Vikings @ Panthers Game Day Discussion Thread -- Week 3

[chicagopurple]

Yo Moth! being the clear eyed, stodgy, realist is never sexy or popular.....But more often then not, you will be proven right in the end. I have the same overall opinion as yourself. Its not a fun perspective, but its likely the most correct viewpoint.

[Pondering Her Percy]

Not sure if anyone said this or not in this thread but Clemmings play pretty solid yesterday. I said this earlier last week regarding him. I have an odd feeling he is going to be pretty solid over there. Allowed just two hurries and one hit in 30 attempts. Not bad at all for his first start at LT. This would be huge if he could develop into a solid LT. It's one of the hardest positions to find and without a first round pick next year, there is a chance we'd have to re-sign Kalil. Lets hope Clemmings continues this type of play

[Nunin]

Not sure if anyone said this or not in this thread but Clemmings play pretty solid yesterday. I said this earlier last week regarding him. I have an odd feeling he is going to be pretty solid over there. Allowed just two hurries and one hit in 30 attempts. Not bad at all for his first start at LT. This would be huge if he could develop into a solid LT. It's one of the hardest positions to find and without a first round pick next year, there is a chance we'd have to re-sign Kalil. Lets hope Clemmings continues this type of play

Amen to that. I had a feeling he'd play better...maybe not so soon, but it's good news

[IrishViking]

Not sure if anyone said this or not in this thread but Clemmings play pretty solid yesterday. I said this earlier last week regarding him. I have an odd feeling he is going to be pretty solid over there. Allowed just two hurries and one hit in 30 attempts. Not bad at all for his first start at LT. This would be huge if he could develop into a solid LT. It's one of the hardest positions to find and without a first round pick next year, there is a chance we'd have to re-sign Kalil. Lets hope Clemmings continues this type of play

I was pleasantly surprised by the Oline in the second half. I think Clemmings maybe much better than an oft injured Kalil and they had some decent pass protections and the barest signs of life in the running game.

If they play as well as they did in the second half the entire game against the Giants I'll consider it a solid improvement

[Mothman]

I don't think it is fair to go back to last season with that stat. We have different players and different coaches. Granted, 3 TDs in 3 games this year is still concerning but we can take it just from when Bradford started we are 3 TDs in 2 games. Plus, with the defense and special teams scoring points, the coaches aren't taking unnecessary risks on offense when maybe we'd be putting up more points if the D wasn't as dominant.

But if we can't extend a stat like that back into last season, it deprives us of a fun fact like the one below!

http://www.espn.com/blog/minnesota-viki ... -nfls-best

The Vikings cannot be counted out of any game these days, even if their opponent is as formidable as the one they faced Sunday. They haven't given up more than 16 points in seven straight games, dating back to last December, and a team that didn't excel at creating turnovers last season has fashioned a plus-8 margin already this year. As the Vikings left Charlotte with a 22-10 win on Sunday, overcoming a 10-0 deficit and battering Cam Newton for eight sacks, their defense made a case it should be on a very short list of the league's best.

[Mothman]

Yo Moth! being the clear eyed, stodgy, realist is never sexy or popular.....But more often then not, you will be proven right in the end. I have the same overall opinion as yourself. Its not a fun perspective, but its likely the most correct viewpoint.

Thanks.

It's just how I prefer to enjoy the games but I do still enjoy them, as I'm sure you do too. For me, hype detracts from the game a little so I do my best to keep things in perspective but to each his own...

[PacificNorseWest]

The defense carried over their entire unit into this season from how it looked to end last season, whereas the offensive personnel looks quite a bit different today as it did in Seattle for the Wild Card.

[Mothman]

The defense carried over their entire unit into this season from how it looked to end last season, whereas the offensive personnel looks quite a bit different today as it did in Seattle for the Wild Card.

I tried to lightheartedly post a positive stat about the defense and I still got grief.

It's been one of the league's weaker offenses for the past 2 years. That trend is continuing. If you guys think it's unfair to consider what we've seen the past 2 years and feel we need to say the trend is only 3 weeks old because the offensive personnel has changed somewhat, fine. It doesn't make it any less problematic.

Meanwhile, go defense! Am I right, fellas?

[PacificNorseWest]

Meanwhile, go defense! Am I right, fellas?

Yes.

I'm just saying. The defense remains intact. The offense has new and integral pieces, including the signal caller. Line takes time to gel. The result is the same right now, but the circumstances completely different. I believe that's a fair evaluation.

[IrishViking]

I tried to lightheartedly post a positive stat about the defense and I still got grief.

It's been one of the league's weaker offenses for the past 2 years. That trend is continuing. If you guys think it's unfair to consider what we've seen the past 2 years and feel we need to say the trend is only 3 weeks old because the offensive personnel has changed somewhat, fine. It doesn't make it any less problematic.

Meanwhile, go defense! Am I right, fellas?

I understood what you were saying. The defense has been stout. For the offense I will say, regardless of pieces they are moving in the right direction for a passing attack. Bridgewater averaged under .85 TDs per game last year. Bradford is at 1.5. Yards per game is up. Average pass distance is up. Its good to see.

Like I said before. The Oline even looked, dare I say... Serviceable in the second half versus a supposedly decent front line for the Panthers. The Running attack looked moderately better in the second half. If the trendline continues we could see A "I could live with this" offensive showing on Monday.

[halfgiz]

Not sure if anyone said this or not in this thread but Clemmings play pretty solid yesterday. I said this earlier last week regarding him. I have an odd feeling he is going to be pretty solid over there. Allowed just two hurries and one hit in 30 attempts. Not bad at all for his first start at LT. This would be huge if he could develop into a solid LT. It's one of the hardest positions to find and without a first round pick next year, there is a chance we'd have to re-sign Kalil. Lets hope Clemmings continues this type of play

T.J. Clemmings was Vikings' best tackle on the field in first start for Matt Kalil. Allowed just two hurries, one hit on 30 pass pro snaps.
It's a good start for him. But consistency is what it comes down to at LT and we will have to see what happens in the coming weeks. I'm sure he will be challenged more in the future.

Hat's off to Sirles too, for playing a decent game.

[halfgiz]

It's been one of the league's weaker offenses for the past 2 years. That trend is continuing. If you guys think it's unfair to consider what we've seen the past 2 years and feel we need to say the trend is only 3 weeks old because the offensive personnel has changed somewhat, fine. It doesn't make it any less problematic.

Meanwhile, go defense! Am I right, fellas?

There's issues with the OL. Part of it has been coaching, though so far it has been difficult to see the progress under Sparano. Part of it is on Spielman, since he's been unwilling to allocate high draft picks to fixing the line, so we end up with a lot of day 3 picks, trades for backups, and lower tier FAs. I also wonder if there are scouting issues, because they haven't been able to field a good OL for at least 4 years if not longer. The Beaver pick is a fine example of that.

[S197]

Since some were asking about what they changed in the 2nd half:

The superb performance by the Vikings’ defense was the talk of the game, but the resiliency of the offense also deserved acknowledgement. This was the type of game the Vikings have played on the road for years and rarely won.

Yet, they beat the Panthers going away and they did it in part because an offense that couldn’t shoot straight for 30 minutes managed to get its act together during halftime.

One reason the Leslie Frazier and Christian Ponder era became maddening was because the typical postgame response after losses was that the mistakes were “easily correctable.” The obvious thought was that if things could be easily corrected why didn’t you correct them during the game?

That isn’t a problem with Zimmer and his coaching staff on both sides of the ball. Bradford, who finished 18 of 28 for 171 yards with the touchdown pass, said there were “definitely adjustments to be made at halftime.”

For instance, after targeting Kyle Rudolph only twice in the opening half, the tight end had eight passes directed his way in the final two quarters. Rudolph finished with seven receptions for 70 yards after catching only one pass for 4 yards in the first half.

“You look at what we came out and did in the second half,” Bradford said. “We got to some of our quicker stuff, we got to empty (in the backfield) a few times, we tried to spread them out. As much zone coverage as they were playing, we felt like there was some air in there if we could get to space and kind of spread them out. I think that’s kind of what we did.”

http://www.1500espn.com/vikings-2/2016/ ... et-groove/

More at the link. Another interesting tidbit from the article, Carolina had won 14 straight at home before Sunday.

[Nunin]

I think they even went no huddle for a bit in that opening drive of the 3rd qtr...which is a good move to help a QB and line IMO

[fiestavike]

There's issues with the OL. Part of it has been coaching, though so far it has been difficult to see the progress under Sparano. Part of it is on Spielman, since he's been unwilling to allocate high draft picks to fixing the line, so we end up with a lot of day 3 picks, trades for backups, and lower tier FAs. I also wonder if there are scouting issues, because they haven't been able to field a good OL for at least 4 years if not longer. The Beaver pick is a fine example of that.

The run blocking has not been good, but there has been clear and marked improvement in pass protection. I think we'll see some more running room against NYG this monday, and hopefully they can get the run game going as we head into the bye week.

The personnel is, if at all, only marginally better, so I'm inclined to assume Sparano does have something to do with the improvements.