Vikings Message Board.Com

HardcoreVikesFan wrote:I don't understand what in the hell we are doing this offseason. We couldn't pay Cordarrelle 5 million? Really? Come the #### on.

We signed a 1st round BUST for 3.75 million though in Datone Jones? WTF.

We have lost a lot of talent and won't replace a majority of it.

I know that my fan allegiance is to the team, and not the players. However, we have lost three of my favorites in one offseason. It is beyond frustrating.

I agree. I'm not sure what the Vikings are trying to do right now.

I'm keeping my fingers crossed regarding Thielen and I certainly hope the team doesn't think they're done with the offensive line.

Rhodes Closed wrote: Apparently, regarding that, he's quoted as saying ''I'm focused on Minnesota. I'm here to enjoy time with a good organization.''

I say sign me up as a Cook fan and give that man a contract.

Oh nice!! Thats good to hear

losperros wrote: I agree. I'm not sure what the Vikings are trying to do right now.

I'm keeping my fingers crossed regarding Thielen and I certainly hope the team doesn't think they're done with the offensive line.

But my question is, you aren't sure what they are doing in what sense?? We're looking into nickel DBs, we're looking into RBs, looking into WRs, etc. Plus we have the draft. And signed two offensive tackles. Outside of CP and Cap, we really lost very little. And both are definitely replaceable. There is no replacement for CP when it comes to KR but as a WR, definitely. I don't understand what everyone is so upset about. We go out and fill huge tackle voids which is what everyone wanted and there are still fans that aren't pleased. I don't get it. We didnt let Danielle Hunter and Stefon Diggs go. It was a nickel back and a #3-4 WR. They are two replaceable players. Look at the contracts up next year. We need the money for much more valuable players other than a nickel back that wanted to play outside and signed a 4 year deal at age 29 and a good kick returner. I wouldve like to have CP back but its not the end of the world

Well said. Couldn't agree more!

Interesting sidebar on Eddie Lacy - last season after being told to lose weight he turned up at 234lbs and had a good start to the season before injury...one of his team visits this last week he weighed in at 267lbs.

Now read into this what you will, he's been out for the season and it's the off-season...but after the issues at Green Bay i'd expected him to be closely controlling it. The fact he isn't makes me glad we passed on him.

JDLon wrote:Interesting sidebar on Eddie Lacy - last season after being told to lose weight he turned up at 234lbs and had a good start to the season before injury...one of his team visits this last week he weighed in at 267lbs.

Now read into this what you will, he's been out for the season and it's the off-season...but after the issues at Green Bay i'd expected him to be closely controlling it. The fact he isn't makes me glad we passed on him.

I agree and very good points made. We can find a decent RB in the draft

Pondering Her Percy wrote:But my question is, you aren't sure what they are doing in what sense?? We're looking into nickel DBs, we're looking into RBs, looking into WRs, etc. Plus we have the draft. And signed two offensive tackles. Outside of CP and Cap, we really lost very little. And both are definitely replaceable. There is no replacement for CP when it comes to KR but as a WR, definitely. I don't understand what everyone is so upset about. We go out and fill huge tackle voids which is what everyone wanted and there are still fans that aren't pleased. I don't get it.

Take off the purple goggles you're wearing over your purple glasses for a minute and maybe you will. Just think, for Pete's sake. You literally wrote the following earlier in this same thread:

But lets go get more injury prone tackles like Okung or Clady and hope everything is ok.....oh wait, or maybe Mr. Inconsistency Matt Kalil 2.0 in Riley Reiff. And we wonder why this OL wont get any better. Because we never want to spend any money on it via FA and dont draft them. We just get a bunch of has-beens

Now you expect us to believe you're genuinely puzzled because people aren't thrilled about the signings of Reiff and Remmers? I know, you were freaking out and now you've calmed down. Nevertheless, your opinion of these two players wasn't so high before they suddenly became Vikings and now you seem to expect everybody to be impressed that Spielman actually paid a premium for a couple of free agent cast-offs to play tackle. That's taking homer-ism to another level.

If Newman and Peterson are both gone, along with Munnerlyn and Patterson, those are all significant losses. Newman and Munnerlyn have both played very important roles in the Vikings defense over the last 3 years. Just because you think Peterson is washed up, that doesn't mean everybody does and washed-up or not, his likely departure leaves a big void at RB. Patterson's one of the best special teams players in the game and although he's replaceable at WR, he had moved into the #3 spot last season and was doing some good things. Nobody is irreplaceable but these guys all played their positiosn well enough that replacing them with players of equal or greater value isn't a given. There's room for a little uncertainty and disappointment.

We didnt let Danielle Hunter and Stefon Diggs go. It was a nickel back and a #3-4 WR. They are two replaceable players. Look at the contracts up next year. We need the money for much more valuable players other than a nickel back that wanted to play outside and signed a 4 year deal at age 29 and a good kick returner. I wouldve like to have CP back but its not the end of the world

Nobody is saying it's the end of the world. They're saying they would have liked the Vikes to keep him. It's not the same thing.

My assessment of FA so far:

Positives:
Our biggest weakness, OT, has been addressed (this cannot be overstated in how big it is)
We added some depth at DT (not sure how positive this is, more not a negative)

Negatives:
We lost our KR, gadget play guy, elite gunner
Lost our punter
Lost our nickel corner (I almost said nickel back, LOL)
RB is a ?
Still have ? at RG, but Sirles can play that position

Overall, I think this is a net positive.

Losing the ST stuff sucks, but that is an area of high turnover in general within the NFL and Priefer has shown himself to be a good ST coach over the years. I think we'll bounce back here. FWIW, I wanted Patterson back, but the fact that he could only get a 1yr deal on the open market says a lot about how the league (not just the Vikings) valued his skill set.

The loss of Munnerlyn leaves questions at Slot Corner, but we have both Alexander and Waynes waiting to step in. I think we'll take a step back early on, but not that much of a step back. Neither of Waynes nor Alexander are pure rookies and they have time within Zimmer's system.

RB is a question mark. McKinnon has never been able to play a full season durability wise when he has been taking a majority of the snaps. Moreover, I'm not sure AP is a good fit for the quick style passing they seem to want to employ. This has yet to be addressed. This is another case where the fact that AP remains unsigned is a sign of the times. The League isn't valuing him highly as a whole, not just the Vikings. IMO, the team would be best served drafting a Chester Taylor type player with a developed skillset even if he lacks the flash a more name player. A role player could probably do good things for them if he can execute.

However, despite all of the above, they addressed what was there single greatest weakness as a team in adding two OT. In 2016 the play of the tackles was so bad that it literally crippled the entire offense and by extension the whole team. Addressing this issue will provide a dramatic boost to the offense and add a lot of sorely needed balance to this team.

Overall, I think the Vikings in addressing their issues at Tackle are a better team today than the one that ended the 2016 season.

For upcoming issues, this is my assessment:

1.) Who scares people on this offense? Who is the playmaker? We've got a few above average guys, but no one that really has "juice". Right now it seems like Kyle Rudolph is the scariest guy. Hopefully someone can emerge here?

2.) How well and how quickly can the new look OL come together and play competitively? Will this cost us games early?

3.) Can ST bounce back from losing CP84 and Jeff Locke?

4.) How well does the transition at Slot Corner go? Growing pains early?

Also remember PHP, we have no place kicker, no punter, and arguably the best return man the Vikings ever had is now on a different team too. Locke wasn't great, but he had a very good year last year especially as pinning opponents to deep. Basically the top three things you need for special teams we don't have (I am not counting the players they signed yet because I haven't heard anything about them and I don't know if believe they were signed with the intention of letting Locke walk and not having a plan at Pk.

Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk

Mothman wrote: Take off the purple goggles you're wearing over your purple glasses for a minute and maybe you will. Just think, for Pete's sake. You literally wrote the following earlier in this same thread:
Now you expect us to believe you're genuinely puzzled because people aren't thrilled about the signings of Reiff and Remmers? I know, you were freaking out and now you've calmed down. Nevertheless, your opinion of these two players wasn't so high before they suddenly became Vikings and now you seem to expect everybody to be impressed that Spielman actually paid a premium for a couple of free agent cast-offs to play tackle. That's taking homer-ism to another level.

If Newman and Peterson are both gone, along with Munnerlyn and Patterson, those are all significant losses. Newman and Munnerlyn have both played very important roles in the Vikings defense over the last 3 years. Just because you think Peterson is washed up, that doesn't mean everybody does and washed-up or not, his likely departure leaves a big void at RB. Patterson's one of the best special teams players in the game and although he's replaceable at WR, he had moved into the #3 spot last season and was doing some good things. Nobody is irreplaceable but these guys all played their positiosn well enough that replacing them with players of equal or greater value isn't a given. There's room for a little uncertainty and disappointment.
Nobody is saying it's the end of the world. They're saying they would have liked the Vikes to keep him. It's not the same thing.

And you clearly haven't read my posts regarding my OP regarding missing on Wagner that you just put up there. And Adrian Peterson is no longer a significant loss. We practically lost him last offseason. And with what's out there, it's easily replaceable at this point. And we're looking at CBs Jim!! We're looking to fill the void of Newman. You act like if these guys leave, we're either leaving the hole empty or they can't be replaced. Your hate for Spielman is clearly showing and it seems like you're only seeing what you want to see. Carry on.....

Mothman wrote: Take off the purple goggles you're wearing over your purple glasses for a minute and maybe you will. Just think, for Pete's sake. You literally wrote the following earlier in this same thread:
Now you expect us to believe you're genuinely puzzled because people aren't thrilled about the signings of Reiff and Remmers? I know, you were freaking out and now you've calmed down. Nevertheless, your opinion of these two players wasn't so high before they suddenly became Vikings and now you seem to expect everybody to be impressed that Spielman actually paid a premium for a couple of free agent cast-offs to play tackle. That's taking homer-ism to another level.

If Newman and Peterson are both gone, along with Munnerlyn and Patterson, those are all significant losses. Newman and Munnerlyn have both played very important roles in the Vikings defense over the last 3 years. Just because you think Peterson is washed up, that doesn't mean everybody does and washed-up or not, his likely departure leaves a big void at RB. Patterson's one of the best special teams players in the game and although he's replaceable at WR, he had moved into the #3 spot last season and was doing some good things. Nobody is irreplaceable but these guys all played their positions well enough that replacing them with players of equal or greater value isn't a given. There's room for a little uncertainty and disappointment.

Good response, Jim. You define the reality of the team's situation quite well. I agree with everything you said.

Some may disagree but I see no coup scored by the Vikings during this free agency. There is good, there certainly is bad, and there are still far too many question marks regarding the team.

PurpleMustReign wrote:Also remember PHP, we have no place kicker, no punter, and arguably the best return man the Vikings ever had is now on a different team too. Locke wasn't great, but he had a very good year last year especially as pinning opponents to deep. Basically the top three things you need for special teams we don't have (I am not counting the players they signed yet because I haven't heard anything about them and I don't know if believe they were signed with the intention of letting Locke walk and not having a plan at Pk.

Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk

Uh we have a kicker....

Patterson's value as a kick returner is vastly overrated. He only returned 25 kicks last season as most of the kickoffs sent his way sailed out the back of the endzone. His average return length was 31 yards, and since he was returning most of those from the middle/back of the endzone, on average, the Vikings would have had better starting field position if he had downed the ball. The one touchdown was nice, but it added 4 yards to his return average, which even further illustrates that the team would be better off on average for him to down the ball. He is a dynamic returner, but it just doesn't matter that much anymore. The rules have changed to such a degree that it isn't an important position any longer. In a year or two when they eliminate the kickoff, his value there will be 0.

Is he worth 5 million as a WR? I think its a legitimate question, and I could argue both sides.

Will guys just let free agency take its course?? These players are replaceable. The sky isn't falling. We have guys on visits. There are others we're interested in. Relax and see what happens

Pondering Her Percy wrote:And you clearly haven't read my posts regarding my OP regarding missing on Wagner that you just put up there.

I've read them all and even acknowledged your change of heart in my post. In fact, that's part of the point. Before the Vikings signed Reiff, you considered him "Mr. Inconsistency Matt Kalil 2.0". Once he became a Viking, he was suddenly another good move by Rick Spielman. The underlying point isn't just about your change of heart, it's that because of your fluctuating feelings on the subject, you should be able to grasp why some people might not be too excited about the two tackles the Vikings signed.

And Adrian Peterson is no longer a significant loss. We practically lost him last offseason.

Yes, and their running game fell to the very bottom of the league without him.

And we're looking at CBs Jim!! We're looking to fill the void of Newman. You act like if these guys leave, we're either leaving the hole empty or they can't be replaced.

I haven't said anything like that. They obviously will be replaced. I'm simply saying these are significant departures and it's not hard to see and understand why some people are concerned about these losses or will simply miss these particular players. I'm saying you should be able to see that.

Your hate for Spielman is clearly showing and it seems like you're only seeing what you want to see. Carry on.....

This has nothing to do with me "hating" Spielman and everything to do with me getting tired of watching you bemoan one post after another in which someone indicates they are disappointed or underwhelmed with the way the Vikings are handling this offseason thus far. You meet such posts time and time again with hyperbolic responses. If someone says they're disappointed, that doesn't mean they think the sky is falling. If I say the loss of Adrian Peterson leaves a void, that doesn't mean I'm speaking out of irrational hatred for Rick Spielman. It's simply an acknowledgment of what an all-time great RB and former league MVP has meant to the team.