Vikings Message Board.Com

Coach Frazier said on Monday (yesterday), apparently oblivious:

"Josh will still be our nickel back, Josh actually did a pretty good job for us yesterday, I know some will think he didn't do some things well, but he did some good things in that ballgame, had one of his better ball games inside, didn't give up any big plays for us, which was encouraging,"

And courtesy of @PFF_Sam:

"Josh Robinson has been thrown at 42 times this season. Allowed 39 receptions."

Frazier has been absolving all negatives about Robinson, yet pointing out Xavier Rhodes' flaws.

I can't stand him or Musgrave anymore.

Purplemania wrote:WTF is Frazier smoking?

I was a big J-Rob fan last year. He showed decent coverage skills and was a tackling maniac. This year he is getting DESTROYED by everyone, including scrubs.

My #1 pet peeve in all of sports is coaches refusing to play rookies because they're rookies. Mother effer, if they can play, PLAY THEM! Who cares if they're rookies. Rhodes has shown he can hang in the league and has made some great plays in coverage.

Agreed. Especially in the NFL and you are a defensive back playing mainly man coverage.

Purplemania wrote:I was a big J-Rob fan last year. He showed decent coverage skills and was a tackling maniac.

I noted this too. If this isn't an indictment of coaching, you'll need to come up with a plausible reason why Robinson went from a competent, albeit raw, corner, to what his has become this season. I'm willing to entertain other explanations, but it seems to me that coaching is a likely culprit.

Just Me wrote: I noted this too. If this isn't an indictment of coaching, you'll need to come up with a plausible reason why Robinson went from a competent, albeit raw, corner, to what his has become this season. I'm willing to entertain other explanations, but it seems to me that coaching is a likely culprit.

How about a position switch and more targets? Robinson struggled at times last year too but his role has changed and opposing offenses are going after him.

Mothman wrote: How about a position switch and more targets? Robinson struggled at times last year too but his role has changed and opposing offenses are going after him.

And who switched his position?

Mothman wrote: How about a position switch and more targets? Robinson struggled at times last year too but his role has changed and opposing offenses are going after him.

The position switch I'll go for as a possibility. The more targets are simply because of his ineffectiveness in his position. Why, as a QB, would I pass in the neighborhood of any other defender, when Robinson gives me (effectively) the same result as the receiver being uncovered 90% of the time. And again, short term I can see the issue with the position change. Long term, I expect the coach to either teach, or address the deficient position by substitution if needed.

Mothman wrote: How about a position switch and more targets? Robinson struggled at times last year too but his role has changed and opposing offenses are going after him.

Yea, and he allows a 93% completion rate when he is targeted. That is off the charts bad. It's just as frustrating that he continues to get the majority of snaps.

Just Me wrote:[ when Robinson gives me (effectively) the same result as the receiver being uncovered 90% of the time.

His completion percentage is about 93% now!

Edit - beaten by yezzir!

mondry wrote: His completion percentage is about 93% now!

Edit - beaten by yezzir!

wow. and how many td's has he given up? I've never been one to bash on players but how bad are we when a guy performing like this still gets all the reps?!

mondry wrote: His completion percentage is about 93% now!

Edit - beaten by yezzir!

But seriously, Robinson looks completely over matched and lost on the field. It seems like he is continually 7 yards behind the receiver he is trying to cover.

vikeinmontana wrote: wow. and how many td's has he given up? I've never been one to bash on players but how bad are we when a guy performing like this still gets all the reps?!

Actually I think just 2 from the Carolina game and yes I'm putting both of them on him. Before that he had done a "good" job of keeping everything in front of him and tackling. He actually lead the team in tackles against the Steelers with 12, though as a CB that's not a "great" thing as it means they're completing a lot of balls in front of you.

I'm not sure it's because we don't have anyone better than him to play slot corner. No one else has been given much of a chance, this is one of my big peeves with Frazier, he'll give Josh Robinson every possible chance to not suck, learning on the job but then we have to bring rhodes along super slow like he's an idiot? I guess I just don't get it. At this point I think it's well past time to try sherels, Jefferson, or rhodes in the slot, even if they're not ideal or you don't think they can do it and put Robinson back outside where he's been some what better. Of course that violates Frazier's other "rule" that Rhodes can only learn one position at a time and has to stay there no matter what... ugg...

mondry wrote:And who switched his position?

Who cares? He asked for a plausible reason for Robinson's performance other than coaching so I gave him one.

Just Me wrote:The position switch I'll go for as a possibility. The more targets are simply because of his ineffectiveness in his position.

Sure, but the more he's targeted the more it underlines that ineffectiveness. That's why I mentioned the targets.

Purplemania wrote:WTF is Frazier smoking?

I was a big J-Rob fan last year. He showed decent coverage skills and was a tackling maniac. This year he is getting DESTROYED by everyone, including scrubs.

My #1 pet peeve in all of sports is coaches refusing to play rookies because they're rookies. Mother effer, if they can play, PLAY THEM! Who cares if they're rookies. Rhodes has shown he can hang in the league and has made some great plays in coverage.

Lets hope it's a sophmore thing, because he has the tools needed to be good. After 3 years we will see where we stand.

Mothman wrote:

Sure, but the more he's targeted the more it underlines that ineffectiveness. That's why I mentioned the targets.

I'm not disagreeing with you, exactly (well, OK - I am disagreeing on this point )

I'm asking what has made him "worse" this year than last. Position switch? Got it. Certainly could account for some of his struggles. Being targeted more? Was he giving up 90% of his plays last year? I'm using 90% because it's easier math to make my point. He may have been targeted less, but his percentage would (ostensibly) be the same if his performance was similar. IOW if he was targeted 10 times all last year, he would be expected to give up 9 passes. If he's targeted 50 times this year (not yet, but by the end of the Giants game he will be) he would be expected to give up 45 passes. I understand your saying it underlines (<-- is there such as thing as a formatting pun) his ineffectiveness, but that just means that it is highlighting it more. I think a 93% failure rate is evident enough without the need for it to be highlighted further.

I'm saying that being targeted more doesn't seem to be a valid reason to regress in performance. You appear to be offering a possibility that his performance regressed because he is being targeted more (maybe I'm misinterpreting that). I'm saying that causal link is reversed. He's being targeted more because his performance has regressed.

Lastly, I think the position switch is a major factor in his "drop off." Maybe they really have no better alternative <cough>Xavier Rhodes<cough>, but after 6 weeks into the season, shouldn't the coaching staff be able to work with him to improve the 90% burn rate? Instead, it seems to be getting worse.