Vikings Message Board.Com

Let's face it, this is a BIG move. The truth of the matter is we will have no idea if this was a good move or not until next season. Even if We get someone like Cruz we still won't know anything until sometime next season. Everything is up in the air. I for one am completely withholding judgement until I see what Spielman does with this move. And I don't think I will be able to form any kind of informed opinion until after draft day round one.

Well, here we go. I've been speculating all weekend on what Harvin's true value is. Now we've got a pretty good idea.

Let's analyze this without emotion by comparing Percy Harvin to Victor Cruz.

Overall, Victor Cruz's numbers are very comparable to Percy's, when you factor in Percy's rushing and receiving yards. Percy beats him in yardage, but not by much.

As a receiver, Cruz buries Harvin, numbers-wise. Look it up. He's got 168 catches for more than 2,600 yards and 19 TDs over the past two seasons. Those are insane stats for a WR. Even if you add in Percy's rushing and return numbers, he has only 500 more total yards and 5 fewer total TDs than Cruz. Based on numbers, their respective values are a wash.

Victor Cruz has a first-round tender on him. Yet the Vikings just got a first-rounder AND two additional picks -- significantly more than the designated value of Victor Cruz -- despite very comparable numbers. I'd say they did pretty well.

Now, I realize Percy has value as a kick returner. But how much, really? Even though Percy averages more than 32 yards per kick return the past two seasons, the new kickoff rules have diminished his value. He's dropped from 40+ returns his first two years to only 16 each of the past two because of the 80%+ touchback rate across the league. That's one touch per game, folks. And you can't say we're losing 500+ yards in kick returns because SOMEBODY will return the kicks. Even if Percy's replacement returns kicks at the league average of 23.9, you're talking a grand total of 138 yards less than Percy would have achieved. That's less than 10 yards total on one touch per game.

So if we take emotion out of the picture, you simply can't blame Spielman for doing this. And if Percy was burning his bridges as has been reported, then it is nothing less than a coup by the Vikings front office.

Percy Harvin - WR - Seahawks

The 2014 "mid-round pick" the Vikings are acquiring as part of the Percy Harvin trade is expected to be a third-rounder.

It means the Vikings are coming away with a first-, second- and third-day pick in exchange for their No. 1 receiver. It's still not equal value for a player of Harvin's caliber, but far exceeds what the Dolphins received for Brandon Marshall. It also betters the package Randy Moss fetched in 2005. It's a small price to pay for an elite receiver still two months shy of his 25th birthday.
Source: Danny O'Neil on Twitter

WOWZA's, I had hoped deep down that this whole thing wasn't true but that settles it. I think we got okay compensation, but it's risky business. You can almost pencil in taking a WR with one of our #1 picks now and probably even another before the 4th round is over. How crazy would it be if we took two WR's with both the first rounders? The receiving corps is so bad though that it wouldn't even be that bad of a plan, yikes!

Definitely hoping this was the best move of a bad situation, seattle has harvin and Rice now, and that team just got a whole lot scarier.

Will be interested to see how Harvin's career plays out now, best of luck to him.

dead_poet wrote:Percy Harvin - WR - Seahawks
The 2014 "mid-round pick" the Vikings are acquiring as part of the Percy Harvin trade is expected to be a third-rounder.

Wow, that's higher than I expected so I hope that expectation becomes a reality.

It means the Vikings are coming away with a first-, second- and third-day pick in exchange for their No. 1 receiver. It's still not equal value for a player of Harvin's caliber, but far exceeds what the Dolphins received for Brandon Marshall. It also betters the package Randy Moss fetched in 2005. It's a small price to pay for an elite receiver still two months shy of his 25th birthday.

There's no doubt that Harvin is a superb talent and a genuine playmaker but an elite receiver? I just don't think he's put himself in that category. A 1st, a 3rd and a 7th could turn out to be more than equal value for him if used wisely. Only time will tell.

mondry wrote:WOWZA's, I had hoped deep down that this whole thing wasn't true but that settles it. I think we got okay compensation, but it's risky business. You can almost pencil in taking a WR with one of our #1 picks now and probably even another before the 4th round is over. How crazy would it be if we took two WR's with both the first rounders? The receiving corps is so bad though that it wouldn't even be that bad of a plan, yikes!

I could see them taking two WRs in the first 2 rounds even if they use one of the first round picks on another position. I'm just "thinking aloud" here but I wonder if they might even consider taking Tyler Eifert if he falls to them. I realize they already have Rudolph, Carlson and Ellison but considering Carlson's disappointing 2012 season and relatively low cap hit, I can see it being a consideration. I have to believe that finding the best weapons they can for Ponder will be a priority.

I would really like to see the Vikings use one of those 1st rd picks and make a run at Cruz. He is a more complete WR than Wallace and younger than Jennings. Essentially it becomes Harvin for Cruz and that is a lot easier to stomach than hearing your 2nd best player is traded for picks.

Vikefan68 wrote:I would really like to see the Vikings use one of those 1st rd picks and make a run at Cruz. He is a more complete WR than Wallace and younger than Jennings. Essentially it becomes Harvin for Cruz and that is a lot easier to stomach than hearing your 2nd best player is traded for picks.

Actually it would be Harvin for Cruz plus 2 picks.

Vikefan68 wrote:I would really like to see the Vikings use one of those 1st rd picks and make a run at Cruz. He is a more complete WR than Wallace and younger than Jennings. Essentially it becomes Harvin for Cruz and that is a lot easier to stomach than hearing your 2nd best player is traded for picks.

I'm not against this notion, all I can see are positives. You're getting a young guy, who is proven in the pros and from an ownership standpoint but ultimately to a lesser extent, think of all the merchandise we'll ship with Cruz's popularity.

I'm glad Percy is gone. Don't get me wrong, he's great. I even named my truck Percy, but when all his drama came out I renamed it to Fran Truckenton.
Anyways, if he stayed, it would have gotten bad. Like Titus Young or Moss in Oakland bad. I got really tired of all this prima Dona Percy rumor crap. I know hes a hard guy to replace but the dude is a cancer. Plus, two first rounders this year is sweeet. Hopefully K. Allen and someone else vikings need. Hopefully the Seattle pick isn't wasted on a "best player available" pick. In Spilmen I trust.

Vikefan68 wrote:I would really like to see the Vikings use one of those 1st rd picks and make a run at Cruz. He is a more complete WR than Wallace and younger than Jennings. Essentially it becomes Harvin for Cruz and that is a lot easier to stomach than hearing your 2nd best player is traded for picks.

Agree completely. Wallace has had his issues. And doesn't seem all their emotionally. Jennings is old and definitely toward the end of his career. Cruz has no issues other than wanting a pay day and taking that pick.

I'd definitely take him over whoever we can get come draft day...in a heartbeat!

Percy will be lucky to get 1,000 yards in Seattle. They have had exactly 2, 1,000 yard WR's in the last 10 years. With Wilson running the ball and Rice on the other side, I expect Percy will be complaining by the 6th game of his second season with them. While I enjoyed him playing here, I am not sad to see him go if he is going to be a PITA. I would laugh like crazy if Ponder puts up 4,000 yards this year. (Not likely, but it would be funny.)

Not to mention Golden Tate all three of them have big ego's Rice Harvin and Golden Tate all are me me me players good luck with that

They got enough. I am happy. Spielman totally into Ted Thompson mode. It's his team now, and for years to come. Go Vikes!

Just had to be the Seahawks didn't it? Smh...I live in Seattle. This hurts.

Given the situation though,I think it should work out for both teams if the Vikings can hit on the draft picks. Hate to see him go man, and I back up AP's sentiments.

I tried getting on the local sports radio show to impart to these fools out here just what they're getting, but Softy cut it short.