Justin Jefferson

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Tommy TarkenKapp
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Re: Justin Jefferson

Post by Tommy TarkenKapp »

cogitator wrote: Tue Jun 11, 2024 1:29 pm
CharVike wrote: Mon Jun 10, 2024 8:18 pm
That's funny. With his BS talking about taking a pay cut to turn pro and stating he will only play for a few teams would turn me away if I was a GM.
I think he backpedaled on that only playing for a few teams statement. Which really means he meant it when he said it, then saw how much criticism he got and tried to do damage control by saying he didn't really mean it, or was misquoted, or whatever the usual thing people say when they step in it. I wonder if the pink fingernails might kind of turn off a few teammates.
I'm not sure he had to backpedal. I kind of remember some of this & I think he just mentioned there were some teams he would "prefer" to play for. I don't think the word "refused" was ever used. I could be wrong though. I think the Vikings were actually one of the teams cited. Makes sense. Given the talent the Vikes have at WR & TE. And having an offensive minded HC.
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Re: Justin Jefferson

Post by Tommy TarkenKapp »

makila wrote: Mon Jun 10, 2024 8:36 pm In all seriousness. Where did CW say he would only play for a few teams? Him. On record. Did his dad say things? Yes.

What are your thoughts on John Elway and Eli Manning?
About the only time I could condone a rookie QB pulling an Elway or Manning is if a top prospect QB got drafted by the Jets. And I'm not even kidding. That team has somehow bungled the drafting & development of young QBs for almost nearly four decades. Ken O'Brien was drafted by them in 1983. He had one or two really good years statistically but overall he was probably serviceable at best. Browning Nagle was a disaster as I recall. Chad Pennington wasn't great but he did OK for a few years. Mark Sanchez was not good at all. We know all about Sam Darnold & Zach Wilson. I refuse to believe that the Jets are simply unlucky in the drafting of QBs. They just can't develop QBs. That's why they're almost always looking for an already established vet QB in free agency or trade.
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Re: Justin Jefferson

Post by CharVike »

Tommy TarkenKapp wrote: Tue Jun 11, 2024 1:51 pm
cogitator wrote: Tue Jun 11, 2024 1:29 pm

I think he backpedaled on that only playing for a few teams statement. Which really means he meant it when he said it, then saw how much criticism he got and tried to do damage control by saying he didn't really mean it, or was misquoted, or whatever the usual thing people say when they step in it. I wonder if the pink fingernails might kind of turn off a few teammates.
I'm not sure he had to backpedal. I kind of remember some of this & I think he just mentioned there were some teams he would "prefer" to play for. I don't think the word "refused" was ever used. I could be wrong though. I think the Vikings were actually one of the teams cited. Makes sense. Given the talent the Vikes have at WR & TE. And having an offensive minded HC.
The stuff about only playing for 5 teams was posted on this site. The Bears were one of those teams so he has no reason to complain. We were one of those teams and that's probably why it was posted. The Giants were on it to. It could be junk stuff. I don't watch college ball or pay attention. But when that was posted Caleb didn't really play good ball. Starting when he couldn't beat Noter Dame. It did go quite because he wasn't playing good. I'm sure his agent told him to keep the chatter down or it may impact your draft spot and my commission. This entire draft class looks like 6 future HOFers. It never works that way. In today's world picking a QB is cheap. It's just another 1st round pick. There are no hold outs for monster deals. That's why it's no big deal to reach for a guy because you might get lucky. It seems luck is more important than anything else. The 49ers Lance pick No 3 vs Purdy the last draft pick. That shows how hard it is to evaluate QBs. What pisses me off the most about what this new group has done was turn the QB room into an empty space. That is beyond dumb. I've heard the Cousins sucks stuff and all the other negative BS. If he does suck he never would have made another 100 million. He would be on the street. Now we sit with nothing and will waste whatever talent we have at WR. Sure Slinging Sammy can be the next Mahomes. He won't come close to Cousins so people can forget that. He blows and is a backup who our dumb GM gave 10 million to. More than likely we reached for a guy who won't make it or will take 3+ years to figure it out like Jordan Love. Plus he had a solid vet to learn from and coaching. Our coaching turned Dobbs into a guy who they couldn't even put on the field. Mullens and his chicken wing arm is useless. But we saved 35 million in cap. Whoopee. I bet Addison was more productive with Cousins than the other stiffs our coaching put out there. Is it the WR or the QB? Depends on your view and expectations. I've seen Cunningham given a huge contract and then he laid down and counted the money. He was never a good passer but having 2 HOF WRs and a fantastic OL helped him. Do we have 2 HOF WRs? I doubt it. Our OL is still full of holes.
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VikingLord
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Re: Justin Jefferson

Post by VikingLord »

makila wrote: Mon Jun 10, 2024 6:16 pm
VikingLord wrote: Mon Jun 10, 2024 5:32 pm

True, but the great GMs see those pending flaws and avoid them at worst or exploit others' failure to see them at best. I wonder what the Bears could have gotten had they traded out of the 1st pick this year? And let's say they traded out, got that stash, and still ended up then drafting a great QB? The Bears GM would be legend, taking his place (rightfully) among the GM gods.

I do wonder whether Williams is another fool's gold college QB. A guy with tons of talent but who is essentially uncoachable and is despised by his teammates because he's arrogant, selfish and unreliable.
That is not at all how his teammates at OU felt. I can't speak first hand to what happened after he left here however.
There were some stories about Williams before he came out that raised some eyebrows. As with all things, the proof will be on the field, and on the bright side for Williams, while the Bears aren't a great overall team (yet), he's got a lot to work with coming in. But he's still going to be one of those guys thrust into franchise savior mode immediately, and if he's ill-suited to handle that pressure, the odds of him flaming out go way up.
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Re: Justin Jefferson

Post by makila »

He never said he'd only play for certain teams. He said he preferred to play for certain teams. Every prospect has preferred destinations. His dad was the one who made NIL comments.

CW, and Carl, wanted him to be the #1 pick. That's all they cared about. For better or worse. It was their goal before he enrolled in college. Everything was posturing.

And you think NFL locker rooms care about off the field? If you help them win nothing else matters.
VikingLord wrote: Tue Jun 11, 2024 4:03 pm
makila wrote: Mon Jun 10, 2024 6:16 pm

That is not at all how his teammates at OU felt. I can't speak first hand to what happened after he left here however.
There were some stories about Williams before he came out that raised some eyebrows. As with all things, the proof will be on the field, and on the bright side for Williams, while the Bears aren't a great overall team (yet), he's got a lot to work with coming in. But he's still going to be one of those guys thrust into franchise savior mode immediately, and if he's ill-suited to handle that pressure, the odds of him flaming out go way up.
Agree proof will be on the field. 100%. It's all that matters at this point.

CW gave a large chunk of his NIL at OU to his oline. As an example. I respect the hell out of you VL. Not on this one though. Bash the on-field play and antics all you want.

I have issue with how he handled himself after losses. On the field and in media sessions. Now I know for fact Lincoln Riley is a massive control freak and limits and/or denies media access. He also doesn't bring players out to post game press conferences when I personally think they need to be held accountable more. I think there are some flags here though on handling failure.

Sorry for passionate responses. I've bit my tongue with most of the CW personal bashing on these boards. Rip him apart on the field all you want. I'd guess no one here has spoken with him face to face, yet can tell us what he was thinking? My tiny bit of insight does come from players and others in the OU program.
Last edited by makila on Tue Jun 11, 2024 9:17 pm, edited 5 times in total.
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Re: Justin Jefferson

Post by CharVike »

Here is were some of this CW stuff on this board came from.
https://x.com/NFCNorthNewss
He never said a thing. I don't think this is an NFL news source. Looks like people having fun. It don't matter to me. The Bears made the choice. We made our choice. Looks like the fight for the bottom will be Bears/Vikings. I don't expect a prime time game after the crap show we put on when the fans threw a fit watching that train wreck game. We lost 12-10. Bears and Fields couldn't score a TD and we had no offense from our KOC game plan. This was Dobbs at his almost worse. The worst was that Raider 3-0 slugfest. I never thought that could be possible from an offensive minded HC in year 2023. Maybe 1971 in a white out blizzard.
Last edited by CharVike on Tue Jun 11, 2024 8:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Justin Jefferson

Post by makila »

Wow. I've got a little free time I guess...
CharVike wrote: Tue Jun 11, 2024 3:32 pm The stuff about only playing for 5 teams was posted on this site. The Bears were one of those teams so he has no reason to complain. We were one of those teams and that's probably why it was posted. The Giants were on it to. It could be junk stuff.
The "stuff" you keep regurgitating isn't accurate. It's rumors and hearsay. You can choose to believe whatever you want of course, we are grown adults. He said he had preferred teams he wanted to play QB for. Who the hell doesn't have a preferred destination on where they'll be spending their career/life?
CharVike wrote: Tue Jun 11, 2024 3:32 pm I don't watch college ball or pay attention. But when that was posted Caleb didn't really play good ball. Starting when he couldn't beat Noter Dame. It did go quite because he wasn't playing good.
Ok, so you didn't pay attention and don't watch college football. Are you drawing a conclusions off something you don't watch or pay attention to? What about the year before when he did beat ND? How does that work?

It's almost like.... a college football player's team result against another college program has little to no bearing on their NFL team's success. Keep on calling the front office and coaches dumb though. When you admit you don't watch or pay attention to college football. Makes sense when talking about draft and college prospects.
CharVike wrote: Tue Jun 11, 2024 3:32 pm I'm sure his agent told him to keep the chatter down or it may impact your draft spot and my commission.
You're "sure" you know what his agent told him? Wowzer, I'd go buy some lottery tickets with those abilities.
CharVike wrote: Tue Jun 11, 2024 3:32 pm This entire draft class looks like 6 future HOFers.
Just QBs? All players? What's this statement based on? Or about?
CharVike wrote: Tue Jun 11, 2024 3:32 pm It never works that way. In today's world picking a QB is cheap. It's just another 1st round pick. There are no hold outs for monster deals. That's why it's no big deal to reach for a guy because you might get lucky. It seems luck is more important than anything else. The 49ers Lance pick No 3 vs Purdy the last draft pick. That shows how hard it is to evaluate QBs.
I do agree it's very hard to evaluate QBs. For multiple reasons. The margin between being successful and not is razor thin at QB. One of the hardest positions to play in any sport.

The rookie scale contracts after the Bradford #1 contract is what changed the hold outs.
CharVike wrote: Tue Jun 11, 2024 3:32 pm What pisses me off the most about what this new group has done was turn the QB room into an empty space. That is beyond dumb.
That's fair. We don't have much of anything with proven track records there. The two with NFL tape (Darnold and Mullens) have been a bust and a backup at best respectively.

I am in the camp of resetting the roster to get us out of cap hell we've been in. That meant re-evaluating how the roster was built top to bottom. I'd have preferred the first year of KAM and KOC they separated at QB. 13 wins sure was fun though right? Right? Ok it was fun, just any objective fan knew it was fools gold. I am also in the camp of trying to see if you can build a roster out around a cheaper QB until they are ready for their big contract (assuming they have success).
CharVike wrote: Tue Jun 11, 2024 3:32 pm I've heard the Cousins sucks stuff and all the other negative BS. If he does suck he never would have made another 100 million. He would be on the street.

Agreed! Don't think he sucks. Don't think he's HOF. There's a middle ground fwiw. Kirks gone though.
CharVike wrote: Tue Jun 11, 2024 3:32 pm Now we sit with nothing and will waste whatever talent we have at WR. Sure Slinging Sammy can be the next Mahomes. He won't come close to Cousins so people can forget that. He blows and is a backup who our dumb GM gave 10 million to.
Huh? He could be the next Mahomes, but won't come close to Kirk? He got 10m, for one year. How does his contract make or break anything for this team? 10M in today's nfl at a QB spot, even for a #2 qb, is minimal.

Per overthecap.com, Darnolds 2024 cash value at QB is #23, and his cap hit is #33. That's what you are complaining about?

These are the 5 QBs above him in cash value this year:
Tua Tagovailoa
Geno Smith
Gardner Minshew
Bo Nix
Jordan Love

The 5 below him:
Jacoby Brissett
Tyrod Taylor
Marcus Mariota
Jarrett Stidham
Trevor Lawrence

Seems pretty on par money with the QBs around him. Definitely debatable though. Not a hill I'd die on.
CharVike wrote: Tue Jun 11, 2024 3:32 pm More than likely we reached for a guy who won't make it or will take 3+ years to figure it out like Jordan Love. Plus he had a solid vet to learn from and coaching. Our coaching turned Dobbs into a guy who they couldn't even put on the field. Mullens and his chicken wing arm is useless. But we saved 35 million in cap. Whoopee.
Well yeah, Mullens is a late round pick, backup QB. What's your expectation there? Same with Dobbs. There's a reason he has played for like 1/3rd of the NFL teams. Yet our staff is the problem? The dude is a backup journey man who couldn't catch on with any of the dozen chances he got with NFL teams before. People lost their minds last year after 1-2 games ignoring the extensive tape that alreaedy existed. I didn't get. I said it here then.

You're upset they went the budget route because you wanted to spend more? It's about having flexibility beyond this year. Signing a large vet qb contract would hamstring that future flexibility. Darnold won't be here after this year.
CharVike wrote: Tue Jun 11, 2024 3:32 pm I bet Addison was more productive with Cousins than the other stiffs our coaching put out there. Is it the WR or the QB? Depends on your view and expectations.
How about we see the results on the field before knee jerking much?
Sometimes you take one step backwards, to take two forward.
CharVike wrote: Tue Jun 11, 2024 3:32 pm I've seen Cunningham given a huge contract and then he laid down and counted the money. He was never a good passer but having 2 HOF WRs and a fantastic OL helped him. Do we have 2 HOF WRs? I doubt it. Our OL is still full of holes.
No clue what your point about Cunningham is supposed to be.

You can be as pissed as you want. It's your blood pressure. It's the boat we are in now regardless. Harping on how dumb you think they are isn't going to change it either.

I do agree wholeheartedly about oline. Not as many holes as in the past. The OTs, it's health. They gotta stay on the field. Interior needs to improve (both o and d lines fwiw). We need a freaking guard to be pissed off, and actually well rounded as a player, not just one dimensional.
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Re: Justin Jefferson

Post by CharVike »

makila wrote: Tue Jun 11, 2024 8:46 pm Wow. I've got a little free time I guess...
CharVike wrote: Tue Jun 11, 2024 3:32 pm The stuff about only playing for 5 teams was posted on this site. The Bears were one of those teams so he has no reason to complain. We were one of those teams and that's probably why it was posted. The Giants were on it to. It could be junk stuff.
The "stuff" you keep regurgitating isn't accurate. It's rumors and hearsay. You can choose to believe whatever you want of course, we are grown adults. He said he had preferred teams he wanted to play QB for. Who the hell doesn't have a preferred destination on where they'll be spending their career/life?
CharVike wrote: Tue Jun 11, 2024 3:32 pm I don't watch college ball or pay attention. But when that was posted Caleb didn't really play good ball. Starting when he couldn't beat Noter Dame. It did go quite because he wasn't playing good.
Ok, so you didn't pay attention and don't watch college football. Are you drawing a conclusions off something you don't watch or pay attention to? What about the year before when he did beat ND? How does that work?

It's almost like.... a college football player's team result against another college program has little to no bearing on their NFL team's success. Keep on calling the front office and coaches dumb though. When you admit you don't watch or pay attention to college football. Makes sense when talking about draft and college prospects.
CharVike wrote: Tue Jun 11, 2024 3:32 pm I'm sure his agent told him to keep the chatter down or it may impact your draft spot and my commission.
You're "sure" you know what his agent told him? Wowzer, I'd go buy some lottery tickets with those abilities.
CharVike wrote: Tue Jun 11, 2024 3:32 pm This entire draft class looks like 6 future HOFers.
Just QBs? All players? What's this statement based on? Or about?
CharVike wrote: Tue Jun 11, 2024 3:32 pm It never works that way. In today's world picking a QB is cheap. It's just another 1st round pick. There are no hold outs for monster deals. That's why it's no big deal to reach for a guy because you might get lucky. It seems luck is more important than anything else. The 49ers Lance pick No 3 vs Purdy the last draft pick. That shows how hard it is to evaluate QBs.
I do agree it's very hard to evaluate QBs. For multiple reasons. The margin between being successful and not is razor thin at QB. One of the hardest positions to play in any sport.

The rookie scale contracts after the Bradford #1 contract is what changed the hold outs.
CharVike wrote: Tue Jun 11, 2024 3:32 pm What pisses me off the most about what this new group has done was turn the QB room into an empty space. That is beyond dumb.
That's fair. We don't have much of anything with proven track records there. The two with NFL tape (Darnold and Mullens) have been a bust and a backup at best respectively.

I am in the camp of resetting the roster to get us out of cap hell we've been in. That meant re-evaluating how the roster was built top to bottom. I'd have preferred the first year of KAM and KOC they separated at QB. 13 wins sure was fun though right? Right? Ok it was fun, just any objective fan knew it was fools gold. I am also in the camp of trying to see if you can build a roster out around a cheaper QB until they are ready for their big contract (assuming they have success).
CharVike wrote: Tue Jun 11, 2024 3:32 pm I've heard the Cousins sucks stuff and all the other negative BS. If he does suck he never would have made another 100 million. He would be on the street.

Agreed! Don't think he sucks. Don't think he's HOF. There's a middle ground fwiw. Kirks gone though.
CharVike wrote: Tue Jun 11, 2024 3:32 pm Now we sit with nothing and will waste whatever talent we have at WR. Sure Slinging Sammy can be the next Mahomes. He won't come close to Cousins so people can forget that. He blows and is a backup who our dumb GM gave 10 million to.
Huh? He could be the next Mahomes, but won't come close to Kirk? He got 10m, for one year. How does his contract make or break anything for this team? 10M in today's nfl at a QB spot, even for a #2 qb, is minimal.

Per overthecap.com, Darnolds 2024 cash value at QB is #23, and his cap hit is #33. That's what you are complaining about?

These are the 5 QBs above him in cash value this year:
Tua Tagovailoa
Geno Smith
Gardner Minshew
Bo Nix
Jordan Love

The 5 below him:
Jacoby Brissett
Tyrod Taylor
Marcus Mariota
Jarrett Stidham
Trevor Lawrence

Seems pretty on par money with the QBs around him. Definitely debatable though. Not a hill I'd die on.
CharVike wrote: Tue Jun 11, 2024 3:32 pm More than likely we reached for a guy who won't make it or will take 3+ years to figure it out like Jordan Love. Plus he had a solid vet to learn from and coaching. Our coaching turned Dobbs into a guy who they couldn't even put on the field. Mullens and his chicken wing arm is useless. But we saved 35 million in cap. Whoopee.
Well yeah, Mullens is a late round pick, backup QB. What's your expectation there? Same with Dobbs. There's a reason he has played for like 1/3rd of the NFL teams. Yet our staff is the problem? The dude is a backup journey man who couldn't catch on with any of the dozen chances he got with NFL teams before. People lost their minds last year after 1-2 games ignoring the extensive tape that alreaedy existed. I didn't get. I said it here then.

You're upset they went the budget route because you wanted to spend more? It's about having flexibility beyond this year. Signing a large vet qb contract would hamstring that future flexibility. Darnold won't be here after this year.
CharVike wrote: Tue Jun 11, 2024 3:32 pm I bet Addison was more productive with Cousins than the other stiffs our coaching put out there. Is it the WR or the QB? Depends on your view and expectations.
How about we see the results on the field before knee jerking much?
Sometimes you take one step backwards, to take two forward.
CharVike wrote: Tue Jun 11, 2024 3:32 pm I've seen Cunningham given a huge contract and then he laid down and counted the money. He was never a good passer but having 2 HOF WRs and a fantastic OL helped him. Do we have 2 HOF WRs? I doubt it. Our OL is still full of holes.
No clue what your point about Cunningham is supposed to be.

You can be as pissed as you want. It's your blood pressure. It's the boat we are in now regardless. Harping on how dumb you think they are isn't going to change it either.

I do agree wholeheartedly about oline. Not as many holes as in the past. The OTs, it's health. They gotta stay on the field. Interior needs to improve (both o and d lines fwiw). We need a freaking guard to be pissed off, and actually well rounded as a player, not just one dimensional.
I made some stupid statements like the Cunningham stuff and I apologize for that. We will see shortly how smart this new organization is. This year will not be very entertaining for me. We are basically just playing the year out. I've seen decades of that. I would have kept our QB so that we could at least battle teams. If we go backwards fall to pick No 1. Even with JJM draft another QB. Of course no team will do that. Only Landry had a couple drafted studs Morton/Stuaback. Your right this is the boat we are in. If a fan don't like it jump off. I feel we could have competed this year. Now it's play the string out and hoping JJM gets in late like game 12 and lights it up. That's possible.
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Re: Justin Jefferson

Post by VikingLord »

makila wrote: Tue Jun 11, 2024 6:29 pm Sorry for passionate responses. I've bit my tongue with most of the CW personal bashing on these boards. Rip him apart on the field all you want. I'd guess no one here has spoken with him face to face, yet can tell us what he was thinking? My tiny bit of insight does come from players and others in the OU program.
For my part I'm not saying Williams is that kind of player, which is why I said we have to wait and see how things pan out in Chicago with him. He may very well turn out to be one of the greatest QBs to ever play the game for all I know. Had the Vikings had the 1st pick in this last draft I would have expected them to take Williams and would have been upset if they hadn't. I wouldn't say that unless I believed he was worth that pick.

On a slightly related note, OU is my alma mater. It's been a while but I'll always remember my college years as some of the best of my life. Still remember going to the football games on Saturdays. Boomer Sooner!
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Re: Justin Jefferson

Post by makila »

VikingLord wrote: Wed Jun 12, 2024 4:53 pm
makila wrote: Tue Jun 11, 2024 6:29 pm Sorry for passionate responses. I've bit my tongue with most of the CW personal bashing on these boards. Rip him apart on the field all you want. I'd guess no one here has spoken with him face to face, yet can tell us what he was thinking? My tiny bit of insight does come from players and others in the OU program.
On a slightly related note, OU is my alma mater. It's been a while but I'll always remember my college years as some of the best of my life. Still remember going to the football games on Saturdays. Boomer Sooner!
Woooo nice! Boomer Sooner! They've built out the rest of stadium on the south (Lindsey) side now, it's all "bowled in". Gets even louder!

I've been in Norman about 25 years (I am an alum). My wife about 30 years living in town (she's osu alum). Older kid went to OU as well, graduated some years ago. Our younger one is there now, just finished second year.
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Re: Justin Jefferson

Post by cogitator »

This is different. Justin Jefferson - supermodel.

Cincinnati Bengals quarterback Joe Burrow and Minnesota Vikings wide receiver Justin Jefferson stepped out of their "comfort zones" over the weekend by walking in the Vogue World fashion show during Paris Fashion Week.

Both Burrow and Jefferson are known for their style when they show up to their respective NFL games each season, but strutting in front of thousands of people in Paris was something they did not expect to do.

https://www.si.com/nfl/joe-burrow-justi ... shion-show