Top Tier QB's

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VikingsVictorious
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Re: Top Tier QB's

Post by VikingsVictorious »

vikeinmontana wrote: Wed Sep 14, 2022 3:15 pm
phantom wrote: Tue Sep 13, 2022 12:23 pm

Little early to be saying that after one win. He already has failed, If you can't see that then your bias because you love Kirk. I had an open mind when they brought him in here. You better bring it if your Kirk regardless, of system or coach within 3 seasons a Super Bowl win ideal, but a least 3 winnings season over 12 wins if your the real deal upgrade. Vikes proved to win without him and never needed him. I though Zimmer was OK, and the 2017 probably saved his job. Sounds more like you hate Zimmer. Don't tell me you would not be pissed if someone pissed and Sh&^ on your brand new rug. You can take any who can throw a ball decent to make the throws to JJ who was 5 steps open. Cousins has had controversy everywhere he goes. Washington and Now MN. Some of that has to be him. Please don't write a book next time. I work 40 hours a week and don't have time.
:lol:

That was awesome. I'm going to read your entire response, respond with a paragraph of my own, and then tell you not to post so long.

This board is awesome.
I was thinking the same thing. However, Honestly I don't like long posts. I usually don't take the time to read them. Am I guilty of long ones?
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Re: Top Tier QB's

Post by vikeinmontana »

VikingsVictorious wrote: Wed Sep 14, 2022 3:21 pm
vikeinmontana wrote: Wed Sep 14, 2022 3:15 pm
:lol:

That was awesome. I'm going to read your entire response, respond with a paragraph of my own, and then tell you not to post so long.

This board is awesome.
I was thinking the same thing. However, Honestly I don't like long posts. I usually don't take the time to read them. Am I guilty of long ones?
Eh, I'm sure a lot of us have been guilty of that at some time. I love Kapps posts so I guess I haven't noticed.

I don't like every thread turning into a Kirk Cousins pissing match. What I have done to combat this is when a thread does turn into a Kirk Cousins pissing match, I usually stop reading those posts. What I definitely don't do, is read the posts and then respond. And then go ahead a step farther and complain about the post. It's a wild strategy, but one that has suited me well..... :whistle:
i'm ready for a beer.
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Re: Top Tier QB's

Post by VikingLord »

I'm going to say this about the 2022 Kirk Cousins:

- He was consistent against the Packers. He was effective, hitting them with a combo of longer attempts and shorter attempts. He made some really nice throws, and one throw to avoid a sack that was pretty dicey and luckily didn't cost him.
- He needed a solid team effort around him to win. Had the defense not performed as well, or had the kicking game not done as well, or heck, had the Packers not dropped a sure long TD on their first play, and the Vikings had lost, I'm sure Cousins would be getting a lot of criticism. Everything else the same in terms of Cousins' performance, but the rest of the team not as good, and Cousins would get some blame.

Whether Vikings fans love or hate Cousins, the fact remains that winning in the pros takes an entire team and coaches to make the right calls and play well. It is a rare QB who can overcome poor play or poor decisions from other areas of the team.

One valid criticism of Kirk is he didn't distribute the ball in the passing game (maybe because the Packers just left JJ open enough and throwing to him is the same as deciding to throw at a barn door as a target in an accuracy contest in that situation). I can't necessarily fault Cousins for getting it to JJ so much, but I hope he leverages all of his many weapons and isn't focusing on JJ. Along those lines, the 3rd down conversion ratio has to go up. 4-13 isn't going to cut it. With all of the weapons the Vikings offense has there is no excuse for not maintaining a conversion rate closer to 50%. I feel like Cousins might still be content with throws short of the sticks on 3rd down, which is something Kurt Warner pointed out about him and something Cousins should be able to focus on going forward.

Other than those few criticisms, I thought Cousins looked great against the Packers.
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Re: Top Tier QB's

Post by phantom »

vikeinmontana wrote: Wed Sep 14, 2022 3:15 pm
phantom wrote: Tue Sep 13, 2022 12:23 pm

Little early to be saying that after one win. He already has failed, If you can't see that then your bias because you love Kirk. I had an open mind when they brought him in here. You better bring it if your Kirk regardless, of system or coach within 3 seasons a Super Bowl win ideal, but a least 3 winnings season over 12 wins if your the real deal upgrade. Vikes proved to win without him and never needed him. I though Zimmer was OK, and the 2017 probably saved his job. Sounds more like you hate Zimmer. Don't tell me you would not be pissed if someone pissed and Sh&^ on your brand new rug. You can take any who can throw a ball decent to make the throws to JJ who was 5 steps open. Cousins has had controversy everywhere he goes. Washington and Now MN. Some of that has to be him. Please don't write a book next time. I work 40 hours a week and don't have time.
:lol:

That was awesome. I'm going to read your entire response, respond with a paragraph of my own, and then tell you not to post so long.

This board is awesome.
That's because my original post was a sentence long like most of mine. There long essays on this site help me sleep thou.
The Northern Goshawk "phantom of the forest"
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Re: Top Tier QB's

Post by Cliff »

phantom wrote: Thu Sep 15, 2022 10:40 am
vikeinmontana wrote: Wed Sep 14, 2022 3:15 pm
:lol:

That was awesome. I'm going to read your entire response, respond with a paragraph of my own, and then tell you not to post so long.

This board is awesome.
That's because my original post was a sentence long like most of mine. There long essays on this site help me sleep thou.
I think you might be looking for Twitter and accidentally got onto this site.
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Re: Top Tier QB's

Post by VikingsVictorious »

Cliff wrote: Thu Sep 15, 2022 10:49 am
phantom wrote: Thu Sep 15, 2022 10:40 am

That's because my original post was a sentence long like most of mine. There long essays on this site help me sleep thou.
I think you might be looking for Twitter and accidentally got onto this site.
I don't agree with Phantom on much, but I like him prefer short and sweet posts over people going into detailed analysis. However, some people like reading those and that's totally cool.
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Re: Top Tier QB's

Post by Cliff »

VikingsVictorious wrote: Thu Sep 15, 2022 10:58 am
Cliff wrote: Thu Sep 15, 2022 10:49 am

I think you might be looking for Twitter and accidentally got onto this site.
I don't agree with Phantom on much, but I like him prefer short and sweet posts over people going into detailed analysis. However, some people like reading those and that's totally cool.
And it's totally fine to prefer shorter posts ... but nobody is forcing anybody to read longer ones. These kinds of message boards are meant to discuss things more in depth. Complaining about the platform you're on being the platform you're on is asinine.
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Re: Top Tier QB's

Post by CharVike »

VikingsVictorious wrote: Thu Sep 15, 2022 10:58 am
Cliff wrote: Thu Sep 15, 2022 10:49 am

I think you might be looking for Twitter and accidentally got onto this site.
I don't agree with Phantom on much, but I like him prefer short and sweet posts over people going into detailed analysis. However, some people like reading those and that's totally cool.
For Phantom his post are short and really he don't even need a sentence. He only needs 3 words for whatever happens and they are "because blank sucks". We all know who the blank is. Like when that great 2017 team sucked in 2018 he can use his 3 word response. But most fans know it was deeper than that. To explain what really went wrong takes more than a sentence. That's what he is looking for.
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Re: Top Tier QB's

Post by StumpHunter »

CharVike wrote: Thu Sep 15, 2022 12:24 pm
VikingsVictorious wrote: Thu Sep 15, 2022 10:58 am
I don't agree with Phantom on much, but I like him prefer short and sweet posts over people going into detailed analysis. However, some people like reading those and that's totally cool.
For Phantom his post are short and really he don't even need a sentence. He only needs 3 words for whatever happens and they are "because blank sucks". We all know who the blank is. Like when that great 2017 team sucked in 2018 he can use his 3 word response. But most fans know it was deeper than that. To explain what really went wrong takes more than a sentence. That's what he is looking for.
He could always just copy and paste from an article online into his post and pretend like they were his own words. Or repeat over and over again that the key to winning is winning at the line of scrimmage.
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Re: Top Tier QB's

Post by CharVike »

StumpHunter wrote: Thu Sep 15, 2022 2:53 pm
CharVike wrote: Thu Sep 15, 2022 12:24 pm
For Phantom his post are short and really he don't even need a sentence. He only needs 3 words for whatever happens and they are "because blank sucks". We all know who the blank is. Like when that great 2017 team sucked in 2018 he can use his 3 word response. But most fans know it was deeper than that. To explain what really went wrong takes more than a sentence. That's what he is looking for.
He could always just copy and paste from an article online into his post and pretend like they were his own words. Or repeat over and over again that the key to winning is winning at the line of scrimmage.
Our use a fantasy stat to prove his point. You have repeated over and over that the LOS battle isn't that important. Tell that to the SB QBs who were sacked 7 times each and both got beat. Rodgers fell victim again to bad OL play just like he did in
the playoff loss to the 49ers. Rodgers will get back on track once his OTs return to the field. You need to block people. It's key. Of course if your defense dominates it won't matter as when Burrow was sacked 9 times in a playoff game and won. There's an out for everything but the odds aren't very good for the out.
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Re: Top Tier QB's

Post by StumpHunter »

CharVike wrote: Fri Sep 16, 2022 6:36 am
StumpHunter wrote: Thu Sep 15, 2022 2:53 pm
He could always just copy and paste from an article online into his post and pretend like they were his own words. Or repeat over and over again that the key to winning is winning at the line of scrimmage.
Our use a fantasy stat to prove his point. You have repeated over and over that the LOS battle isn't that important. Tell that to the SB QBs who were sacked 7 times each and both got beat. Rodgers fell victim again to bad OL play just like he did in
the playoff loss to the 49ers. Rodgers will get back on track once his OTs return to the field. You need to block people. It's key. Of course if your defense dominates it won't matter as when Burrow was sacked 9 times in a playoff game and won. There's an out for everything but the odds aren't very good for the out.
If we are going to go with one offs, 5 of the bottom 6 teams in pass blocking efficiency (how often the QB got sacked/pressured per dropback) won their football games. 4 of those wins were massive upsets. Seems like football might be more nuanced than just "pass block bad means loss".
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Re: Top Tier QB's

Post by CharVike »

StumpHunter wrote: Fri Sep 16, 2022 8:53 am
CharVike wrote: Fri Sep 16, 2022 6:36 am
Our use a fantasy stat to prove his point. You have repeated over and over that the LOS battle isn't that important. Tell that to the SB QBs who were sacked 7 times each and both got beat. Rodgers fell victim again to bad OL play just like he did in
the playoff loss to the 49ers. Rodgers will get back on track once his OTs return to the field. You need to block people. It's key. Of course if your defense dominates it won't matter as when Burrow was sacked 9 times in a playoff game and won. There's an out for everything but the odds aren't very good for the out.
If we are going to go with one offs, 5 of the bottom 6 teams in pass blocking efficiency (how often the QB got sacked/pressured per dropback) won their football games. 4 of those wins were massive upsets. Seems like football might be more nuanced than just "pass block bad means loss".
You have your take so stick with it. I'll stick with mine. I'm not running through page after page of posts concerning this again. It was all ready done in the past.
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Re: Top Tier QB's

Post by StumpHunter »

You know who aren't a top tier QBs? Winston, Trubisky, Ryan and Fields.

We dodged a bullet when Spielman failed to trade up for Fields, possibly the easiest to sack running QB in the history of the NFL. It is like he is trying to get tackled out there.

Winston is just plain awful and he gave the Saints no chance despite his D playing really well for most of that game.

Watching Trubisky in Pittsburgh was like watching him in Chicago. Listening to the boos as he would consistently go 3 and out or make an uncatchable pass to wide open receivers, it was like it was 2019 all over again. I think Pickett or Rudolph win that game.

Ryan had no receivers and a bad Oline, but I think he has just gone off the proverbial cliff the vast majority of QBs fall off in their mid 30s. Brady has us all thinking QBs can play well into their 40's but there are a lot more QBs who stopped being effective at around 35 then who played well at 38 or older. Some QBs even begin to struggle as early as 32.
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Re: Top Tier QB's

Post by Bowhunting Viking »

Cliff wrote: Thu Sep 15, 2022 12:22 pm
VikingsVictorious wrote: Thu Sep 15, 2022 10:58 am
I don't agree with Phantom on much, but I like him prefer short and sweet posts over people going into detailed analysis. However, some people like reading those and that's totally cool.
And it's totally fine to prefer shorter posts ... but nobody is forcing anybody to read longer ones. These kinds of message boards are meant to discuss things more in depth. Complaining about the platform you're on being the platform you're on is asinine.
......Yup
I just wanna die as a Super Bowl Champion Viking Fan!!
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Re: Top Tier QB's

Post by phantom »

CharVike wrote: Thu Sep 15, 2022 12:24 pm
VikingsVictorious wrote: Thu Sep 15, 2022 10:58 am
I don't agree with Phantom on much, but I like him prefer short and sweet posts over people going into detailed analysis. However, some people like reading those and that's totally cool.
For Phantom his post are short and really he don't even need a sentence. He only needs 3 words for whatever happens and they are "because blank sucks". We all know who the blank is. Like when that great 2017 team sucked in 2018 he can use his 3 word response. But most fans know it was deeper than that. To explain what really went wrong takes more than a sentence. That's what he is looking for.
Because Cousins should go back and look at the tape in 2017 so Case could show him how it's done.
The Northern Goshawk "phantom of the forest"