Vikings (1-0) at Eagles (1-0) MNF Week 2

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Fat Stupid Loser
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Re: Vikings (1-0) at Eagles (1-0) MNF Week 2

Post by Fat Stupid Loser »

Pondering Her Percy wrote: Mon Sep 19, 2022 10:56 pm
StumpHunter wrote: Mon Sep 19, 2022 10:55 pm
Someday Kirk will get a play caller who will be able to help Kirk succeed. Not SB winning coaches McVay or Kubiak, not coach of the year Stefanski, someone else right?
There he is, twisting away my words. Did you see the part where I said, bad QB play? But unfortunately everyone probably had to listen to you whine tonight about one person. Glad I had you foed!
And did you notice, he was quite absent after last week's game.
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Re: Vikings (1-0) at Eagles (1-0) MNF Week 2

Post by J. Kapp 11 »

VikingLord wrote: Tue Sep 20, 2022 2:00 pm
Pondering Her Percy wrote: Tue Sep 20, 2022 10:58 am I mean one thing that sticks out is Donatell and the fact that it seemed like he was running the same defense over and over again. I honestly can’t even recall someone blitzing. It reminded me of madden where you just pick the same defense over and over.
I was shocked that the Vikings were in that soft zone coverage seemingly all game. Philly WRs were wide open everywhere and Hurts rarely had to make a contested throw.

Bynum was god-awful too. He seemed lost all game, and why he jumped that short route that was already covered while he let the Philly WR run straight past him deep is beyond me. I was a big Bynum fan prior to last night. After last night I'm hopeful Cine can get on the field and soon.
Pondering Her Percy wrote: Tue Sep 20, 2022 10:58 am In terms of offense, maybe not as much the play calls specifically but the overall game plan going in. I really thought we’d put some focus on others outside of JJ. They did with irv but not the others. They just didn’t have a good plan going into this game. That’s why I said I don’t think it matters who was at QB, I just don’t think they were properly prepared going in
The offense was terrible. Cousins looked scared most of the game, the Vikings couldn't run against a defense that got gashed by the Lions, and once again the Vikings offense under KOC can't convert on 3rd down to sustain drives (4-12 in this game after going 3-9 against the Packers and similar stats in every preseason game).

I kept thinking that the Vikings had this high powered, new age aggressive offensive scheme and the players to run it, and yet every time I watch them (including against the Packers), I see very little risk taken and an almost laser-like focus on short passes and safety. Yeah, there were a ton of drops last night and everyone played poorly, but come on KOC, where's the beef? All of this "collaborative" talk is great and all, but if this is an explosive offense I'm going to be the next president of the US. The Eagles showed exactly how you beat it, too - just send 6 guys and Cousins will float it and panic. If the DBs for the other team just spy him it's easy picks. Slay could have had 2 more interceptions by my count. Play after play there near the end of the game the Eagles just sent more than the Vikings could block and Cousins floated the ball right back to the Eagles. Vikings can't account for that? Nothing in the game plan to deal with max pressure? Cousins, after all of his years in the league, doesn't know how to handle that situation?

Embarrassing loss. It really does look like KOC's offense can't convert on 3rd and sustain drives. It is becoming a trend. The offense is uber conservative. Cousins won't throw past 10 yards unless it is wide open, and Philly showed how to not make it wide open. I suspect had the Packers done what Philly did, the offensive output would have been similar.

We'll see where things go from here, but this does not appear to be the team I hoped they were. The Lions are much better than people are giving them credit for. I would not be surprised at all to see them take it to the Vikings this Sunday.
Kurt Warner talks about this VERY THING in his analysis of Kirk Cousins on YouTube. He keeps saying, "You know where the pressure is coming from ... call the hot route and throw it into the blitz. That area of the field is vacant."

The problem appears to be that Kirk, after 10 years in the league, DOESN'T know where the pressure is coming from. Like he can't recognize it pre-snap. He just seems to drop back and go through his normal progressions, which of course take too long and turns to disaster. I guarantee you, run those same blitzes against Brady, and the Eagles get torched. Guys like Brady and Rodgers beat you off-script, but they don't do it by running around like the ghost of Fran Tarkenton. They do it by recognizing what's coming pre-snap and calling something to beat it. They don't need to run around.

I'm truly worried about the Lions. They can rush the passer without blitzing. Aiden Hutchinson is really good. The thing in our favor is that the Lions have yet to play a road game. Hopefully we fans can have an impact on their offense, which is scoring 35.5 ppg. I mean, I can't even believe I just typed "35.5 ppg" and "Lions offense" in the same sentence. We don't have 35 points total yet, and we're supposed to have the innovative offense!
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Re: Vikings (1-0) at Eagles (1-0) MNF Week 2

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allday1991 wrote: Tue Sep 20, 2022 5:41 am
S197 wrote: Tue Sep 20, 2022 1:51 am This team could be a Super Bowl contender. If they only played on Wednesday. Broadcast on Lifetime network.
Talent just isn’t there. I wouldn’t be surprised if lions show there the 2nd best team in this division next weekend.
Well they hung with Philly who look really good.
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Re: Vikings (1-0) at Eagles (1-0) MNF Week 2

Post by Fat Stupid Loser »

S197 wrote: Tue Sep 20, 2022 12:10 pm I feel like you could read this thread anytime over the last 3+ years and it would be the same issues. There's not a lot of common denominators over that span. I don't think Cousins was the sole reason they lost but $40M is just far too much for this guy. He has so many weapons and an OL made up of entirely 1st and 2nd round picks. At some point you need to show up. Look at what Tua and Wentz are doing with better levels of talent.
Wentz? Commie fans already are beside themselves.
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Re: Vikings (1-0) at Eagles (1-0) MNF Week 2

Post by Foreman44 »

How much of this game falls on defense. They did curb the Eagle some second half.

But hurts made me a liar last night. I said he wasn’t a passing QBs. Saban replaced Hurts with Tua after hurts got Bama to the championship game the year before. Saban wanted him to pass more. But whenever he panicked. He ran... Then against us hurts passed 300:plus yds.. But it was his first 300 yard passing game ever...

I only watched the first half getting up at 4:30. Figured midnight would be games end here. I was shocked we only gave up 27 points..

Looked to mr igglesbD was busting through our o line.

Another thought. Did our Vikings get caught up on all the hype. Jefferson’s 180;yds receiving. Cousins game against GB. How well we performed against GB. I felt Bama did the same against Texas.

Most were picking Minn to win, though a good game. Maybe the Iggles were fired up to prove all wrong...

Detroit May tell us a lot.imo
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Re: Vikings (1-0) at Eagles (1-0) MNF Week 2

Post by Pondering Her Percy »

Fat Stupid Loser wrote: Tue Sep 20, 2022 3:50 pm
Pondering Her Percy wrote: Mon Sep 19, 2022 10:56 pm

There he is, twisting away my words. Did you see the part where I said, bad QB play? But unfortunately everyone probably had to listen to you whine tonight about one person. Glad I had you foed!
And did you notice, he was quite absent after last week's game.
Lol yeah he always is after the big wins. Because his narrative doesn’t apply to those games
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Re: Vikings (1-0) at Eagles (1-0) MNF Week 2

Post by VikingLord »

J. Kapp 11 wrote: Tue Sep 20, 2022 3:50 pm I'm truly worried about the Lions. They can rush the passer without blitzing. Aiden Hutchinson is really good. The thing in our favor is that the Lions have yet to play a road game. Hopefully we fans can have an impact on their offense, which is scoring 35.5 ppg. I mean, I can't even believe I just typed "35.5 ppg" and "Lions offense" in the same sentence. We don't have 35 points total yet, and we're supposed to have the innovative offense!
The Lions can definitely move the ball and score. If the Vikings defense doesn't make better adjustments more quickly than they did against the Eagles, it's going to be another long off week to "fix" things. I hope Cine gets the start too. Bynum's play against the Eagles was nothing short of malpractice.

But offensively, if Cousins doesn't start reading the field and making some deeper throws this is going to be another disappointing season. The running game doesn't appear to be explosive at all anymore. Cook looks average. Mattison has some pop but he's not getting enough attempts. Maybe KOC should give Chandler some touches?
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Re: Vikings (1-0) at Eagles (1-0) MNF Week 2

Post by Fat Stupid Loser »

Foreman44 wrote: Tue Sep 20, 2022 4:29 pm How much of this game falls on defense. They did curb the Eagle some second half.

But hurts made me a liar last night. I said he wasn’t a passing QBs. Saban replaced Hurts with Tua after hurts got Bama to the championship game the year before. Saban wanted him to pass more. But whenever he panicked. He ran... Then against us hurts passed 300:plus yds.. But it was his first 300 yard passing game ever...

I only watched the first half getting up at 4:30. Figured midnight would be games end here. I was shocked we only gave up 27 points..

Looked to mr igglesbD was busting through our o line.

Another thought. Did our Vikings get caught up on all the hype. Jefferson’s 180;yds receiving. Cousins game against GB. How well we performed against GB. I felt Bama did the same against Texas.

Most were picking Minn to win, though a good game. Maybe the Iggles were fired up to prove all wrong...

Detroit May tell us a lot.imo
The D was porous. It was awful. It set the terms of the game. Made us one dimensional playing catch up. Plus we couldn't run, so more one dimensional. Easy to pound any offense if they are one dimensional.
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Re: Vikings (1-0) at Eagles (1-0) MNF Week 2

Post by JJBreaksRecords »

Fat Stupid Loser wrote: Tue Sep 20, 2022 5:05 pm
Foreman44 wrote: Tue Sep 20, 2022 4:29 pm How much of this game falls on defense. They did curb the Eagle some second half.

But hurts made me a liar last night. I said he wasn’t a passing QBs. Saban replaced Hurts with Tua after hurts got Bama to the championship game the year before. Saban wanted him to pass more. But whenever he panicked. He ran... Then against us hurts passed 300:plus yds.. But it was his first 300 yard passing game ever...

I only watched the first half getting up at 4:30. Figured midnight would be games end here. I was shocked we only gave up 27 points..

Looked to mr igglesbD was busting through our o line.

Another thought. Did our Vikings get caught up on all the hype. Jefferson’s 180;yds receiving. Cousins game against GB. How well we performed against GB. I felt Bama did the same against Texas.

Most were picking Minn to win, though a good game. Maybe the Iggles were fired up to prove all wrong...

Detroit May tell us a lot.imo
The D was porous. It was awful. It set the terms of the game. Made us one dimensional playing catch up. Plus we couldn't run, so more one dimensional. Easy to pound any offense if they are one dimensional.
Cousins was more of a problem than the D. The D held them to 27 points, not great but good enough.. The mighty Cousins should have been able to over come that right? He is a superstar to a few people on this board, but once again he proved he is a .500 winner. He will be the same when he finally leaves us. But he will be a billionaire, thanks to the Wilfs. And no, it wasnt all Cousins fault. A good chunk of it was though. The Vikes coaching staff were in WAY over their heads, except the ST coach (Daniels maybe?). Donatell was worse at adjustments than Zimmer ever was. The Lions will literally run all over us if things aernt fixed. Right now I doubt we can beat the Bears.
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Re: Vikings (1-0) at Eagles (1-0) MNF Week 2

Post by Cliff »

JJBreaksRecords wrote: Tue Sep 20, 2022 6:47 pm
Fat Stupid Loser wrote: Tue Sep 20, 2022 5:05 pm The D was porous. It was awful. It set the terms of the game. Made us one dimensional playing catch up. Plus we couldn't run, so more one dimensional. Easy to pound any offense if they are one dimensional.
Cousins was more of a problem than the D. The D held them to 27 points, not great but good enough.. The mighty Cousins should have been able to over come that right? He is a superstar to a few people on this board, but once again he proved he is a .500 winner. He will be the same when he finally leaves us. But he will be a billionaire, thanks to the Wilfs. And no, it wasnt all Cousins fault. A good chunk of it was though. The Vikes coaching staff were in WAY over their heads, except the ST coach (Daniels maybe?). Donatell was worse at adjustments than Zimmer ever was. The Lions will literally run all over us if things aernt fixed. Right now I doubt we can beat the Bears.
The defense held them to 24. Also, the defense didn't allow a score in the 2nd half. Seems like he adjusted ok.

It's hard not to put much of the loss on Cousins. He threw the ball 46 times for 7 points and 3 turnovers. I guess you can blame the game plan in that they tried to put the game on his shoulders.
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Re: Vikings (1-0) at Eagles (1-0) MNF Week 2

Post by VikingLord »

Fat Stupid Loser wrote: Tue Sep 20, 2022 5:05 pm The D was porous. It was awful. It set the terms of the game. Made us one dimensional playing catch up. Plus we couldn't run, so more one dimensional. Easy to pound any offense if they are one dimensional.
It was, right from the get-go. The announcers were even commenting on that as the Eagles marched right down the field with receivers more or less standing wide open and Hurts unmolested for the most part. The Eagles were breaking off nice chunks running it, too.

The more I look at it, it really looked to me like the Eagles had the Vikings read like a book on both sides of the ball. If there were ever a game I watched where I'm convinced one team knew the playcalls and signals of the other team, that game last night was it. The Eagles ran the perfect offense to beat every coverage and ran it perfectly against the defense. When the Vikings offense was on the field, they were all over everything Cousins tried to do. In fact, I can't recall watching a pro or college football game where the DBs were so consistently not just in a position to break up passes, but a position to intercept those passes. There were a couple of passes Kirk threw to Thielen late in the game that I have no idea how they weren't picked off, much less Thielen caught them.

But it was like that all night, like the Eagles knew the primary receiver on each play and even the route he was running. It's possible the Eagles studied that well and/or just played lights out like that. They were good - too good almost.

Of course, then I look at that other play I referenced where JJ was lined up in the backfield and was completely uncovered and Cousins focused in on Cook and only Cook on a well covered screen. Had he looked towards JJ it was an easy completion and maybe a big play, but he was throwing it to Cook no matter what.

Also, there are 32 starting QBs in the league. Of that number, I bet 31 of them look off Cook on that play and at least look elsewhere. Cook was not only not open, he was literally being swarmed by Eagle defenders. There was no hope for that play and no need to throw that ball even if JJ was covered and nobody else was open. In a situation like that a 10 year veteran starting QB making whatever ridiculous sum of money Kirk is making this year should show some awareness. If a guy is covered like that and there are no other options, throw the ball away. Don't take a loss or make a risky throw there. A better QB looks elsewhere, and an even better QB might roll to his right away from the play flow to buy himself a little more time to look elsewhere. Kirk? He is WAY better than that, or at least, the Wilfs, KOC and KAM seem to believe he is.

That play was a microcosm of Kirk's play for the entire game. He didn't read anything pre-snap, didn't properly react to anything post-snap, and he locked on to the nearest receiver most of the time, often throwing inaccurately to boot. It was a horrifyingly poor performance for a guy so many have placed so much faith and resources in. If the Eagles knew the plays, at least Kirk would have an excuse for what we saw. But I think the more likely explanation is, they studied Kirk and knew how he'd react to what they were doing and were just ready for that.

If I stop watching the Vikings this year, it's going to be because I'm simply done watching Cousins submarine their chances in big games. The special teams tried to get them back in it. The defense made a play to help get them back in it. Cousins gave it right back each time.

I'm not going there yet, but if I see more of this, I think I'm going to save my Sundays for more productive activities until the Vikings finally ship Cousins and start off fresh. I was very disappointed when they extended him because I thought he'd go when Spielman and Zimmer went, but then I got talked into believing KOC could be the Cousins-whisperer and get him into great situations where he could thrive. Thrive he did not last night, and it's clear what the limits of what any head coach can do for Cousins seems to be at this point.

Enough ranting from me. Cousins is who is he and I'm just going to hope the team around him is good enough to figure it out so whatever Cousins can give them will be enough to get them somewhere.

Get ready to see a LOT of blitzing on Sunday from the Lions. They'll be coming until Cousins or KOC prove they can deal with it.
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Re: Vikings (1-0) at Eagles (1-0) MNF Week 2

Post by VikingLord »

Cliff wrote: Tue Sep 20, 2022 7:01 pm The defense held them to 24. Also, the defense didn't allow a score in the 2nd half. Seems like he adjusted ok.

It's hard not to put much of the loss on Cousins. He threw the ball 46 times for 7 points and 3 turnovers. I guess you can blame the game plan in that they tried to put the game on his shoulders.
The defense gave up 486 yards of offense, 23 first downs, allowed a 7-13 conversion rate on 3rd down. Saying they played OK for the 2nd half is fine, but unfortunately, they didn't play well for the game. I think they'd be the first to admit that.

Also, there is no excuse for a defense full of veterans like the Vikings have to get spanked around like that for a full half. Adjusting after a half really doesn't cut it.

As for Cousins, he is who he is, and this is the type of game the Vikings are going to get from him in pressure situations for the most part. So if they're going to make the playoffs this year, the rest of the team is going to have to be a lot better than what we saw last night or it's going to be another whiff season.
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Re: Vikings (1-0) at Eagles (1-0) MNF Week 2

Post by Fat Stupid Loser »

JJBreaksRecords wrote: Tue Sep 20, 2022 6:47 pm
Fat Stupid Loser wrote: Tue Sep 20, 2022 5:05 pm The D was porous. It was awful. It set the terms of the game. Made us one dimensional playing catch up. Plus we couldn't run, so more one dimensional. Easy to pound any offense if they are one dimensional.
Cousins was more of a problem than the D. The D held them to 27 points, not great but good enough..
It was over by then. We were way behind, couldn't run the ball 3 feet. They just teed off on a one- dimensional offense. A little like we did to Erin the week before. Easy to do when it gets like that. And Kirk isn't a generational world beater like Erin, who has one 1 whole superbowl in his 36 year career.
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Re: Vikings (1-0) at Eagles (1-0) MNF Week 2

Post by Pondering Her Percy »

The main question is how this team will bounce back. One of these two games was a fluke or “out of the norm”. It was a really good game vs a really bad game. Both against solid teams. If they let this eagles game get them down, it could be a long season. If they go back to playing how they did against GB, things could go great. Granted many are going to lean towards the packers game being the fluke because the eagles game is fresh. But I’ve seen plenty of bad losses around this league over the past however many years and the good teams bounce back. The good coaching staffs adjust. The good players play better.

Only time will tell but I have confidence this staff gets this team right after that game. Too much good juju going around for them not to. Hell, the rams lost 3 games in a row last year and won the SB. The bills had a worse offensive game than we did vs Philly against a 3-14 jaguars team last year. The bengals lost to the jets and bears last year and went to the SB. Again, it’s how you bounce back from those embarrassing losses or those slumps. We just have to have a short memory and push forward.
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Re: Vikings (1-0) at Eagles (1-0) MNF Week 2

Post by Pondering Her Percy »

Man I will say, our fan base when we lose is flat out embarrassing sometimes. Especially on social media. Saw that Irv had to suspend commenting on his Instagram after last night because you get the psycho computer tough guys go off on him on social media. Should irv had caught that ball? 100%. It honestly might’ve been one of the best throws I’ve ever seen cousins make. Took a hit and threw an absolute dart right on the money. But in the end, it drives me nuts that fans have to act that way. I honestly think that after embarrassing losses like that, I get more annoyed with how fans react via social media than I do at the actual game. Because they are beyond embarrassing. They did it with Matt Kalil, Ponder, Thielen when he fumbled a punt vs Dallas, Walsh, and so on. Must be the millennial generation? Idk but I wish it would stop. Unfortunately I don’t see that happening
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