Vikings Message Board.Com

I put a lot of it on Ponder. Asking a defense to play against that offense while also sholdering an offense that is a 3 and out machine is too much in the NFL. They had issues and those need to get fixed, but it is really hard to get past just how dreadful the QB performance was last night.

I agree with Zulugad. Anybody could have been put in and played that terrible. Yet, with Ponder, everyone knows before he takes the field what they are going to get and the fans are sick of it. At least with some kid we picked up off the street there is an outside chance he might suprise is, however unlikely. With Ponder there is no hope, just disaster.

BGM wrote:I don't see anyone defending Ponder. Not one. What I see is people trying to deal with a frustrating loss by evaluating the team effort, which was abysmal all around. In fact, is there any facet f the game that anyone would gove a passing grade? Game planning? OL? DL? LBs? DBs? WRs? Special Teams, maybe? Clock Management? Ponder was truly horrible last night, but there was plenty of frustration to vent at the entire team. Besides, I have a problem kicking a guy when he is obviously at the very bottom. Of course, I wouldn't mind getting paid as much as he is to be at the bottom.

I agree. There is lots of blame to go around and nobody who can't up their game. If I had to pick a strong point in last nights game I guess I would say the secondary. Our CBs covered pretty well and Harrison made a lot of plays on a gimpy leg. Blanton was totally out classed and struggled but at least showed a little heart by continuing to take on Lacy head on, so I'll even give a little bit of credit to him. Munnerlyn remained unimpressive.

I am sincerely disappointed by Munnerlyn. Had high hopes for him and he has struggled and even been a liability. If there is one position of glaring need, I see it at CB.

And Zimmer showed his lack of experience as a head coach last night. McCarthy out coached him badly. One team was ready to play last night and looked impressive.

BGM wrote:I don't see anyone defending Ponder. Not one. What I see is people trying to deal with a frustrating loss by evaluating the team effort, which was abysmal all around. In fact, is there any facet f the game that anyone would gove a passing grade? Game planning? OL? DL? LBs? DBs? WRs? Special Teams, maybe? Clock Management? Ponder was truly horrible last night, but there was plenty of frustration to vent at the entire team. Besides, I have a problem kicking a guy when he is obviously at the very bottom. Of course, I wouldn't mind getting paid as much as he is to be at the bottom.

It would make the bottom a lot more comfortable.

To answer your question: no, there's no aspect of the team I would give a passing grade for last night's game. Not one. The team needed to raise their game to help make up for the loss of their new starting QB and instead, they lowered it and Ponder responded in kind, with a bad performance. The Vikes were thoroughly out-coached and out-played. I hope they can re-group and play much better at home against Detroit.

I guess there is a little bit of silver lining, even if it's not much

Arif Hasan ‏@ArifHasanNFL 54m54 minutes ago

Vikings defense had a good Drive Success Rate, which measures first downs+touchdowns/down series. Generally not affected by field position.

Arif Hasan ‏@ArifHasanNFL 52m52 minutes ago

The Drive Success Rate that Vikings held Rodgers' drives to would make an offense rank 20th over the course of a standard season.

Against a top offense, the defense may not have been great, but you can't stop everyone all the time.

Arif Hasan ‏@ArifHasanNFL 53m53 minutes ago

A less indicative stat, but still a good sign: Rodgers' Packers were two of seven on third down.

Better than what we were previously giving up I guess.

Reignman wrote:Apparently you didn't see all those quick short passes that Ponder missed on badly early in the game. Or all those deep balls he missed on badly, even with a clean pocket. And I hate to break it to you, but the average pass in this league is released in 2.5 to 3 seconds from the snap. I've clocked some of Ponders games, and he's much slower at getting rid of the ball the most QB's. And because of that, it makes the o-line look worse than it is. Remember the Steelers game last year? Strange how the o-line looked immediately better in that 1 game when Cassel started, and it's becaues he was getting rid of the ball in a timely manner. Last week was the same, the o-line looked better with Teddy because Teddy can make a decision and get rid of the ball quickly. Not to mention he can buy additional time with his elusiveness.

guys, c'mon he is obviously joking around. 15 seconds of protection with his primary receiver open for 10 seconds and within 20 yards?!!??
I laughed out loud when I read that....
And you guys think he's defending Ponder? Sheesh
But you were posting last night and probably drunk and angry, so I won't give you too hard of a time

VH, thanks for the laugh

PS - I think that I could be successful under those conditions

I could explain my feelings on Ponder, but a picture is worth a thousand words.

dead_poet wrote:Zulgad: Vikings owe it to everyone, including Ponder, to jettison QB

http://www.1500espn.com/sportswire/Zulg ... n_QB100314

A great article with which I agree 100%.

Look, last night's debacle was not all Ponder's fault. But I wonder how much of the "here we go again" factor in the subconscious of each player out there contributes to the poor team performance. That is not an excuse for others playing poorly, but a speculative explanation ... the QB position is so important, and leadership there is so critical, that I can't help but think that most of the guys on that team got a bad feeling about the game as soon as they learned Ponder would be the starter.

Contrast that with Rodgers, who, with the team reeling two weeks ago, got up in front of the national media and with one simple phrase inspired his entire team and restored their confidence.

I'm not saying the Vikings would have won last night with Teddy, but I think they would have played better, I think he would have hit a couple of open receivers early which Ponder failed to even see that would have kept early drives alive and prevented us from going down 14-0 so quickly which deflated the team and began to snowball. I believe Teddy would not have thrown that pick-six, and instead would have likely made the score 14-7 instead of 21-0, and as a result, it would have forced the Packer defense to play differently which would have helped out our OLine and our running game and simply made the game more competitive. Plus the team would have played better knowing they had a chance to win.

The Vikings have been put through the ringer this season ... they lost their starting QB and best OLineman to season-ending injury, their star running back is out indefinitely, their pro bowl TE and LB are both out for extended periods, their best receiver and stud safety are hobbled and playing through injury, and their rookie QB couldn't play last night. All of this with a new coaching staff, a first-time head coach and new offensive and defensive systems. So this week-to-week volatility is not all that surprising, although I certainly did not expect the Green Bay buzzsaw last night, but I'm guessing will continue for the forseeable future. We'll probably kick the crap out of the Lions and leave everyone scratching their heads.

The one thing that is clear to me in all this mess, however, is that Ponder has had his last chance and should no longer be any part of this team's future. And I think the team knew that even before he took his first snap last night.

LEAFMAN THE PURPLE FAN

Ugh. An article where Zulgad pounds his chest about how right he was? Spare me.

The idea that Harnish or any other QB off the street could have looked equally as bad is not the point. It is not as if QB is a plug and play position. I am not happy they held on to Ponder, either, but get over it. They did. He sucked. It's over. I imagine when Harnish gets up to speed, we may actually see Ponder relegated to the practice squad. Or at the very least inactive while Bridgewater plays and Harnish backs up. That is what I would like to see.

But swallowing that contract hit is what kept Ponder here more than naything. Along with the fact that he has zero value on the market.

If this is indeed a bit of Spielman hubris, then I stand corrected. But right now, this article comes off as just a bunch of chest-thumping.

BGM wrote:Ugh. An article where Zulgad pounds his chest about how right he was? Spare me.

LOL! He really has become insufferable since his Star Tribune beat reporter days.

The idea that Harnish or any other QB off the street could have looked equally as bad is not the point. It is not as if QB is a plug and play position. I am not happy they held on to Ponder, either, but get over it. They did. He sucked. It's over. I imagine when Harnish gets up to speed, we may actually see Ponder relegated to the practice squad. Or at the very least inactive while Bridgewater plays and Harnish backs up. That is what I would like to see.

I don't think Ponder would be eligible for the practice squad but I would like to see Harnish do some good work and rise up the depth chart.

Mothman wrote: LOL! He really has become insufferable since his Star Tribune beat reporter days.
I don't think Ponder would be eligible for the practice squad but I would like to see Harnish do some good work and rise up the depth chart.

Quite right. My bad.

BGM wrote: Quite right. My bad.

No worries.

BGM wrote:Ugh. An article where Zulgad pounds his chest about how right he was? Spare me.

<stuff cut>

If this is indeed a bit of Spielman hubris, then I stand corrected. But right now, this article comes off as just a bunch of chest-thumping.

I can see how you might read it that way based on his opening paragraph, but I got past that and read the rest of the article as a very good effort to explain why Ponder was still on the roster, and, more importantly, what should be done now. The implication is that Ponder's presence is a liability purely from a team psychology standpoint, and I agree with that. And in that case, I think Zulgad is probably correct that keeping him on the team is most unfair to Ponder himself. He needs a fresh start, either with another football team or with another line of work.

LEAFMAN THE PURPLE FAN

But the financial reality of the situation (and this is a business), which Zulgad does not address, is the cap hit that releasing him would cause. I also have doubts about the psychological effects. This was a short week of a very messed up season so far. Injuries, off-field issues, a new coaching staff, and Zulgad thinks cutting Ponder loose will help cure some ills? Nah. If Zulgad is so concerned about the psychological health of this team, then why write a column like this that will sow nothing but seeds of dissension and doubt? Why not try and find something positive out of last night (granted a very tall order!)? But that kind of column doesn't get people to click on his page.

I'll take my columnists with a grain of salt. It seems they traffic in speculation rather than good writing. Ah, Jim Klobuchar, how we miss thee.

In my opinion we were hoping to trade ponder to someone else
I don't see that happening at all better to dump him and go for a project. Guy IMO