2022 NFL Draft

[StumpHunter]

I'm just concerned with him being too light and not a mauler. Basically Bradbury 2.0. Ive grown tired of seeing our lightweights get bullied and tossed around. I wouldn't want him at pick 12. I'm not sure who who I want them to draft yet but I'm leaning WR or pass rusher. Thielen is old and JJ is going to need a new partner in crime. Also your 3rd WR is a starter in today's NFL. Nickel corners and slot WRs are worthy of 1st round picks.

I think the 2nd and 3rd WR are generally schemed open in todays NFL and are not worthy of early round draft picks except for teams that are already really stacked at QB, OL, and pass rush. CBs are playing at such disadvantage that the shut down CB is no longer a part of the game. That being the case, almost no DB is worth drafting in the first round in the modern NFL.

If you look at the Rams, TB, KC and Philly and all 4 had 2 great receivers when they won it all. Even going back to Denver, the non-NE winning SB teams have had multiple great receivers and even in NE there was Gronk and Edelman/Welker.

I think the reason for that is because while it is possible to have one, high priced, shut down CB, having two is almost unheard of. So if you have two or even three great WRs, one of them is going to have a 2nd or 3rd tier CB covering them and is probably going to be open.

[fiestavike]

I think the 2nd and 3rd WR are generally schemed open in todays NFL and are not worthy of early round draft picks except for teams that are already really stacked at QB, OL, and pass rush. CBs are playing at such disadvantage that the shut down CB is no longer a part of the game. That being the case, almost no DB is worth drafting in the first round in the modern NFL.

If you look at the Rams, TB, KC and Philly and all 4 had 2 great receivers when they won it all. Even going back to Denver, the non-NE winning SB teams have had multiple great receivers and even in NE there was Gronk and Edelman/Welker.

I think the reason for that is because while it is possible to have one, high priced, shut down CB, having two is almost unheard of. So if you have two or even three great WRs, one of them is going to have a 2nd or 3rd tier CB covering them and is probably going to be open.

It certainly makes it easier to execute, but I think that observation is at least largely explained by correlation. The most critical prerequisites, in my opinion, remain, in order 1) QB who can process quickly, 2) QB who can avoid/manage pressure, 3) OL that can at least sufficiently pass block for your QB (depending on how good he is at 1 and 2), 4) the ability to quickly pressure the opposing QB.

[fiestavike]

I like that the Bucs and Rams have won the last 2 SB and have shown that they have won with a dominant DL.
The Bucs also had a dominant OL where the Rams had a serviceable one. The Bengals were in the SB with a dominant DL also.
Yes the QB play has been stellar. KC has the best QB in the game, lost the SB as Mahomes' OL was bullied around.
You have to have great WR play imo also. Look at the WR for the last 2 SB. Godwin and Evans for TB, Hill Kelce(TE) for KC, Chase, Higgins, Boyd for Cincy, and Kupp and OBJ for LAR. 4 very talented QBs. A LOT of very talented WRs. Dominant DL.
TB, LAR, CIN, and KC all dominated in the middle of the DL with immovable objects and penetration.
KC and Cincy had horrible OL play and the Rams was not great.
So all of this to me says that to be in the game, you need that top QB, and elite interior DL, and a very productive receiving corps.

This QB draft class is not special to me. So I can see keeping Kirk, but we HAVE TO create a dominant DL. That may require trading him and accumulating draft picks. This DL group this year is great. Between the DT and the Edge rushers.
There is quality depth at the DB positions.
So we have to either get to the QB with our 1st pick, protect our QB with the first pick, or we add a special weapon to the arsenal.
Hard to stop a WR when the QB has time to let the athletes get open. So the top CB can be a wasted pick.

A productive WR core is largely correlation with the other necessities. Take the same two WRs who are wildly productive and put them on a team with a QB who can't process quickly, climb the pocket, and who has poor pass blocking and they won't be as productive.

Though to be fair, even a moderately competent QB can put up huge numbers for is WRs in todays NFL.

[fiestavike]

Agree on the DB assessment. I've seen enough of them drafted high by us. I look at the WR option as drafting your starter across JJ after this year. At this point I think the best option is to restructure and extend Hunter and draft his pass rush partner and possible replacement as the high paid pass rusher 5 years from now. I haven't watched a lot of film on the edge guys after the top two yet though. An outside the box option that will never happen is to trade O' Neil and draft another OT at 12 considering how a very good prospect might be on the board still. That will never happen though I'm just spit balling. I'd say unfortunately at this point the betting favorite is that we will draft a CB at 12.

CBs are important and this modern NFL has been around for decades. Last year CBs were picked at 8,9,22,26 and 29. Of course you need to have pressure. That's always been key going back with us from the Page/Eller, Doleman/Millard and whoever else. At 12 we can pick anything and justify it. The key is getting the best player. IMO it all starts at the LOS. You need to win that battle or your chances of getting a win become very slim. We need a center and two guards and our LT is a question mark. Is he any good? Who knows. But at 12 I wouldn't use that pick on C or G. You need to try and fill the key positions first. The key positions fly off the board when a player is there. IMO they need to go pass rusher or cover guy. If a game breaker Ja'Marr Chase type WR is there then you can't skip that type of skill. That don't come around every year.

Unless I go back and look at teams who picked at 8, 9, 22, 26, and 29, I can't say those were bad picks, but I maintain that generally those positions really depend for success on these other positions, which are primary. If I were a GM in the modern NFL, I would heavily weight getting that QB, building an OL, Adding pass rush, in that order. Next comes offensive weapons at WR that make it easier to execute, then linebackers and DBs, then RB.

What I call the modern NFL has been around to some extent since the mid-to-late-nineties, but has been made almost unrecognizable in the series of rules to limit contact to the QB (can't touch their head, can't touch their legs, can't throw them on the ground with force, can't land on top of them) and then the similar though less totally absurd changes made regarding hitting and tackling other offensive skill position players. I think that was around 2010. Since then the modern NFL has been fully on display, offensive production has exploded, and football has been ruined. Most of the players in the hall of fame could not play in todays NFL. They would be ejected. Their "legacy" is now against the rules. Meanwhile, very few of the QBs in todays NFL, including those in the GOAT conversation, could have played in the early 90s and before.

[StumpHunter]

Since 2006 the average SB winning team was 7th in QB rank, 15th in rushing, 8.5 in offensive scoring, 7th in WR grade, 17th in Oline grade, 13th in pass rushing grade, 10th in pass defense DVOA and 8.9 in defensive scoring rank.

The Vikings are probably still there at WR and getting close to that Oline rank with some improvement from young guys on the Oline. After that the Vikings should be looking to improve their QB, pass rush and secondary in this draft to get close to the average SB winning team.

[Maelstrom88]

I still view Darrisaw as an unknown.

[CharVike]

CBs are important and this modern NFL has been around for decades. Last year CBs were picked at 8,9,22,26 and 29. Of course you need to have pressure. That's always been key going back with us from the Page/Eller, Doleman/Millard and whoever else. At 12 we can pick anything and justify it. The key is getting the best player. IMO it all starts at the LOS. You need to win that battle or your chances of getting a win become very slim. We need a center and two guards and our LT is a question mark. Is he any good? Who knows. But at 12 I wouldn't use that pick on C or G. You need to try and fill the key positions first. The key positions fly off the board when a player is there. IMO they need to go pass rusher or cover guy. If a game breaker Ja'Marr Chase type WR is there then you can't skip that type of skill. That don't come around every year.

Unless I go back and look at teams who picked at 8, 9, 22, 26, and 29, I can't say those were bad picks, but I maintain that generally those positions really depend for success on these other positions, which are primary. If I were a GM in the modern NFL, I would heavily weight getting that QB, building an OL, Adding pass rush, in that order. Next comes offensive weapons at WR that make it easier to execute, then linebackers and DBs, then RB.

What I call the modern NFL has been around to some extent since the mid-to-late-nineties, but has been made almost unrecognizable in the series of rules to limit contact to the QB (can't touch their head, can't touch their legs, can't throw them on the ground with force, can't land on top of them) and then the similar though less totally absurd changes made regarding hitting and tackling other offensive skill position players. I think that was around 2010. Since then the modern NFL has been fully on display, offensive production has exploded, and football has been ruined. Most of the players in the hall of fame could not play in todays NFL. They would be ejected. Their "legacy" is now against the rules. Meanwhile, very few of the QBs in todays NFL, including those in the GOAT conversation, could have played in the early 90s and before.

There is a position importance that's for sure. CB wouldn't be at the top of the list unless the other more important positions were filled to a teams satisfaction. I see what you are getting at with the modern NFL and that's a fair view. The NFL is a passing league. They bend every rule to generate more passing. It puts people in the seats and TV's tuned in. IMO our team could select almost any position and say it filled a void. We do have a pass rusher with Hunter but we don't have a CB on our roster that I think is very good.

[fiestavike]

Since 2006 the average SB winning team was 7th in QB rank, 15th in rushing, 8.5 in offensive scoring, 7th in WR grade, 17th in Oline grade, 13th in pass rushing grade, 10th in pass defense DVOA and 8.9 in defensive scoring rank.

The Vikings are probably still there at WR and getting close to that Oline rank with some improvement from young guys on the Oline. After that the Vikings should be looking to improve their QB, pass rush and secondary in this draft to get close to the average SB winning team.

I really think this is a terrible way to try to analyze how to build a winner. Every one of the things you are pointing to with these stats is just correlation to some actual realities on the field. Basically what these numbers amount to is the assertion that to be a contender you need to be in the top 1/3 of the league in passing and offensive scoring, top 1/3 in pass defense and scoring defense, and that QB is more important than OL

If I were to take anything meaningful from those stats, it would be that you need a QB who can quickly process, can handle pressure OR a top pass blocking OL, and finally a good pass rush, but I don't need the stats to tell me that. It's already obvious.

[IIsweet]

So in the draft, I am not confident in the QBs being any better than Mond. So I see us trying to load up the LOS.
I do however also see the need for quality DB help. I think that resigning Woods and restructuring Smith is a great idea. Smith is a fave and is getting long in the tooth, but he can mentor and help prepare the young secondary. We have some mid to late CB on the roster and they have to be upgraded. This is a deep CB class and their is value in the class well into the mid rds. It might need some coaching, but a lot of athleticism and measurables.
At DE... Hunter is an elite DE, when healthy.... but he also has shown that he is best as a LDE going against the RT. Thus in the 1st rd this year, a DE David Ojabo from Michigan may just be that guy. Purdue's George Karlaftis played a ton of football every game and durability is not a concern. Plus he's relentless, I think Jared Allen. Georgia's Travon Walker is a beast and has great tools, but is not a refined pass rusher yet. The Georgia system is not one designed for Sack numbers from the outside. Florida State Jermaine Johnson, left Georgia and had a dominating year rushing the passer as well as exploded at the Senior Bowl.
I am curious as to how our young guys are developing behind the scenes. Hard to know as Zimmer never threw the kids into the fire to see what they could do.

So hopefully these guys are able to get a good look at our current guys and determine just what we need. I am hoping for an interior DL like an Aaron Donald that is disruptive inside. We do not have that, we have space eaters.
I would love a true RDE to keep Hunter at LDE and allow his speed and athleticism to wreak havoc on RT's.
I would be thrilled with Linderbaum !

Right now I am gearing up for Combine week and about to take notes

[Maelstrom88]

I'd like to save money at safety and play Bynum next season. Dantzler should start as well.

[Maelstrom88]

Donatel has emphasized the desire for his defense to set hard edges. This is probably the best player coming out for that and he has a decent chance to be there at 12.

https://youtu.be/lDOf2LvXLcA

[CharVike]

I'd like to save money at safety and play Bynum next season. Dantzler should start as well.

I have a hard time with Dantzler. That Lion game when he just stood there and didn't even try to jump the route was as bad as it gets. Malcom Butler made a fortune when he baited Russell Wilson into tossing up a dead duck for a game saving end zone interception. But I agree with what you posted. They need to take some steps to rebuild this hunk of junk secondary. FA has few CBs that can play at a high level. You get the Trea Waynes of the world as shown below.
When the Cincinnati Bengals signed Trae Waynes during the 2020 free agency period, they thought they were getting a solid-to-good cornerback whose track record said he was always available — they were sadly mistaken.
On March 27, 2020, the Bengals agreed to a deal worth $42 million over three years with Wayne, then experiencing his first free agency. While he wasn’t the best corner available, he was coveted enough to warrant Cincinnati paying him $14 million a year despite no Pro Bowl appearances.
With his seven interceptions and 42 pass deflections in Minnesota, the former 11th-overall pick figured to be an immediate contributor to the Bengals. That hasn’t been the case at all. ‘
That's why I'm not a big fan of FA. Yes there are some very good players available but you will need to pay them way above there value. It's a bidding war or highest auction price. Most of the time the highest bidder gets the prize. Money hungry Cousins actually took less to play for us. You don't see too many FAs taking less. Of course the haters will say it was only a couple cents less.
Like always it comes down to how you draft.

[IIsweet]

We could absolutely go that route if the Vikings feel that we have the right personnel up front.
Adding at 12 a CB like Sauce Gardner, Stingley, or McDuffie and then getting a safety like Brisker, Pitre, Hill, or Cine in the 2nd. Granted those are the #2-5 ranked safeties, but I wouldn't look at any other I don't think.
Those 2 picks could become immediate starters on Day 1.

I still feel that the LOS is where we win and lose but you have to have playmakers on all levels of the Defense. With our cap situation and aging players, this is a huge draft for us to get it right.

[Maelstrom88]

I'd like to save money at safety and play Bynum next season. Dantzler should start as well.

I have a hard time with Dantzler. That Lion game when he just stood there and didn't even try to jump the route was as bad as it gets. Malcom Butler made a fortune when he baited Russell Wilson into tossing up a dead duck for a game saving end zone interception. But I agree with what you posted. They need to take some steps to rebuild this hunk of junk secondary. FA has few CBs that can play at a high level. You get the Trea Waynes of the world as shown below.
When the Cincinnati Bengals signed Trae Waynes during the 2020 free agency period, they thought they were getting a solid-to-good cornerback whose track record said he was always available — they were sadly mistaken.
On March 27, 2020, the Bengals agreed to a deal worth $42 million over three years with Wayne, then experiencing his first free agency. While he wasn’t the best corner available, he was coveted enough to warrant Cincinnati paying him $14 million a year despite no Pro Bowl appearances.
With his seven interceptions and 42 pass deflections in Minnesota, the former 11th-overall pick figured to be an immediate contributor to the Bengals. That hasn’t been the case at all. ‘
That's why I'm not a big fan of FA. Yes there are some very good players available but you will need to pay them way above there value. It's a bidding war or highest auction price. Most of the time the highest bidder gets the prize. Money hungry Cousins actually took less to play for us. You don't see too many FAs taking less. Of course the haters will say it was only a couple cents less.
Like always it comes down to how you draft.

Yeah Dantzler didn't have a great year. I'm not sure how much Zimmer had to do with that. I think he will probably be the number two corner this year. They dodged a bullet on Waynes. He never made enough plays on the ball for me.

[allday1991]

We could absolutely go that route if the Vikings feel that we have the right personnel up front.
Adding at 12 a CB like Sauce Gardner, Stingley, or McDuffie and then getting a safety like Brisker, Pitre, Hill, or Cine in the 2nd. Granted those are the #2-5 ranked safeties, but I wouldn't look at any other I don't think.
Those 2 picks could become immediate starters on Day 1.

I still feel that the LOS is where we win and lose but you have to have playmakers on all levels of the Defense. With our cap situation and aging players, this is a huge draft for us to get it right.

I respect you opinion but must say I totally disagree, no more wasting top picks on CBs. Load up the LOS on both sides of the ball and go from there. Pass rushers and o-line with the first two picks please depending on players available.