Vikings Message Board.Com

i think many are looking way too much into this, and especially the "altercation" with frazier. you guys know how nmany players get into arguments with their coaches? a ton. i've seen manning scream at his coaches and that guy is a saint. brady and belichik have went at it countless times. they are competitors and in the heat of the moment things happen. percy is no different. he's competitive and has a little bit of a hot head. but find quotes from urban meyer about harvin and he has nothing but good things to say about the guy. i imagine frazier feels the same.

all i'm saying is if we're going to take this limited knowledge we have as fans and act like we know what we're talking about we can at least be consistent. if we're going to label percy a bad guy and a cancer because of arguments with coaches that not a single one of us witnessed first hand....we should do that with every player who has had an argument with their coaches. and i think you'd be surprised to see just how big that number is.

dead_poet wrote:Two reader comments to the above story that I found interesting.

Exactly the same thing was said in this forum by many of us. It's highly unusual that someone would go from "might play on Sunday" to "no way he can come back for the playoffs in two months". Especially for a key player. You might put a third string player on IR in the same situation to free up a roster spot, but not your leading receiver.

I don't understand how anyone can believe the spin coming out of Winter Park about this. "Oh, I guess the doctors must have been mistaken." Right.

Eli wrote:I don't understand how anyone can believe the spin coming out of Winter Park about this. "Oh, I guess the doctors must have been mistaken." Right.

Have Vikings' brass actually said this?

Percy is great player but he misses a lot of games, maybe more than Sydney Rice did for us ..

I say try and trade him and move on

jackal wrote:Percy is great player but he misses a lot of games, maybe more than Sydney Rice did for us ..

I say try and trade him and move on

i see people say this often and i just don't think it's true. this is the first season that he has missed many games due to an injury or otherwise. he played 15 of 16 games his rookie year. 14 of 16 in 2010. every single game last year. and 9 this year before getting hurt. so in his first 3 years before this season he missed 3 games which i guess i just don't see as a lot.

jackal wrote:Percy is great player but he misses a lot of games, maybe more than Sydney Rice did for us ..

I say try and trade him and move on

Other than this year, Percy has been able to play on Sundays just as much if not more than the average player. He miss practices more than most, but has usually always played on Sunday.
The Vikes are worried about his selfishness after refusing to be at least on the sidelines the last half of the year. My guess is that the timing of his injury and the bleek lookout a month ago for the Vikes' playoff chances, he just said screw it and left. But him refusing not to at the least be on the sidelines is pretty telling.

There is a huge amount of speculation all over this issue. Frasier didn't say anything negative or even remotely bad about the situation.

The only reason people are hammering on this is because PH is a high profile star player and every move he makes is documented by the media. I also think there are some lingering fears after the DC mess in 2006. I get all that, but I also feel like in terms of the facts, nothing has changed since PH went on IR. The only thing that has happened since then is more media speculation fueling more fan speculation and around and around we go.

I hope the PH situation ends up with a result that makes him happily crushing opposing defenses while wearing a Viking uniform for years to come. If that doesn't happen, for whatever reason, then I hope the vikings make the best of the situation. At this point, we do not know anything new so I'm just focusing on getting pumped for the playoff game.

mansquatch wrote:There is a huge amount of speculation all over this issue. Frasier didn't say anything negative or even remotely bad about the situation.

Go figure. A Viking player could go on a mass murder spree and Frazier would say in his typical deadpan delivery: "We're still waiting to get all the facts."

The only reason people are hammering on this is because PH is a high profile star player and every move he makes is documented by the media.

No, people are hammering on this because it just doesn't add up.

Eli wrote: Go figure. A Viking player could go on a mass murder spree and Frazier would say in his typical deadpan delivery: "We're still waiting to get all the facts."
No, people are hammering on this because it just doesn't add up.

Sure it does... you just don't want that answer so you refuse to see anything other than the darker, conspiratorial potential of the situation.

The severity of high ankle sprains can be difficult to diagnose and sometimes standard x-rays won't reveal the true extent of the injury so the idea that they didn't immediately realize the severity of Harvin's injury isn't far-fetched. Since the long-term stability of an ankle that's suffered a high sprain can be a concern, it's also not that hard to believe that once the Vikings determined Harvin had a complete tear of the ligament, they decided to shut him down for the year. Everything else associated with this situation can be easily explained. That doesn't mean you and the other people convinced that there's a deepening rift between Harvin and the team aren't right. It just means that's not the only reasonable explanation.

Mothman wrote:Sure it does... you just don't want that answer so you refuse to see anything other than the darker, conspiratorial potential of the situation.

There is no "answer". There are only questions.

The severity of high ankle sprains can be difficult to diagnose and sometimes standard x-rays won't reveal the true extent of the injury so the idea that they didn't immediately realize the severity of Harvin's injury isn't far-fetched. Since the long-term stability of an ankle that's suffered a high sprain can be a concern, it's also not that hard to believe that once the Vikings determined Harvin had a complete tear of the ligament, they decided to shut him down for the year. Everything else associated with this situation can be easily explained. That doesn't mean you and the other people convinced that there's a deepening rift between Harvin and the team aren't right. It just means that's not the only reasonable explanation.

What has Harvin done to earn all this ire? People say he's a cancer? Really? Based on what?

Harvin has had his fair share of drama, and the supposed trade request over the summer was strange to say the least, but he came to camp. He didn't hold out or do anything other than give the team everything he had all season from what I've seen. Maybe he blew up a few times, but so what? If Frazier needed to discipline him for it he would have. The fact is, Harvin has never received a single fine, been held out of the starting lineup for missing or being late to any practice, been arrested, or had any trouble beyond his failed mary jo test before the Combine.

When he's on the field he's a monster. He does it all - returns kicks, runs the ball, and is a solid receiver who can turn nothing into something consistently.

How is this guy a cancer?

I just don't think there is much to read into this. Harvin got hurt. The injury was worse than they thought. He stuck around and it failed to improve, and when it was clear it was more severe than expected, he decided to go get a little home cooking while he let it heal. Would it have been nice if he stayed with the team? Sure, but Harvin is a person and obviously wanted to be around family while he healed up. That isn't shocking, especially around the holidays.

Harvin is a great player and I'd guess the vast majority of his teammates like him and want him around for as long as possible. Whatever friction he's had with the Vikings and Frazier is between them, and while there have been some strange things associated with Harvin, there is no way he should be traded unless A) Harvin forces it and then, even in that case B) the Vikings can get just compensation for the guy, which in my opinion would be nothing less than a top-10 pick for a player who does all he does as well as he does at the point in his career where he is.

Eli wrote:There is no "answer". There are only questions.

Obviously... nobody is suggesting there's a definitive answer to any of this.

I don't watch 30 Rock but I assume the photo you posted was intended to deride my optimistic viewpoint so this seems like an appropriate response:

http://www.dailynorseman.com/2013/1/2/3 ... val-harvin

"But Kyle," you say. "Harvin is a locker room cancer." Well, first off, I suppose that the term ‘locker room cancer' is vague and subjective to one's own definition. To me, a locker room cancer is someone who distracts the team from focusing on games, brings down locker room morale, and increases the likelihood of the team quitting. And I honestly have no reason to believe that Harvin would do that. Observe:

I don't see him as a cancer and I wonder if the argument he was having with Fraizer has to do with him not wanting to be on the IR. Harvin is crazy competitive and still pretty green in the maturity department.

VikingLord wrote:What has Harvin done to earn all this ire? People say he's a cancer? Really? Based on what?

Harvin has had his fair share of drama, and the supposed trade request over the summer was strange to say the least, but he came to camp. He didn't hold out or do anything other than give the team everything he had all season from what I've seen. Maybe he blew up a few times, but so what? If Frazier needed to discipline him for it he would have. The fact is, Harvin has never received a single fine, been held out of the starting lineup for missing or being late to any practice, been arrested, or had any trouble beyond his failed mary jo test before the Combine.

When he's on the field he's a monster. He does it all - returns kicks, runs the ball, and is a solid receiver who can turn nothing into something consistently.

How is this guy a cancer?

He's not just a cancer, he's a "team killer" and a "coach berating psychopath".

Jim