King of Cassel

[Webbfann]

Excellent post! I've been trying to get used to Matt under center since week 4 too, and I stopped watching games completely until they put him back there. I went on a Cassel Strike!! And I'll do it again if they let anyone else start before he sucks eggs for at least 3 games straight.

I would agree with you that Matt Cassel's history is up-and-down, but there's one thing that has to be taken into account. His history also shows the ability to play well for long stretches, which backup-only types typically aren't capable of.

In 2008, the year he replaced an injured Tom Brady, he had 10 of 15 starts that were at or above league average for QBR. This despite never having started an NFL game and not even being a starter in COLLEGE (he rode the pine behind Matt Leinart). In 2010, his Pro Bowl season, 9 of his 16 starts were above league average. Add it up, and you get 19 of 31, or 61% of his starts above league average. That's very solid, consistent play for two entire seasons, no matter how you cut it. To give this level of play some comparison, Drew Brees has 8 of 14 games this season above league average, or 57%.

The other years Cassel was a starter -- 2009, 2011, and 2012 -- his stats were admittedly bottom-feeder material, with just 8 of 32 games at or above league average. So it begs the question: Why is a quarterback like Cassel so hit-or-miss? I don't know, but there is one common thread to his bad play ... it was with a very bad team.

To add to the mystery, he's on a pretty bad team again this year, yet he's played quite well. His QBR of 90.7 would place him just out of the top 10 if he had enough attempts to qualify. He would rank 8th in yards per attempt, 11th in yards per game, and he would be on pace for a 30-TD season.

So yeah, there are a lot of unknowns with Matt Cassel. But here's what we do know ... compared to what we have on the roster right now, he's easily the best QB on this team.

And despite the prevailing thought on this board, a lot of experts don't like this year's quarterback class (save for Teddy Bridgewater, who is by NO MEANS as much a certainty as Andrew Luck was, or even RGIII). That means Cassel, assuming he sticks around, is likely to be the best QB we'll have on the roster NEXT year.

Might want to get used to #16 under center.

[purplehaze]

Bump for King of Cassel: Just a little facts: He gonna kick some #### against bengals next week!

He became the fifth player in NFL history to have back-to-back 400-yard passing games with a 415-yard performance against the Miami Dolphins on Nov. 23 after a 400-yard performance against the New York Jets on Nov. 13. In 2010, Cassel led the Chiefs to their first divisional championship in seven years, and earned a Pro Bowl berth in the process. He also posted a career-high passer rating of 136.3 while throwing for a career-best three touchdown passes in the Patriots' 41-7 victory over the Broncos on Oct. 20 ... His 136.3 passer rating against the Broncos ranks as the 10th best mark by a Patriots quarterback since the 1970 AFL-NFL merger

Yeahhhhh!!!

[Reignman]

Nothing surprising here, just more confirmation of what we all already knew. We're more vertical and the WR's are more involved when Cassel is back there chucking the ball around. And the games are a helluva lot less painful to watch xD.

Code: Select all

        start cmp  att   pct    yds   avg td in  lg  rate
Ponder     9  152  239  63.6%  1648  6.90  7  9  47  77.9
Cassel     5  111  197  56.3%  1387  7.04  9  4  79  85.1

Christian Ponder

Code: Select all

             rec  yds   avg  td  lg   rec%  yard%
WR Jennings   24  274  11.42  0  27  15.79  16.63
WR Patterson  22  207   9.41  1  37  14.47  12.56
WR Simpson    21  364  17.33  0  47  13.82  22.09
WR Wright     11  169  15.36  1  38   7.24  10.25
WR Webb        2    9   4.50  0   8   1.32   0.55
TE Carlson    20  196   9.80  1  28  13.16  11.89
TE Rudolph    16  183  11.44  2  31  10.53  11.10
TE Ford        2   22  11.00  0  20   1.32   1.33
TE Ellison     2   26  13.00  1  14   1.32   1.58
RB Peterson   20  116   5.80  1  19  13.16   7.04
RB Gerhart     7   43   6.14  0  13   4.61   2.61
FB Felton      4   31   7.75  0  11   2.63   1.88
FB Line        1    8   8.00  0   8   0.66   0.49
   Total     152 1648  10.84  7  47

             rec  yds   avg  td  lg   rec%  yard%
   WR's       80 1023  12.79  2  47  52.63  62.08
   TE's       40  427  10.68  4  31  26.32  25.91
   backs      32  198   6.19  1  19  21.05  12.01

Matt Cassel

Code: Select all

             rec  yds   avg  td  lg   rec%  yard%
WR Jennings   25  308  12.32  3  70  22.52  22.21
WR Patterson  15  307  20.47  2  79  13.51  22.13
WR Simpson    23  322  14.00  2  51  20.72  23.22
WR Wright      7   90  12.86  1  24   6.31   6.49
WR Webb        3   24   8.00  0  15   2.70   1.73
TE Carlson    13  158  12.15  0  30  11.71  11.39
TE Rudolph    11  103   9.36  1  23   9.91   7.43
TE Ford        2   13   6.50  0  11   1.80   0.94
TE Ellison     0    0   0.00  0   0   0.00   0.00
RB Peterson    7   29   4.14  0  11   6.31   2.09
RB Gerhart     4   28   7.00  0  10   3.60   2.02
FB Felton      1    5   5.00  0   5   0.90   0.36
FB Line        0    0   0.00  0   0   0.00   0.00
   Total     111 1387  12.50  9  79    

             rec  yds   avg  td  lg   rec%  yard%
   WR's       73 1051  14.40  8  79  65.77  75.78
   TE's       26  274  10.54  1  30  23.42  19.75
   backs      12   62   5.17  0  11  10.81   4.47

[Just Me]

Nothing surprising here, just more confirmation of what we all already knew. We're more vertical and the WR's are more involved when Cassel is back there chucking the ball around. And the games are a helluva lot less painful to watch xD.

<Stats snipped for brevity>

Thanks for doing the work on the stats. 90 and change for Cassel's passer rating this year is something we could live with pretty easily until we transition to our 'franchise guy.' (Whomever and whenever that may be...)

[Webbfann]

Thanks for doing the work on the stats. 85 and change for Cassel's passer rating this year is something we could live with pretty easily until we transition to our 'franchise guy.' (Whomever and whenever that may be...)

Not sure where the 85 came from or what source is most reliable but http://www.pro-football-reference.com/p ... ssMa00.htm has him at 90.7.

[dkoby]

It's weird watching the Vikings with a legitimate passing game.

I nominate this for post of the year.

[Just Me]

Not sure where the 85 came from or what source is most reliable but http://www.pro-football-reference.com/p ... ssMa00.htm has him at 90.7.

90.7 is correct. I think the source I was using hadn't factored in last Sunday's game yet. (Corrected my earlier post - Thanks for letting me know...)

[mondry]

The saddest part about those yardage totals is that Ponder's played nearly twice as many games! And of course the WR TD's is what stands out to me.

[losperros]

The other years Cassel was a starter -- 2009, 2011, and 2012 -- his stats were admittedly bottom-feeder material, with just 8 of 32 games at or above league average. So it begs the question: Why is a quarterback like Cassel so hit-or-miss? I don't know, but there is one common thread to his bad play ... it was with a very bad team.

To add to the mystery, he's on a pretty bad team again this year, yet he's played quite well. His QBR of 90.7 would place him just out of the top 10 if he had enough attempts to qualify. He would rank 8th in yards per attempt, 11th in yards per game, and he would be on pace for a 30-TD season.

I wonder if the quality of his WRs on the teams had anything to do with it. Cassel has always liked throwing the ball to his wide outs rather than dumping off. As I've said before, I think the Vikings have four quality WRs in Jennings, Simpson, Wright, and Patterson. I'm not saying they're the best WR corps in the NFL, but these guys are athletically inclined and can make tough catches. And it appears as if Cassel has some chemistry with them. Look at how both Jennings and Patterson are getting involved in the game now.

[Purple bruise]

I wonder if the quality of his WRs on the teams had anything to do with it. Cassel has always liked throwing the ball to his wide outs rather than dumping off. As I've said before, I think the Vikings have four quality WRs in Jennings, Simpson, Wright, and Patterson. I'm not saying they're the best WR corps in the NFL, but these guys are athletically inclined and can make tough catches. And it appears as if Cassel has some chemistry with them. Look at how both Jennings and Patterson are getting involved in the game now.

I have seen much improvement in the pass protection and it seems as though Loadholt is playing more consistently. Berger seems to be much better in pass protecting that Fusco. A few more upgrades and tweeks with the Draft and trades and this team will be back on track in the third and final year of the Spielman's rebuild plan

[dkoby]

I have seen much improvement in the pass protection and it seems as though Loadholt is playing more consistently. Berger seems to be much better in pass protecting that Fusco. A few more upgrades and tweeks with the Draft and trades and this team will be back on track in the third and final year of the Spielman's rebuild plan

I'm not disagreeing that the protection is getting better, but watch this play and you see Cassel avoid 2 defenders....step up in the pocket....anticipating a receiver breaking open.... reset his feet and deliver a strike.
http://www.vikings.com/media-vault/vide ... 116504b52e

Now, watch it again with Ponder in your mind.....Sack or QB run.

[headless_norseman]

The other years Cassel was a starter -- 2009, 2011, and 2012 -- his stats were admittedly bottom-feeder material, with just 8 of 32 games at or above league average. So it begs the question: Why is a quarterback like Cassel so hit-or-miss? I don't know, but there is one common thread to his bad play ... it was with a very bad team.

Cassel generally played well when he played under a good coach and with talent around him. His worst years recently with KC, he had a horrible coach, as evidenced by And Reid's commplete turnaround of that team in one season.

[mondry]

I wonder if the quality of his WRs on the teams had anything to do with it. Cassel has always liked throwing the ball to his wide outs rather than dumping off. As I've said before, I think the Vikings have four quality WRs in Jennings, Simpson, Wright, and Patterson. I'm not saying they're the best WR corps in the NFL, but these guys are athletically inclined and can make tough catches. And it appears as if Cassel has some chemistry with them. Look at how both Jennings and Patterson are getting involved in the game now.

They very much remind of the GB packers WR corp. Not a truly dominant one in the bunch but plenty of quick guys who just need someone to deliver an accurate ball on time 5-15 yards down the field to give them the opportunity for the catch and to pick up some YAC. I absolutely love what we have on offense as far as talent and personnel goes, if Cassel can play like he has against PIT and PHI this unit can be REALLY good.

Improve the defense and coaching and this team has a real shot I think next year to turn some heads.

[saint33]

I'm not disagreeing that the protection is getting better, but watch this play and you see Cassel avoid 2 defenders....step up in the pocket....anticipating a receiver breaking open.... reset his feet and deliver a strike.
http://www.vikings.com/media-vault/vide ... 116504b52e

Now, watch it again with Ponder in your mind.....Sack or QB run.

This is the biggest difference in the offense. The WRs aren't playing different, nor is the line. It is a tale of two QBs. One QBs panics under pressure, at times holding the ball to long and getting sacked. Other times, he tries to step up in the pocket and runs directly into the oncoming pressure. He drops his head when he feels pressure, and when he doesn't get hit, he'll almost always tuck it and run. On the other side of the spectrum, Cassel sets up nicely in the pocket and gets the ball out of his hands quickly if coverage dictates that he has a place to go with the ball. If not, he correctly feels pressure and will step up, keep his eyes down field and anticipate his receiver coming open and throw the ball to that spot.

Nothing has changed about our protection, we just have a QB who doesn't fold under the slightest glimpse of pressure like we did for the majority of the season.

[Just Me]

This is the biggest difference in the offense. The WRs aren't playing different, nor is the line. It is a tale of two QBs. One QBs panics under pressure, at times holding the ball to long and getting sacked. Other times, he tries to step up in the pocket and runs directly into the oncoming pressure. He drops his head when he feels pressure, and when he doesn't get hit, he'll almost always tuck it and run. On the other side of the spectrum, Cassel sets up nicely in the pocket and gets the ball out of his hands quickly if coverage dictates that he has a place to go with the ball. If not, he correctly feels pressure and will step up, keep his eyes down field and anticipate his receiver coming open and throw the ball to that spot.

Nothing has changed about our protection, we just have a QB who doesn't fold under the slightest glimpse of pressure like we did for the majority of the season.

I agree completely with this assessment. Freeman actually does this well too (in terms of movement and awareness in the pocket - not the accurate throwing part), but Cassel is clearly out-performing all our current QBs.