J. Kapp 11 wrote: ↑Wed Mar 24, 2021 8:35 am
First off, let's not deal in hypotheticals. I can make that 15.8 ppg case for a LOT of quarterbacks. Let's stick to the facts.
AGAIN, I know you can make the case for a lot of QBs That's the point and I just told Stump the same thing. That stat was geared more towards Vikings fans being blinded by Case Keenums success here than it was a testament of how good Kirk Cousins is. But my other point to that is, Cousins getting here a year too late. If they gave Cousins that contract in 2017, with that defense, I can bet money there wouldnt be a soul complaining about Cousins. Well maybe Stump but that's expected. I sometimes wish Keenum would've stayed just so it would open fans eyes on just how pathetically bad he would've been under DeFelippo's pass heavy scheme that requires the QB to do it all.
So ... $20 million is silly. Fine. What's the right number? You've already said that his play doesn't warrant $45 million. How about the $31 million he'll make in 2021? It's highly subjective, I realize. But what's your number? Was he worth the $21 the Vikings paid him in 2020?
I've already stated my number above when basing everything off Mahomes contract given he's currently the bar. As for the $21 million he made in 2020, yeah that's a bargain IMO given the current market and how we played offensively. You know just as well as I do that the offense wasnt the problem last year. As for this year, I would say 31 is a little high in terms of other QBs AAV. And $45 is obviously ridiculous.
Before you answer, please note that Cousins' Total QBR was 18th in the NFL last year. He ranked behind Teddy Bridgewater ($14 million cap hit in 2020), Matthew Stafford ($21.3 million), Kyler Murray ($8 million), Baker Mayfield ($9 million), Ryan Fitzpatrick ($4 million), and a slew of other QBs who made less than Cousins. Aaron Rodgers, league MVP and No. 1 in Total QBR, made the same as Cousins. Meanwhile, Cousins ranked one spot ahead of Philip Rivers, and ended up less than 2 QBR points ahead of such stalwarts as Daniel Jones and Mitchell Trubisky.
Well first, you listed two QBs that are still on rookie contracts.... Murray and Mayfield will clearly be making more than $8-9 million in a year or two. And come on lets be honest here, Teddy.....Fitz...even Stafford. Are you really going to sit here on just the eye test alone and say "yup, those guys were better QBs than Cousins last year"?? We're allowed to use the stat of QBR, but nothing else now? QBR is now the end all be all? I mean I'm not sure what you're trying to get at. I mean I can rattle off plenty of meaningful statistics and comparisons as well.
....Like the fact that Kirk Cousins led the entire NFL in 2nd half TD passes when the score margin was within 3 points....when everyone says he's just a garbage time QB
.... or since 2012 Aaron Rodgers is 7-24 against winning teams, Cousins career record vs. winning teams is 5-24 and Matt Staffords career record is 9-54
....or in the 2019 season, Cousins ranked top 7 in completion %, YPA, TD:INT ratio, passer rating, PFF passer rating, deep ball passer rating and passer rating under pressure.
....or how about the last teams to own the 29th ranked defense in points allowed finished with the follow records:
-2020 MIN (7-9)
-2019 TB (7-9)
-2018 NYJ (4-12)
-2017 MIA (6-10)
-2016 SD (5-11)
-2015 CLE (3-13)
-2014 WAS (4-12)
-2013 OAK (4-12)
................and we're sitting here complaining about how he performed last year.
.... or one of my personal favorites, the guy you and Stump recently mentioned (and praised), Aaron Rodgers is a whopping 0-42 against winning teams when trailing by more than 1 point in the 4th quarter. Now THATs a QB you have justifiable proof that he is indeed a garbage time QB. Oh and he's also 1-8 when trailing at halftime in the playoffs. Call him the Comeback Kid!!! Where's the media at on that one? Oh wait, he's the golden boy of the NFL, lets just focus on Cousins stupid 1-9 MNF stat instead
Kirk Cousins once again had great stats. Maybe the best of his career. But when you compare his actual play to the other quarterbacks in the league, that $20 million doesn't seem quite as far-fetched.
eh, it still does. Especially when you realize Teddy broke his own personal TD pass record of 14 with a whopping 15 TDs this year along with 11 INTs. Compared to Cousins 35 TDs to 13 INTs. I dont care how many TDs of Cousins you think were "garbage time" or not worthy of recognition but that guy threw TWENTY more TDs than Teddy Bridgewater. The fact you're hanging a QBR stat out there to try and prove "beat" Cousins in a statistic really makes me question this.
I'll grant you that he probably is worth a little more than that. But the franchise-paralyzing $76 million he'll make over the next two years? Now that's silly.
I dont agree with it either, but everybody, every year, says Cousins contract cripples the team and we dont have cap space for this or cap space for that. Yet what has it really crippled? I can tell you his contract wasnt the reason guys like Rhodes tallied off, Waynes got overpaid, Joseph tallied off, Rudolph to age, etc. So is it because the Vikings couldnt afford Joe Thuney's asinine $16 million a year asking price? Like this has been a thing people say year after year and I dont see this team crippled yet and they are still dipping into FA no problem. If I told you in my mock offseason that we'd sign Tomlinson for $22 million and Peterson for $10 million, would you consider that unrealistic? I mean we're still landing solid free agents, we're still keeping the core of this team in tact and all along, everyone is saying Cousins is crippling the team? Like I 100% get that he does not deserve $45 mill next year. But in terms of what has happened so far, I dont think he's crippled this team at all. This staff are the ones about to cripple Kirk if they dont find him some interior lineman sooner than later.