Vikings Message Board.Com

Pondering Her Percy wrote:I see what you're saying but if you're going to refer to drafting Carr, he was no different in that aspect. Carr ran a ton out of shotgun as well in college.

I'm just asking the question. If I had intended to make a point about Carr, I would have simply done that. Since you mentioned him, shotgun or not, his arm strength might have made him a better fit but honestly, this isn't about him. I'm trying to figure out what did they saw in Bridgewater to make them think this was all going to come together and that he was their guy.

Also, I think it's pretty clear that Norv had no clue AP couldn't run out of shotgun either.

That's probably because over the years, he's run just fine out of that formation (not frequently, but productively). It's not that he can't run from the shotgun. It's that he hasn't been successful running from it this year.

I'm thinking they didn't expect to be using the shotgun so much in the first place. Their plan seemed to be to start Cassel and develop Bridgewater behind him in 2014. Maybe they figured they could turn him into a dropback passer by 2015 and then merge him smoothly into Turner's take on the Coryell offense, power running game and all. Perhaps using him the shotgun so much last year was simply a concession the rushing him on the field in relief of Cassel and playing without Peterson. They may have wanted to keep him in more familiar territory.

I just hope Zimmer and Spielman have a clear vision of what they are trying to build on offense, especially Spielman. I'm seeing a lot of mismatched pieces.

Raptorman wrote:Everyone bad mouthing Teddy, but yet not one of you has put up a viable replacement from the draft or anywhere else.

Just curious but what would that do ? w could say anything or anyone but w e are tied to a QB that has a slow release and can't make quick reads and is wildly inaccurate , he is not above criticism just like you or I if we had a terrible day at our prospective jobs . When he plays well he gets accolades when he plays like Ponder he's gunna get ripped just like Ponder did .

TSonn wrote:I would argue there is plenty of evidence that suggests any QB starting for us would struggle since that has been the only case aside from Favre. How many guys have we had since Favre? 6? And they've all put up pedestrian numbers.

They were pedestrian players... and in some cases that might even be a generous assessment.

Of course, I'd love for there to be evidence of the contrary, but that would mean we've had QB success since drafting AD.

They did: in 2009. Favre thrived with Peterson in the backfield.

I love me some AD but maybe there is something to his game that hurts our passing game. Heck, it even seems like Teddy played better last year when AD was out. Sure there are other factors like a healthier line last year (although wasn't last year when Kalil was garbage?) and we had different receivers (Jennings v Wallace), but a consistent factor in our decade of bad QB play has been having AD in the backfield.

If we look at those QBs: Jackson, Bollinger, Frerotte, Holcomb, Favre, Webb, Ponder, Cassel, Rosenthal, Bridgewater... what stands out as another consistent factor and which of those players is not like the others?

I mean no offense but I think it's a reach to suggest AD is the problem. If anything, they've done him a disservice by putting a series of rookies, backups and journeymen on the field at QB for most of his career.

it doesn't freaking matter, 3 step drop or 4 step drop. norv turner or god himself as the coordinator. bridgewater clearly cannot play at the nfl level on a consistent basis. he cannot execute throws beyond 5 yards, his mechanics are awful, and now his confidence is shot. so, what now? peterson is leading the nfl in rushing behind this so called "horrible" offensive line. this kid has a weak arm on top of everything he is finished. i just hope they don't stick by him as long as ponder. and for those who think peterson is hindering bridgewaters development you have to be kidding me. bridgewater is horrible, plain and simple.

A fairly terse article by Michael Rand. I can't say I disagree with him. Here's a taste...

We keep asking the question: if Teddy Bridgewater finds himself in a game where he is forced to throw to keep the Vikings in it, can he (and his offensive line and receivers, again in no particular order) rise to the challenge and be more than a game-managing offense?

So far, the answer is a resounding, “No.” It’s to the point where the Vikings and particularly their offense (though the defense gets plenty of blame against Seattle in particular) is guilty until proven innocent against very good teams. The default position is that they can’t keep up until they show us that they can.

http://www.startribune.com/against-top- ... 360727901/

Mothman wrote: They were pedestrian players... and in some cases that might even be a generous assessment.
They did: in 2009. Favre thrived with Peterson in the backfield.
If we look at those QBs: Jackson, Bollinger, Frerotte, Holcomb, Favre, Webb, Ponder, Cassel, Rosenthal, Bridgewater... what stands out as another consistent factor and which of those players is not like the others?

I mean no offense but I think it's a reach to suggest AD is the problem. If anything, they've done him a disservice by putting a series of rookies, backups and journeymen on the field at QB for most of his career.

Man, I was hoping you wearnt going to praise Favre in this post lol. I would have to shoot myself if you were giving Favre some love.

purplehaze wrote:I have been a Vikings fan for over 40 years. Been to many games, buy lots of merchandise, groomed my kids to be die hard fans. I feel like we Viking fans deserve to get lucky and draft a superstar QB one of these years. Why cant we draft the real deal for once? Will this ever happen in my lifetime??? I am 48 years old right now.

Culpepper was pretty good before he blew out his knee.

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culpepper was only good when he had moss, are you serious? look at his statistics without him. my god i could throw to moss he is the best ever. and favre is the only legitimate qb we've had in 17 years since cunningham. 17 freaking years nearly 2 decades now.

Mothman wrote: I'm just asking the question. If I had intended to make a point about Carr, I would have simply done that. Since you mentioned him, shotgun or not, his arm strength might have made him a better fit but honestly, this isn't about him. I'm trying to figure out what did they saw in Bridgewater to make them think this was all going to come together and that he was their guy.
That's probably because over the years, he's run just fine out of that formation (not frequently, but productively). It's not that he can't run from the shotgun. It's that he hasn't been successful running from it this year.

I'm thinking they didn't expect to be using the shotgun so much in the first place. Their plan seemed to be to start Cassel and develop Bridgewater behind him in 2014. Maybe they figured they could turn him into a dropback passer by 2015 and then merge him smoothly into Turner's take on the Coryell offense, power running game and all. Perhaps using him the shotgun so much last year was simply a concession the rushing him on the field in relief of Cassel and playing without Peterson. They may have wanted to keep him in more familiar territory.

I just hope Zimmer and Spielman have a clear vision of what they are trying to build on offense, especially Spielman. I'm seeing a lot of mismatched pieces.

I think it really is as simple as improving the O-line, at whatever cost within reason. They also need to find guys that are equally good in pass pro as they are run blocking. These 7 step drops take time so it's obvious why there but we also don't want to have to leave extra blockers in to make it happen since that takes away our options. With better blocking they can run peterson out of the shotgun again without taking negative runs as often. I have to believe that was their goal this year (since that's what they tried to do at the start) but the O-line just didn't allow that to continue.

But it's imperative that they get rid of this idea that they're a power running team and teddy's just a game manager. When they let teddy sling it last year because there wasn't as much pressure to win he was effective. Instead of encouraging him to be a game manager they need to encourage him to take over games because they have a talented defense that can make up for any mistakes he makes. If anything it makes sense to take MORE risk.

Raptorman wrote:Everyone bad mouthing Teddy, but yet not one of you has put up a viable replacement from the draft or anywhere else.

Then why draft heineicke???

it doesn't matter what teddy did last year because his confidence is shot. you can see it on his face. once that goes, forget it. think what you will, but he clearly has lost his confidence.

mosscarter wrote:culpepper was only good when he had moss, are you serious? look at his statistics without him. my god i could throw to moss he is the best ever. and favre is the only legitimate qb we've had in 17 years since cunningham. 17 freaking years nearly 2 decades now.

Your spot on MC.

Raptorman wrote:Everyone bad mouthing Teddy, but yet not one of you has put up a viable replacement from the draft or anywhere else.

You mean right now or ever? There's been tons of people wanting us to do more than just draft guys like Ponder and Bridgewater and pray it works out. There was multiple posters here wanting us to at least kick the tires on guys like Carson Palmer or other FA QB's.

Kapernick would be worth a shot. He at least has a cannon and can improvise with his freak athletic ability. Could be brought in for cheap and have a competition.

it's tough to fathom how we passed on both carr and daulton purplehaze. maybe we are cursed.