Vikings Message Board.Com

S197 wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:34 pm That's the kind of trade that can kill franchises. Especially for a pass rusher, I mean how many in the past decade have made that much of an impact to help a team become a contender? Von Miller? Even Mack wasn't enough to make the Bears a contender and he's a wrecking ball.

Young looks good but not generationally good. He could be another Clowney which simply isn't enough for the draft capital given up.

S197 wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:34 pm That's the kind of trade that can kill franchises. Especially for a pass rusher, I mean how many in the past decade have made that much of an impact to help a team become a contender? Von Miller? Even Mack wasn't enough to make the Bears a contender and he's a wrecking ball.

Young looks good but not generationally good. He could be another Clowney which simply isn't enough for the draft capital given up.

fiestavike wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 5:28 pm

S197 wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:34 pm That's the kind of trade that can kill franchises. Especially for a pass rusher, I mean how many in the past decade have made that much of an impact to help a team become a contender? Von Miller? Even Mack wasn't enough to make the Bears a contender and he's a wrecking ball.

Young looks good but not generationally good. He could be another Clowney which simply isn't enough for the draft capital given up.

If I'm trading up to 2 its for Herbert or Tua, or possibly to trade back with the Chargers and collect more picks.

Pondering Her Percy wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 6:17 am

cmoss84 wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 12:50 am What are the chances things get crazy during draft week? Like, crazy crazy?
Like:
1) Dalvin gets traded. No extension. Vikes decide to invest elsewhere. Either goes to Bucs or Seachickens. We get a 1st rd pick.
2) We trade Reiff, and a 4th for Mr. Williams. 4/56 million extension.
3) Harris is traded for a 2nd and a 4th. No extension.
4) Swift...who's comp is...Cook...gets drafted with one of our 3 1st rd picks.

Semi-rebuild, semi-competitive moves.

At this point. you might as well trade the whole team away. I’m a hard no on trading cook and Harris

RandyMoss84 wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 9:06 pm

Pondering Her Percy wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 6:17 am

At this point. you might as well trade the whole team away. I’m a hard no on trading cook and Harris

Why a hard no on Cook? Cook can not stay healthy so I do not mind trading Cook, Mattison can replace Cook

Pondering Her Percy wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 9:49 pm

RandyMoss84 wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 9:06 pm

Why a hard no on Cook? Cook can not stay healthy so I do not mind trading Cook, Mattison can replace Cook

How do you know Mattison can replace Cook? Can Mattison stay healthy? He missed 3 games this year. Cook only missed 2 games and had 150 more carries and 43 more receptions. For a grand total for 193 more touches than Mattison. And Mattison missed more time. But Cook gets hurt his first two years in the league, proves how dominant he can be this year, shows us his true potential and now we should let him go?

If a RB is missing 1-2 games a year, I would say that's staying pretty healthy given the nature of the position. Cook has only done that once. But he blew his knee out. It wasnt a soft tissue injury that hampers other players. Do you know how many guys in this league have blown their knee out and still come back at a high level? Peterson is just one example.

Dalvin Cook has missed 7 games in the last two years at a position that takes much more of a beating.
Diggs missed 4 games in the last 2 years
Thielen missed 6 games in the last 2 years.

Lets say Diggs never went down cry baby road and had a similar demeanor as Thielen. Nobody would be talking about trading Diggs or Thielen. Hell, some people still think it was dumb that we traded Diggs cry baby or not. But we're going to say, yeah lets trade Dalvin Cook? Cook is the heart and soul of this offense IMO. We can have success without Diggs, we can have success without Thielen. I dont think we can have success without Cook unless Mattison could somehow take over a full role and stay healthy but he's done nothing more than Cook has to prove that yet.

I have a hard time ever buying into "injury prone" labels. Look at Rudy for example. Everyone labeled him as that. He missed 16 games in his first 4 years. Cook would have to miss 9 games this coming year to even match that total. However in the last 5 years, Rudy hasnt missed a single game.

VikingsVictorious wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 9:53 pm

Pondering Her Percy wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 9:49 pm

How do you know Mattison can replace Cook? Can Mattison stay healthy? He missed 3 games this year. Cook only missed 2 games and had 150 more carries and 43 more receptions. For a grand total for 193 more touches than Mattison. And Mattison missed more time. But Cook gets hurt his first two years in the league, proves how dominant he can be this year, shows us his true potential and now we should let him go?

If a RB is missing 1-2 games a year, I would say that's staying pretty healthy given the nature of the position. Cook has only done that once. But he blew his knee out. It wasnt a soft tissue injury that hampers other players. Do you know how many guys in this league have blown their knee out and still come back at a high level? Peterson is just one example.

Dalvin Cook has missed 7 games in the last two years at a position that takes much more of a beating.
Diggs missed 4 games in the last 2 years
Thielen missed 6 games in the last 2 years.

Lets say Diggs never went down cry baby road and had a similar demeanor as Thielen. Nobody would be talking about trading Diggs or Thielen. Hell, some people still think it was dumb that we traded Diggs cry baby or not. But we're going to say, yeah lets trade Dalvin Cook? Cook is the heart and soul of this offense IMO. We can have success without Diggs, we can have success without Thielen. I dont think we can have success without Cook unless Mattison could somehow take over a full role and stay healthy but he's done nothing more than Cook has to prove that yet.

I have a hard time ever buying into "injury prone" labels. Look at Rudy for example. Everyone labeled him as that. He missed 16 games in his first 4 years. Cook would have to miss 9 games this coming year to even match that total. However in the last 5 years, Rudy hasnt missed a single game.

You make great points PHP, but if you were the Vikings GM how much would you be willing to pay Cooks on a 4 year extension?

VikingsVictorious wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 9:53 pm

Pondering Her Percy wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 9:49 pm

How do you know Mattison can replace Cook? Can Mattison stay healthy? He missed 3 games this year. Cook only missed 2 games and had 150 more carries and 43 more receptions. For a grand total for 193 more touches than Mattison. And Mattison missed more time. But Cook gets hurt his first two years in the league, proves how dominant he can be this year, shows us his true potential and now we should let him go?

If a RB is missing 1-2 games a year, I would say that's staying pretty healthy given the nature of the position. Cook has only done that once. But he blew his knee out. It wasnt a soft tissue injury that hampers other players. Do you know how many guys in this league have blown their knee out and still come back at a high level? Peterson is just one example.

Dalvin Cook has missed 7 games in the last two years at a position that takes much more of a beating.
Diggs missed 4 games in the last 2 years
Thielen missed 6 games in the last 2 years.

Lets say Diggs never went down cry baby road and had a similar demeanor as Thielen. Nobody would be talking about trading Diggs or Thielen. Hell, some people still think it was dumb that we traded Diggs cry baby or not. But we're going to say, yeah lets trade Dalvin Cook? Cook is the heart and soul of this offense IMO. We can have success without Diggs, we can have success without Thielen. I dont think we can have success without Cook unless Mattison could somehow take over a full role and stay healthy but he's done nothing more than Cook has to prove that yet.

I have a hard time ever buying into "injury prone" labels. Look at Rudy for example. Everyone labeled him as that. He missed 16 games in his first 4 years. Cook would have to miss 9 games this coming year to even match that total. However in the last 5 years, Rudy hasnt missed a single game.

You make great points PHP, but if you were the Vikings GM how much would you be willing to pay Cooks on a 4 year extension?

fiestavike wrote: ↑Fri Apr 10, 2020 4:44 am

VikingsVictorious wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 9:53 pm
You make great points PHP, but if you were the Vikings GM how much would you be willing to pay Cooks on a 4 year extension?

No more than 7 million a year, if he wants guaranteed money. If its a year to year deal with zero guaranteed, I might give him 10. I suspect he would not even consider either of those offers.

Pondering Her Percy wrote: ↑Fri Apr 10, 2020 6:23 am

VikingsVictorious wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 9:53 pm
You make great points PHP, but if you were the Vikings GM how much would you be willing to pay Cooks on a 4 year extension?

I would say $11-13 million. I don’t think he’s going to be asking for zeke money or to be the highest paid back. But I have zero problem extending him. I think we need to extend him to be honest. Mattison looks to be solid but he’s been in the league 1 year and missed 3 games. Cook took on almost 200 more touches and was able to play in more games. Point is, mattison is far from a guarantee to stay healthy and be able to take on a load.

VikingsVictorious wrote: ↑Fri Apr 10, 2020 6:37 am

fiestavike wrote: ↑Fri Apr 10, 2020 4:44 am

No more than 7 million a year, if he wants guaranteed money. If its a year to year deal with zero guaranteed, I might give him 10. I suspect he would not even consider either of those offers.

I know it seems strange, but as one of the best if not the best RBs in the game we must understand how insulting those numbers would seem.

cmoss84 wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 12:50 am What are the chances things get crazy during draft week? Like, crazy crazy?
Like:
1) Dalvin gets traded. No extension. Vikes decide to invest elsewhere. Either goes to Bucs or Seachickens. We get a 1st rd pick.
2) We trade Reiff, and a 4th for Mr. Williams. 4/56 million extension.
3) Harris is traded for a 2nd and a 4th. No extension.
4) Swift...who's comp is...Cook...gets drafted with one of our 3 1st rd picks.

Semi-rebuild, semi-competitive moves.

VikingsVictorious wrote: ↑Fri Apr 10, 2020 6:39 am

Pondering Her Percy wrote: ↑Fri Apr 10, 2020 6:23 am

I would say $11-13 million. I don’t think he’s going to be asking for zeke money or to be the highest paid back. But I have zero problem extending him. I think we need to extend him to be honest. Mattison looks to be solid but he’s been in the league 1 year and missed 3 games. Cook took on almost 200 more touches and was able to play in more games. Point is, mattison is far from a guarantee to stay healthy and be able to take on a load.

I still think it would take the $13 million you are stated at a minimum. With a reasonable part of it guaranteed.

StumpHunter wrote: ↑Fri Apr 10, 2020 7:20 am

cmoss84 wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 12:50 am What are the chances things get crazy during draft week? Like, crazy crazy?
Like:
1) Dalvin gets traded. No extension. Vikes decide to invest elsewhere. Either goes to Bucs or Seachickens. We get a 1st rd pick.
2) We trade Reiff, and a 4th for Mr. Williams. 4/56 million extension.
3) Harris is traded for a 2nd and a 4th. No extension.
4) Swift...who's comp is...Cook...gets drafted with one of our 3 1st rd picks.

Semi-rebuild, semi-competitive moves.

I am okay with trading Cook and Harris, but a 1st seems unlikely for Cook. I don't know if their is a running back who could get a 1st and a big pay day out there. Henry maybe could, but I am not sure if there is another.

cmoss84 wrote: ↑Fri Apr 10, 2020 2:10 pm

StumpHunter wrote: ↑Fri Apr 10, 2020 7:20 am

I am okay with trading Cook and Harris, but a 1st seems unlikely for Cook. I don't know if their is a running back who could get a 1st and a big pay day out there. Henry maybe could, but I am not sure if there is another.

Fair point. The 2 teams I brought up: Bucs...going all in with Brady. Maybe they give us a 2nd and a 3rd. Maybe we give them a 4th and take the 14th overall pick (side question: which of those deals would you rather have w/Bucs?)
Sea...Seems like a Sea move. Their 1st is a late one.
Any other potential suitors? KC for #32 pick?