Vikings Final Four Wins analysis (Ponder)

[Demi]

I am in Tjoke panic this year.

Which is more than fitting. Especially with this thread. Yet another QB that fans have to make excuses for in his wins. Because unlike good quarterbacks, the team wins those games despite him. Cassel could have been plugged in, won 10 games and got us to the playoffs. Or any other numbers of Ponder level average quarterbacks. And a few that could do better.

Even TJoke and Gus Frerotte got us 10 wins and a playoff #### whooping. Isn't it about time we expect just a little more out of our QBs than "don't screw up"? "Don't screw up" doesn't win super bowls...or playoff games...

I say that not to be a jerk but because you should also know the the definition of wether is: a castrated ram.

Bernie Kosar, is that you?

[PurpleKoolaid]

Wow, I was so sure there were 3 versions of whether. Positive. 1 for the weather, the other 2 for the same term, whether. I really should have looked it up before correcting someone else lol

[The Breeze]

Which is more than fitting. Especially with this thread. Yet another QB that fans have to make excuses for in his wins. Because unlike good quarterbacks, the team wins those games despite him. Cassel could have been plugged in, won 10 games and got us to the playoffs. Or any other numbers of Ponder level average quarterbacks. And a few that could do better.

Even TJoke and Gus Frerotte got us 10 wins and a playoff #### whooping. Isn't it about time we expect just a little more out of our QBs than "don't screw up"? "Don't screw up" doesn't win super bowls...or playoff games...



Bernie Kosar, is that you?

So, my friends uncle is an intern at a hospital in Branson, Missouri. Evidently a boy was just born there with a birthmark on his forehead that reads 'frAncHisE Qb'. His name is Brett Mannitas. Maybe you should jet on down there with your noodle-ometer and get some noodle numbers on his arm.....maybe check his S.I.T.H numbers while you're at it....you know, how long did it take him to get through the birth canal, was his footwork good and whatnot. A purple binkie as a gift would be a nice touch. If we sign him now we could just IR him for twenty years......I won't even be seventy yet by time he hits the field~

[Mothman]

Wow, I was so sure there were 3 versions of whether. Positive. 1 for the weather, the other 2 for the same term, whether. I really should have looked it up before correcting someone else lol

Hey, it led to us learning a new word to describe a castrated ram. Maybe we can use it the next time the Vikes play against St. Louis.

[Mothman]

So, my friends uncle is an intern at a hospital in Branson, Missouri. Evidently a boy was just born there with a birthmark on his forehead that reads 'frAncHisE Qb'. His name is Brett Mannitas. Maybe you should jet on down there with your noodle-ometer and get some noodle numbers on his arm.....maybe check his S.I.T.H numbers while you're at it....you know, how long did it take him to get through the birth canal, was his footwork good and whatnot. A purple binkie as a gift would be a nice touch. If we sign him now we could just IR him for twenty years......I won't even be seventy yet by time he hits the field~

[Funkytown]

Bernie Kosar, is that you?

Good work!

[Demi]

If we sign him now we could just IR him for twenty years......I won't even be seventy yet by time he hits the field~

Well, Fran hasn't played in 45 years. The last time we had a franchise QB, and judging by the scrubs like Tjoke and Ponder these geniuses keep trying to force into the role...20 years seems pretty darn optimistic.

Skol Vikings!

[The Breeze]

Well, Fran hasn't played in 45 years. The last time we had a franchise QB, and judging by the scrubs like Tjoke and Ponder these geniuses keep trying to force into the role...20 years seems pretty darn optimistic.

Skol Vikings!

Nah....if Ponder is not the guy (and I know your opinion on that) they will draft accordingly this offseason IMO. I would imagine that they draft a guy regardless, based on what the 3rd string spot looks like. What Ponder does or doesn't do will determine what round. I'm not convinced Ponder is a Harrington\Sanchez type.....but I've got faith in Spielman if it turns out that way. I know Spielman drafted CP, but he has hit on his picks more often than not thus far, and QB is a total crapshoot most of time anyway.

SKOL Vikings 2033!

[VikingHoard]

I don't know if it was your intention but you did a great job in reminding us how Ponder got way more credit for those 4 wins then he deserved! But you are right in that when we really needed him, he delivered in that final game in GB, and played one of his best games of the season.

However I see this very much as Costanza leaving the room after telling a funny joke, as that was one game versus several bad ones earlier in the year. And while I have suspended my doctrine to get rid of Ponder I am not ready to put faith in him yet that he will be the "good" version of Ponder from here on out. And I gotta tell ya, throwing a pick six on his second pass of the 1st preseason game did not make me feel better at all. I'll wait to see how he does in the REGULAR season Week 1 and the rest of the preseason, but not screwing up for 3 games and playing well in 1 last December is not enough to make up for all the sub-mediocre play from 2012.

I concur with all of this. The original post reads like "he didn't do much during the first two games but he didn't need to", to which I reply, yeah but he didn't do much. Not needing to put on a good QB performance is not the same as actually putting on a good QB performance. The third game reads as "He did decent, but it was against a great defense" which has a little more merit, but still we aren't talking about a great performance. Only the 4th of his last 4 games last year was impressive, and trying to extend that to all 4 of the last games is just a wishful rewriting of history.

[mondry]

I concur with all of this. The original post reads like "he didn't do much during the first two games but he didn't need to", to which I reply, yeah but he didn't do much. Not needing to put on a good QB performance is not the same as actually putting on a good QB performance. The third game reads as "He did decent, but it was against a great defense" which has a little more merit, but still we aren't talking about a great performance. Only the 4th of his last 4 games last year was impressive, and trying to extend that to all 4 of the last games is just a wishful rewriting of history.

Thanks for the reply, as the writer of the original post it's my fault if it did read like that and I apologize for that. It's not meant to be an excuse for Mr. Ponder or put him on a pedestal as having had great games. The main idea behind the post was to investigate HOW the VIKINGS won the last 4 games, and what the role Ponder played in it was. Upon further analysis, the simple truth of the matter is that it was more than less impossible for him to have a great performance in 3 of the 4 games, so you're exactly right in that he didn't "do much" however what he DID do was make the necessary plays for the team to succeed.

If you make one hand off to Adrian and he runs for an 82 yard touchdown (rams game) it's very hard to "shine" yourself. If Harrison Smith returns an INT for a touchdown and you're winning by 14 (chicago game) the coaches are going to want you to milk the clock. Same thing if the defense holds the other team to 6 points. (texans game)

The final game against Green Bay is the only time he had to go win the game himself, that's certainly true, but that isn't the significantly useful part of the story. It's the fact that in that situation, he flourished and ultimately won the game. Now, given all that, you may not be impressed with him and that's totally fine, aside from the green bay game he certainly didn't have to do much! The Vikings are that good!

[Reignman]

mondry, after reading your post, and as well researched and written as it was, I'm still not sure if it's a defense or an indictment.

- we simply weren't ever going to throw the ball much, it WASN'T needed.

- he can only do what the coaches ask and call the plays for.

- absolutely no reason to be aggressive in our passing game up by 20+ points for most of the game

- 212 yards by Adrian, AVERAGED 8.8 yards per carry, why exactly would we pass more?

- Complete domination by the defense holding the Texans to 6 points, Ponder did what he needed to do

- But again we aren't going to take risks with the game so thoroughly in hand.

- All in all each game looks to have Ponder doing what he has to, doing what the coaches asked of him.

- Any game plan the coaches, QB, and team can execute to get Peterson 30+ carries and 200+ yards for him is FINE BY ME.

- Once we're up big sure he doesn't pick up a lot more but I'm sorry folks, we have the best player in the NFL and he happens to play RB instead of QB so yes he's going to get the ball.

You're trying to say one thing, but your words are trying to say something else.

Good post, Mondry. Thanks for doing that research. A few additional notes from memory: I recall Ponder completing passes to convert significant third downs in the second half (probably the 4th quarter) of both the Bears and Texans games. That won't seem like much to determined naysayers

Determined? Lol good stuff. Come hell or high water I'm determined to remain a naysayer for no rational reason. You make it seem like a few 3rd down completions is something extraordinary. Exactly how low is the bar for Ponder?

Based on that shot lone, I'm not sure that play was much of a missed opportunity. It's hard to tell without context but in the still shot, it looks like the safety is already breaking on the receiver without a pass even in the air and it also looks like Ponder might have to throw across his body into the middle of the field

1st, you got the grammar down, now you need to work on your quoting, and 2nd it's official, I now believe you're trolling xD. Come on man, you take apologizing to a whole new level. Context or not, he missed that clear opportunity. I'm sure even Brady and Rodgers have missed ones like that a time or 2.

Isn't it about time we expect just a little more out of our QBs than "don't screw up"? "Don't screw up" doesn't win super bowls...or playoff games...

And here Demi pretty much sums up in 2 sentences what I've been trying to say in all my Ponder bashing posts combined.

The original post reads like "he didn't do much during the first two games but he didn't need to", to which I reply, yeah but he didn't do much. Not needing to put on a good QB performance is not the same as actually putting on a good QB performance. The third game reads as "He did decent, but it was against a great defense" which has a little more merit, but still we aren't talking about a great performance. Only the 4th of his last 4 games last year was impressive, and trying to extend that to all 4 of the last games is just a wishful rewriting of history.

Couldn't have said it better myself.

[mondry]

mondry, after reading your post, and as well researched and written as it was, I'm still not sure if it's a defense or an indictment.

Perfect, it's not meant to be either, in fact all I wanted to do is look into how the VIKINGS won their last 4 games and what Ponder did in them to help the team and see if it was reasonable for him to do "more" in which my findings were that in 3 of the 4 games his teammates ensured that it wasn't. Hopefully that helps.

[Raptorman]

Well, Fran hasn't played in 45 years. The last time we had a franchise QB, and judging by the scrubs like Tjoke and Ponder these geniuses keep trying to force into the role...20 years seems pretty darn optimistic.

Skol Vikings!

Culpepper had franchise QB stats but most wouldn't consider him to be one.

[Raptorman]

Hey, it led to us learning a new word to describe a castrated ram. Maybe we can use it the next time the Vikes play against St. Louis.

Or maybe a Packer game. "Rodgers is running around like a new wether out there today."

[Just Me]

Or maybe a Packer game. "Rodgers is running around like a new wether out there today."

As far as the Packer's game, the real question is: Whether the weather will affect that wether.