Vikings Message Board.Com

Demi wrote:How about we look at the QBs left in the playoffs? 6'4, 6'4, 6'4, 6'6.

How about we think beyond something as insignificant as the height of the 4 QBs remaining in this year's playoffs to team football? For example, Russell Wilson isn't in the playoffs because his team wasn't quite good enough to beat the Falcons in a close game last week, not because he isn't 6' 4". Ditto for 6'2" Aaron Rodgers (winner of a Super Bowl), whose team couldn't beat the 49ers last week.

Having a tall QB doesn't get anyone to the Super Bowl. Having a good QB and a championship-caliber team gets them there.

Jim

Mothman wrote: How about we think beyond something as insignificant as the height of the 4 QBs remaining in this year's playoffs to team football? For example, Russell Wilson isn't in the playoffs because his team wasn't quite good enough to beat the Falcons in a close game last week, not because he isn't 6' 4". Ditto for 6'2" Aaron Rodgers (winner of a Super Bowl), whose team couldn't beat the 49ers last week.

Having a tall QB doesn't get anyone to the Super Bowl. Having a good QB and a championship-caliber team gets them there.

Jim

You can think that if you want, Jim. I think the Vikings should be eyeing this guy for their QB;



He's both Jolly (wouldn't be a cancer) and tall!

HardcoreVikesFan wrote:To this day, I still believe that Christian Ponder was chosen as our QB because Jake Locker was drafted before we picked. Jake Locker is not simply just a west coast QB. IMO, Minnesota was not looking for a west coast QB specifically. They took Ponder because they had him as the best QB available when they picked.

I agree and because the only QB they had under contract was Joe Webb, they were determined to pick the best QB available to them.

Your reference to Colin Kapernick is interesting. Something tells me you would have gone ballistic if the Vikings took Colin Kapernick in the 2011 draft. I was not pleased we selected Ponder, but I did not want Kapernick at the time either. Heck, the general consensus on this board and in the NFL world was that Colin Kapernick was the rawest QB in the draft.

Like it or not, Ponder will get 2013 to prove his worth. Should he flop, I can guarantee that this team will not hesitate to find a better QB. That being said, I hope that not only Ponder succeeds, but I hope Minnesota finds a capable QB to be behind Ponder this offseason. Regardless if that QB comes via free agency or in the draft.

Well said!

MrPurplenGold wrote: I'm saying there wasn't anyone else worth picking at that position. QBs are over drafted because of their value to a team. the talent base of first round of the 2011 draft overall just wasn't very good

my question for you was with who was available after ponder who would you have picked and you can say Dalton but he would have been just as big of a reach as ponder

I disagree with this, What i wouldve liked to see in the 2011 draft would have been Nick Fairley or Prince Amukamara in the first round then Ponder, Dalton or Kaepernick in the second round (assuming that one of them wouldve gotten bumped up to us if we hadnt reached so far for ponder) of coarse in that situation we miss out on rudolph OR miss out on a QB all together.

EDIT: Guess i couldve commented a bit on the subject, I agree with most here, i would like to see improvements at WR, Guard, LB and some secondary depth this offseason. based on the success of the last two drafts i would like to see these needs addressed mostly through the draft, i dont want to see a HUGE free agent signing.

Cliff wrote:He's both Jolly (wouldn't be a cancer) and tall!

LOL! I just don't know if that green would work with the Vikings purple, gold and white uniforms. After all, color coordination is even more important to effective QB performance than height.

I guess I should qualify that obvious joke by saying that I understand height can be advantage for a QB. It makes it easier for them to see and throw over tall linemen and to spot receivers. It's just not a characteristic that dictates quality of performance. Within reason, a shorter QB can be very successful in the NFL.

AADPFan wrote: I disagree with this, What i wouldve liked to see in the 2011 draft would have been Nick Fairley or Prince Amukamara in the first round then Ponder, Dalton or Kaepernick in the second round (assuming that one of them wouldve gotten bumped up to us if we hadnt reached so far for ponder) of coarse in that situation we miss out on rudolph OR miss out on a QB all together.

EDIT: Guess i couldve commented a bit on the subject, I agree with most here, i would like to see improvements at WR, Guard, LB and some secondary depth this offseason. based on the success of the last two drafts i would like to see these needs addressed mostly through the draft, i dont want to see a HUGE free agent signing.

Nick Fairley has been in and out of legal troubles since he got into the league and Prince Amukamara has had injury and consistency problems and neither one of them make the type of impact that a QB can.

Jeez, you'd think we jsut went 2-14 not 10-6 by reading some of these posts.

mansquatch wrote:Jeez, you'd think we jsut went 2-14 not 10-6 by reading some of these posts.

Yep. There certainly are a whole lot of "Gloom and Doomers" around

MrPurplenGold wrote: Nick Fairley has been in and out of legal troubles since he got into the league and Prince Amukamara has had injury and consistency problems and neither one of them make the type of impact that a QB can.

I'm talking about what i would've preferred back in 2011, hindsight is 20/20. basically my point is that there were other players that were worth picking back then (even if they ended up having injury and legal troubles).

Heck, the general consensus on this board and in the NFL world was that Colin Kapernick was the rawest QB in the draft.

And if we had drafted him, he'd be another square peg being pounded into a round hole, and probably if not completely ineffective, no where near as effective as he has been for the 49ers.

I guess I should qualify that obvious joke by saying that I understand height can be advantage for a QB. It makes it easier for them to see and throw over tall linemen and to spot receivers. It's just not a characteristic that dictates quality of performance. Within reason, a shorter QB can be very successful in the NFL.

And that's my overall point. There are certain features that translate better to certain positions. One of them being height at various positions, with QB being one of them. Obviously you can succeed being closer to six foot then not. But when you're trying to find a franchise player at any position you should try and limit your risk in any way possible, and one of those ways is taking a player who's more likely to succeed, in this case because of their size. Height is a benefit in a number of ways, and we continue to bring in smaller QBs. Is there a reason for this? Probably because it usually means they're more athletic. Or at least carry less bulk. It'd be nice to *once* pin our hopes on a guy with that ideal size which we haven't seen since Culpepper.

Cliff wrote: You can think that if you want, Jim. I think the Vikings should be eyeing this guy for their QB;













He's both Jolly (wouldn't be a cancer) and tall!

Woah, we could just put 10 big blockers on the field, 10 steps he scores a TD, on every drive. Think about how cool it would be, when he scores, and hollers HO HO HO.

Demi wrote:And that's my overall point. There are certain features that translate better to certain positions. One of them being height at various positions, with QB being one of them. Obviously you can succeed being closer to six foot then not. But when you're trying to find a franchise player at any position you should try and limit your risk in any way possible, and one of those ways is taking a player who's more likely to succeed, in this case because of their size.
Height is a benefit in a number of ways, and we continue to bring in smaller QBs. Is there a reason for this? Probably because it usually means they're more athletic. Or at least carry less bulk. It'd be nice to *once* pin our hopes on a guy with that ideal size which we haven't seen since Culpepper.

It would be nice but since size is just one determining factor in drafting a QB teams are obviously going to select QBs who have less than ideal size if they feel a player's other attributes and skills are enough to make up for a lack of ideal height.

AADPFan wrote: I'm talking about what i would've preferred back in 2011, hindsight is 20/20. basically my point is that there were other players that were worth picking back then (even if they ended up having injury and legal troubles).

Fairley had character issues coming out of Auburn and the Vikings didn't have a "need" among the defensive line then

MrPurplenGold wrote: Fairley had character issues coming out of Auburn and the Vikings didn't have a "need" among the defensive line then

Percy Harvin and Randy Moss had character issues coming out of college as well, hell Cris Carter had character issues... your point is invalid. Also, we did have a need at DT in 2011, Pat Williams was gone, so we were no better off back then than we are now. Also if your drafting BPA then you might not always draft for your biggest need. No need to go back and forth about this, all im saying is that there were plenty of other options with the 12th pick than to reach for ponder.

What exactly does this hindignt is 20/20 discussion have to do with the off-sesaon direction of the Vikings? You don't like the Ponder pick. Well boo-hoo, until somebody invents a wayback machine we are all going to have to deal with the fact that barring injury he'll be the starter in September.

The NT aspect of this thread is of interest. I think getting a solid playmaker at NT and MLB would do much to improve our defense. Are there any FA or Draft prospects that could be the next Vince Wilfork or Pat Williams for this club?