Texans @ Vikings Game Day Discussion Thread -- Preseason #1

[Demi]

Yeah, Ponder over threw Simpson slightly, but I agree pulling him out after 2 snaps is dumb on the coaches part.

He's a head case. You have to limit him when he goes retarded as much as possible or he'll go all flappy in the head.

Cassel is going to push ponder. that's good.

Fat chance. It's Tjoke all over again. Ponder will start until he proves beyond a reasonable doubt he's a bum and the year is done. Then Cassell will get a chance.

Ponder is mentally weak and physically scrubbish. Good luck with that twit. We're screwed...Cassell might give us a chance at a playoff spot...if that even matters.

Wooo.

[Reignman]

I just got off work but...........................WHY THE MOTHER EFFIN HELLBLAZING BLUE BALLS WOULD YOU TAKE OUT PONDER AFTER 2 PASS ATTEMPTS??

I mean is he hurt? WTF. This guy needs REPS. Like crazy. Against any kind of defense that he can possibly get. 1st, 2nd, 3rd, college back ups, dont' matter. He isn't good enough to sit after 2 attempts!! He hasn't proven he's the future. He needs reps! WTFFF Frazier you clown! I better not see this $hit again next game! Sorry for my rant, but wow it just makes zero sense!

Exactly! I'll never understand this. We did this same crap with TJoke too. I get that you don't want to get guys injured in the preseason, but when those guys clearly need reps, is it really a risk to keep em in a little longer? Also they yanked him after an INT. If a guys 1st series is done that quick and ends on a bad note, wouldn't it be a good idea to send him out there for 1 more series and possibly end on a better note and maybe with some momentum?

Oh and I watched the game on NBC and the uniforms looked blue to me too, but the helmets were definitely purple. However, on some replays the uniforms looked purple like the helmets. On the same TV last year the uniforms and helmets were the shame shade of purple, so I don't know what's going on. It is a bit annoying. Overall I'm not a fan of the new design, but at least I'm not a Jags fan. Damn I don't know what they were thinking with those half tan half black helmets.

[Demi]

I'll never understand this. We did this same crap with TJoke too.

They aren't mentally strong. You can't let them get wacky in the head. They're both scrubs. You don't let scrubs just keep digging themselves into a hole. You get them out of there! Look at their careers. You have to do as much as you can to prop them up and convince them they aren't the bums they are.

Flushed 5 years down the toilet with TJoke, and 5 with Ponder. No Favre to bail us out this time (well, Manning, but blah blah whatever), Bridgewater? nah. Won't be early enough. We're doomed. We need a 3 win season along with some damn good luck to manage it in a quarterback heavy draft.

One franchise QB in this teams history...and he managed a few super bowls. After that? Favre for one good year. One play away from a super bowl. And dicked around with the position for 46 years. Wooo. So depressing. Who knows. 5 years? 10? 20? until we manage to get a top 10 QB back in here?

[Reignman]

They aren't mentally strong. You can't let them get wacky in the head. They're both scrubs. You don't let scrubs just keep digging themselves into a hole. You get them out of there! Look at their careers. You have to do as much as you can to prop them up and convince them they aren't the bums they are.

I see what you're getting at, but as we've proven last year, no matter how much you try to talk a guy up, it doesn't translate to better production. "Scrubs" need more reps/practice or they'll remain scrubs.

But when Ponder was digging himself and the Vikings deep holes in the Seahawks, Bears, and Packers games last year, how come Frazier didn't get him out of there when we still had a shot to win? This is the same guy (Frazier) that said "It didn't occur to him to go to Webb" late in the 4th quarter of the Packers game when Ponder was sitting at 60yds passing with a division title still in reach.

And what do you mean bum? Didn't Ponder play like a pro bowler in those final 4 games last year? LOL, sorry I couldn't resist that last one. It still cracks me up when I hear people try to argue how well he played during that stretch like the rest of us don't have eyes or a memory.

I agree with everything else you said though.

[Hunter Morrow]

How do we have the best running back of his decade and a bottom 5 quarterback?

If we had even a top 10 or 15 quarterback we could win a Super Bowl but we're just gonna
piss away the finest RB of his generation with Shartvarious Jokeson 2.0

Imagine this team with Andy Dalton or Carson Palmer.

I'm not saying imagine the team if we were starting Tom Brady. I'm just saying, imagine if we just
started the very definition of 15th quarterback in the league.

[Reignman]

Shartvarious Jokeson 2.0

Rofl, that's good stuff. But be careful, your whole post is fighting words around here. Also Shartvarious Jokeson 1.0 was a surprising 8/9 for 128yds and 2 TD's the other day. He's a late bloomer. In fact I had to double check to make sure it wasn't a different T.Jackson xD. I didn't know he was back with Seattle.

[Tark10]

Patterson looked good and seems to have a good presence on the field. Don't form any opinions on the projected starters as yet. I am surprised Ponder wasn't kept in a bit longer. After watching this team for 42 seasons, its hard to get accustomed to those flat finish helmets. They look dull and unfinished. Hopefully the team won't play the same way. Was Jennings even on the field?

[King James]

I see what you're getting at, but as we've proven last year, no matter how much you try to talk a guy up, it doesn't translate to better production. "Scrubs" need more reps/practice or they'll remain scrubs.

But when Ponder was digging himself and the Vikings deep holes in the Seahawks, Bears, and Packers games last year, how come Frazier didn't get him out of there when we still had a shot to win? This is the same guy (Frazier) that said "It didn't occur to him to go to Webb" late in the 4th quarter of the Packers game when Ponder was sitting at 60yds passing with a division title still in reach.

And what do you mean bum? Didn't Ponder play like a pro bowler in those final 4 games last year? LOL, sorry I couldn't resist that last one. It still cracks me up when I hear people try to argue how well he played during that stretch like the rest of us don't have eyes or a memory.

I agree with everything else you said though.

If you look back at the playoff game when Green Bay whooped us, THATS why Ponder didn't get pulled during the season..lol Joe Webb was even more terrible as a QB. The way I see Ponder getting pulled, is like Demi said, the team has to have finally had enough of him and Cassel would then get his chance to start. But of course if Cassel does ever start, im guessing we would have already lost so many games that we would only have a slight shot of making the playoffs.

[Mothman]

Maybe Ponder was told he'd play one series and that's just how it played out. But I would also like to hear a 'why for' on that one. I'll be really amazed if it's not one of the first questions asked of Fraizer.

Frazier was asked about it and said he was tempted to put Ponder back in but then he reminded himself why he had decided to only play him for one series. He didn't address it specifically beyond that but he immediately talked about how they'd have more chances to see the "ones" and about the need to evaluate some people on the roster. It sounds like he really wanted to see as much of the second and third units as possible.

You can hear his post-game comments on vikings.com:

http://www.vikings.com/media-vault/vide ... aa9fa235f2

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Tark10: Jennings didn't play.

It will definitely take time to adjust to the matte finish helmets.

[Mothman]

First preseason game you're looking at as many 2nd and 3rd stringers as possible. When they get an idea of who is advancing and who isn't the coaches can get an idea of their depth chart. That will affect decisions for the rest of the camp. In the second and third preseason games you spend more time on sharpening up your starters. The fourth is a quarter or so at full speed and then the rest of the game is spent looking at the spots on the depth chart where they still have questions.

Exactly! Good post.

[Reignman]

If you look back at the playoff game when Green Bay whooped us, THATS why Ponder didn't get pulled during the season..lol Joe Webb was even more terrible as a QB.

Ha, for your theory to be true, it would have to mean Frazier and co are terribly incompetent. If they knew Webb was that terrible, chose to keep him over Sage, and didn't do anything to find a better backup long before the playoff game, he shouldn't be a HC for an NFL franchise.

The truth is, nobody knew Webb was going to play that bad. Musgrave deserves some of the blame for trying to turn Webb into a pocket passer in the middle of a playoff game as if it were some meaningless preseason game. In the past Webb had proven to be a viable backup, like in the Philly game as a starter, the Skins game in relief, and the Lions game in relief. My theory goes like this ... perhaps if Webb had gotten some snaps late in some of those eggs that Ponder was laying, maybe he wouldn't have been so rusty in the playoff game. Heck maybe Webb even engineers a comeback or 2 and we're talking about a division title instead of another 1 and done 6th seed.

But yeah if you seriously believe Frazier knew Webb was that terrible and kept him on the roster as the #2, I want some of whatever it is you've been smoking xD.

[Reignman]

Exactly! Good post.

Yes in theory, if you're already set at starter, that approach makes sense. But when you look at the Vikings situation, Ponder is still a huge question mark. If you're still not quite sure what your starter brings to the table what's the point of giving the 2nd and 3rd stringers more time? Doesn't make much sense to me.

[Texas Vike]

Yes in theory, if you're already set at starter, that approach makes sense. But when you look at the Vikings situation, Ponder is still a huge question mark. If you're still not quite sure what your starter brings to the table what's the point of giving the 2nd and 3rd stringers more time? Doesn't make much sense to me.

Clearly Frazier sees Ponder differently from some of you. I also expected Ponder back out there after the first series was cut short by a poorly executed slant, but some of you are acting like there's a battle at QB. Frazier has made it clear that there is not.

My main concern from last night was our O-line. They had a hard time with the Texans' #1 D-line (w/o their superstar). Cassel had little to no time to get his throws off. He looked like Ponder last year---flustered. He did make some nice throws though when he had time. CP84 looked better than I'd anticipated, and it was interesting to see him used in a more traditional way (not bubble screens and such). That may change once the regular season starts, but for now he looks solid working different parts of the field.

[Mothman]

Yes in theory, if you're already set at starter, that approach makes sense. But when you look at the Vikings situation, Ponder is still a huge question mark. If you're still not quite sure what your starter brings to the table what's the point of giving the 2nd and 3rd stringers more time? Doesn't make much sense to me.

The point is to evaluate those second and third stringers. Cassel is new to the team and system so they probably want to get him plenty of reps this preseason. They may need him to play during the season. MBT and Vandenberg are competing for the #3 job and they obviously want to evaluate them.

There are questions about Ponder but as far as the Vikings themselves are concerned, they are set at starter going into this season. They've committed to Ponder. He'll get more reps in the second and third preseason games and he's getting starter's reps in practice. Another series or two against Houston last night wasn't going to make or break his season and keeping the starting QB in the first preseason game typically means keeping other starters in too. Maybe they didn't want to do that.

[The Breeze]

Frazier was asked about it and said he was tempted to put Ponder back in but then he reminded himself why he had decided to only play him for one series. He didn't address it specifically beyond that but he immediately talked about how they'd have more chances to see the "ones" and about the need to evaluate some people on the roster. It sounds like he really wanted to see as much of the second and third units as possible.

You can hear his post-game comments on vikings.com:

http://www.vikings.com/media-vault/vide ... aa9fa235f2

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Tark10: Jennings didn't play.

It will definitely take time to adjust to the matte finish helmets.

Thanks Jim, I caught a transcript of his comments this morn.

Interesting that the game in which most teams will give lots of reps to starters,we will be playing the Niners. That should be a real good litmus test.