Vikings Message Board.Com

Posted: **Sat Apr 06, 2024 6:45 pm**

VikingsVictorious wrote: ↑Sat Apr 06, 2024 5:37 pm
Tommy TarkenKapp wrote: ↑Sat Apr 06, 2024 4:02 pm

He'll play this year & hit free agency next year. I suspect we'd try to trade him for some good draft picks instead of have him hit free agency. I saw the Bills traded Stefon Diggs & just had deja vu feeling. Jefferson doesn't seem like a malcontent. He's appears to be a great kid. I would never compare him to Diggs personality-wise.

But, seeing Buffalo trade Diggs got me to thinking. I try not to do that as I'm not a critical thinker like Aaron Rodgers. But, anyhow...I can't imagine Buffalo viewing themselves as non-contenders & maybe doing a soft reset. Why let their top two WRs go? Do they have something in the works? Tee Higgins? It's a deep WR class but do you really want to put your eggs in the rookie WR basket?

Could the Bills swing another deal for a Vikings WR? I know KAM has said the standard things any GM would say about the Jefferson extension situation. "We want to keep Jefferson in Minnesota." "We're not interested in trading Justin Jefferson". "Blah, blah blah". Well, they said all those nice things about wanting Kirk to remain a Viking. They said they wanted Cousins back but they really didn't. Not at his asking price anyhow. They probably made a respectable offer that they knew he would turn down.

As for Jefferson...what's the sticking point. I'd love for Jefferson to stay. But, I agree with a lot of posters in this thread. WRs are not the centerpiece of an NFL team. When was the primary reason an NFL team won a championship because they had the best & highest paid WR? Never. Get multiple picks from a team now if an agreement can't be reached. Preferably an AFC team.
This is a change. Didn't you start out saying Jefferson would never play for us again? I'd probably be OK with a Jefferson for Josh Allen trade. What would be fun is trading Jefferson to the Bengals for Higgins and 3 FRPs. Last time I can think of a WR being the main reason a team won Super Bowls was Jerry Rice. He was more important than Montana.

I meant that if they don't come to an agreement on an extension that Jefferson will most likely be traded. As for your take on Rice & Montana. I strongly disagree. Montana & the 49ers won two Super Bowls & were contenders for a lot of years before Rice arrived. How many Super Bowls did the 49ers win with Rice after Montana was no longer their QB? One with Steve Young. Another Hall of Famer.

It's just too hard for a WR carry a team to a Super Bowl. They'll always need a capable QB to throw them ball. Hell, we've probably seen the last of a dominant rushing team & stout defense carry a team to the Super Bowl.

And I do want to clarify. I really want Jefferson to remain a Viking. He's so much damn fun to watch. I've re-watched the 2022 season three times. I'll really miss the Cousins to Jefferson combo. 2022 was a fun year. Even though it didn't end the way I would have liked. Which based on the teams shortcomings...I would have been satisfied with a win in the Wild Card Game & a respectable showing in the Divisional round.

Posted: **Sat Apr 06, 2024 8:25 pm**

Tommy TarkenKapp wrote: ↑Sat Apr 06, 2024 6:45 pm
VikingsVictorious wrote: ↑Sat Apr 06, 2024 5:37 pm

This is a change. Didn't you start out saying Jefferson would never play for us again? I'd probably be OK with a Jefferson for Josh Allen trade. What would be fun is trading Jefferson to the Bengals for Higgins and 3 FRPs. Last time I can think of a WR being the main reason a team won Super Bowls was Jerry Rice. He was more important than Montana.
I meant that if they don't come to an agreement on an extension that Jefferson will most likely be traded. As for your take on Rice & Montana. I strongly disagree. Montana & the 49ers won two Super Bowls & were contenders for a lot of years before Rice arrived. How many Super Bowls did the 49ers win with Rice after Montana was no longer their QB? One with Steve Young. Another Hall of Famer.

It's just too hard for a WR carry a team to a Super Bowl. They'll always need a capable QB to throw them ball. Hell, we've probably seen the last of a dominant rushing team & stout defense carry a team to the Super Bowl.

And I do want to clarify. I really want Jefferson to remain a Viking. He's so much damn fun to watch. I've re-watched the 2022 season three times. I'll really miss the Cousins to Jefferson combo. 2022 was a fun year. Even though it didn't end the way I would have liked. Which based on the teams shortcomings...I would have been satisfied with a win in the Wild Card Game & a respectable showing in the Divisional round.

In Fantasy Football Jerry Rice led far more teams to championships than Joe Montana

. IMO if Rice hadn't come along Montana's Super Bowls would have ended. As you mentioned the QB changed and Rice continued to win another Super Bowl. Honestly I don't know who was more important.

Posted: **Sun Apr 07, 2024 9:09 am**

They can franchise him for two seasons if they really want as well. Granted that still results in the player being traded most of the times, or no long term deal reached. They can control him for this season (final of rookie deal), and two more, if they wanted though.

Posted: **Tue Apr 09, 2024 11:36 pm**

VikingsVictorious wrote: ↑Sat Apr 06, 2024 5:37 pm
Tommy TarkenKapp wrote: ↑Sat Apr 06, 2024 4:02 pm

He'll play this year & hit free agency next year. I suspect we'd try to trade him for some good draft picks instead of have him hit free agency. I saw the Bills traded Stefon Diggs & just had deja vu feeling. Jefferson doesn't seem like a malcontent. He's appears to be a great kid. I would never compare him to Diggs personality-wise.

But, seeing Buffalo trade Diggs got me to thinking. I try not to do that as I'm not a critical thinker like Aaron Rodgers. But, anyhow...I can't imagine Buffalo viewing themselves as non-contenders & maybe doing a soft reset. Why let their top two WRs go? Do they have something in the works? Tee Higgins? It's a deep WR class but do you really want to put your eggs in the rookie WR basket?

Could the Bills swing another deal for a Vikings WR? I know KAM has said the standard things any GM would say about the Jefferson extension situation. "We want to keep Jefferson in Minnesota." "We're not interested in trading Justin Jefferson". "Blah, blah blah". Well, they said all those nice things about wanting Kirk to remain a Viking. They said they wanted Cousins back but they really didn't. Not at his asking price anyhow. They probably made a respectable offer that they knew he would turn down.

As for Jefferson...what's the sticking point. I'd love for Jefferson to stay. But, I agree with a lot of posters in this thread. WRs are not the centerpiece of an NFL team. When was the primary reason an NFL team won a championship because they had the best & highest paid WR? Never. Get multiple picks from a team now if an agreement can't be reached. Preferably an AFC team.
This is a change. Didn't you start out saying Jefferson would never play for us again? I'd probably be OK with a Jefferson for Josh Allen trade. What would be fun is trading Jefferson to the Bengals for Higgins and 3 FRPs. Last time I can think of a WR being the main reason a team won Super Bowls was Jerry Rice. He was more important than Montana.

A Jefferson for Josh Allen trade straight up would be SCRUMPTIOUS. But won’t happen. I’d even go Jefferson plus 2 Vikings FRPs for Allen. (Keep in mind the value of a FRP could easily equate to Lewis Cine). And the Jefferson for Higgins plus 3 FRPs would be so tasty, but won’t happen. I’d even go Jefferson for Higgins and 2 FRPs. So the question isn’t should they trade Jefferson now for picks… it’s WHICH picks. Substantiate your claim. If you’d trade him, then for what specifically?

I just watched the Kevin Hart “cold as balls” thing on YouTube and he had Jefferson on. I had forgotten that for all Jefferson’s production, the KID is still 24 years old.

I say… make him the highest paid WR on a 4 year contract and draft a QB that can deliver him the ball. And if things don’t work out you can always trade him in 2 years at the ripe geriatric age of TWENTY SIX for, likely, a FRP and more.

Posted: **Tue Apr 09, 2024 11:53 pm**

I just looked up the Davonte Adams trade. Adams is 31, was traded 2 years ago for a 1st AND 2nd rd pick at age 29. (I’m drinking and might be off by a few months with my math cause I didn’t feel like looking up his birthday to the month). But Adams drew a 1st and second at age 29. If the Vikings throw the Benjamin’s at Jefferson as they should, then I have to imagine they can trade him after 2 or 3 years for multiple FRP’s if needed at age 26 or 27.

I can’t stand the packers… I still can’t stand Rodgers, he’s a weirdo. I like Favre, obviously, even without his tenure in Minnesota. But I HAVE to respect the general managing of player personnel in Green Bay. They went straight from Favre to Rodgers. Now they have Love who is, at the very least, feasible. (Though I certainly don’t think he will be the next Favre/Rodgers).

Kwesi should’ve protected the present AND future simultaneously, but he didn’t. Could’ve had Maye/Penix sitting behind Cousins for a year or 2 and developing in to a dynasty level QB.

Posted: **Wed Apr 10, 2024 6:56 am**

BeforeIDie wrote: ↑Tue Apr 09, 2024 11:53 pm
Kwesi should’ve protected the present AND future simultaneously, but he didn’t. Could’ve had Maye/Penix sitting behind Cousins for a year or 2 and developing in to a dynasty level QB.

You'd pay Cousins 180m over 4 years and only start him 1 or 2 years?

Posted: **Thu Apr 11, 2024 6:48 am**

Cliff wrote: ↑Wed Apr 10, 2024 6:56 am
BeforeIDie wrote: ↑Tue Apr 09, 2024 11:53 pm
Kwesi should’ve protected the present AND future simultaneously, but he didn’t. Could’ve had Maye/Penix sitting behind Cousins for a year or 2 and developing in to a dynasty level QB.
You'd pay Cousins 180m over 4 years and only start him 1 or 2 years?

I would have been happy if Cousins’ last Vikings extension was longer, and would have been cheaper at that time. Now IF Kwesi had brought in some real potential simmering behind Cousins for the last 2 years… that would be a different story. You’d have us go 6-11 with Darnold for the sake of saving someone else’s money?

Posted: **Thu Apr 11, 2024 8:58 am**

I can understand the angst. JJ hasn't signed an extension. It seems like an absolute no-brainer to get him signed. What's the holdup?

To perhaps calm some fears, let's look at this historically, with respect to how the Vikings have handled contract extensions for their biggest stars.

• TJ Hockenson signed his extension in late August of last year.
• Brian O'Neill signed his extension in September of 2021
• Harrison Smith signed his latest extension in August of 2021
• Dalvin Cook signed his last Vikings extension in September of 2020
• Danielle Hunter signed extensions in June of 2018 and July of 2023
• Stefon Diggs signed his last Vikings extension in July of 2017

The point being ... the Vikings rarely do extensions in the spring. Kirk Cousins was the notable exception, but that was for the same reason they do restructures (not extensions) early in the year ... to get under the cap by the first day of the new league year. Every Cousins extension also was a restructure for cap relief. This is simply the way the Vikings do things, and it's been this way for probably as long as Rob Brzezinski has been in charge of contracts, which is 23 years now. Right now, they're concentrating on the draft.

The fact that Justin Jefferson hasn't signed a contract extension by the second week of April should be of little or no concern to anybody. Maybe, MAYBE we have the right to be a little nervous on draft night, but I doubt it. And if a trade hasn't happened by the time the Vikings have made their first-round pick, then it's not going to happen.

I am 99.9999% sure the Vikings will get an extension done for Justin Jefferson over the summer ... just as they have for a long time.

Posted: **Thu Apr 11, 2024 9:10 am**

BeforeIDie wrote: ↑Thu Apr 11, 2024 6:48 am
Cliff wrote: ↑Wed Apr 10, 2024 6:56 am

You'd pay Cousins 180m over 4 years and only start him 1 or 2 years?
I would have been happy if Cousins’ last Vikings extension was longer, and would have been cheaper at that time. Now IF Kwesi had brought in some real potential simmering behind Cousins for the last 2 years… that would be a different story. You’d have us go 6-11 with Darnold for the sake of saving someone else’s money?

So much speculation.

To start with you don't know what Cousins was or wasn't willing to do. For all we know it was his idea to only extend it one year and test free agency as a business move after. You have no idea if they'll go 6-11 with Darnold or if he'll even start. I could just as easily say they'll go 12-5 with Darnold or a rookie will start instead and our guesses are worth about the same.

As far as the team strategy, it seems like a "rock and a hard place" kind of situation. It's my understanding that they went *hard* to move up and get a QB last year but couldn't get the deal done. Levis happened to work out but would have been a reach at 23 and the Vikings didn't have a 2nd round pick.

It seems the original plan is what you want (and of course is ideal) for a rookie to sit behind Cousins last year. But it didn't work out. That's life sometimes. At some point you have to rip the Band-Aid off with Cousins ready or not. He's not the future and his cap hit is too much to justify stretching it over 4 years with his age and after that injury.

If there was no salary cap I wouldn't care at all. Pay Kirk 200m per year.

Posted: **Thu Apr 11, 2024 9:28 am**

BeforeIDie wrote: ↑Thu Apr 11, 2024 6:48 am
Cliff wrote: ↑Wed Apr 10, 2024 6:56 am

You'd pay Cousins 180m over 4 years and only start him 1 or 2 years?
I would have been happy if Cousins’ last Vikings extension was longer, and would have been cheaper at that time. Now IF Kwesi had brought in some real potential simmering behind Cousins for the last 2 years… that would be a different story. You’d have us go 6-11 with Darnold for the sake of saving someone else’s money?

It isn't just about someone else's money. There's a salary cap.

Posted: **Thu Apr 11, 2024 1:43 pm**

makila wrote: ↑Thu Apr 11, 2024 9:28 am
BeforeIDie wrote: ↑Thu Apr 11, 2024 6:48 am

I would have been happy if Cousins’ last Vikings extension was longer, and would have been cheaper at that time. Now IF Kwesi had brought in some real potential simmering behind Cousins for the last 2 years… that would be a different story. You’d have us go 6-11 with Darnold for the sake of saving someone else’s money?
It isn't just about someone else's money. There's a salary cap.

I’m aware there’s a salary cap. But the weight of the QB position dictates that you may have to sacrifice in other areas. You don’t skimp at QB. Darnold is skimping. You know why this year’s draft is so exciting? Cause it’s all we have.

Posted: **Thu Apr 11, 2024 5:18 pm**

BeforeIDie wrote: ↑Thu Apr 11, 2024 1:43 pm
makila wrote: ↑Thu Apr 11, 2024 9:28 am

It isn't just about someone else's money. There's a salary cap.
I’m aware there’s a salary cap. But the weight of the QB position dictates that you may have to sacrifice in other areas. You don’t skimp at QB. Darnold is skimping. You know why this year’s draft is so exciting? Cause it’s all we have.

Or, build out a roster and try to find a qb on a rookie scale deal. There's more than one approach. All have to operate under the cap though, regardless who pays the bill.

We haven't skimped at qb since 2018. How'd that approach work out?

I find the draft exciting every year, as its how new talent is added across the board to the nfl.

Posted: **Thu Apr 11, 2024 10:42 pm**

makila wrote: ↑Thu Apr 11, 2024 5:18 pm
BeforeIDie wrote: ↑Thu Apr 11, 2024 1:43 pm

I’m aware there’s a salary cap. But the weight of the QB position dictates that you may have to sacrifice in other areas. You don’t skimp at QB. Darnold is skimping. You know why this year’s draft is so exciting? Cause it’s all we have.
Or, build out a roster and try to find a qb on a rookie scale deal. There's more than one approach. All have to operate under the cap though, regardless who pays the bill.

That’s what I’M saying. Except it’s not a plethora of intentional choices… rather choices out of necessity due to poor planning. Here’s what we have…
A.) maybe Darnold will capture lightning in a bottle (I hope he does, I also hope I win the lottery - but I wouldn’t put too many eggs in those baskets).
B.) hope that we land on a QB while ALSO being careful not to throw him in to the deep end of the pool too early.
C.) call this season a WASH aka a “building” year. Seems like the likely scenario here.
D.) the wild card… maybe trade for Herbie or Kyler or something unlikely and unforeseen.

We haven't skimped at qb since 2018. How'd that approach work out?

You can’t get on base if you don’t swing the bat. We swung and struck out with Cousins. But we also had a chance. You also can’t get on base if you never step up to the plate. Which feels like what the Vikes are doing with 2024. It’s either start Darnold or throw a rook out there prematurely. Didn’t have to be that way.

But now I’m just crying over spilt milk, and I’m a glass half full guy. So I’ll stop my whining. Just have to get the poison out sometimes.

I find the draft exciting every year, as its how new talent is added across the board to the nfl.

Posted: **Thu Apr 11, 2024 10:45 pm**

I messed up the structure of my last post. Not very good with technology. And I’m only 35!

Posted: **Fri Apr 12, 2024 8:58 am**

BeforeIDie wrote: ↑Thu Apr 11, 2024 10:45 pm I messed up the structure of my last post. Not very good with technology. And I’m only 35!

It's not really "technology", it's just a tag system. Image links go between an image tag, quotes go between a quote tag, to bold text it goes between the bold tag, etc.

It's pretty simple but I could see some confusion if you're not used to it. Message Boards like this have mostly been replaced with social media.

If you want to respond to individual parts of a post you need a quote tag around each place you want the other person's quote to stop. Then write your text, then put their next section in quotes, and so on.

There is also a preview button you can use to check what your post will look like before you post.

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