Vikings @ Dolphins post game

[StumpHunter]

So I was at the game and the stats were very accurate but in the end misleading IMO.
In the 1st quarter, we were absolutely obliterated. The only reason that we were even in the game was due to Miami constantly drawing penalty flags.
However, the minute Teddy came into the game, in the 2nd quarter, I felt the Vikings took control of the game. The passing stats that Teddy put up are also very misleading. The majority of his yards were YAC yards by Hill and Waddle. Waddle took a Hitch and went like 50 yards with it. Hill did catch a few 15-20 yard passes in soft zone, but he also took off and added a bunch of YAC.
BTW, Hill made Chandler Sullivan look absolutely elementary on 1 play. Like Sullivan was a Pop Warner football player. Afetr taking a 2 score lead, the defense became very much a bend but don't break defense. It was designed to keep the play in front of the defender and keep the clock running. Miami went right down the field in 3 or 4 plays !!! Our DB speed is pedestrian !

I noticed also KOC with his head down not watching the defense, but let's be real, he is the play caller on offense! He has to get it right. Heck, if you don't score, it's impossible to win !!! So it doesn't bother me that he did this.

The fans around me were so disgusted with so many of Cousins check downs and terrible throws. We were all commenting on Captain Checkdown, and Keeping that completion % high, etc.... It was brutal how numerous times the throws were so bad to not even get to the 1st down marker. For instance the poor pass to Thielen on 3rd and 2. Seriously a terrible throw that Thielen dove for and it was still 2 yards behind the 1st down marker. Constant checkdowns and throw aways. The 1 play that stood out so much to me was when we were out of FG range, 3rd and long, he had KJ 1on 1 on a 9 route and instead of throwing the ball into space and giving KJ a chance to make a play on it, he checked down and threw a pass out of bounds. Why? We had to punt regardless. Why not take the chance to see if your WR can beat the CB. Maybe even get a PI !!

Those throws short of the sticks with no shot at a 1st are really bad plays by the QB that show up as positives on the stat sheet and there were just way too many of them on Sunday. This, despite facing the 2nd worst pass defense in the NFL through 6 games.

[VikingLord]

Those throws short of the sticks with no shot at a 1st are really bad plays by the QB that show up as positives on the stat sheet and there were just way too many of them on Sunday. This, despite facing the 2nd worst pass defense in the NFL through 6 games.

Do you think Cousins consistently throwing short of the sticks on 3rd downs (so far this year, at least) is a feature of the KOC offensive strategy or something Cousins himself is doing on those plays?

While I'm tempted to blame Cousins for this as we've seen this from him when Zimmer was the head coach, we heard a lot about how KOC was going to bring a new offensive philosophy and play design to the offense that would play to Cousins' strengths and the strengths of the team. So, if one assumes that KOC has in fact attempted to do that, is it possible the Cousins throws short consistently because that is what KOC wants him to do on those 3rd downs? Maybe KOC expects the short receivers on those plays to convert the downs by running more effectively after the catch or something?

If Cousins is the one choosing the checkdown routes because they are always open (and they should be because that is what any defensive coordinator wants the opposing QB to choose in those situations), then it seems like KOC's main goal needs to be getting into Cousins' head and making sure he's not giving up early on the 1st down routes. I'm sure he doesn't want Cousins to become reckless in those situations, but this strikes me as a balance between being pragmatic and not taking undue risks to convert 3rd downs and actually attempting the throws needed to convert those 3rds and keep drives alive.

The point about Miami having a struggling pass defense suggests it is Cousins who is bailing on the 1st down routes, but man, this has been a consistent problem for the Vikings offense since KOC took over, including during the preseason when Cousins and the starting offense didn't play a down. If it is KOC's strategy to convert by throwing short and getting the yards after the catch, I hope it starts to pay dividends soon. The Vikings have been relatively fortunate to play some teams with greater issues than they have right now, but come playoff time they can't expect their opponents to be physically hobbled or to shoot themselves in their own feet.

[VikingsVictorious]

So I was at the game and the stats were very accurate but in the end misleading IMO.
In the 1st quarter, we were absolutely obliterated. The only reason that we were even in the game was due to Miami constantly drawing penalty flags.
However, the minute Teddy came into the game, in the 2nd quarter, I felt the Vikings took control of the game. The passing stats that Teddy put up are also very misleading. The majority of his yards were YAC yards by Hill and Waddle. Waddle took a Hitch and went like 50 yards with it. Hill did catch a few 15-20 yard passes in soft zone, but he also took off and added a bunch of YAC.
BTW, Hill made Chandler Sullivan look absolutely elementary on 1 play. Like Sullivan was a Pop Warner football player. Afetr taking a 2 score lead, the defense became very much a bend but don't break defense. It was designed to keep the play in front of the defender and keep the clock running. Miami went right down the field in 3 or 4 plays !!! Our DB speed is pedestrian !

I noticed also KOC with his head down not watching the defense, but let's be real, he is the play caller on offense! He has to get it right. Heck, if you don't score, it's impossible to win !!! So it doesn't bother me that he did this.

The fans around me were so disgusted with so many of Cousins check downs and terrible throws. We were all commenting on Captain Checkdown, and Keeping that completion % high, etc.... It was brutal how numerous times the throws were so bad to not even get to the 1st down marker. For instance the poor pass to Thielen on 3rd and 2. Seriously a terrible throw that Thielen dove for and it was still 2 yards behind the 1st down marker. Constant checkdowns and throw aways. The 1 play that stood out so much to me was when we were out of FG range, 3rd and long, he had KJ 1on 1 on a 9 route and instead of throwing the ball into space and giving KJ a chance to make a play on it, he checked down and threw a pass out of bounds. Why? We had to punt regardless. Why not take the chance to see if your WR can beat the CB. Maybe even get a PI !!

5-1.

[Texas Vike]

If there is a time in a season where struggling with consistency is OK, the first half of the season is it. If there is a point in the season where a team needs to win ugly a few times, the first half is it. And if there is a point in the season where a team needs to start demonstrating it can put the pieces together into a cohesive, consistent approach, well, that time is almost here for the Vikings. For me to get fully on board with believing in this team is going to take me seeing several games where the consistency and production are both there. I am optimistic that will start happening, because I really, really want to believe in this team this year.

Anyway, for those of you who saw the game, I truly appreciate reading the comments and insights. It provides a lot of context.

One last thing I wanted to say was about Dalvin Cook and how nice it was to see him break one finally. He's looked frustrated because it always seems like there is one last guy who just trips him up and prevents him from breaking off the long TD run. He finally found the daylight he needed to avoid that, and it was great to see him capitalize and take it all the way. He's got a ton of talent and he's a guy I really want to root for and hope he succeeds.

VL: Totally agree with your points above, especially the sentence I put in bold. We took care of chapter 1 well. We can see some promising signs, but the real test is coming and I doubt we will find ourselves in such favorable situations as we have thus far. Lady Fortune is fickle, and she's been on our side for most of the first 6 games. I do believe that your attitude and the overall level of trust and buy in that you have on a team can help influence your luck, so maybe all of the 'good vibes' chatter with KOC and KAM has actually paid dividends. But surely, the weather will turn and the wind will blow against us more fiercely.

We need to continue to win games that we should (AZ, WA, Lions, Bears), but we have a fair number of games against teams that are looking robust (Giants, Pats, Jets, Colts, Cowboys) and then we have the Bills on the road, who are SB favorites by a long shot. It really is against those robust teams that we will need to prove ourselves. 4 of 5 are at home, which should help a lot. Like you, I WANT to believe in this team!

[IIsweet]

Texas Vike, it is easy to get on board with this team. they are not playing at an elite SB type level, IMO, but they are winning. There is a lot to be excited about. As Viking Victorious responded ever so eloquently to my message, 5-1.
It is very accurate because, Cousins is still not an elite QB, but we are 5-1. The defense has it's flaws, mostly the lack of speed imo, but we are still 5-1. The interior OL is getting pushed around by the better DT's but yet we are still 5-1.
I have to say, that we have a lot of room for improvement which is exciting because we have much room to continue to develop.
As much as I do not like Donatell's defense, they are making adjustments and we are 5-1.
As much as I am not a Cousins fan, they still keep moving the ball and he has not killed the offense.
KOC and staff have done a great job imo of doing what it takes to win games. They do not have a perfect roster to work with, but they are doing whatever it takes to win.

On a side note - KOC has a clock guy on staff. I know that it was brought up that he does not watch the clock and the defense, but the reasoning is because he hired a clock manager so that he could focus on the defense. This, IMO, is a brilliant move. Knowing what you need to be successful. I am now curious as to whether this is a McVay thing that he learned

[CharVike]

Texas Vike, it is easy to get on board with this team. they are not playing at an elite SB type level, IMO, but they are winning. There is a lot to be excited about. As Viking Victorious responded ever so eloquently to my message, 5-1.
It is very accurate because, Cousins is still not an elite QB, but we are 5-1. The defense has it's flaws, mostly the lack of speed imo, but we are still 5-1. The interior OL is getting pushed around by the better DT's but yet we are still 5-1.
I have to say, that we have a lot of room for improvement which is exciting because we have much room to continue to develop.
As much as I do not like Donatell's defense, they are making adjustments and we are 5-1.
As much as I am not a Cousins fan, they still keep moving the ball and he has not killed the offense.
KOC and staff have done a great job imo of doing what it takes to win games. They do not have a perfect roster to work with, but they are doing whatever it takes to win.

On a side note - KOC has a clock guy on staff. I know that it was brought up that he does not watch the clock and the defense, but the reasoning is because he hired a clock manager so that he could focus on the defense. This, IMO, is a brilliant move. Knowing what you need to be successful. I am now curious as to whether this is a McVay thing that he learned

We played the Rams early last year and the last thing I thought was they were an elite SB team. They tried to give us that game by throwing ints and we didn't want it. Their ST made the big play. Of course we don't have a player on D that is at Donald or Ramsey level. IMO what will kill us on offense when/if it happens is our OL play. We saw it against the Phines as we couldn't even run the ball. Basically nothing on the ground. Yes Cook finally broke one. We are killed at that point because they owned the LOS. I wish they would can Donatell. This 3-4 is a shambles and should be scrapped during the bye week. Our NT Phillips weighs only 307. We will get destroyed with that. No way he can hold the point. Hunter should never have been moved to LBer. No team has a perfect roster. But we play guys in positions were they have very little chance of success especially on D. I'm sure there are other things being done that I can't see. Like coverage that doesn't fit our players ect....... KOC appears to be too much involved with one piece of the puzzle. He needs to be watching the whole project which includes 2 other pieces. He needs to be at a higher level than play to play management of the O. They are beating the teams they should beat.

[vikeinmontana]

I tend to be of the belief that the average fan such as ourselves never realize two major things. One, it is very hard to win games in in the NFL. Which leads to my #2, there is far more parity in this league than people think. Sure it's easy for fans to look at a team like the Panthers and say how much they suck. But in reality they have a lot of very good players who get paid a ton of money to play football. It all has to come together, and more times the more talented team prevails, but there is a reason they say "any given Sunday".

It's super easy to watch a game and find flaws and claim so and so didn't do anything this quarter. But you gotta remember that on the other side of the ball another so and so is paid handsomely to keep us from doing anything. Just like we expect our guys to make adjustments throughout the game, the other side is doing the exact same thing. Which is their jobs. Think we tend to focus so much on what "our" guys are and are not doing that we lose site that on the other side of the ball there are guys doing the exact same thing.

5-1 is a GREAT spot to be right now. If we keep getting better every week we should finish with a great record. If we don't, and this is the best we're going to see all year, then our record will be bad. I don't see any point in looking ahead because we have no idea what it'll look like. What we DO know is going into our bye week we have one of the best records in the NFL. Personally I'm going to enjoy it!

[VikingLord]

If we don't, and this is the best we're going to see all year, then our record will be bad.

Man, I enjoyed your post so much until you wrote the above...

After so many years of watching this team, I can't tell you how shocking it has been to watch the Harrison Smith plinko interception against Miami actually fall into his hands while he's on the ground, or the double-doink field goal miss by the Saints in the London game. There is a part of me (an admittedly big part) that acknowledges all this good fortune is probably not the result of the Vikings being measurably better than their opponents so far this year, but there is another part of me, the part that has been wounded over the years by consistent disappointments in those types of situations, that wants to believe this year's team is somehow different, and, if nothing else, at least the good fortune will continue right up until the last game. Fortune's payback for so many decades of seemingly being on the other side of those sorts of bounces in key moments. They've even been relatively fortunate in the health department compared to those sorts of setbacks in normal seasons.

Anyway, this can't possibly be the best we're going to see all year. Lady Luck is clearly on our side for once. I fully expect to see more improbably great bounces go our way in addition to watching the team just generally play better each week at this point. A truly enjoyable season to be a Vikings fan for the first time in a long time.

All of the above was tongue-in-cheek, of course. But the team does seem to have a different vibe this year. I mean, any year where Cousins is rocking serious chains and shades after a win, and looks good doing it to boot, is an unprecedented development for the Vikings.

[J. Kapp 11]

If we don't, and this is the best we're going to see all year, then our record will be bad.

Man, I enjoyed your post so much until you wrote the above...

After so many years of watching this team, I can't tell you how shocking it has been to watch the Harrison Smith plinko interception against Miami actually fall into his hands while he's on the ground, or the double-doink field goal miss by the Saints in the London game. There is a part of me (an admittedly big part) that acknowledges all this good fortune is probably not the result of the Vikings being measurably better than their opponents so far this year, but there is another part of me, the part that has been wounded over the years by consistent disappointments in those types of situations, that wants to believe this year's team is somehow different, and, if nothing else, at least the good fortune will continue right up until the last game. Fortune's payback for so many decades of seemingly being on the other side of those sorts of bounces in key moments. They've even been relatively fortunate in the health department compared to those sorts of setbacks in normal seasons.

Anyway, this can't possibly be the best we're going to see all year. Lady Luck is clearly on our side for once. I fully expect to see more improbably great bounces go our way in addition to watching the team just generally play better each week at this point. A truly enjoyable season to be a Vikings fan for the first time in a long time.

All of the above was tongue-in-cheek, of course. But the team does seem to have a different vibe this year. I mean, any year where Cousins is rocking serious chains and shades after a win, and looks good doing it to boot, is an unprecedented development for the Vikings.

A couple of thoughts on luck.

1. Luck tends to even out.
Bounces that go our way might not go our way later. Or ... bounces that have not gone our way in the past may finally be going our way now.

2. Ben Hogan, the great golfer, once said, "The harder I work, the luckier I get."
There's really something to that, in all avenues of sports. I'm a competitive golfer, and I believe this with every fiber of my being. I work hard at my game. What others may see as luck might just be me being better prepared. Same with the Vikings.

3. Some of what appears to be luck might actually be attention to detail.
Case in point: Penalties. The Vikings are the second-least penalized team in the NFL. The Dolphins absolutely imploded in the first half with penalties. As Vikings fans know all too well from last year, this isn't luck. We were always getting killed with untimely penalties. KOC is a guy who pays a lot of attention to the details. As a result, this team is very, very disciplined. It's showing in the wins. We're winning not because we're dominant, but because we're winning in the margins. Don't discount the power of that.

(As an aside, anybody who thinks Mike McDaniel is ahead of KOC in Coach of the Year running is out of their minds — for this very reason. I don't care what kind of genius boy wonder McDaniel is supposed to be. The Dolphins beat themselves. That's coaching.)

Eventually we all hope the Vikings play a complete game where all three phases play their best at the same time. But luck is a funny thing. Ride it while you got it.

[vikeinmontana]

If we don't, and this is the best we're going to see all year, then our record will be bad.

Man, I enjoyed your post so much until you wrote the above...

After so many years of watching this team, I can't tell you how shocking it has been to watch the Harrison Smith plinko interception against Miami actually fall into his hands while he's on the ground, or the double-doink field goal miss by the Saints in the London game. There is a part of me (an admittedly big part) that acknowledges all this good fortune is probably not the result of the Vikings being measurably better than their opponents so far this year, but there is another part of me, the part that has been wounded over the years by consistent disappointments in those types of situations, that wants to believe this year's team is somehow different, and, if nothing else, at least the good fortune will continue right up until the last game. Fortune's payback for so many decades of seemingly being on the other side of those sorts of bounces in key moments. They've even been relatively fortunate in the health department compared to those sorts of setbacks in normal seasons.

Anyway, this can't possibly be the best we're going to see all year. Lady Luck is clearly on our side for once. I fully expect to see more improbably great bounces go our way in addition to watching the team just generally play better each week at this point. A truly enjoyable season to be a Vikings fan for the first time in a long time.

All of the above was tongue-in-cheek, of course. But the team does seem to have a different vibe this year. I mean, any year where Cousins is rocking serious chains and shades after a win, and looks good doing it to boot, is an unprecedented development for the Vikings.

Let me clarify VL.

People tend to disregard the actual record of the team, and instead find any faults they can. Our record is only good because we haven't played anyone. Our line is getting pushed around. Our defense is soft. We won't beat good teams playing this way. Etc. You see it week in and week out. People like to look into the future and project what is going to happen. So my point is if we're going to do that, and pretend to see the future; it goes both ways. Sure, we have things to work on. We can get better across the board every day of the season. That is the point. If for some reason we don't improve what needs to improve, and this is the best we'll look all year, we won't be good. I don't see that happening. As it stands we are 5-1, lead the division, and are in a great position to keep building on those wins.

[VikingLord]

People tend to disregard the actual record of the team, and instead find any faults they can. Our record is only good because we haven't played anyone. Our line is getting pushed around. Our defense is soft. We won't beat good teams playing this way. Etc. You see it week in and week out. People like to look into the future and project what is going to happen. So my point is if we're going to do that, and pretend to see the future; it goes both ways. Sure, we have things to work on. We can get better across the board every day of the season. That is the point. If for some reason we don't improve what needs to improve, and this is the best we'll look all year, we won't be good. I don't see that happening. As it stands we are 5-1, lead the division, and are in a great position to keep building on those wins.

I get what you're saying and I agree. The Vikings have had a really fortuitous start to the season and while the record looks great, it's pretty clear as you point out that the better teams aren't going to let them get away with many of the things that have benefited the Vikings to this point.

[psjordan]

People tend to disregard the actual record of the team, and instead find any faults they can. Our record is only good because we haven't played anyone. Our line is getting pushed around. Our defense is soft. We won't beat good teams playing this way. Etc. You see it week in and week out. People like to look into the future and project what is going to happen.

Oh I don't think it's so much that when people bring up negatives. I mean, we really HAVEN'T played anyone that good [at the time] and yes we have a gaudy record, but is a good W-L record the goal six games in?

I'm perfectly comfortable bringing up negatives of this team so far. I'd bring up far fewer negatives if we were 2-4, played five clear playoff teams, played great football and lost due to a bad bounce here or a rookie (player or coach) mistake there. I'm way less comfortable with us 5-1 with the way we played. I mean something like 10 of our 14 drives against MIA went for less than 10 yards! I'm not pulling a hammy stating that won't fly against better teams, geesh.

The goal, for me, is to make the playoffs and hopefully get a win there, then see if we can get on a roll. I don't care if we get in at 16-1 or 9-8, if we lose the first playoff game it's all the same to me.

So the goal, one step removed, is to be playing good enough football to beat playoff caliber teams. I don't think we're anywhere close to that right now.

The ARZ game is HUGE in my opinion, like a SEASON-DEFINING type game. We cannot willy nilly through the game and hope for a W at the end. WE SIMPLY CANNOT GO THREE AND OUT ON THE FIRST DRIVE. We have to have solid drives on offense for most of the game - scoring drives or not. We have to unveil at least one or two creative plays on offense. We have to adjust QUICKLY to what is thrown at us. We have to make some 3-and-out stops on D. We need sound ST and clock management from the coaches.

Based on what I've seen so far, I'm not so sure this group can get it together in that way. I sure hope I'm wrong.