Offseason Thread

[CharVike]

Here's an open question for the board - if you had to choose among bringing Spielman back, extending KAM, or hiring a different GM from around the NFL, which would you choose and why?

I think it is notable that nobody picked Spielman up after the Vikings let him go. I think it is equally notable to wonder what other teams around the league might jump at a guy like KAM were the Vikings to let him go. The comparisons between Spielman's performance and his lingering impact on the team's talent profile compared to KAM's performance and his impact are valid.

If you think about head coaches it is easier because their performance is more directly tied to a team's ultimate win-loss record, but in general good coaches are in demand. They don't have to be objectively great coaches - just good. If the Vikings were to have let KOC walk, for example, does anyone doubt he would have had multiple job offers waiting for him around the league?

Can the same be said for KAM?

Speilman was Mr trade down collecting as many 7th rounders as he could. 2 years with 4 of them and 2 with 3. Nobody will give that a job. It's plain stupidity. KAM is actually worse because he can't hit on anything. Even his best pick comes with side issues and who knows what's next with him. Nothing would surprise me. If JJM turns out to be a super star and can take our team to the Super Bowl this season then KAM wins easily and should be given the keys to the city along with a gold plated office on the top floor at the company complex. This is a 14 win team so it's doable. Without knowing what JJM is Speilman wins by a mile over data driven cue ball Kewsi. So I would go brand new and look at the Eagles or Chiefs or Ravens for a guy. Those 3 teams can build rosters and it starts with the draft.

[CharVike]

Grant Udinski hired as Jax OC.

[Cliff]

Are they built as a "win now" team though? What do you mean by that? They are winning now, which is great, but they drafted a QB in the last draft. Before they started winning games last season they were considered a "rebuilding team". They've got a lot of cap space to make moves. Some of their "core" pieces are signed for the next 3 or 4 years (Darrisaw, Jefferson, Greenard, Hockenson). With many others signed through 2026. I'm sure they expect McCarthy and Turner to be "core" players as well and if that turns out to be true they're both signed through 2028.

What I mean by win now is signing veteran high dollar players to fill open spots. I don't see many young players in our lineup. Of course that will change with JJM and Turner in there this season. Perhaps Mekhi Blackmon and the other young CB will be in the lineup. That will be a tremendous savings as well. The Commanders were also in rebuild and made it to the Champ game. They knocked off the best team in the NFC in the playoffs also. Who saw that? The Rams got zero respect and won a playoff game easily. They gave the Eagles a good fight. Losing their rookie DT that game hurt them big time. Nobody expected them to draft like they did. Just as for us there wasn't a person out there that expected Sammy to play like he did. He had a tremendous season
which was so far out of his expectation it could be called a miracle one off. That helped us big time. The entire team rallied around him. It was great to see for a change and excellent entertainment.
A guy I forgot Cashman, He was tremendous. When he missed games we got beat.

Are you expecting that to happen? The highest paid players on the Vikings are Jefferson (25), Darrisaw (25), O'Neill (25), Greenard (26), Hockenson (26). Everybody else on the team is making under 10m per season. Byron Murphy will probably get a good contract but he's 25. Any younger than that and you're talking about guys still on rookie contracts. Whether you're extending players you drafted yourself (Jefferson, O'Neill, Darrisaw) or paying other players coming off of a rookie contract (Hockenson, Greenard) you're going to be paying some players big contracts.

[Cliff]

Here's an open question for the board - if you had to choose among bringing Spielman back, extending KAM, or hiring a different GM from around the NFL, which would you choose and why?

I think it is notable that nobody picked Spielman up after the Vikings let him go. I think it is equally notable to wonder what other teams around the league might jump at a guy like KAM were the Vikings to let him go. The comparisons between Spielman's performance and his lingering impact on the team's talent profile compared to KAM's performance and his impact are valid.

If you think about head coaches it is easier because their performance is more directly tied to a team's ultimate win-loss record, but in general good coaches are in demand. They don't have to be objectively great coaches - just good. If the Vikings were to have let KOC walk, for example, does anyone doubt he would have had multiple job offers waiting for him around the league?

Can the same be said for KAM?

I think I would let KAM go through the 2025 season as per his contract and then offer him a new one if things go well. If he decides not to take it and go elsewhere he hasn't done so well that I would worry much about it and work with KOC on bringing in someone else. I definitely wouldn't bring Spielman back.

[VikingLord]

If JJM turns out to be a super star and can take our team to the Super Bowl this season then KAM wins easily and should be given the keys to the city along with a gold plated office on the top floor at the company complex. This is a 14 win team so it's doable. Without knowing what JJM is Speilman wins by a mile over data driven cue ball Kewsi. So I would go brand new and look at the Eagles or Chiefs or Ravens for a guy. Those 3 teams can build rosters and it starts with the draft.

I don't know if its that simple. This *was* a 14 win team. With all of the turnover that is going to happen on defense, the lack of a clear impact player at RB, the the interior OL issues that remain unaddressed heading into this offseason, and as of right now only 3 picks in the 2025 draft, two of which are 5th rounders, KAM has his work cut out for him well beyond whether McCarthy turns out to be the real deal next year. Even if McCarthy is a stud at QB, it's going to be hard to deal with all of those other issues purely in free agency without taking a big step back somewhere.

KAM said he believes he's laid a solid foundation for the team going forward. Next season will illustrate if he knows what he's talking about.

[J. Kapp 11]

I’m not here to defend KAM, but let’s be fair. Spielman’s players include Jefferson, Darrisaw, O’Neill, Bradbury, Harry and Bynum. That’s it. Every other starter was either drafted or acquired by KAM.

Look guys, he’s going to get extended. It’s not a matter of if, but when. We might as well get used to the idea. It’s long been a tradition in the NFL that you don’t make news leading up to the Super Bowl. Once it’s over, they’ll announce his signing.

They can extend him to do his current duties like culture building which is a bunch of BS and there's not a person walking who can define it. It can't even be measured. Get somebody in here that understands player evaluation methods, value of draft slots so we don't give picks away again and everything else related to acquiring young talent via the draft process. This building a team through FA won't work. The cost is too high and there is a limited amount available.

Really? You can’t define culture building?

Allow me to help.

— A positive environment where players, coaches and other staff can thrive without fear of being humiliated or fired.
— Connection between players, coaches, and front office where doors are open.
— Communication, where players and coaches have open lines, and front office and coaches have open lines.
— Accountability. Not just players to coaches and coaches to front office, but to each other.
— Caring for one another (if you think this is bulls**t, then I would suggest it’s likely you never served in the military).

None of this has anything to do with Xs, Os, the draft, free agency, technique, strength or speed. It has everything to do with the answer to a very important question: Is this a place where people WANT to go to work every day? And the answer for the Vikings is unquestionably yes.

Now in fairness, Kevin O’Connell is the driving force behind much of this. But it doesn’t happen without a general manager who is just as committed to it. The Vikings employ more than 600 people. They all report to KAM. Only the players and coaches have KOC in the pipeline. Yet the Vikings have been at the top of the NFLPA’s survey of players for having the best work environment.

Finally, if you think none of this matters to the success of a football team, then I’m out of the conversation about KAM. I’m not a KAM-Stan, but I can look objectively at what he’s done right.

[J. Kapp 11]

Look guys, he’s going to get extended. It’s not a matter of if, but when. We might as well get used to the idea. It’s long been a tradition in the NFL that you don’t make news leading up to the Super Bowl. Once it’s over, they’ll announce his signing.

While that wouldn't surprise me, one would hope the Wilfs are not resigned to it just because they don't want to admit they made a bad move hiring him.

I don’t hope that … because I don’t agree it was a bad move.

[CharVike]

If JJM turns out to be a super star and can take our team to the Super Bowl this season then KAM wins easily and should be given the keys to the city along with a gold plated office on the top floor at the company complex. This is a 14 win team so it's doable. Without knowing what JJM is Speilman wins by a mile over data driven cue ball Kewsi. So I would go brand new and look at the Eagles or Chiefs or Ravens for a guy. Those 3 teams can build rosters and it starts with the draft.

I don't know if its that simple. This *was* a 14 win team. With all of the turnover that is going to happen on defense, the lack of a clear impact player at RB, the the interior OL issues that remain unaddressed heading into this offseason, and as of right now only 3 picks in the 2025 draft, two of which are 5th rounders, KAM has his work cut out for him well beyond whether McCarthy turns out to be the real deal next year. Even if McCarthy is a stud at QB, it's going to be hard to deal with all of those other issues purely in free agency without taking a big step back somewhere.

KAM said he believes he's laid a solid foundation for the team going forward. Next season will illustrate if he knows what he's talking about.

It's never simple. Every off season teams go through changes. That includes players and coaches. If KAM laid a solid foundation then there shouldn't be much to add or change. We need to replace Grant Udinski who stood by KOC.

[CharVike]

They can extend him to do his current duties like culture building which is a bunch of BS and there's not a person walking who can define it. It can't even be measured. Get somebody in here that understands player evaluation methods, value of draft slots so we don't give picks away again and everything else related to acquiring young talent via the draft process. This building a team through FA won't work. The cost is too high and there is a limited amount available.

Really? You can’t define culture building?

Allow me to help.

— A positive environment where players, coaches and other staff can thrive without fear of being humiliated or fired.
— Connection between players, coaches, and front office where doors are open.
— Communication, where players and coaches have open lines, and front office and coaches have open lines.
— Accountability. Not just players to coaches and coaches to front office, but to each other.
— Caring for one another (if you think this is bulls**t, then I would suggest it’s likely you never served in the military).

None of this has anything to do with Xs, Os, the draft, free agency, technique, strength or speed. It has everything to do with the answer to a very important question: Is this a place where people WANT to go to work every day? And the answer for the Vikings is unquestionably yes.

Now in fairness, Kevin O’Connell is the driving force behind much of this. But it doesn’t happen without a general manager who is just as committed to it. The Vikings employ more than 600 people. They all report to KAM. Only the players and coaches have KOC in the pipeline. Yet the Vikings have been at the top of the NFLPA’s survey of players for having the best work environment.

Finally, if you think none of this matters to the success of a football team, then I’m out of the conversation about KAM. I’m not a KAM-Stan, but I can look objectively at what he’s done right.

Thanks for the explanation and I agree KOC is the driving force. He was a player and coach of SB winning teams so he has seen that side of it. He understands the dynamics between players and what is needed to make it fit his vision. KAM on the other hand I'm not sure what he understands. I assume data, analytics and process. This is his background in the NFL.
NFL experience
San Francisco 49ers: 2013–2016 as manager of football research and development, and 2017–2019 as director of football research and development
Cleveland Browns: 2020–2021 as vice president of football operations
You're probably right and he will get extended like KOC to a 6 year never ending contract. Hopefully one of these years he hits a monster draft so we have players that can be developed and step in and help out.

[makila]

Here's an open question for the board - if you had to choose among bringing Spielman back, extending KAM, or hiring a different GM from around the NFL, which would you choose and why?

I think it is notable that nobody picked Spielman up after the Vikings let him go. I think it is equally notable to wonder what other teams around the league might jump at a guy like KAM were the Vikings to let him go. The comparisons between Spielman's performance and his lingering impact on the team's talent profile compared to KAM's performance and his impact are valid.

If you think about head coaches it is easier because their performance is more directly tied to a team's ultimate win-loss record, but in general good coaches are in demand. They don't have to be objectively great coaches - just good. If the Vikings were to have let KOC walk, for example, does anyone doubt he would have had multiple job offers waiting for him around the league?

Can the same be said for KAM?

I think I would let KAM go through the 2025 season as per his contract and then offer him a new one if things go well. If he decides not to take it and go elsewhere he hasn't done so well that I would worry much about it and work with KOC on bringing in someone else. I definitely wouldn't bring Spielman back.

Would you have any reservation letting KAM draft this year on a lame duck contract? I would be worried he would mortgage a lot of future for the now.

[VikingLord]

While that wouldn't surprise me, one would hope the Wilfs are not resigned to it just because they don't want to admit they made a bad move hiring him.

I don’t hope that … because I don’t agree it was a bad move.

I was talking more about the motivation behind that decision rather than stating my personal belief that hiring KAM was a bad move per se. Pride goeth before a fall, basically. The Wilfs keep KAM not because they believe KAM is doing a good job, but because they don't want to look bad.

I think KAM should not be extended this offseason. He should get the final year of his current deal to show what he can do and what, if he has one, his master plan is. If he does a good job, talk turkey before next offseason, and if someone else wants to scoop him up for a lot more, well, that would suck, but something tells me that is unlikely to happen.

[VikingLord]

I think I would let KAM go through the 2025 season as per his contract and then offer him a new one if things go well. If he decides not to take it and go elsewhere he hasn't done so well that I would worry much about it and work with KOC on bringing in someone else. I definitely wouldn't bring Spielman back.

Would you have any reservation letting KAM draft this year on a lame duck contract? I would be worried he would mortgage a lot of future for the now.

When could they ever get rid of an under-performer then? Fire him outright?

Plus, the Vikings have 3 total picks in this year's draft, four if one includes the compensatory pick they're likely to get. A bottom-half 1st, maybe a mid 3rd (compensatory), and two 5ths. One could argue that KAM already crossed the bridge of mortgaging a lot of the future for the now...

[cogitator]

I'll just throw this out there in the "Ain't never gonna happen" category. Rumor is Aaron Rodgers will be released by the Jets. Likely landing spots seem like Browns, Titans, Raiders, and most certainly not Vikings. That would create quite a clog at that position. In the thread I read this on, someone put up Rodgers stats side by side with Josh Allen, almost the same in yards, TDs, interceptions, completion percentage. Of course, Allen has that running ability.

[Cliff]

I think I would let KAM go through the 2025 season as per his contract and then offer him a new one if things go well. If he decides not to take it and go elsewhere he hasn't done so well that I would worry much about it and work with KOC on bringing in someone else. I definitely wouldn't bring Spielman back.

Would you have any reservation letting KAM draft this year on a lame duck contract? I would be worried he would mortgage a lot of future for the now.

Something like targeting players from other teams for 1st rounders next year and beyond? Signing them to cap-killing contracts that kick in later, etc?

Seems like it would be a good way to lose his job and then also not be hired by anybody else.

If the only reason you would extend a guy is so he doesn't blow your team's future up then go ahead and fire him.

[Cliff]

I'll just throw this out there in the "Ain't never gonna happen" category. Rumor is Aaron Rodgers will be released by the Jets. Likely landing spots seem like Browns, Titans, Raiders, and most certainly not Vikings. That would create quite a clog at that position. In the thread I read this on, someone put up Rodgers stats side by side with Josh Allen, almost the same in yards, TDs, interceptions, completion percentage. Of course, Allen has that running ability.

Nah, Rodgers is also looking to take control over the offense and roster to some degree. Even if it was just him the player it'd be a no, but him the player-coach-gm absolutely no.