Norv

[mosscarter]

norv should be upset he has to work each week with one of the worst starting qb's in the nfl. aside from a better coach and defense; this offense is a mirror image of 2012. it got to the point where i simply turned the t.v. off i couldn't watch bridgewater anymore he reminds me so much of christian ponder its sickening. then all you heard paul allen say was, "teddy drops back, dumps it off" "teddy, dump pass." and just like 2012, with this type of qb play we will lose in the first round of the playoffs.

[The Breeze]

I see those similarities too...but I believe if Ponder had played in that playoff game the Vikes stood a great chance of winning.

I think Ponder made his fair share of plays in that season...regardless of what became of his career.
TB is at a similar stage of development and he also makes his fair share of plays.
I think the biggest difference will be made in terms of keeping him healthy long enough to makes his progress.
That certainly didn't happen in Ponder's case....whether it made a difference or not is debateable

[PurpleMustReign]

I see those similarities too...but I believe if Ponder had played in that playoff game the Vikes stood a great chance of winning.

I think Ponder made his fair share of plays in that season...regardless of what became of his career.
TB is at a similar stage of development and he also makes his fair share of plays.
I think the biggest difference will be made in terms of keeping him healthy long enough to makes his progress.
That certainly didn't happen in Ponder's case....whether it made a difference or not is debateable

I want to see what Teddy can do if he HAS to be the main point of the offense. For example, if AD was hurt or really ineffective (not that I want him to be hurt but you know what I mean). He played well against Denver, and had some good games last season.

[The Breeze]

I want to see what Teddy can do if he HAS to be the main point of the offense. For example, if AD was hurt or really ineffective (not that I want him to be hurt but you know what I mean). He played well against Denver, and had some good games last season.

I find it frustrating that TB spends less time in the shotgun because AD can't run from that formation...I'll give you that.
I know it's a sore subject here...butI find AD to be decidedly one dimentional, albeit that dimention is outstanding, but it does create strange hinderances in this offense when he is it's focus.
I have mixed feelings about him as a player.

[Mothman]

I want to see what Teddy can do if he HAS to be the main point of the offense. For example, if AD was hurt or really ineffective (not that I want him to be hurt but you know what I mean). He played well against Denver, and had some good games last season.

Haven't we basically seen that already? He became the focal point in all 3 losses this year.

[mosscarter]

exactly moth. peterson can only be asked to do so much. you could argue under the circumstances of this year's passing offense, and that offense in 2012 those could be argued as the 2 greatest rushing seasons ever. this season isn't over; but lets hope he stays healthy and finishes strong. both teams had NO passing attack he was (and is) running against 9 and 10 men in the box. you name me one back in history that could do that consistently?

[fiestavike]

I find it frustrating that TB spends less time in the shotgun because AD can't run from that formation...I'll give you that.
I know it's a sore subject here...butI find AD to be decidedly one dimentional, albeit that dimention is outstanding, but it does create strange hinderances in this offense when he is it's focus.
I have mixed feelings about him as a player.

I agree with you. He is outstanding in that dimension, but he is quite one dimensional and it can be frustrating. I don't think it would be such an issue if a) Teddy were able to operate better from under center, or b) the line could hold up for a bit longer and give Teddy time and space to make the pass.

There are just 3 puzzle pieces that all have significant weaknesses and can't quite seem to fit together. I would love to see it click, but Clemmings looked like a dumpster fire today, and I was disappointed we didn't get the chance to see Shepherd in the second half.

[mosscarter]

well peterson is the best one dimensional running back in nfl history then.

[The Breeze]

well peterson is the best one dimensional running back in nfl history then.

and if i had a choice between him ,LT or Marshall Faulk, i'd take one of the other two 99/100 times

[Mothman]

I find it frustrating that TB spends less time in the shotgun because AD can't run from that formation...I'll give you that.

That perception drives me nuts.

It's not that Peterson can't run from that formation... he's had some good runs from the shotgun but, as I've been saying all year, that's a passing formation. Teams don't stop keying on AD just because the Vikes are in the shotgun. Their passing game hasn't been effective enough to shift the defensive focus just because the team's in shotgun so it's hardly surprising that he's less effective running out of that formation. Putting that on him, as if he can't handle the job, ignores other factors.

The primary running play out of the shotgun is a draw play, which is designed to attack aggressive, pass-rushing defenses by "drawing" them down the field, thus creating gaps that can be exploited. It's a play based on deception but when the defense isn't afraid of the pass and still keys on the RB that tends to carry the offense on his back, the deception isn't very effective.

I know it's a sore subject here...butI find AD to be decidedly one dimentional, albeit that dimention is outstanding, but it does create strange hinderances in this offense when he is it's focus.
I have mixed feelings about him as a player.

I think his supposed one-dimensionality has been greatly exaggerated. For example, he's 4th on the team in receptions this year, behind Rudolph, Diggs and Wallace (and not far behind the latter. His pass-blocking isn't great but he make his share of good blocks.

The main hindrance to the offense is that too many players not named Adrian Peterson fail to make plays.

[Norv Zimmer]

and if i had a choice between him ,LT or Marshall Faulk, i'd take one of the other two 99/100 times

No way I would take either of them over AP
AP runs with power, power is needed

[The Breeze]

It's a solid point, Jim
I think the reason teams don't ever stop keying on AD as a threat to run is partly because of how ineffective he is in the passing game. Being 4th on THIS team in receptions is no great feat...especially when the majority of it has been dump offs.
Today being a big exception with the screen and a drop of what looked to be a sure TD. Then even Lynch lamented on AD's lack of just not having a natural ability to catch a football....not like a Faulk,LT, Forte etc., who are types of guys I'd rather have. I just think it makes it easier for the d to attack the (crappy)line and limits our offensive creativity.
I also think his prowess in Yards after contact has helped this FO justify fielding QB wrecking offensive fronts.

[PurpleKoolaid]

You're right about Zimmer and the Vikings focusing on the defense. I even understand it to a point but I would understand it better if the offense wasn't so anemic. Why do the Vikings have half a team so often? Good defense, crippled offense. Great offense, no defense. We keep seeing variations of that.

Back to Norv, he has made some adaptations but not enough. I think he's still missing the boat with the passing game, which has been woefully lacking so far this season. I'm going to repeat what I've been saying, which is Turner's job is to make this offense work and provide a vision that puts points on the board. I know Bridgewater has fallen short on some things and I've been as critical as anyone about the OL's dreadful performance, but I still believe Norv could do smarter things with the passing game. And I believe some of the offense's limitations are directly a result of Turner's stubborn system.

Couldnt agree more.

[Mothman]

It's a solid point, Jim
I think the reason teams don't ever stop keying on AD as a threat to run is partly because of how ineffective he is in the passing game.

I honestly don't think that has anything to do with it. They don't stop keying on him because the passing game as a whole is an insufficient threat to draw attention away from him. He's the primary threat on offense. There's nobody else even close so defenses game plan to stop him first. If he was also a bigger part of the passing game, why would that lead teams to key on him less? To make that happen, other players need to become more significant threats.

Today being a big exception with the screen and a drop of what looked to be a sure TD. Then even Lynch lamented on AD's lack of just not having a natural ability to catch a football....not like a Faulk,LT, Forte etc., who are types of guys I'd rather have. I just think it makes it easier for the d to attack the (crappy)line and limits our offensive creativity.

I just don't buy it. That seems like misplaced blame. It would be great if AD had Faulk's ability as a receiver but he's not a significant limiting factor in the offense. There's plenty of room for offensive creativity with him in the lineup and even if he's not a natural in the passing game, he's still a legitimate receiving threat. He still has to be accounted for and defended as a receiver.

I also think his prowess in Yards after contact has helped this FO justify fielding QB wrecking offensive fronts.

That's entirely possible but if so, that's hardly a mark against him.

[The Breeze]

Well,I'm not trying to put marks against him. I merely saying the limits in his game allow me to view him as one dimentional...especially in the realm of greatest ever... and that there are several other backs I would prefer based how much more they can do at a high level. And interestingly enough most of them have rings too....primarily because the competant QB was the focal point of their offense.
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What was suggested above was that AD's dominance in terms of being the focus on the field, for both sides, possibly hinders the progress of a young QB.
I see the possibility, due to him being really easy to gameplan for...(bringing him down is an altogether different task)
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I'm not blaming Adrian for the way this team relies on him nor the fact the when he's in the game he's most likely going to run the ball, cause that's basically what he does well.
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I dispute the sentiment that AD is taking pressure off of TB. Because of the way this team is currently built and run and the subsequent way opposing defenses prepare for it, there is more pressure on TB IMO.
I'm certainly not blaming AD for that ,he is what he is.
And I am not looking to drive any kind of perception with my opinion or paint anyone in a negative light...just highlighting what I see as functional inefficiency.