Vikings Message Board.Com

The Breeze wrote: That deep hole you speak of is common around the league.

Green bay and Indy are prime examples. Neither team could do anything after the careers of Starr and Unitas...for 20 years!

Same with the 49ers from Brodie to Montana.

What they have done with Ponder is the correct way...he's just not the right guy.

Cassel could shift some things in the present....but the long term needs to be filled through the draft.

That hole could be filled by this time next season. They have to take another shot in he draft....keep moving forward.

I think the Vikings have shot themselves to deep in a hole to go QB next year. After seeing the Vikings draft these past two seasons, it seems they rather draft value over needs.

3 first rounds picks I think were value picks were Harrison Smith, Xavier Rhodes, and Sharrif Floyd. Most people would argue that Harrison Smith was need, especially with the great things he's done so far. Me personally, I thought Smith was a lucky pick. I don't think he was a need pick. He was probably somebody who they had rated high on the boards but didn't expect him to still be available. So they took him and fortunately for us, he turned out good.

However, I think we over looked positions of dire need like LB, SS, CB, NT, G. Now I know these cant be fixed that quickly. But I don't think the Vikings drafted smartly. Now to the other two Sharrif Floyd and Rhodes. I think Kevin Williams still has a few years left in him. People say he's lost a step but to me he never was on that extra step. Pat Williams was the foundation of that wall. He got the double teams that allowed Kevin to make a stop. I think we should have addressed the nose tackle first. That is the real problem. A 1st round 3 technique DT was not a need this season, in my opinion. As for Xavier Rhodes, I don't think he schematically fits in our system. Maybe it's just the rookie in him, but he is not the corner that I was hoping who can come in and stop the run like Winfield.

It seems the Vikings just simply ignore the O-Line after drafting Kalil.

The main point im making is that, this team has dug a bigger hole than most people realize. A lot of ppl are screaming for a new QB, but our problems are so much beyond that.

I just don't get the excitement over Cassel. He hasn't proven himself at all. I agree with the one poster that any excitement over him is based on desperation and not on his actual play. We'll see Sunday buy I am not expecting much with how poorly our O line is playing. I would have more hope if the line was good at protecting the QB but they're not. Cassel may be better than Ponder but I fear he won't get a chance to show it. As porous as our line is what we'll most likely see is Cassel on his back a lot and/or throwing the ball up for grabs. He'll release the ball too quickly unable to survey the field and he'll either miss the receiver or toss it to a DB.

If he does get time I will expect him to be more accurate than Ponder and have a pretty good night. But he wont get the time.

PurpleKoolaid wrote:He will take more sacks for sure. And more INTs. Hopefully not the pick 6 type. I bet he is able to make more then 1 read, he will see the open receivers, and may even complete multiple passes to Kyle.

More INTs?

Ponder is on pace for 27 picks. It would be very, very hard to top that.

maembe wrote:Keep in mind that in Cassel's career year in 2010 he had a lower QBR than Ponder did last year. So his ceiling is lower than Ponder's season that many thought earned him a spot on the bench. He later proved that that season was fluke, so I have very low expectations of Cassel. The worst thing that could happen is that he plays mediocre and doesn't make too many mistakes so we decide to make him the starter next season.

Cassel's TRUE career year was in 2008, not 2010. His QBR that season was 63.15, which is far better than Ponder's 2012.

As for 2010, Cassel did make the Pro Bowl and had a 27-7 TD-INT ratio, which Christian Ponder couldn't achieve in his wildest dreams. The only reason his QBR was in the low 50s was because he didn't throw for a ton of yards, just over 3,100 on only 450 attempts. He also had only 3 fumbles, which is very good for a QB, so he CAN take care of the ball. And his career sack percentage is actually slightly lower than Ponder's -- significantly lower during his time in Kansas City.

I'm not saying Matt Cassel is going to remind anybody of Drew Brees or Peyton Manning. But honestly, Christian Ponder has shown very little growth for a first-round draft pick now in his third season. Some of the easy throws that Ponder missed last Sunday against Cleveland -- the two most egregious include the missed fade to Webb and the absolutely inexcusable 3rd-and-4 overthrow of Greg Jennings late in the 4th -- I'm confident Cassel would have made. Ponder wasn't under pressure on either of those throws, and both players were wide open.

Don't know about all of you, but I'm ready for a change.

J. Kapp 11 wrote: More INTs?

Ponder is on pace for 27 picks. It would be very, very hard to top that.

Huh? That's less than two per game. Two picks by Cassel on Sunday would beat it.

27 is very bad. 2 per game is worse. Even Favre didn't throw 2 per game. Or even 27 per year, on average. I think Favre only averaged 15/year +/-.

Eli wrote: Huh? That's less than two per game. Two picks by Cassel on Sunday would beat it.

He hasn't? Taking two different teams to the playoffs is not easy to do and not every QB makes it to the Pro Bowl. I know he looked terrible the past couple of years in KC, but it was KC, under Romeo.

2 teams?...Better check again. He's only quarterbacked one playoff team.

The Pro Bowl bit is pure comedy though. EVERYONE makes the Pro Bowl these days. He was an alternate that year. All-Pro's are the only legitimate metric to something like that.

More "proven?" Sure, but let's not reach.

Cassel is another inconsistent QB, it's just his stretches of good and suckage last longer than Ponders so it's all going to come down to which Cassel shows up on Sunday. It could be ugly and it could be holy cow why did we wait this long. I have my excuse ready either way. 1) he hasn't had any time to gel with the starters or 2) a good QB doesn't need time to gel ... or if it's really bad 3) why doesn't this team ever have a viable backup plan xD.

808vikingsfan wrote: I just assumed the Patriots went to the playoffs with an 11-5 record. My mistake. Let me rephrase. Leading two different teams to a 10-6 record is not easy to do.
You can dismiss the pro bowl. I know a lot of people think it's a joke now. But truth is not everyone makes the pro bowl.

No worries. I apologize for the tone of my post as well. I just got done with a heated discussion on another forum and kinda let that leak into here. Damn internet. Serious business.

UKViking wrote:

Thats funny $hit. Good lord. Is there any team worse that ours for QB recruitment?

VikingsFanInCA wrote:It's an awesome situation for Cassel, since he has 0 expectations on him AND it's almost impossible for him to perform worse than the guy he's replacing.

Even better... No matter what happens, in two weeks he goes back to being the guy with the clipboard. Cassel is probably one of a half-dozen or so QBs in the NFL who have no desire to ever step onto the field in a game. He's perfectly content being a backup. It pays well, it's easy, you don't get beat up, it prolongs your career. He'll be a backup for another 6 or 7 years and may never start again by virtue of being the best QB on the team.

I would expect improved QB play. If not, this is gonna be like a horror movie.

Have your popcorn ready.

Isn't rooting for Cassell not to do well the same as rooting against the Vikings? I know, I know. You guys are thinking long-term, what you're really doing is rooting for next year's Vikings. It's no more unreasonable than saying "I hope Musgrave doesn't start calling good games because then he might come back next year and be the same ol' Musgrave", or "I hope the linebackers don't start playing well because then we might not draft new ones next offseason and we'll be stuck with these guys again." Can you imagine if Cassell does well, Musgrave starts calling good games and our linebackers play lights out? What if they all do it so well we win a superbowl? Dammit we'd be stuck with them forever!

VikingHoard wrote:Isn't rooting for Cassell not to do well the same as rooting against the Vikings? I know, I know. You guys are thinking long-term, what you're really doing is rooting for next year's Vikings. It's no more unreasonable than saying "I hope Musgrave doesn't start calling good games because then he might come back next year and be the same ol' Musgrave", or "I hope the linebackers don't start playing well because then we might not draft new ones next offseason and we'll be stuck with these guys again." Can you imagine if Cassell does well, Musgrave starts calling good games and our linebackers play lights out? What if they all do it so well we win a superbowl? Dammit we'd be stuck with them forever!

I can imagine all of that except the LBs playing lights out.
I would love for all these guys to play up to their potential....but at DB and LB I honestly question the potential beig there.

I think the young guys @LB is where the potential is and they should start playing them.
I think we might have 3DBs on the entire roster who are legit. Better LB play and pass rush would help hide that.....but they need to draft and develop better DBs before we can legitimately talk superbowl IMHO.

Can we see this Matt Cassel again?

2010 season

In 2010 Cassel had a resurgent season starting with a 21–14 victory over the San Diego Chargers in the opening week's Monday Night Football late game at home in Arrowhead. Cassel would build off of this start helping guide the Chiefs to a 7–4 record over the first 12 weeks of football. Due to his form during November, he was named AFC Offensive Player of the Month for November. Cassel completed 90 of 144 passes (62.5%) for 1,111 yards and an NFL-leading 12 touchdowns, with just one interception. He had a 111.2 quarterback rating for the month.[43] As a result of his performance against the Seattle Seahawks, Cassel won the FedEx Air & Ground NFL Players of the Week award, as voted by the fans.[44]

On December 8, 2010, Cassel underwent an emergency appendectomy. It was unclear at the time whether he would be able to play in that week's game against the San Diego Chargers.[45] The Chiefs ended up starting backup Brodie Croyle and lost the game 31–0. Cassel would return the next two games however and would lead the Chiefs to landslide wins over both the St. Louis Rams in the Governors Cup and then at home against the Tennessee Titans. The 34–14 win over the Titans, along with a loss by the Chargers to the Bengals, helped the Chiefs clinch the division title.[46] This would be the first Chiefs playoff game in four years and the first home playoff game since 2003, the last time the Chiefs won the AFC West division.[46]

In January 2011 Cassel was named as an alternate to the Pro Bowl in place of an injured Tom Brady. Cassel threw for two touchdowns and two interceptions in the Pro Bowl.