Vikings Message Board.Com

indianation65 wrote:As the metal ball pings from pong to pong to pong, it repeats. I don't believe forum members believe Ponder "can't" throw 40 yards down the field. The impression is that for some reason he won't, or rarely does; but alas, again, no receivers last year. With luck, this year will be vastly different. If not, it may be time to fortify a new Cassel!

...wisdom through opining

Boon wrote:
who in the sam hill? lol

Iowa.

Man the media has been ripping Ponder this off-season. None of them believe he will be here long. None of them think he will get any better. Most probably believe Cassel will take the spot at some point. It's sad really. I'm going to hop on the Ponder bandwagon. I think this season he will play with a big chip on his shoulder and prove everyone wrong. I might change my avi to Ponder....lol

Ponder is gonna lead us to a super bowl this season.... You heard it here first.

Mothman wrote:More minicamp/Ponder stuff (offered for what it's worth):
That second one was amusing.
As I posted earlier, it's June minicamp so I don't think this means any more than the negative stuff did but anyone concerned about the notes from yesterday may find some of the above encouraging.

What ... no "Ponder looking Sharp in Mini-camp" story on the front page of NFL.com like the one where he "wasn't looking sharp"?

Cliff wrote:What ... no "Ponder looking Sharp in Mini-camp" story on the front page of NFL.com like the one where he "wasn't looking sharp"?

I've read many posts on this site as well as others regarding Ponder and Cassell and I'm quite angry at all the negativeism hurled at both our QB's. Ponder and Cassell may not be Brees, Manning or Rodgers BUT they are our QB's and we as Viking fans should support them as much as possible. Knocking Ponder or Cassell is as ubiquitous as the scandals occuring in our government currently.

It's easy for most people who have never played football (I'm assuming most on this site and others) to criticize these players w/o knowing what players have to go through to get to this level, make the team and compete for a job.

Give it a rest, wait and see how the season, the team and both QB's progress instead of spewing more negative and critical comments!!

Kansas City had a dark cloud over it last year, on the field, in the stadium and in the locker room. When negativity begins, progresses and lingers, it can consume. That's what happened to them, and most teams that begin a season with several losses. The team, all NFL teams, are steeped with good players, but it's that skinned knee or sore throat that just won't heal. Cassel was stuck in that dark cloud with the rest of the team, and especially that locker room. I think he's a good quarterback and have high hopes for him. I lost Ponder confidence by mid season last year due to the constant short pass. I can't say I want several losses so that Cassel gets a chance, but I am a fan. No matter what happens, no tearing down of the Cassel from this corner. Ponder on the other hand, well, I do hope his chip has grown, and he'll come out firing! I'll be happy with a 6-0 start, well, okay, 5-1 will suffice, but that one loss will hurt.

Addendum: Living in cowboy's land, I can't tolerate any loss to Dallas, or gb! There better be 3 wins right there!

...wisdom

808vikingsfan wrote:Well, he did make the probowl with the Chiefs and he also led 2 different teams to the playoffs so that should mean something. He also went through a lot of offensive schemes and poor teams in KC so it's hard to tell how good he can really be. He has the size, he's still young, he's experienced, and he's very competitive. With a good supporting cast around him, i think he can be a 2nd tier QB. The one thing that worries me is he was injured a lot in KC.

I know what you're saying and I agree. However, Cassel received a lot of justifiable criticism during his 2009, 2011, and 2012 seasons. And now he's a backup QB. See the pattern? While injuries were a concern and could still be, it gets even more bothersome when one considers that injuries have been a concern for Ponder as well. Couple that with the fact that both these guys have been streaky in their performances. Are either of these two guys what the Vikings need at QB? I don't know yet. All I'm saying is that I wouldn't bet the farm that Cassel is the Vikings QB of the future, even if Ponder flunks out.

808vikingsfan wrote:If Ponder looks sharp in training and preseason, by all means, start him. I just don't like the idea of just handing him the job.

I think because the Vikings are trying to develop him, Ponder will probably start this year if he looks to be making progress. That's not getting the job handed to hm. OTOH, if he makes a mess of things, then Cassel will probably get a chance and we'll get to see if he's all that or, as I suspect, he really is a backup QB at this point in his career.

Worst case scenario is if the Viking discover they have nothing but backup QBs on their roster.

GBFavreFan wrote:Unless an injury occurs Christian Ponder will start at least through September, however I don't think thread is complete fantasy. I don't know if its the same one that spawned this thread, but I did read an article about this and it was based on their performances in mini-camp/OTA's. Of course they won't change the QB starter based on that, but this could possibly foreshadow some issues depending how training camp and the pre-season goes. Again, I don't think the starter in Week 1 changes no matter what, but the more Cassel outperforms Ponder before September, the more heat will be on Ponder. Ponder has not yet cemented this status as the long-term starter, so I think its legit to examine the possibility of a QB controversy. We won't really have enough evidence to debate things at this point, but as the thick of summer rolls in it'll be interesting to see what happens!

A QB controversy seems inevitable because there are segments of both the media and fanbase that clearly want one. Ponder will have to play at a phenomenal level to shut that stuff down.

MV711 wrote:I've read many posts on this site as well as others regarding Ponder and Cassell and I'm quite angry at all the negativeism hurled at both our QB's. Ponder and Cassell may not be Brees, Manning or Rodgers BUT they are our QB's and we as Viking fans should support them as much as possible. Knocking Ponder or Cassell is as ubiquitous as the scandals occuring in our government currently.

It's easy for most people who have never played football (I'm assuming most on this site and others) to criticize these players w/o knowing what players have to go through to get to this level, make the team and compete for a job.

Give it a rest, wait and see how the season, the team and both QB's progress instead of spewing more negative and critical comments!!

I agree. I was stating in another Ponder thread on how the team has to be patient if they want Ponder to improve. Not every QB can come out right away and start throwing like Tom Brady. Plus Ponder was thrown into the fire his rookie year with no rookie minicamp or anything. But each year it seems like Ponder is progressing. He's not getting any worse, the sky is the limit for him.

I think the offense will be less rushing focused than last year given all the investments they've made in pass catchers over the past 2 years. However, this team still features #28 as the marquee player, so my guess is that such a shift will be relatively small in the grand scheme of things.

That being said, I think the coaching staff is looking for efficient and effective passing. I'll take 200 yard games with very low turnovers if AP is putting up 150 yards a game. My guess is they'll win 90% of the games where they put up that range of stats, even with the media barking non-stop about QB mediocrity.

This team is still built to play power football and win TOP. I think it has become more explosive in the offseason, but unless Ponder has a monster season, I don't see them getting too far away from the winning formula of feeding the beast.

Seifert's take.

On the state of Christian Ponder's progress
http://espn.go.com/blog/nfcnorth/post/_ ... s-progress

"I love his personality," Jennings said. "I love his demeanor on the field. The one thing we talk about, and I've shared with him more than anything, is the trust factor. Because he has everything he needs. He has all the tangibles. He has the skill set. He has it. It's just about trusting the other guy, whether that other guy is Kyle, myself, [Jerome Simpson], across the board. It's just about trust: That we're going to be where he knows we should be. And us trusting that he's going to have the ball where we know it should be. That's the one thing that kind if takes that split second off of our timing. Other than that, once we develop that trust and that comfort, sky's the limit."

dead_poet wrote:Seifert's take.

On the state of Christian Ponder's progress
http://espn.go.com/blog/nfcnorth/post/_ ... s-progress

Thanks for the link. That's a pretty fair, measured take from Siefert and I'm glad he qualified a few comments by saying nobody is perfect.

I found Frazier's comments encouraging. As Siefert pointed out, they're what you'd expect from an optimistic coach but it sounds like he saw progress and progress is the best we can expect.

I think we need to have realistic expectations about Ponder and just what might constitute turning the corner for him this season. If he's going to become a really good NFL starter, I suspect that will still be part of a gradual process and we won't see him suddenly emerge from the development "cocoon" as a full-blown star QB. If he can gradually develop the trust Jennings' talked about, improve the consistency of his throws and decision-making, etc. then by the end of the season he may put a lot of doubts to rest but I have no doubt it will be a bumpy ride at times.

I loved this line:

Even as the national media hovers and waits for controversy with new backup Matt Cassel, I'm certain that the Vikings will take Ponder's good along with the bad.

That hits the nail on the head!

Good article. When he was in the top 10 (statistically for QBs) the Vikes were 7-1. The scary part was when he was "off" (Vikes went 3-5) he was 34th! (Holy cow! 3 Back-ups were better?!?)

I think the "good" with the "bad" is a good analogy here. Let's hope we're edging towards the majority of his games being "good" and the "bad" games are diminishing. Call me crazy, but I think that's what we are going to see this year...

Mothman wrote:I think we need to have realistic expectations about Ponder and just what might constitute turning the corner for him this season. If he's going to become a really good NFL starter, I suspect that will still be part of a gradual process and we won't see him suddenly emerge from the development "cocoon" as a full-blown star QB. If he can gradually develop the trust Jennings' talked about, improve the consistency of his throws and decision-making, etc. then by the end of the season he may put a lot of doubts to rest but I have no doubt it will be a bumpy ride at times.

I loved this line:
That hits the nail on the head!

As long as the good outweighs the bad, which both Pelissero and Zulgad said they thought was the case for Ponder during the last OTA day.

I found it interesting that Pelissero and Zulgad feel that Ponder's problems (when he has them) have to do with confidence and the mental part of the game. Not that Ponder is stupid but they believe he gets inside his own head and actually thinks too much during plays, complicating things, which causes hesitations and forced plays. This might also touch on some of the "trust" issues that Greg Jennings has mentioned regarding Ponder in articles. Ponder needs to trust the guys around him and trust himself instead of running variables through his head during plays.