Lions at Vikings

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CharVike
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Re: Lions at Vikings

Post by CharVike »

chicagopurple wrote: Fri Dec 22, 2023 8:47 am The Lion will obliterate us in both games we play with them. Their HC is twice the HC of KO. Didnt some of you want him for COTY :lol: Lioms are still in the hunt for home field advantage and are happy AF they have the Vikings to play 2 times.

The Vikings need new ownership before anything will really chance. Competitive Rebuild my as$
This is one of those times where I am in total agreement with you. The Wilfs have shown Zero ability in owning a football team with their absurd long term devotion to our previous GM who shall remain nameless. Now they will likely spend another decade with KOC and Kawesi, unable to admit their own errors and drafting losers and ignoring the fundamental importance of their Front lines. AND I am very afraid they are about to spend a zillion dollars on a long term extension on Pocket Kirk.....aaaaargh
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Wilf bought the team in 2005. In 2006 his 1st HC was Childress. The team that got beat in the 2009 champ game was a very good team. One of if not our best IMO. Of course like people want now we drafted QB TJacker who sucked from day 1. Farve saved Childog. Then Frazier, Zimmer and KOC. This year has been horrible. Look how many players we lost. Just having the ability to maybe make the playoffs at this point is an incredible achievement. Speilman had our team in terrible shape. No cap and the roster had very little talent. Our roster still sucks. We have zero depth and 2 stars. JJ who missed many games and Hunter. I think we have added some talent even though Kewsi missed with his 1st draft. Very few if any rotate an entire roster in 2 years and win a SB. Dallas who were the team of the 90s didn't do it in 2 years. They sucked. And they got lucky because we gave them the bullets with the worst trade in NFL history. They also had Aikman available to draft. Guys like him aren't there year in and year out. That don't exist with the current draft class either.
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chicagopurple
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Re: Lions at Vikings

Post by chicagopurple »

For over a decade- really since the Wilfs took over, I have felt like a broken record. Ownership and the goofs they have hired to run football operations have NEVER shown a shred of competence regarding the development of the front lines. They either ignore the need for an OL/DL or draft busts and kids with pre-existing back injuries. GMs and Coaches who have built winning organizations have always had one thing in common.....a focus on the front lines. In my 50 yrs as an NFL fan there has been only one team, in one year , that broke that rule. We had freakin Adrian Peterson, the most monstrous RB ever, and managed to avoid getting to a Super Bowl. Most of his career he tore up teams despite having little help up front, we had Brett Farve and missed out on a SB because the dirtbag Saints knew they could eliminate him due to a lack of protection, we spent years wasting our time on a QB that is a pocket passer with no pocket to be found, it just goes on and on and this team will go nowhere till this focus is corrected. People forget, or are too young to have seen what a real Vikings contender looks like but I assure you that nothing thats been on the field in the last decade plus has been a true contender. The old guys here know what I mean. When we had Pro Bowl front lines, teams feared the Purple. Teams had losing records the games AFTER facing us because we beat the crap out of them and left them laying on the turf cryin for mama.....right now we are just smoke and mirrors.
CharVike
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Re: Lions at Vikings

Post by CharVike »

chicagopurple wrote: Fri Dec 22, 2023 10:46 am For over a decade- really since the Wilfs took over, I have felt like a broken record. Ownership and the goofs they have hired to run football operations have NEVER shown a shred of competence regarding the development of the front lines. They either ignore the need for an OL/DL or draft busts and kids with pre-existing back injuries. GMs and Coaches who have built winning organizations have always had one thing in common.....a focus on the front lines. In my 50 yrs as an NFL fan there has been only one team, in one year , that broke that rule. We had freakin Adrian Peterson, the most monstrous RB ever, and managed to avoid getting to a Super Bowl. Most of his career he tore up teams despite having little help up front, we had Brett Farve and missed out on a SB because the dirtbag Saints knew they could eliminate him due to a lack of protection, we spent years wasting our time on a QB that is a pocket passer with no pocket to be found, it just goes on and on and this team will go nowhere till this focus is corrected. People forget, or are too young to have seen what a real Vikings contender looks like but I assure you that nothing thats been on the field in the last decade plus has been a true contender. The old guys here know what I mean. When we had Pro Bowl front lines, teams feared the Purple. Teams had losing records the games AFTER facing us because we beat the crap out of them and left them laying on the turf cryin for mama.....right now we are just smoke and mirrors.
I agree with what you post about the front lines on both sides. The Saints also took bounty shots at Farve after the ball was gone. But that OL was better than the credit you are giving. We had Hutch who I think is in the HOF and Mckinney who played good that year ect. We had Allen, Williams on the DL. To have a chance a team needs to be very talented at the LOS. You can't afford to have 5 all pros with the cap. I think our problem is having players that shouldn't be on the field like Ingram last year. I'm old and watched those old OL get torn up in the SB's they played in. They couldn't hold up and Fran who was mobile couldn't do anything. Our DL couldn't stop the run. It was like running through nothing. Teams set records against us. Not all teams feared the Purple. The Dolphin players knew before the game they would dominate our DL. In 70 and 71 we made the playoffs and got dumped. I saw most of if not all of those games. We dominated the North but that division in the early 70s was horrible. Friends would make fun of me basically saying your team is in a crap division. They were right. This is a new era in football. The NFL wants every team in the race. They expanded the playoffs. They don't want a few teams dominating like it always was. Fans love that and it shows based on revenue growth. The Rams win the SB and puff nothing. I think it's better now. Ingram was horrible as a rookie. But he did improve. He should be better next year. Call me a homer or whatever but I like the direction this team is going. Risner was a huge upgrade. Clevland sucked. Hock was an upgrade. Addison is an upgrade. Woonan stepped in and is playing good. Flores has hide our CB weakness with pressure. Pressure and sacks can hide a secondary. Blackmon and Evans are young guys who can at least play at a decent level and are still developing. It's not Mike Huges or Waynes level which was nothing.
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VikingLord
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Re: Lions at Vikings

Post by VikingLord »

chicagopurple wrote: Fri Dec 22, 2023 8:47 am The Lion will obliterate us in both games we play with them. Their HC is twice the HC of KO. Didnt some of you want him for COTY :lol: Lioms are still in the hunt for home field advantage and are happy AF they have the Vikings to play 2 times.
I understand your frustration but nobody has obliterated the Vikings this season. The margin of their worst loss this season was by 7 against the Chiefs and 6 against the Eagles. The Lions are a good team, but as frustrating as the Vikings have been this year, they are not such a bad team that they should be an easy out for anyone, much less a divisional foe.

The Vikings need to win this game to keep their playoff hopes alive, while the Lions want to win it to snuff that out. I'd say the Vikings have more motivation as they're fighting for their playoff lives, while the Lions could look at this game as a nice-to-have if they can get it, but they also know they've got the season finale in Detroit if it comes to that.

My main concern with the Vikings in this upcoming game is honestly Nick Mullens at QB. I was not impressed by how he played against the Bengals at all and I'm afraid he's going to turn it over more against the Lions. I'm hopeful that Hall is prepared to go in if called upon and also that KOC won't stick with Mullens if he starts making dumb mistakes like he made against Cincy. But I think the rest of the offense is capable of moving the ball and scoring on the Lions defense, and the Vikings defense is capable of stifling the Lions offense. Special teams are a wash.

This will be a close game that the Vikings can win provided they don't turn it over on offense.
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Re: Lions at Vikings

Post by VikingLord »

CharVike wrote: Fri Dec 22, 2023 12:53 pm Flores has hide our CB weakness with pressure. Pressure and sacks can hide a secondary. Blackmon and Evans are young guys who can at least play at a decent level and are still developing. It's not Mike Huges or Waynes level which was nothing.
Its really sad that the Vikings DBs are constantly in good position to make plays on the ball and yet consistently fail to do so. In fact, I can't recall a season where the opposing QBs have gotten away with so many throws that are honestly crap and should be going the other way. The secondary has left a lot of plays on the field this year.
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Re: Lions at Vikings

Post by cmoss84 »

Well...this is a big one. Hope the fans are rocking and make life hell for "Turn your head and" Goff.

3 Factors that scare me the most:

1) Mullens
2) Gibbs
3) Mullens
I'd rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy.
CharVike
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Re: Lions at Vikings

Post by CharVike »

VikingLord wrote: Fri Dec 22, 2023 1:15 pm
CharVike wrote: Fri Dec 22, 2023 12:53 pm Flores has hide our CB weakness with pressure. Pressure and sacks can hide a secondary. Blackmon and Evans are young guys who can at least play at a decent level and are still developing. It's not Mike Huges or Waynes level which was nothing.
Its really sad that the Vikings DBs are constantly in good position to make plays on the ball and yet consistently fail to do so. In fact, I can't recall a season where the opposing QBs have gotten away with so many throws that are honestly crap and should be going the other way. The secondary has left a lot of plays on the field this year.
Your right. They are developing players. It's on the job training which is painful. You make a mistake and it's curtains. For the good they are in position. Maybe the next step will come with coaching and experience. Blackmon made a nice play early in the game when a guy jumped for it and it was ruled a catch and then over turned. He won't make all of them. Nobody does.
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Re: Lions at Vikings

Post by JJBreaksRecords »

What a game Mullens!! Why is this failure still on the team?

Our QB whisperer in KO is not working out well is it? KO cant even handle being a HC. Time for the Wilfs to start thinking about a change.
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Re: Lions at Vikings

Post by SunyP »

Bottom Line:

1. We really don't have the players.
2. Too many missed tackles..again... don't have the players.
3. Coverage is way too loose...again just not good players.
4. Penalties really killed us today...some bad calls but again and some by our just not good players.

Bright side we will have an off season to correct some of these!
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Re: Lions at Vikings

Post by CharVike »

Mullens is bad real bad. One look QB. That last pick he had guys all over the field open. He acted like JJ was the only guy out. His eyes never left him. He's an easy guy to pick off. Just hang back and wait for the floater. Pat Jones played ok. Gave up that 3rd and a mile play with a penalty which hurt. Mullens had the same type of hits against him and nothing called. Jackson made a nice pop at the end. Woonan getting carted off sucked and I hope it's not a torn ACL. That Lion secondary will get ripped to pieces by a decent QB. Mullens missing Addison twice with interceptions was horrible. Both should have been big gainers and the 2nd one probably a TD. Our OL had penalties. Darrisaw holding again and Ingram with a big one. I think it was unsportsman like penalty. No holes or cracks for our backs. The Lions owned the LOS on both sides. It's almost shocking that we still had a chance on the last drive for the win with the way we played. Having zero ground game was pathetic.
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Re: Lions at Vikings

Post by CharVike »

JJBreaksRecords wrote: Sun Dec 24, 2023 5:02 pm What a game Mullens!! Why is this failure still on the team?

Our QB whisperer in KO is not working out well is it? KO cant even handle being a HC. Time for the Wilfs to start thinking about a change.
You have one more year and then they can move on. Mullens is on the team because there aren't too many superstar backup QB in the NFL. Dobbs is still on the team also. He was on another team before coming here. He will make another squad again next year. Why would any team sign that? We did because we had nothing available and needed a body to take the snaps. Injuries do happen. All teams need a body in case 1 or 2 or 3 go down. If we cut Mullens this off season he will be picked up. Jake for the Bengals was picked up. He fell to Earth.
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Re: Lions at Vikings

Post by Cliff »

Again turnovers negate what would have probably been a win otherwise.

Time to see what Hall can do if anything, Mullens got his shot.
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Re: Lions at Vikings

Post by VikingLord »

Cliff wrote: Mon Dec 25, 2023 6:54 am Again turnovers negate what would have probably been a win otherwise.

Time to see what Hall can do if anything, Mullens got his shot.
Mullens is so bad it almost hurts to watch him. He's the definition of a first read QB who lacks timing and accuracy and is terrible at extending plays or improvising under pressure. That awful floater towards Jefferson that ended the last game is just emblematic of what Mullens is as a QB and what he is going to continue to do if KOC keeps trotting him out there.

The way things are setting up I think KOC is going to ride out the set with Mullens this season, which is too bad because that means the Vikings will head into 2024 not knowing if Hall has promise and a huge decision looms regarding JJ. My son thinks JJ wants them to bring back Cousins, which they may be more or less forced to do if they don't know if Hall can play. They will also go into the draft not in a great position to get a QB in the first round even if they want one because of where they'll be drafting. If healthy, Cousins is probably their best bet for at least another year or two.

The Vikings just can't catch a break injury-wise either. Wonnum is out for the rest of the season. Not sure on Hockenson, but it doesn't look good. I think it is pretty obvious this is not going to be their year. I hope KOC recognizes that and at least does something good for the future by giving Hall a real opportunity to show what he can do.
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Re: Lions at Vikings

Post by psjordan »

As a former high school and college (lacrosse) coach, I can tell you that the coaching staff already has a grip on what they think "Hall can do out there". They've had dozens and dozens of practices and a little game tape.

Assuming Hall is completely healthy:
If they trot out Mullens the rest of the season, well that is likely the death knell for Hall as a Viking. Good news for Hall is the last guy who threw four INT's got benched, so maybe he has a shot.

And while the old "you never know unless you put him out there" mantra does hold some credence, in the NFL they do NOT want to play someone who is "crappy" at practice and seemingly excels in games. Trust me when I say those guys are VERY hard to rely on as a coach, no matter how many rabbits they pull out of hats in games. If Hall hasn't shown much progress in practice, it's a real leap of faith to give him game minutes.

I am really hoping Hall gets the start - that will indicate to me that he has shown at least a little something in practice and the coaches think there may be enough there to develop further. And that they've decided Mullens and Dobbs will not be on next year's roster, which is fine by me.

If Mullens (or Dobbs) gets the start, there really won't be many reasons to skip playing golf to tune in to the final two games.

And yes, we do need Kirk back for at least one season, but those things are hard to pull off and make everyone happy, so it'll likely be two seasons contractually.
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Re: Lions at Vikings

Post by JJBreaksRecords »

Cliff wrote: Mon Dec 25, 2023 6:54 am Again turnovers negate what would have probably been a win otherwise.

Time to see what Hall can do if anything, Mullens got his shot.

The answer might be with Hall. We know it isnt with Mullethead and Dobbs. But KO will never put Hall in why Mullet is still on the team. :deadhorse: