Vikings Message Board.Com

808vikingsfan wrote: Hey! I resent that remark. Don't call me a Ponder apologist. I'm far from one. OK. So let's blame the OL then. Why don't we hear that when addressing Ponder's performance?

People are constantly bringing up the O-line....but it just gets them labeled an apologist who is making excuses for Ponder.

This o-line leaves A LOT to be desired...as does Ponder and a few other spots on this team. But it's week one and a long way to go.

Mothman wrote: He scored 3 touchdowns. That seems helpful.

This gets my vote for the understatement of the year. Thanks for the chuckle, Jim.

Yeah the Oline wasn't very good. But they're going to struggle when the defense can do whatever they want without regard to worrying about the QB making a play. And when he had time, and an open receiver...he still threw inaccurate pass after inaccurate pass.

BGM wrote: You are blaming AD for getting mobbed in the backfield all game? The guy is incredible, but nobody, not Barry Sanders, not Walter Payton, not Emmit Smith, had success when the defenses they faced were able to push into the backfield at will and stop the play before it even started. The Lions had a great gameplan to stop AD and they did for much of the game. The fact he broke off that 78 yarder when everyone knew he was going to be the one to get the ball shows just how superhuman the guy really is.

Plus... 3 TDs. Seriously.

Not to rain on the Ponder bashing parade...but one of those TDs was a pass from the QB.

But to your point of the lions having a great game plan to stop AD (which they certainly did) I put a higher blame on the coaching staff, specifically out OC. Its their job to adjust and make changes once they see things aren't working. You can clearly see that their game plan is working then why are you still calling run, run, pass? Why not mix it up and you know try and throw it on first downs? or second downs? more often? instead of passing only when everyone knows it absolutely has to be a pass.

Saying that always brings back the response that well if Ponder can't make the throws on 3rd down what do you expect on 1st or 2nd? Well, let the kid play. Give him the chance to show what he can do then. We keep sticking him in 3rd and longs and hoping to convert every time with a young QB? i can tell you right now thats not gonna happen. As much as Ponder is to blame for this loss, I think people are putting more blame on him than is warranted. The first INT? Simpson should have caught that, also the D got really lucky that the ball bounced in their DBs hands on the run. The 2nd INT? the kid was trying to throw the ball away..which is what he's taught to do. Also, the last one? I kept hearing over and over again about how he was just padding his stats with the passing late and was all in garbage time, well in the same vain, that INT should also then be considered a garbage INT cause lets face it the game was over at that point.

The sad reality is, that our entire team, from the coaching staff, to the defense, to the offense. No one came to that game prepared the way they should have been. This game was not one persons fault. This was a team failure.

I'm not saying we shouldn't criticize him, but theres more than one way to skin a cat.

808vikingsfan wrote:Geeez, so protective of Mr. 2500.

No, not protective of him. Just do not agree that he did nothing to help yesterday.

BGM wrote: No, not protective of him. Just do not agree that he did nothing to help yesterday.

He did a hell of a lot more to hurt than help. You could start any QB on this roster...and a WR...and they'd do just as much or more to help...

Demi wrote: He did a hell of a lot more to hurt than help. You could start any QB on this roster...and a WR...and they'd do just as much or more to help...

I assume Mr. 2500 referred to Peterson, not Ponder.

I assumed Ponder, especially with his yardage totals and a Christian Ponder thread.

Demi wrote:I assumed Ponder, especially with his yardage totals and a Christian Ponder thread.

No worries. It's been a contentious start to the season. What can you do?

John_Viveiros wrote: This gets my vote for the understatement of the year. Thanks for the chuckle, Jim.

You're welcome. It was intended to amuse so I'm glad it did!

hahaha if Ponder is Mr. 2500 we're in trouble!

Seriously though with what the lions were doing I would have tried passing on first down, don't get the first? Pass again? 3rd down? run it. Just to be unpredictable.

If we can't pass on them with what they were doing on first and second down against the run we might as well forfeit.

BGM wrote: No worries. It's been a contentious start to the season. What can you do?

You're a sconnie you traitor! Can't believe I didn't notice that earlier! No wonder you're a ponderaholic!

So depressing where this team is at.

Demi wrote: You're a sconnie you traitor! Can't believe I didn't notice that earlier! No wonder you're a ponderaholic!

So depressing where this team is at.

Nah, not depressing. Sometimes infuriating. But guys like Harrison Smith and AD keep my head above water.

The Breeze wrote: People are constantly bringing up the O-line....but it just gets them labeled an apologist who is making excuses for Ponder.

WTF is that supposed to mean?

You have a guy basically claiming Adrian Peterson was as much to blame for the loss yesterday as Ponder. If that's not apologizing for Ponder, I don't know what is.

Facts are facts, and they're undeniable here.

As reported by ESPN, Adrian Peterson faced 8 or more in the box on 12 of his 18 carries yesterday, the second highest percentage of his carries in any game over the past two years. Now, most football people would assume that such a defensive tactic would help our erstwhile quarterback, but NO ... Christian Ponder threw two of his three picks with 8 men in the box.

I suppose to criticize Christian Ponder -- even if you've been extremely fair to him, as I have -- puts me at risk of being called somebody who indiscriminately "labels people as apologists." Whatever. I'm not going to sugar-coat yesterdays performance. Yes, the entire team played poorly, but the facts say that Ponder was terrible. To deny it and blame Adrian Peterson is to apologize for the guy.

J. Kapp 11 wrote: WTF is that supposed to mean?

You have a guy basically claiming Adrian Peterson was as much to blame for the loss yesterday as Ponder. If that's not apologizing for Ponder, I don't know what is.

Facts are facts, and they're undeniable here.

As reported by ESPN, Adrian Peterson faced 8 or more in the box on 12 of his 18 carries yesterday, the second highest percentage of his carries in any game over the past two years. Now, most football people would assume that such a defensive tactic would help our erstwhile quarterback, but NO ... Christian Ponder threw two of his three picks with 8 men in the box.

I suppose to criticize Christian Ponder -- even if you've been extremely fair to him, as I have -- puts me at risk of being called somebody who indiscriminately "labels people as apologists." Whatever. I'm not going to sugar-coat yesterdays performance. Yes, the entire team played poorly, but the facts say that Ponder was terrible. To deny it and blame Adrian Peterson is to apologize for the guy.

Crickey Joe...lighten up. IMO 808 has been one of Ponder's more consistent critics....not a Ponder 'apologist'. My remark was a reference to the offensive line comment as I have believed and continue to believe that they are every bit as bad as Ponder can be at times....and often.
But criticism of the o-line as a factor in the poor passing game has brought out the apologist label.

I have no part in this nonsense about blaming AD for anything that happened on Sunday....nonsense claiming it or defending it.