2019 Season General Thread (News, Notes, Interviews, etc)

[cstelter]

With Sherels departing, who ya'll think is up for punt returner?

You think they put Hughes back there off of the knee injury? Zylstra? Beebe maybe?

Abdullah? Pretty sure I heard we resigned him a few days ago?

[PacificNorseWest]

With Sherels departing, who ya'll think is up for punt returner?

You think they put Hughes back there off of the knee injury? Zylstra? Beebe maybe?

Abdullah? Pretty sure I heard we resigned him a few days ago?

Maybe. He has more of the makeup of a kick returner though and not necessarily a punt returner. I don't recall him returning any punts last season...only kickoffs.

[UKno1VIKING]

So I've been thinking lately that if there is ever a quarterback in the first round who has what is perceived to be a great chance to be a franchise quarterback you should always draft that guy. Yes, this would hold true even if you already had a franchise guy. For starters, it would give you big time negotiating power with a guy like Kirk Cousins who is not necessarily franchise caliber but is pretty good. You don't have to get hosed because you always have an option. Also, I think the way to do it is to make sure that quarterback looks good. You don't want to throw him in and have him look like a bust because then it demolishes his trade value. A good idea in my opinion would be to always draft highly thought of quarterbacks if they're on the board when you pick and then you have an honest open competition every camp and preseason. Then say you spent a first-round pick on a guy and he looks great for you in the preseason then a team offers to give you two second-round picks to trade for him. I think two second-round picks trading off with one first round pick is a pretty good deal for the team. That's two starters or at least it can be. Then you also never have to face that you passed up on an Aaron Rodgers for a much lesser player at a need position. That's why if Drew Lock somehow manages to make it to the 18th pick I think they should take him.

See i was thinking this but for Haskins, not Lock. IMO Haskins is the best QB in the draft, and has the potential to be a top 5 QB in the NFL. Great arm, ridiculously accurate, decent feet (when used sparingly) etc.
A big reason for this thought, is because of where it leaves the team when they have a Rookie QB salary for the starter QB. If you look at who represents the NFC in the superbowl in recent years, they all have young QB's under a rookie contract. Which in turn, frees up a big chunk of salary cap to improve the rest of the team.
Draft Haskins, let him learn from Cousins and roll him out when he's ready in 1-2 seasons time.
Thats what i'd do (although i know its not very likely)

[CharVike]

Eh...i don't think when you have a team built to win now and have a QB that you think is a franchise guy, that that is the move to make.

Besides, Drew Lock definitely is not that guy, in my opinion.

What is win now? A Super Bowl or better than .500 record. Lets see. We don't have a TE. We have holes/age on the DL. We have zero top guys on the OL. We have zero depth at WR. We lost our top backup RB which is needed based on our starter has proven he can't stay healthy. With this sive OL how long before our QB gets knocked out. We were all fooled by that 13 win season. That's a great year no doubt but even that team was creamed by the top guns. Couldn't even make a game of it. Somethings not right. At least show up. Maybe that's too harsh but that's how I see it. I don't see much improvement this year. How much can a team expect from the draft? If we hit it we will get one starter on the OL and that guy might be average if we are lucky. But IMO Drew Lock is the guy. We better not let him go by if he's still there.

[PacificNorseWest]

Eh...i don't think when you have a team built to win now and have a QB that you think is a franchise guy, that that is the move to make.

Besides, Drew Lock definitely is not that guy, in my opinion.

What is win now? A Super Bowl or better than .500 record. Lets see. We don't have a TE. We have holes/age on the DL. We have zero top guys on the OL. We have zero depth at WR. We lost our top backup RB which is needed based on our starter has proven he can't stay healthy. With this sive OL how long before our QB gets knocked out. We were all fooled by that 13 win season. That's a great year no doubt but even that team was creamed by the top guns. Couldn't even make a game of it. Somethings not right. At least show up. Maybe that's too harsh but that's how I see it. I don't see much improvement this year. How much can a team expect from the draft? If we hit it we will get one starter on the OL and that guy might be average if we are lucky. But IMO Drew Lock is the guy. We better not let him go by if he's still there.

Well, teams are going to have some weak spots for sure. There's no way around it. But in keeping the context, are you saying they are at a spot where they should consider drafting a quarterback for the future in the 1st round? Because that's what's being discussed. While I see the holes, some of them will be filled before the season starts and no team is going to be stacked, top to bottom.

But just to play aglong...I would like to see Minnesota add a top tier TE, they do have one. Rudolph can get it done on 3rd downs and in the redzone. There's still David Morgan too, don't forget and he's proven to be invaluable. On the DL, the only guy they lost so far is Richardson. While that is a big loss, they already filled his void. Bringing back Everson means they don't have a mass exodus of producers. This is a position that is deep in the draft and they will get another body there for sure. Other than that, there's promise with Weatherly, so that makes 3 good to great DE's and they got some young guys inside to go with Linval. And I agree with the total depth at WR, but it's not like the cupboard is bare...They have 2 of the top 20ish WR's in the game. That's a great place to start. They need one guy to step up and they're good there, but they also probably address this in the draft with a pick. Agree again on RB, but given that there's no real studs in this draft and the fact that you can always find top producing RB's later drafts, the Vikings will be able to find somebody to spell Cook. I'm sure of that. The OL is a mess though and the biggest concern to me. Everything else mentioned can be made whole or much better by one draft pick and/or signing either an unheralded, under the radar player or cap casualty when camp rolls around. The offensive line will take an investment of at least 2 high draft picks and other bodies some other way. I also think they could use another LB.

I see holes, but nothing that can't be fixed with the right moves. It's very much true that the window on this current team is closing pretty fast, but it's not closed completely.

[Pondering Her Percy]

Eh...i don't think when you have a team built to win now and have a QB that you think is a franchise guy, that that is the move to make.

Besides, Drew Lock definitely is not that guy, in my opinion.

What is win now? A Super Bowl or better than .500 record. Lets see. We don't have a TE. We have holes/age on the DL. We have zero top guys on the OL. We have zero depth at WR. We lost our top backup RB which is needed based on our starter has proven he can't stay healthy. With this sive OL how long before our QB gets knocked out. We were all fooled by that 13 win season. That's a great year no doubt but even that team was creamed by the top guns. Couldn't even make a game of it. Somethings not right. At least show up. Maybe that's too harsh but that's how I see it. I don't see much improvement this year. How much can a team expect from the draft? If we hit it we will get one starter on the OL and that guy might be average if we are lucky. But IMO Drew Lock is the guy. We better not let him go by if he's still there.

If we get an OL early, why would he be "average if we're lucky"? Drafting Elflein alone in 2017 helped our OL tremendously IMO. But last year we surrounded him with 2 trash cans for guards. Compared to Berger and Easton prior to that.

[CharVike]

It's just hard to judge completely when the offseason has pretty much just begun. I think the Vikings FO is very much aware of the state of the offensive line. And I'm sure they may have liked a FA or two, but all the guys that could help the team cost more than the Vikings could afford for any one player.

It's easy to say we should have signed a FA lineman, but who is everyone suggesting? It's free agency, so these players, as I alluded to, got to choose where they wanted to go. More times than not, it's the team that can pay them the most...Minnesota wasn't that team. They wanted to bring back Easton...The only reason why the didn't is becuase N.O. offered more money. That's why you see funds being redirected at guys like Stephens becuase even though they need big help along the offensive line, they still needed a replacement for Richardson (who they also wanted to keep, but couldn't afford).

I'm just not seeing the options out there that would benefit the team more than grabbing a few Oline guys in the draft. They'll be cheaper, younger and better. Now, if they go through this draft and don't really address this issue, then yeah...I'll agree.

And I think Elflein is above average and Reiff is serviceable...O'neill has shown a TON of potential and he may be the teams new LT...This to the point of the entire Oline being below par. That's just not true. They really only need 2 starters and they'll be just fine.

I'll admit I don't understand the CAP at all. The Saints were broke and now can sign and overpay any player they want. They give Easton a boat load and what has the guy ever done. Plus he's coming off a neck injury. If Rick did that he would be creamed. I'm sure somewhere he's graded as a good G/C. Just as Elf is graded as good. To me the guy can't block anything and should be graded as a guy that needs to go. But that's only my opinion. People have blamed his play on the Gs. F the Gs. Blow people off the line. Drive them into the secondary. They could have kept Richardson with CAP adjustments. I'm glad they didn't. He will lay down now like always. He can't stick with a team for a reason. Good signing last year. But it was a rental.

[PacificNorseWest]

Well, I think for the Saints, Max Unger their starting the center the past few seasons retired unexpectedly during free agency so it freed up around $7 million for them to use, which is how and why they overpaid Easton and why the Vikings had to move on. As I explained before, it's not that the Vikings didn't want to keep him and it's not like they don't want to sign offensive line help, it's just that the guys worth it are the one's who cost too much for the Vikings. They just don't have the cap space like that, which is why they're bargain hunting and getting guys like Kline and Shatley for depth. Once the draft rounds out the starters, it will look a lot better.

[Maelstrom88]

So I've been thinking lately that if there is ever a quarterback in the first round who has what is perceived to be a great chance to be a franchise quarterback you should always draft that guy. Yes, this would hold true even if you already had a franchise guy. For starters, it would give you big time negotiating power with a guy like Kirk Cousins who is not necessarily franchise caliber but is pretty good. You don't have to get hosed because you always have an option. Also, I think the way to do it is to make sure that quarterback looks good. You don't want to throw him in and have him look like a bust because then it demolishes his trade value. A good idea in my opinion would be to always draft highly thought of quarterbacks if they're on the board when you pick and then you have an honest open competition every camp and preseason. Then say you spent a first-round pick on a guy and he looks great for you in the preseason then a team offers to give you two second-round picks to trade for him. I think two second-round picks trading off with one first round pick is a pretty good deal for the team. That's two starters or at least it can be. Then you also never have to face that you passed up on an Aaron Rodgers for a much lesser player at a need position. That's why if Drew Lock somehow manages to make it to the 18th pick I think they should take him.

See i was thinking this but for Haskins, not Lock. IMO Haskins is the best QB in the draft, and has the potential to be a top 5 QB in the NFL. Great arm, ridiculously accurate, decent feet (when used sparingly) etc.
A big reason for this thought, is because of where it leaves the team when they have a Rookie QB salary for the starter QB. If you look at who represents the NFC in the superbowl in recent years, they all have young QB's under a rookie contract. Which in turn, frees up a big chunk of salary cap to improve the rest of the team.
Draft Haskins, let him learn from Cousins and roll him out when he's ready in 1-2 seasons time.
Thats what i'd do (although i know its not very likely)

If Haskins were available at 18 If definitely take him that would be a steal. I don't see him making it put of the top 10. Hask8ns from what I've seen can struggle to drive the ball outside the numbers and his spiral is a little wonky. Lock has an elite level arm and I think he would be a good pick if he made it to 18 as well. Having a QB play at a pretty high level on a rookie deal works wonders. That's how the Rams were able to go out and seem like they were exempt from the cap.

[Pondering Her Percy]

See i was thinking this but for Haskins, not Lock. IMO Haskins is the best QB in the draft, and has the potential to be a top 5 QB in the NFL. Great arm, ridiculously accurate, decent feet (when used sparingly) etc.
A big reason for this thought, is because of where it leaves the team when they have a Rookie QB salary for the starter QB. If you look at who represents the NFC in the superbowl in recent years, they all have young QB's under a rookie contract. Which in turn, frees up a big chunk of salary cap to improve the rest of the team.
Draft Haskins, let him learn from Cousins and roll him out when he's ready in 1-2 seasons time.
Thats what i'd do (although i know its not very likely)

If Haskins were available at 18 If definitely take him that would be a steal. I don't see him making it put of the top 10. Hask8ns from what I've seen can struggle to drive the ball outside the numbers and his spiral is a little wonky. Lock has an elite level arm and I think he would be a good pick if he made it to 18 as well. Having a QB play at a pretty high level on a rookie deal works wonders. That's how the Rams were able to go out and seem like they were exempt from the cap.

I dont know why I'm just not a Haskins fan. Reminds me of Cam Newton. I'm definitely a fan of Lock though

[CharVike]

Yeah, these Saints, man...Really getting on my nerves. Of non-divisional foes, them and Seattle are my enemies 1a and 1b.

I'm not sold on Lock either. I need to research a lot more on him. I think at 18 he might be worth rolling the dice pn though. Still, I think if you were to draft that many QBs the math says you probably would end up with an elite talent. Remember, you're only drafting guys that you think are likely to develop into franchise caliber. You won't have a talent like that fall to you very often so if you are a good gm you should be able to use the first rounders where you don't take a QB in addition to all your other picks and free agency to build a good team around whatever QB wins out.

In certain years, I may agree with you. That is, if I'm a GM and I really like a QB and he falls, I'd take him. I just don't feel like this would be one of those years. If the core of our team wasn't an aging group -- and I'm specifically thinking Minnesota's defense here -- I'd consider it as well. It's just that their window is shrinking. And I also don't think the return you'd get in year 1 or 2 from a rookie like that would be equal to Kirk...Maybe said QB turns out to be much better in the long run, but for right now, I'd take the 2 seasons that Kirk has left and go from there. If Kirk fails considerably next season though and it's appearing like he won't be re-signed when his contract is up and also assuming they address the Oline this draft, then I could see something like that happening in next years draft. Especially since it's a much deeper QB draft and a few guys as of today look like they could be pretty good. Same goes for the 2021 class. So, it might just work out for the Vikings, if that's what has to happen.

The window has closed for this core unit to make the SB. I think the talent is there to play some good football but overall we lack the talent to challenge the top teams. If we win 4 games this season it wouldn't shock me. If we win 12 it wouldn't shock me either. That's a big spread. The bottom line is the O needs to carry some weight. It goes beyond Cousins also. Sure having a QB that's better than Cousins would be great. But who is this guy and is he available. IMO if Drew L is there at 18 he better be the pick. At least he can sit and learn for two years. Rick can draft Ford and plug him in at G but how good will he be? He'll get abused early and then hopefully improve enough not to be a swinging gate by years end. Just like Hernandez did for the Giants. And there not totally sold yet. But somebody might get killed early on. That's the biggest problem with relying on the draft for a plug in starter. Not a good idea.

[CharVike]

What is win now? A Super Bowl or better than .500 record. Lets see. We don't have a TE. We have holes/age on the DL. We have zero top guys on the OL. We have zero depth at WR. We lost our top backup RB which is needed based on our starter has proven he can't stay healthy. With this sive OL how long before our QB gets knocked out. We were all fooled by that 13 win season. That's a great year no doubt but even that team was creamed by the top guns. Couldn't even make a game of it. Somethings not right. At least show up. Maybe that's too harsh but that's how I see it. I don't see much improvement this year. How much can a team expect from the draft? If we hit it we will get one starter on the OL and that guy might be average if we are lucky. But IMO Drew Lock is the guy. We better not let him go by if he's still there.

If we get an OL early, why would he be "average if we're lucky"? Drafting Elflein alone in 2017 helped our OL tremendously IMO. But last year we surrounded him with 2 trash cans for guards. Compared to Berger and Easton prior to that.

IMO if we draft Ford, who should be a good player, I don't expect him to be plug and play. Yes he could start day 1 but he'll probably get abused early on and then get better as the year progresses. That's a good point you made about Elf having two Gs that could play. And maybe Elf will be ok again. I jump to quick decisions. That can lead to mistakes and misjudgment. I'd cut half the team after a crappy season.

[Pondering Her Percy]

If we get an OL early, why would he be "average if we're lucky"? Drafting Elflein alone in 2017 helped our OL tremendously IMO. But last year we surrounded him with 2 trash cans for guards. Compared to Berger and Easton prior to that.

IMO if we draft Ford, who should be a good player, I don't expect him to be plug and play. Yes he could start day 1 but he'll probably get abused early on and then get better as the year progresses. That's a good point you made about Elf having two Gs that could play. And maybe Elf will be ok again. I jump to quick decisions. That can lead to mistakes and misjudgment. I'd cut half the team after a crappy season.

haha yeah that comes with frustrating seasons. I mean I really think that goes for any center in the league. If you have terrible guards on both sides of you, it's pretty tough to look good yourself. For Berger being older, he was actually a very solid RG. And Easton was so-so. But Easton was still better than either of the two guards we had this year. So it definitely wasnt working in Elfleins favor. That's why I dont put much into him having a bad year. I want to see him with at least one (hopefully two) decent to good guards on each side of him before making any kind of judgement on him. Because he showed he was a very solid player in 2017 and really helped our OL.

As for Ford, he's definitely a plug and play IMO. Mainly because we dont have anyone there to even compete with him. I highly doubt they start a guy like Isidora over our first round pick. Unless we land another Compton type signing, our first OL pick (within the first round or two) will be starting. Elflein started day 1 and was fine. And he was a 3rd round pick

[CharVike]

What is win now? A Super Bowl or better than .500 record. Lets see. We don't have a TE. We have holes/age on the DL. We have zero top guys on the OL. We have zero depth at WR. We lost our top backup RB which is needed based on our starter has proven he can't stay healthy. With this sive OL how long before our QB gets knocked out. We were all fooled by that 13 win season. That's a great year no doubt but even that team was creamed by the top guns. Couldn't even make a game of it. Somethings not right. At least show up. Maybe that's too harsh but that's how I see it. I don't see much improvement this year. How much can a team expect from the draft? If we hit it we will get one starter on the OL and that guy might be average if we are lucky. But IMO Drew Lock is the guy. We better not let him go by if he's still there.

Well, teams are going to have some weak spots for sure. There's no way around it. But in keeping the context, are you saying they are at a spot where they should consider drafting a quarterback for the future in the 1st round? Because that's what's being discussed. While I see the holes, some of them will be filled before the season starts and no team is going to be stacked, top to bottom.

But just to play aglong...I would like to see Minnesota add a top tier TE, they do have one. Rudolph can get it done on 3rd downs and in the redzone. There's still David Morgan too, don't forget and he's proven to be invaluable. On the DL, the only guy they lost so far is Richardson. While that is a big loss, they already filled his void. Bringing back Everson means they don't have a mass exodus of producers. This is a position that is deep in the draft and they will get another body there for sure. Other than that, there's promise with Weatherly, so that makes 3 good to great DE's and they got some young guys inside to go with Linval. And I agree with the total depth at WR, but it's not like the cupboard is bare...They have 2 of the top 20ish WR's in the game. That's a great place to start. They need one guy to step up and they're good there, but they also probably address this in the draft with a pick. Agree again on RB, but given that there's no real studs in this draft and the fact that you can always find top producing RB's later drafts, the Vikings will be able to find somebody to spell Cook. I'm sure of that. The OL is a mess though and the biggest concern to me. Everything else mentioned can be made whole or much better by one draft pick and/or signing either an unheralded, under the radar player or cap casualty when camp rolls around. The offensive line will take an investment of at least 2 high draft picks and other bodies some other way. I also think they could use another LB.

I see holes, but nothing that can't be fixed with the right moves. It's very much true that the window on this current team is closing pretty fast, but it's not closed completely.

Good points. No team is stacked. Perhaps I'm looking to down on everything. Getting Griff back was a very good move no doubt. Maybe his issues are in check. I thought he was gone for sure. But he took a CAP redo also. Another good thing. I missed on that one. One player I hope wouldn't be back is Rudy. IMO he's not good enough for what he gets. Matter of fact he's not that good at anything. Another great point is 20ish WRs. Having 2 is a good thing. I was under the impression that some felt they were two top WRs. Again a mistake on my part. They will fix things the best they can with the means available. Which is exactly what you stated.

[Pondering Her Percy]

Well, teams are going to have some weak spots for sure. There's no way around it. But in keeping the context, are you saying they are at a spot where they should consider drafting a quarterback for the future in the 1st round? Because that's what's being discussed. While I see the holes, some of them will be filled before the season starts and no team is going to be stacked, top to bottom.

But just to play aglong...I would like to see Minnesota add a top tier TE, they do have one. Rudolph can get it done on 3rd downs and in the redzone. There's still David Morgan too, don't forget and he's proven to be invaluable. On the DL, the only guy they lost so far is Richardson. While that is a big loss, they already filled his void. Bringing back Everson means they don't have a mass exodus of producers. This is a position that is deep in the draft and they will get another body there for sure. Other than that, there's promise with Weatherly, so that makes 3 good to great DE's and they got some young guys inside to go with Linval. And I agree with the total depth at WR, but it's not like the cupboard is bare...They have 2 of the top 20ish WR's in the game. That's a great place to start. They need one guy to step up and they're good there, but they also probably address this in the draft with a pick. Agree again on RB, but given that there's no real studs in this draft and the fact that you can always find top producing RB's later drafts, the Vikings will be able to find somebody to spell Cook. I'm sure of that. The OL is a mess though and the biggest concern to me. Everything else mentioned can be made whole or much better by one draft pick and/or signing either an unheralded, under the radar player or cap casualty when camp rolls around. The offensive line will take an investment of at least 2 high draft picks and other bodies some other way. I also think they could use another LB.

I see holes, but nothing that can't be fixed with the right moves. It's very much true that the window on this current team is closing pretty fast, but it's not closed completely.

Good points. No team is stacked. Perhaps I'm looking to down on everything. Getting Griff back was a very good move no doubt. Maybe his issues are in check. I thought he was gone for sure. But he took a CAP redo also. Another good thing. I missed on that one. One player I hope wouldn't be back is Rudy. IMO he's not good enough for what he gets. Matter of fact he's not that good at anything. Another great point is 20ish WRs. Having 2 is a good thing. I was under the impression that some felt they were two top WRs. Again a mistake on my part. They will fix things the best they can with the means available. Which is exactly what you stated.

The only good things Rudy has left are his catching ability and size. His speed and agility wasnt great to begin with but it's near gone at this point. He's a solid redzone target still but he's not much of a threat in between the 20's