Are we screwed with Cousins.

[VikeFanInEagleLand]

You give Cousins a running game like Sunday and he will kill you.

That's sort of my point though. So far, at least to my eyes, it appears that we got rid of two QB's that could also do that IF you have a complimentary running game.Neither one of them might have been the "put the game on your shoulders" type, but I'm not sure Cousins is either. So unless Cousins proves me wrong, the Vikings wasted a lot of money on a position that would have best served somewhere else.

[Pondering Her Percy]

You give Cousins a running game like Sunday and he will kill you.

That's sort of my point though. So far, at least to my eyes, it appears that we got rid of two QB's that could also do that IF you have a complimentary running game.Neither one of them might have been the "put the game on your shoulders" type, but I'm not sure Cousins is either. So unless Cousins proves me wrong, the Vikings wasted a lot of money on a position that would have best served somewhere else.

I mean Case has a really good run game in Denver right now and he's not getting much done at all. And as for Teddy, he never proved he could do it without a run game. So that's something we will probably never know.

So this offseason you have options of Case Keenum, who had one good year in his career out of 7 and is a giant question mark, you have Teddy who was a question mark to begin with because of his knee and never showed he could do much without a run game and then you have Cousins who hasnt had a run game but has overall, been consistent throughout his career when it came to throwing the football. Way more consistent than Teddy or Case ever was. So regardless, I still spend that money any day on Cousins. Case was simply too much of a question mark for me. It was just one of those miracle years where you didnt know if he could ever continue it. And it's showing in Denver.

[StumpHunter]

That's sort of my point though. So far, at least to my eyes, it appears that we got rid of two QB's that could also do that IF you have a complimentary running game.Neither one of them might have been the "put the game on your shoulders" type, but I'm not sure Cousins is either. So unless Cousins proves me wrong, the Vikings wasted a lot of money on a position that would have best served somewhere else.

I mean Case has a really good run game in Denver right now and he's not getting much done at all. And as for Teddy, he never proved he could do it without a run game. So that's something we will probably never know.

Both are true, although Teddy looked pretty good as a rookie with Matt Asiata as his starter. I would argue Cousins hasn't proven he can win with or without a run game though. At least with Teddy and Case you know they are capable of leading a team to 10+ win season. We don't know Cousins is capable of that yet, but hopefully next year.

[StumpHunter]

You give Cousins a running game like Sunday and he will kill you.

That's sort of my point though. So far, at least to my eyes, it appears that we got rid of two QB's that could also do that IF you have a complimentary running game.Neither one of them might have been the "put the game on your shoulders" type, but I'm not sure Cousins is either. So unless Cousins proves me wrong, the Vikings wasted a lot of money on a position that would have best served somewhere else.

It bothers me that the game plan on Sunday that worked the best was limiting the 84 million dollar QB's pass attempts, but to be fair to the guy, it could also be limiting the number of chances the Oline has to get its QB sacked.

[Pondering Her Percy]

I mean Case has a really good run game in Denver right now and he's not getting much done at all. And as for Teddy, he never proved he could do it without a run game. So that's something we will probably never know.

Both are true, although Teddy looked pretty good as a rookie with Matt Asiata as his starter. I would argue Cousins hasn't proven he can win with or without a run game though. At least with Teddy and Case you know they are capable of leading a team to 10+ win season. We don't know Cousins is capable of that yet, but hopefully next year.

I would say Teddy looked serviceable as a rookie. Case looked good with a run game last year but doenst this year. Teddy again looked serviceable with one as well. He had no run game in 2014 and an elite one in 2015. He looked mediocre both years. Granted it was early in his career but still, you would expect a bigger jump in his 2nd year than what he showed. Case's 10+ win season was legit. Teddys? Not so much. That season was ridden on the coat tails of AP. When AP couldnt get going that year, we usually lost. That right there is when a "good" QB should be able to carry a team to some wins. Teddy didnt do that. There wasnt one game we lost last year where AP went over 100. In those 5 games, AP averaged 3.5 YPC. In our wins he averaged 4.8 YPC. That's a huge difference.

Cousins had pretty much 0 run game outside of Arizona and Miami. So in turn, he pretty much won 5 games with no run game at all. Teddy won 1 maybe? The KC game. However he played terrible that game. Point is, Teddy never really showed me he could carry a team when the run game wasnt working.

As for the Cousins 10+ win thing, I agree, you're right. However if we go 9-6-1, that's a 10 win season IMO. Because in that tie game vs. GB, Cousins brought us back and took us to OT. He played amazing in the end just for Carlson to blow the game. If we had a kicker (ever), we win that game and it's because of Kirk Cousins. I'm just intrigued to see Cousins in this "new system" and see how the rest of the year goes

[The negotiator]

[*][vine[/vine]
Be thankful you are not a lions fan.
60 years of misery, mismanagement, incompetence, failure to hire quality coaches when they were available, poor drafts and your left with chasing a dream which is never going to happen. And we know that before the first game of the season. Try that on for 60 years. No hope, ever! All we ever had was the Barry Sanders era. Period. At least in Minny, you have had a lot of rich history, you have tasted the good times even though you haven’t won the big one yet. Great stadium, ownership, quality people from top to bottom. An organization that spares no expense for the players or fans. You are so fortunate to have a team like this. Do they make mistakes....sure. But from an outsiders perspective, you are so lucky to have a team that is in the hunt more times than not. You are the envy of many fans across the country.
You have a bright future. Off topic, sorry.

[StumpHunter]

[*][vine[/vine]
Be thankful you are not a lions fan.
60 years of misery, mismanagement, incompetence, failure to hire quality coaches when they were available, poor drafts and your left with chasing a dream which is never going to happen. And we know that before the first game of the season. Try that on for 60 years. No hope, ever! All we ever had was the Barry Sanders era. Period. At least in Minny, you have had a lot of rich history, you have tasted the good times even though you haven’t won the big one yet. Great stadium, ownership, quality people from top to bottom. An organization that spares no expense for the players or fans. You are so fortunate to have a team like this. Do they make mistakes....sure. But from an outsiders perspective, you are so lucky to have a team that is in the hunt more times than not. You are the envy of many fans across the country.
You have a bright future. Off topic, sorry.

Is Stafford worth the money to you? I see him as being the same guy as Cousins, a guy who puts up good numbers in losses. It just seems like he loses as many games for the Lions ashe wins them, which is why he has been a .500 QB for most of his career.

[fiestavike]

I mean Case has a really good run game in Denver right now and he's not getting much done at all. And as for Teddy, he never proved he could do it without a run game. So that's something we will probably never know.

Both are true, although Teddy looked pretty good as a rookie with Matt Asiata as his starter. I would argue Cousins hasn't proven he can win with or without a run game though. At least with Teddy and Case you know they are capable of leading a team to 10+ win season. We don't know Cousins is capable of that yet, but hopefully next year.

To be fair, Matt Asiata is a better RB than Murray, but still Teddy had a very poor offensive line, and overall very poor support from the skill positions.

[PurpleKoolaid]

Both are true, although Teddy looked pretty good as a rookie with Matt Asiata as his starter. I would argue Cousins hasn't proven he can win with or without a run game though. At least with Teddy and Case you know they are capable of leading a team to 10+ win season. We don't know Cousins is capable of that yet, but hopefully next year.

To be fair, Matt Asiata is a better RB than Murray, but still Teddy had a very poor offensive line, and overall very poor support from the skill positions.

?

[The negotiator]

When it comes to resigning a qb like Stafford, ownership understands if they don’t, the fans will revolt in a way that’s financially damaging and they will be perceived as not wanting to win. How much does it affect Staffords performance when he knows they are not going to surround him with the talent he needs to win. I think after 10 years, he runs out the clock. He’s never been surrounded with the talent and given a chance to win. Is he worth $25m based on how he’s played. Probably not. The bigger question to me is always could the elite qb’s win in Detroit. I don’t think so. Detroit is a graveyard for any qb. I judge a qb based on the talent level of the O line, rb’s and receivers, with the biggest component being the O line.
That’s why I’m following the Vikings and Cousins. They have a good team,
and from all appearances management will do what it takes to win. From my perspective, our O line needs to be upgraded and the jury’s out on our new OC. It’s a short window to win here with most players in their prime and with key player contracts coming up in a couple of years. Long way to answer your question. The market is the market. We all judge performance through
our own lens. The more knowledgeable fans look at an entire body of work for the season based on all relevant facts. Question? I’ve never posted much. What do I do to answer you and my answer is right below your question? Thanks.

[PurpleMustReign]

Both are true, although Teddy looked pretty good as a rookie with Matt Asiata as his starter. I would argue Cousins hasn't proven he can win with or without a run game though. At least with Teddy and Case you know they are capable of leading a team to 10+ win season. We don't know Cousins is capable of that yet, but hopefully next year.

To be fair, Matt Asiata is a better RB than Murray, but still Teddy had a very poor offensive line, and overall very poor support from the skill positions.

Asiata is not a better rb than Murray.

[fiestavike]

To be fair, Matt Asiata is a better RB than Murray, but still Teddy had a very poor offensive line, and overall very poor support from the skill positions.

Asiata is not a better rb than Murray.

I'm willing to discuss if you'd like. I don't think its close, although Murray certainly has higher top end speed, Asiata is better at pretty much everything else.

[Mothman]

When it comes to resigning a qb like Stafford, ownership understands if they don’t, the fans will revolt in a way that’s financially damaging and they will be perceived as not wanting to win. How much does it affect Staffords performance when he knows they are not going to surround him with the talent he needs to win. I think after 10 years, he runs out the clock. He’s never been surrounded with the talent and given a chance to win. Is he worth $25m based on how he’s played. Probably not. The bigger question to me is always could the elite qb’s win in Detroit. I don’t think so. Detroit is a graveyard for any qb. I judge a qb based on the talent level of the O line, rb’s and receivers, with the biggest component being the O line.
That’s why I’m following the Vikings and Cousins. They have a good team,
and from all appearances management will do what it takes to win. From my perspective, our O line needs to be upgraded and the jury’s out on our new OC. It’s a short window to win here with most players in their prime and with key player contracts coming up in a couple of years. Long way to answer your question. The market is the market. We all judge performance through
our own lens. The more knowledgeable fans look at an entire body of work for the season based on all relevant facts. Question? I’ve never posted much. What do I do to answer you and my answer is right below your question? Thanks.

When you wish to respond to an existing post (comment), simply click on the quotation mark icon visible in the upper right of that post. It will quote the post and you can type your reply beneath the quoted text. The end result will be formatted just like my reply to you here.

[Rhodes Closed]

Are we actually having the "Asiata vs. Murray" discussion again?

Latavius Murray: 4.1 YPA
Matt Asiata: 3.5 YPA

End of story.

[The negotiator]

When it comes to resigning a qb like Stafford, ownership understands if they don’t, the fans will revolt in a way that’s financially damaging and they will be perceived as not wanting to win. How much does it affect Staffords performance when he knows they are not going to surround him with the talent he needs to win. I think after 10 years, he runs out the clock. He’s never been surrounded with the talent and given a chance to win. Is he worth $25m based on how he’s played. Probably not. The bigger question to me is always could the elite qb’s win in Detroit. I don’t think so. Detroit is a graveyard for any qb. I judge a qb based on the talent level of the O line, rb’s and receivers, with the biggest component being the O line.
That’s why I’m following the Vikings and Cousins. They have a good team,
and from all appearances management will do what it takes to win. From my perspective, our O line needs to be upgraded and the jury’s out on our new OC. It’s a short window to win here with most players in their prime and with key player contracts coming up in a couple of years. Long way to answer your question. The market is the market. We all judge performance through
our own lens. The more knowledgeable fans look at an entire body of work for the season based on all relevant facts. Question? I’ve never posted much. What do I do to answer you and my answer is right below your question? Thanks.

When you wish to respond to an existing post (comment), simply click on the quotation mark icon visible in the upper right of that post. It will quote the post and you can type your reply beneath the quoted text. The end result will be formatted just like my reply to you here.

Many thanks!