Tackle the experts are projecting in round 1 and swing back around and get these guards you are talking about in the 2-4 rounds. This is the year we need to fix the offense.
There is also a lot of talent on the Defensive side round 2-4. Lets see what Zimmer can do with them.

[VikingsVictorious]

Since 2007, the Minnesota Vikings under Rick Spielman have also refrained from spending early draft capital on interior linemen. Other than Pat Elflein (3rd round) the Vikings have not selected a SINGLE interior offensive lineman before the 5th round in that time span!

Whoa. Wait a minute. Sure they have, in five different seasons (six counting Elflein).

Phil Loadholt -- 2009, 2nd round
Matt Kalil -- 2012, 1st round
T.J. Clemmings -- 2015, 4th round
Willie Beavers -- 2016, 4th round
Pat Elflein -- 2017, 3rd round
Brian O'Neill -- 2018, 2nd round

Granted, that list is not exactly the Who's Who of great offensive linemen, but you don't need to overplay your hand -- because you have a good one.

You are totally correct in your assertion that the Vikings under Rick Spielman have not prioritized O-linemen in the early rounds. But here is perhaps an even more telling fact. During the time period you mention (since 2007), there have been four drafts where the Vikings took ZERO offensive linemen.

My hope is that Gary Kubiak still has the Midas touch. Everywhere he's coached, they've had offensive linemen who weren't household names but played really well as a unit. Kubiak takes linemen who fit what he wants to do, so I'm hoping that's what he's doing here. Not necessarily looking for the biggest names or studliest dudes, but guys who have the specific attributes his system requires (whether that's in free agency or the draft). Don't ask me what those are because I'm not that smart.

I'm so glad the Vikings picked an OL in the first round even with Montez Sweat being available. The one they got is going to be a spectacular player. Just think if Kubiak can be successful with lesser talented players how good will he be able to do with Bradbury and to a lesser degree Samia.

[VikingsVictorious]

The Pats OL blows although PFF and others will state they are the best. Yes they pushed the Jets all over the field twice and our crappy OL did the same thing once. I thought our OL looked like the old hogs from the Skins during that game. Based on that game I don't see a huge need. The Rams have the best OL and couldn't move the Pats DL in the SB. They were overwhelmed. They should have just pushed that D right down the field. IMO they need to rebuild that line across the board. But it's rated as the best. I don't get it.

The patriots OL doesn’t not blow. Nor does the rams. Not sure why the jets game has anything to do with anything. It’s more about coaching and scheme than talent IMO, but at the same time both offensive lines have talent. Whitworth, Saffold, Blythe and Havenstein were all top 10 at their position. If anything, the weak link was Sullivan. But that was a very good OL still. I mean look at Indy. They add Quinton Nelson and they are a top OL in the nfl. Nelson is an excellent player but one player doesn’t turn a terrible OL into an elite one. DeGuglielmo was the brains behind that operation. Yet he gets fired because he was mcdaniels guy, not Reichs. Bottom line is, we need to invest more into this OL but at the same time, stefanski, Kubiak and Dennison need to put them in a position to succeed

With an offensive line there is a domino effect. The addition of Nelson also improved the players working next to him. Hopefully Bradbury has the same effect and Kubiak also works his magic.

[Pondering Her Percy]

The patriots OL doesn’t not blow. Nor does the rams. Not sure why the jets game has anything to do with anything. It’s more about coaching and scheme than talent IMO, but at the same time both offensive lines have talent. Whitworth, Saffold, Blythe and Havenstein were all top 10 at their position. If anything, the weak link was Sullivan. But that was a very good OL still. I mean look at Indy. They add Quinton Nelson and they are a top OL in the nfl. Nelson is an excellent player but one player doesn’t turn a terrible OL into an elite one. DeGuglielmo was the brains behind that operation. Yet he gets fired because he was mcdaniels guy, not Reichs. Bottom line is, we need to invest more into this OL but at the same time, stefanski, Kubiak and Dennison need to put them in a position to succeed

With an offensive line there is a domino effect. The addition of Nelson also improved the players working next to him. Hopefully Bradbury has the same effect and Kubiak also works his magic.

I agree. I know a lot of guys are down on Elflein but I thought that our line in 2017 made a huge jump as well because of him (and others as well). Berger was able to go back to his natural position. Reiff played well. Remmers was solid at RT. Elflein didnt have a Quinton Nelson type impact but I think he definitely helped our OL that year. I think this year he struggled simply because he had two terrible guards on each side of him in Compton and Remmers. Now he should be in between Bradbury and Reiff/O'Neill. I think you'll definitely see an improvement. No less, he excelled at guard in college and that was always his natural position. Berger was a decent center, but a better guard. That's how I envision Elflein.

[StumpHunter]

With an offensive line there is a domino effect. The addition of Nelson also improved the players working next to him. Hopefully Bradbury has the same effect and Kubiak also works his magic.

I agree. I know a lot of guys are down on Elflein but I thought that our line in 2017 made a huge jump as well because of him (and others as well). Berger was able to go back to his natural position. Reiff played well. Remmers was solid at RT. Elflein didnt have a Quinton Nelson type impact but I think he definitely helped our OL that year. I think this year he struggled simply because he had two terrible guards on each side of him in Compton and Remmers. Now he should be in between Bradbury and Reiff/O'Neill. I think you'll definitely see an improvement. No less, he excelled at guard in college and that was always his natural position. Berger was a decent center, but a better guard. That's how I envision Elflein.

According to PFF, Berger was a better center than guard. PFF isn't the gold standard they think they are, but the Vikings must have thought something similar in 2016 when they started him at center over guard.

[Pondering Her Percy]

I agree. I know a lot of guys are down on Elflein but I thought that our line in 2017 made a huge jump as well because of him (and others as well). Berger was able to go back to his natural position. Reiff played well. Remmers was solid at RT. Elflein didnt have a Quinton Nelson type impact but I think he definitely helped our OL that year. I think this year he struggled simply because he had two terrible guards on each side of him in Compton and Remmers. Now he should be in between Bradbury and Reiff/O'Neill. I think you'll definitely see an improvement. No less, he excelled at guard in college and that was always his natural position. Berger was a decent center, but a better guard. That's how I envision Elflein.

According to PFF, Berger was a better center than guard. PFF isn't the gold standard they think they are, but the Vikings must have thought something similar in 2016 when they started him at center over guard.

I would say he started at center because we didnt have one and he played it before. No different than Elflein. He probably could have went straight to guard but we didnt have a center at the time either

[MikethePurple]

With an offensive line there is a domino effect. The addition of Nelson also improved the players working next to him. Hopefully Bradbury has the same effect and Kubiak also works his magic.

I agree. I know a lot of guys are down on Elflein but I thought that our line in 2017 made a huge jump as well because of him (and others as well). Berger was able to go back to his natural position. Reiff played well. Remmers was solid at RT. Elflein didnt have a Quinton Nelson type impact but I think he definitely helped our OL that year. I think this year he struggled simply because he had two terrible guards on each side of him in Compton and Remmers. Now he should be in between Bradbury and Reiff/O'Neill. I think you'll definitely see an improvement. No less, he excelled at guard in college and that was always his natural position. Berger was a decent center, but a better guard. That's how I envision Elflein.

It also doesn't get talked about a ton but Elflein missed so much time practicing as well as in strength and conditioning all of last year leading up to the season. It was also two injuries/surgeries, not just one. He wasn't ready to go at the beginning of the season and I wonder how much that set him back for the entire year? If he struggles again this year then I think it will be a concern, but I think his injuries don't get mentioned when taking his down year into context.

[StumpHunter]

According to PFF, Berger was a better center than guard. PFF isn't the gold standard they think they are, but the Vikings must have thought something similar in 2016 when they started him at center over guard.

I would say he started at center because we didnt have one and he played it before. No different than Elflein. He probably could have went straight to guard but we didnt have a center at the time either

We had a center who played in the SB this season on one of the best Olines in football. Not good enough for that 2016 line though.
What we didn't have was a viable RG. Fusco was terrible in 2015, and then was terrible again in 2016.

[Pondering Her Percy]

I would say he started at center because we didnt have one and he played it before. No different than Elflein. He probably could have went straight to guard but we didnt have a center at the time either

We had a center who played in the SB this season on one of the best Olines in football. Not good enough for that 2016 line though.
What we didn't have was a viable RG. Fusco was terrible in 2015, and then was terrible again in 2016.

Sullivan was the weak link on the rams OL and was one of the worst centers in football this year. I don’t care if he played in the SB or not. Idk why that matters.

Despite starting all 16 games, veteran center John Sullivan turned in the lowest overall grade of his career at 51.7. Particularly in pass blocking, Sullivan struggled and allowed 37 total pressures, the most of any center in the league.

But hey he played in the super bowl....

Either way he wasn’t on this team in 2016 so yeah, we didn’t have a center. Sure we could have kept him but we decided not to. Whether Berger played center or guard, it didn’t matter. Berger was the #2 center in the league when playing there. He was the #6 guard. Bottom line was, we were two interior lineman short that year because Boone wasn’t any good either. Keeping Fusco was stupid I agree. Maybe could’ve gotten another year or so out of Sully. Either way, none of it is relevant to my point.

My point was I think Elflein is better suited at guard anyways. Berger it was a toss up I guess because he was good no matter where you put him. But none of it had anything to do with John Sullivan or him playing in a SB. Any idea how many bad players I could name that played in a SB over the years? If Pat Elflein was the center of the rams this year, they still go to the Super Bowl. It’s not like Sully carried them there, if anything, he hurt them. Giving up 37 pressures was worse than Elflein who gave up 33. And Elflein also had 2 junk guards next to him where sully didn’t. John Sullivan is a has-been that’s washed up at this point and like I said, completely irrelevant to my argument