Who would've been better?

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Re: Who would've been better?

Post by VikingLord »

fiestavike wrote: Fri Jul 08, 2022 2:19 pm Teddy was far and away the best and most complete QB of the three. It's hard not to wonder what would have become of the vikings if he hadn't been injured and played out that season. Zimmer and Spielman might still be here, and still be on the same page. I have the sneaking suspicion that differences on handling that QB position were ultimately the undoing of that regime.
It's a little hard to argue Teddy was "far and away" above the other two. Maybe if he had never been injured I could agree with that, but he did return to the pros and has never been a full time starter anywhere. He looks fully recovered from his injury and it's hard to argue that ultimately held him back although it did cost him some time. He's basically bounced around the league as a journeyman since his return despite the league having an insatiable need for starting QBs.

In the end, Bridgewater is about as close to a "system QB" that the NFL has. He's physically limited and scares nobody with his arm or mobility, but he knows the playbook, throws accurately, and won't stray far from the script. In other words, he's the perfect QB for a coach like Mike Zimmer. He's also the definition of a journeyman backup, which is what he's become in a league desperate for starting QBs who can make an impact. Bridgewater isn't that. If he did well in 2016, it's largely the result of the strength of the rest of the team he played on ala what Jimmy G managed when he went to the Superbowl with San Fran. Put a strong enough team around a system QB who avoids mistakes and that can result in a winning team, but that doesn't make the QB great.

I agree with your observations on Culpepper's limitations. They were significant. Still, Culpepper had the arm strength to hurt teams deep and the physicality to extend plays. Defenses had to account for those attributes even if Culpepper never managed to maximize them. And I think those attributes show up in the TDs he threw compared to Bradford or Bridgewater. The threw almost 40 TDs in his best year, which is double the max number of TDs Teddy ever threw in any of his seasons as a pro.
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Re: Who would've been better?

Post by J. Kapp 11 »

fiestavike wrote: Fri Jul 08, 2022 2:19 pm
StumpHunter wrote: Fri Jul 08, 2022 8:29 am Bradford Career stats before the injury (6 seasons):
62.3 %, 6.6 YPA (dead last during that timeframe), 3.4 TD % (dead last), 84.5 passer rating (3rd to last), 32-45

Teddy's career before the injury(2 seasons):
64.9%, 7.2 YPA, 3.4 TD%, 87 passer rating, 17-11

Teddy since the injury:
67.8%, 7.3 YPA, 3.8 TD%, 93.4 passer rating, 16-19

Teddy won more and put up better stats than Bradford both before and after his injury and I don't think people realize just how bad a QB Bradford was for his ENTIRE career, not just after the injury. A very mediocre season in 2016 doesn't change that.

It is tough to argue Culpepper not as #1, but people forget just how bad he was without moss in 2005:
2-5, 6 TDs, 12 Ints, 72 passer rating. Brad Johnson came in after the injury, went 7-2 and nearly saved the season so it wasn't like that team was horrible either.

1. Culpepper
2. Teddy






3. Bradford
Sam Bradford was a genuinely terrible NFL QB. His pocket presence was -5 out of 10. He literally had no reaction to pressure except to backpedal like Soda Popinski until he could unload the ball. A classic example of arm strength and stats being confused with competent QB play.

Culpepper was extremely limited and kept to half field reads most of his career, as I recall. He did bring some extra components that made him somewhat dynamic, but very few QBs have had success with that formula.

Teddy was far and away the best and most complete QB of the three. It's hard not to wonder what would have become of the vikings if he hadn't been injured and played out that season. Zimmer and Spielman might still be here, and still be on the same page. I have the sneaking suspicion that differences on handling that QB position were ultimately the undoing of that regime.
I know my order is the exact opposite of what you have. But honestly, it wouldn’t be hard to convince me of a different argument, especially when it comes to Bridgewater.

As far as talent is concerned, Bridgewater is dead last in my book. But in just about every other aspect of quarterback play, he ranks pretty high. He’s a born leader, a guy whose personality is a magnet to not just the locker room, but to the entire organization. He works very hard. He’s accountable. Honestly, he’s the kind of guy you’d want your daughter to marry. No, his stats over the course of his career don’t match up with top QBs. But that injury … guys on the field that day got sick seeing it. I’ve read accounts from the surgeon who first examined him that there was basically nothing holding his femur to his tib-fib. If blood vessels had been damaged, he would have lost the leg. It would be hard for anyone to come back from that.

And your point about the Zimmer-Spielman regime is spot on. Today, I am one of Mike Zimmer’s biggest detractors. But that’s because I believe he betrayed this fan base. Up until Teddy’s injury, he was an old-school, no-nonsense coach that inspired guys to run through fire for him. But he was never the same after that. In 2016, the team started 5-0 and looked great. Then they lost a road game at Philly, and Zimmer sort of lost his mind, calling his O-line “soft” in the press. There are reports that he put stuffed animals with their heads ripped off in players’ lockers during the bye week. Norv Turner resigned in the middle of the season when the Vikings were 5-2 and still in the thick of the playoff race. And when Spielman went out and signed Cousins, Zimmer never recovered. Teddy, his surrogate son, was released. Nobody was going to take his place.

Once again, I go back to the 2016 preseason. Teddy was so good, like a different guy. He was commanding the team and throwing with authorityd. Lest we forget, here’s a highlight video from that game.

[media] [/media]

Again, it’s one preseason game. But that’s not a guy with a rag arm. Please board, don’t throw stats at me. I know the record. This entire thread is speculation. Just using my eyes here.

It certainly makes we wonder what might have been.
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Re: Who would've been better?

Post by StanM »

J. Kapp 11 wrote: Sat Jul 09, 2022 10:39 am
fiestavike wrote: Fri Jul 08, 2022 2:19 pm

Sam Bradford was a genuinely terrible NFL QB. His pocket presence was -5 out of 10. He literally had no reaction to pressure except to backpedal like Soda Popinski until he could unload the ball. A classic example of arm strength and stats being confused with competent QB play.

Culpepper was extremely limited and kept to half field reads most of his career, as I recall. He did bring some extra components that made him somewhat dynamic, but very few QBs have had success with that formula.

Teddy was far and away the best and most complete QB of the three. It's hard not to wonder what would have become of the vikings if he hadn't been injured and played out that season. Zimmer and Spielman might still be here, and still be on the same page. I have the sneaking suspicion that differences on handling that QB position were ultimately the undoing of that regime.
I know my order is the exact opposite of what you have. But honestly, it wouldn’t be hard to convince me of a different argument, especially when it comes to Bridgewater.

As far as talent is concerned, Bridgewater is dead last in my book. But in just about every other aspect of quarterback play, he ranks pretty high. He’s a born leader, a guy whose personality is a magnet to not just the locker room, but to the entire organization. He works very hard. He’s accountable. Honestly, he’s the kind of guy you’d want your daughter to marry. No, his stats over the course of his career don’t match up with top QBs. But that injury … guys on the field that day got sick seeing it. I’ve read accounts from the surgeon who first examined him that there was basically nothing holding his femur to his tib-fib. If blood vessels had been damaged, he would have lost the leg. It would be hard for anyone to come back from that.

And your point about the Zimmer-Spielman regime is spot on. Today, I am one of Mike Zimmer’s biggest detractors. But that’s because I believe he betrayed this fan base. Up until Teddy’s injury, he was an old-school, no-nonsense coach that inspired guys to run through fire for him. But he was never the same after that. In 2016, the team started 5-0 and looked great. Then they lost a road game at Philly, and Zimmer sort of lost his mind, calling his O-line “soft” in the press. There are reports that he put stuffed animals with their heads ripped off in players’ lockers during the bye week. Norv Turner resigned in the middle of the season when the Vikings were 5-2 and still in the thick of the playoff race. And when Spielman went out and signed Cousins, Zimmer never recovered. Teddy, his surrogate son, was released. Nobody was going to take his place.

Once again, I go back to the 2016 preseason. Teddy was so good, like a different guy. He was commanding the team and throwing with authorityd. Lest we forget, here’s a highlight video from that game.

[media] [/media]

Again, it’s one preseason game. But that’s not a guy with a rag arm. Please board, don’t throw stats at me. I know the record. This entire thread is speculation. Just using my eyes here.

It certainly makes we wonder what might have been.
His confidence was high and his coach loved him. Stats don’t tell the full story of what he might have become. At this point after the injury just making the roster and playing a full career is a win. Intangibles go a long ways and have resulted in undrafted free agents becoming stars. That’s what keeps the game interesting.

Now if we could just find a way to transplant Teddy’s heart and leadership into #8.
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Re: Who would've been better?

Post by makila »

Jeff Fisher, the qb killer. Don't forget who coached the rams when Sam was there. Yeah yeah he got McNair early in his career. After that pretty much every qb did not develop under him.

With the vikings, could have been:
Daunte
Sam
Teddy
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Re: Who would've been better?

Post by StumpHunter »

makila wrote: Mon Jul 11, 2022 10:51 am Jeff Fisher, the qb killer. Don't forget who coached the rams when Sam was there. Yeah yeah he got McNair early in his career. After that pretty much every qb did not develop under him.

With the vikings, could have been:
Daunte
Sam
Teddy
So you are saying outside of the one good QB Fisher ever coached, he held back Vince Young, Case Keenum, Jared Goff (in his rookie year) and Sam Bradford? Not very compelling evidence to me.

There is also the fact that Bradford wasn't any different with the Eagles or in a MN Vikings offense that had Case Keenum as the leading EPA passer of 2017.

Of those three only Teddy was the one who hadn't hit that important third or fourth seasons that has seen guys like Allen, Brady, Stafford, Brees, and Big Ben really start to produce.

The book was already out on Bradford, we know what he could do and it wasn't even as good as what Teddy did in his second year.

Culpepper on the other hand had been elite and been awful, so even though he had been in the league a while, we still didn't really know what we had in him without Moss.
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Re: Who would've been better?

Post by VikingsVictorious »

VikingLord wrote: Fri Jul 08, 2022 4:46 pm
fiestavike wrote: Fri Jul 08, 2022 2:19 pm Teddy was far and away the best and most complete QB of the three. It's hard not to wonder what would have become of the vikings if he hadn't been injured and played out that season. Zimmer and Spielman might still be here, and still be on the same page. I have the sneaking suspicion that differences on handling that QB position were ultimately the undoing of that regime.
It's a little hard to argue Teddy was "far and away" above the other two. Maybe if he had never been injured I could agree with that, but he did return to the pros and has never been a full time starter anywhere. He looks fully recovered from his injury and it's hard to argue that ultimately held him back although it did cost him some time. He's basically bounced around the league as a journeyman since his return despite the league having an insatiable need for starting QBs.

In the end, Bridgewater is about as close to a "system QB" that the NFL has. He's physically limited and scares nobody with his arm or mobility, but he knows the playbook, throws accurately, and won't stray far from the script. In other words, he's the perfect QB for a coach like Mike Zimmer. He's also the definition of a journeyman backup, which is what he's become in a league desperate for starting QBs who can make an impact. Bridgewater isn't that. If he did well in 2016, it's largely the result of the strength of the rest of the team he played on ala what Jimmy G managed when he went to the Superbowl with San Fran. Put a strong enough team around a system QB who avoids mistakes and that can result in a winning team, but that doesn't make the QB great.

I agree with your observations on Culpepper's limitations. They were significant. Still, Culpepper had the arm strength to hurt teams deep and the physicality to extend plays. Defenses had to account for those attributes even if Culpepper never managed to maximize them. And I think those attributes show up in the TDs he threw compared to Bradford or Bridgewater. The threw almost 40 TDs in his best year, which is double the max number of TDs Teddy ever threw in any of his seasons as a pro.
Teddy couldn't throw a deep pass to save his ####. If a player got open deep Teddy would hyperventilate from excitement and overthrow him by 10 yards. This happened many times.
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Re: Who would've been better?

Post by makila »

StumpHunter wrote: Mon Jul 11, 2022 12:47 pm
makila wrote: Mon Jul 11, 2022 10:51 am Jeff Fisher, the qb killer. Don't forget who coached the rams when Sam was there. Yeah yeah he got McNair early in his career. After that pretty much every qb did not develop under him.

With the vikings, could have been:
Daunte
Sam
Teddy
So you are saying outside of the one good QB Fisher ever coached, he held back Vince Young, Case Keenum, Jared Goff (in his rookie year) and Sam Bradford? Not very compelling evidence to me.

There is also the fact that Bradford wasn't any different with the Eagles or in a MN Vikings offense that had Case Keenum as the leading EPA passer of 2017.

Of those three only Teddy was the one who hadn't hit that important third or fourth seasons that has seen guys like Allen, Brady, Stafford, Brees, and Big Ben really start to produce.

The book was already out on Bradford, we know what he could do and it wasn't even as good as what Teddy did in his second year.

Culpepper on the other hand had been elite and been awful, so even though he had been in the league a while, we still didn't really know what we had in him without Moss.
Haha touche

I am saying Fisher isn't a coach who developed qbs. He has a track record of the opposite of that. For example sam and VY both went backwards under him. VY won offensive roy, as did Sam. Not like they were untalented hacks.

Of course that's separate from how one players career unfolded with the Vikings specifically. I mentioned fisher as you were looking at Sams career beyond minny.

He is an ultimate, what if. His knees were toast within a few seasons. He was already banged up coming out of ou, with some injury concerns. Thanks byu. Dude could throw a pretty pretty ball though.
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Re: Who would've been better?

Post by allday1991 »

makila wrote: Mon Jul 11, 2022 6:22 pm
StumpHunter wrote: Mon Jul 11, 2022 12:47 pm
So you are saying outside of the one good QB Fisher ever coached, he held back Vince Young, Case Keenum, Jared Goff (in his rookie year) and Sam Bradford? Not very compelling evidence to me.

There is also the fact that Bradford wasn't any different with the Eagles or in a MN Vikings offense that had Case Keenum as the leading EPA passer of 2017.

Of those three only Teddy was the one who hadn't hit that important third or fourth seasons that has seen guys like Allen, Brady, Stafford, Brees, and Big Ben really start to produce.

The book was already out on Bradford, we know what he could do and it wasn't even as good as what Teddy did in his second year.

Culpepper on the other hand had been elite and been awful, so even though he had been in the league a while, we still didn't really know what we had in him without Moss.
Haha touche

I am saying Fisher isn't a coach who developed qbs. He has a track record of the opposite of that. For example sam and VY both went backwards under him. VY won offensive roy, as did Sam. Not like they were untalented hacks.

Of course that's separate from how one players career unfolded with the Vikings specifically. I mentioned fisher as you were looking at Sams career beyond minny.

He is an ultimate, what if. His knees were toast within a few seasons. He was already banged up coming out of ou, with some injury concerns. Thanks byu. Dude could throw a pretty pretty ball though.
I’d actually put Bradford a head of Bridgewater for potential. I didn’t watch the Vikings in the 90s enough to evaluate Culpupper. Bradford was literally on his last leg with us and he did a decent job being a pocket passing QB with our oline. Definitely had the better arm of the two.
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Re: Who would've been better?

Post by JJBreaksRecords »

Bradford had no potential with the Vikings. His knees were too bad by the time he got here. It was a horrible deal for Rick to make. Always waiting on the QB instead of making one ourselves. I was hoping that would happen with Cousins, that he would be replaced. We had seen enough of him, but no, the Wilfs are in love with him.

the order is
Teddy-he had worse receivers than Dante and was still almost better.
Dante
Sam

When will the Vikings develop a QB? Its driving me crazy.
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Re: Who would've been better?

Post by fiestavike »

J. Kapp 11 wrote: Sat Jul 09, 2022 10:39 am
fiestavike wrote: Fri Jul 08, 2022 2:19 pm

Sam Bradford was a genuinely terrible NFL QB. His pocket presence was -5 out of 10. He literally had no reaction to pressure except to backpedal like Soda Popinski until he could unload the ball. A classic example of arm strength and stats being confused with competent QB play.

Culpepper was extremely limited and kept to half field reads most of his career, as I recall. He did bring some extra components that made him somewhat dynamic, but very few QBs have had success with that formula.

Teddy was far and away the best and most complete QB of the three. It's hard not to wonder what would have become of the vikings if he hadn't been injured and played out that season. Zimmer and Spielman might still be here, and still be on the same page. I have the sneaking suspicion that differences on handling that QB position were ultimately the undoing of that regime.
I know my order is the exact opposite of what you have. But honestly, it wouldn’t be hard to convince me of a different argument, especially when it comes to Bridgewater.

As far as talent is concerned, Bridgewater is dead last in my book. But in just about every other aspect of quarterback play, he ranks pretty high. He’s a born leader, a guy whose personality is a magnet to not just the locker room, but to the entire organization. He works very hard. He’s accountable. Honestly, he’s the kind of guy you’d want your daughter to marry. No, his stats over the course of his career don’t match up with top QBs. But that injury … guys on the field that day got sick seeing it. I’ve read accounts from the surgeon who first examined him that there was basically nothing holding his femur to his tib-fib. If blood vessels had been damaged, he would have lost the leg. It would be hard for anyone to come back from that.

And your point about the Zimmer-Spielman regime is spot on. Today, I am one of Mike Zimmer’s biggest detractors. But that’s because I believe he betrayed this fan base. Up until Teddy’s injury, he was an old-school, no-nonsense coach that inspired guys to run through fire for him. But he was never the same after that. In 2016, the team started 5-0 and looked great. Then they lost a road game at Philly, and Zimmer sort of lost his mind, calling his O-line “soft” in the press. There are reports that he put stuffed animals with their heads ripped off in players’ lockers during the bye week. Norv Turner resigned in the middle of the season when the Vikings were 5-2 and still in the thick of the playoff race. And when Spielman went out and signed Cousins, Zimmer never recovered. Teddy, his surrogate son, was released. Nobody was going to take his place.

Once again, I go back to the 2016 preseason. Teddy was so good, like a different guy. He was commanding the team and throwing with authorityd. Lest we forget, here’s a highlight video from that game.

[media] [/media]

Again, it’s one preseason game. But that’s not a guy with a rag arm. Please board, don’t throw stats at me. I know the record. This entire thread is speculation. Just using my eyes here.

It certainly makes we wonder what might have been.
Well said, and I will gladly concede that Teddy was the worst of the three in terms of physical talent. Yet, I'll still stand by ranking him at the top of those three. Bradford and Culpepper's deficiencies were such that they were never going to be excellent NFL QBs anyway. Teddy really had the chance, and had a tremendous number of things going in his favor. A system QB in the right system can be something else.
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Re: Who would've been better?

Post by VikingLord »

J. Kapp 11 wrote: Sat Jul 09, 2022 10:39 am Again, it’s one preseason game. But that’s not a guy with a rag arm. Please board, don’t throw stats at me. I know the record. This entire thread is speculation. Just using my eyes here.
One point you raise with your comment is that great QB play doesn't require great physical attributes. We only have to look at Tom Brady who is arguably the best QB to ever play for confirmation of that. Awareness, timing, leadership, and cool under pressure can have a much greater overall impact on results than simply being physically superior, and if I were ranking these QBs based on what each displayed in terms of those traits over their pre-injury careers, I'd put Bridgewater at the top.

Reading the various rankings and comments on this thread has been fascinating. The QB position is multi-faceted and a lot goes into the end result even beyond what a particular QB brings to the table on the field. I too wonder what might have been had Bridgewater not suffered the injury when he did with the Vikings on a clear upward trend at that point. What might a healthy Bridgewater have been able to do in that 2017 season where Zimmer's team had the best defense in the league and the QB and coach were on the same page...
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Re: Who would've been better?

Post by CharVike »

VikingLord wrote: Wed Jul 13, 2022 3:12 pm
J. Kapp 11 wrote: Sat Jul 09, 2022 10:39 am Again, it’s one preseason game. But that’s not a guy with a rag arm. Please board, don’t throw stats at me. I know the record. This entire thread is speculation. Just using my eyes here.
One point you raise with your comment is that great QB play doesn't require great physical attributes. We only have to look at Tom Brady who is arguably the best QB to ever play for confirmation of that. Awareness, timing, leadership, and cool under pressure can have a much greater overall impact on results than simply being physically superior, and if I were ranking these QBs based on what each displayed in terms of those traits over their pre-injury careers, I'd put Bridgewater at the top.

Reading the various rankings and comments on this thread has been fascinating. The QB position is multi-faceted and a lot goes into the end result even beyond what a particular QB brings to the table on the field. I too wonder what might have been had Bridgewater not suffered the injury when he did with the Vikings on a clear upward trend at that point. What might a healthy Bridgewater have been able to do in that 2017 season where Zimmer's team had the best defense in the league and the QB and coach were on the same page...
It was a good thread. The thing with Teddy is that he plays better when there isn't much expected. Like the year he took us to the playoffs. He played great as a backup for the Saints. Then the Panthers signed him to a good contract as a starter and it didn't last long. They shipped him to Denver. That didn't last. Something is lacking when teams don't keep a QB. The Eagles ripped Zim's D in 2017 and nothing was changing that. That was against Foles who will never be considered a good QB. Our current guy who was unrecruited at the Division I level beat him out at Mich St and Foles transferred to AZ. That 2017 No 1 D lacked something when in a win or go home game. They almost gave away the miracle game. We had a 17 point half time lead at home. Teddy wasn't changing that.
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Re: Who would've been better?

Post by StumpHunter »

CharVike wrote: Wed Jul 13, 2022 5:59 pm
VikingLord wrote: Wed Jul 13, 2022 3:12 pm

One point you raise with your comment is that great QB play doesn't require great physical attributes. We only have to look at Tom Brady who is arguably the best QB to ever play for confirmation of that. Awareness, timing, leadership, and cool under pressure can have a much greater overall impact on results than simply being physically superior, and if I were ranking these QBs based on what each displayed in terms of those traits over their pre-injury careers, I'd put Bridgewater at the top.

Reading the various rankings and comments on this thread has been fascinating. The QB position is multi-faceted and a lot goes into the end result even beyond what a particular QB brings to the table on the field. I too wonder what might have been had Bridgewater not suffered the injury when he did with the Vikings on a clear upward trend at that point. What might a healthy Bridgewater have been able to do in that 2017 season where Zimmer's team had the best defense in the league and the QB and coach were on the same page...
It was a good thread. The thing with Teddy is that he plays better when there isn't much expected. Like the year he took us to the playoffs. He played great as a backup for the Saints. Then the Panthers signed him to a good contract as a starter and it didn't last long. They shipped him to Denver. That didn't last. Something is lacking when teams don't keep a QB. The Eagles ripped Zim's D in 2017 and nothing was changing that. That was against Foles who will never be considered a good QB. Our current guy who was unrecruited at the Division I level beat him out at Mich St and Foles transferred to AZ. That 2017 No 1 D lacked something when in a win or go home game. They almost gave away the miracle game. We had a 17 point half time lead at home. Teddy wasn't changing that.
The point of this thread is to talk about what these QBs could have been before the injury, but if you want to talk about what the QBs did after, Teddy blows both Culpepper and Bradford out of the water. Heck, Teddy post injury is still much better than Bradford was pre injury.

As for what Teddy could have done in 2017, we don't know for sure, but what we do know is that the Eagles would not have had Alshon Jeffrey and probably aren't the #1 seed without him. The Vikings trading for Sam is one of the bigger contributors to the Eagles success in 2017, and without Teddy's injury, that trade doesn't happen. Teddy also might not have thrown the pick in the 3rd quarter of that Saints game that allowed the Saints to mount their 17 point comeback. Or a pick six in the conference game that completely took away the momentum of the Vikings and gave it to the Eagles.
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Re: Who would've been better?

Post by S197 »

J. Kapp 11 wrote: Fri Jul 08, 2022 9:22 am So for me, it goes like this:

1. Sam Bradford — I still to this day believe Sam Bradford was the second- or third-most talented passer I’ve ever seen. His start with the Vikings in 2016, coming in cold and knowing nothing about the Vikings’ offense or personnel, was incredible. Of course, that season completely fell apart, but I don’t blame Bradford for that. Then in 2017, he opened the season with one of the greatest games I’ve ever seen a quarterback play. Unfortunately, the guy just couldn’t stay on the field. But I wonder how good that 13-3 team would’ve been with a healthy Sam Bradford.

2. Teddy Bridgewater — This one is purely speculative, but it sure looked like TB was poised to break out in 2016. Alas, we’ll never know. Teddy was a class act in the locker room and a true leader, with a bit of a clutch gene (4 fourth-quarter comebacks in 28 games with Minnesota). He wasn’t as physically gifted as others, and that may well have held him back.

3. Daunte Culpepper — Here’s the thing about Culpepper. He really only had one great season, in 2004. That was his only season with a 100+ passer rating, For his Vikings career, he averaged only 22 TDs per season but 14 picks, and despite his mobility was sacked about 3 times per game. His career passer rating with the Vikings was just 91.5. He had a winning record as a starter only in his first year as a starter in 2001. And in 2005, he was having one of the worst seasons in Vikings history before he went down with that gruesome knee injury, with 12 picks in 7 games and a 72 passer rating. We remember the 4,700-yard season and the spectacular plays, but he had plenty of bad plays. And his refusal to rehab his injury with a competent NFL medical staff brings his dedication into question for me.
Agree on Bradford and I don’t think it’s close. His arm talent was just far and beyond the other two. I was at the Saints game in 2017 and you’re right, a healthy Bradford would have led that team far.

I would put Culpepper second and Teddy third.
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Re: Who would've been better?

Post by CharVike »

StumpHunter wrote: Thu Jul 14, 2022 7:22 am
CharVike wrote: Wed Jul 13, 2022 5:59 pm
It was a good thread. The thing with Teddy is that he plays better when there isn't much expected. Like the year he took us to the playoffs. He played great as a backup for the Saints. Then the Panthers signed him to a good contract as a starter and it didn't last long. They shipped him to Denver. That didn't last. Something is lacking when teams don't keep a QB. The Eagles ripped Zim's D in 2017 and nothing was changing that. That was against Foles who will never be considered a good QB. Our current guy who was unrecruited at the Division I level beat him out at Mich St and Foles transferred to AZ. That 2017 No 1 D lacked something when in a win or go home game. They almost gave away the miracle game. We had a 17 point half time lead at home. Teddy wasn't changing that.
The point of this thread is to talk about what these QBs could have been before the injury, but if you want to talk about what the QBs did after, Teddy blows both Culpepper and Bradford out of the water. Heck, Teddy post injury is still much better than Bradford was pre injury.

As for what Teddy could have done in 2017, we don't know for sure, but what we do know is that the Eagles would not have had Alshon Jeffrey and probably aren't the #1 seed without him. The Vikings trading for Sam is one of the bigger contributors to the Eagles success in 2017, and without Teddy's injury, that trade doesn't happen. Teddy also might not have thrown the pick in the 3rd quarter of that Saints game that allowed the Saints to mount their 17 point comeback. Or a pick six in the conference game that completely took away the momentum of the Vikings and gave it to the Eagles.
Bradford won the NFL Offensive Rookie of the Year award. He deserves some credit for that. IMO he was a better passer than Teddy.