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Re: Cousins Extended
Posted: Sun Mar 13, 2022 9:25 pm
by 40for60
There’s a lot we don’t know. Did they get nothing in trade talks? Are the Wilfs thinking Kirk has to be kept? Are KAM and KOC convinced they can win with Kirk? They are so far away from a championship I would feel better if they traded him for a bag of footballs if a team would take on his salary. And the worst part is he has a no trade clause. So the new regime is betting half of their contracts on Kirk. Plus if/when you draft a new QB it takes a couple of years usually for that to work out. And Kirk said something like “now let’s go get the Lombardi trophy”… Dokay.
Re: Cousins Extended
Posted: Sun Mar 13, 2022 9:29 pm
by 40for60
StumpHunter wrote: ↑Sun Mar 13, 2022 9:21 pm
J. Kapp 11 wrote: ↑Sun Mar 13, 2022 8:29 pm
I am man enough to say it.
I. Was. Wrong.
Did not see this coming. Not at all. But now I’m seeing images of KOC with his signed Kirk Cousins Redskins jersey in a shadow box (wait … I can’t say the “R” word, can I?), complete with a note calling KOC the best coach ever in the whole wide world. I guess KOC wasn’t kidding. He really does like Kirk.
What stuns me is that Cousins actually agreed to a somewhat team-friendly deal … although with another fully guaranteed contract.
OK Mr. O’Connell. Now we’re gonna see just how much of a quarterback whisperer you are.
Nothing team friendly about this deal. It is another Cousins special that is lose lose for the franchise. If he plays well on it, which he won't, he gets even more money in 2023. If he plays poorly or the same as he has the past 4 seasons, we will have wasted another 35 million on him.
Lose-lose.
KAM has now failed in his first two big moves as GM and is off to a really rough start. Dude better nail the draft or he might not make it 3 years.
Right, the worst part is he has a no trade clause.
Re: Cousins Extended
Posted: Sun Mar 13, 2022 9:42 pm
by halfgiz
40for60 wrote: ↑Sun Mar 13, 2022 9:29 pm
StumpHunter wrote: ↑Sun Mar 13, 2022 9:21 pm
Nothing team friendly about this deal. It is another Cousins special that is lose lose for the franchise. If he plays well on it, which he won't, he gets even more money in 2023. If he plays poorly or the same as he has the past 4 seasons, we will have wasted another 35 million on him.
Lose-lose.
KAM has now failed in his first two big moves as GM and is off to a really rough start. Dude better nail the draft or he might not make it 3 years.
Right, the worst part is he has a no trade clause.
Not real happy with the no trade clause either.
Re: Cousins Extended
Posted: Sun Mar 13, 2022 9:43 pm
by Thaumaturgist
40for60 wrote: ↑Sun Mar 13, 2022 9:29 pm
StumpHunter wrote: ↑Sun Mar 13, 2022 9:21 pm
Nothing team friendly about this deal. It is another Cousins special that is lose lose for the franchise. If he plays well on it, which he won't, he gets even more money in 2023. If he plays poorly or the same as he has the past 4 seasons, we will have wasted another 35 million on him.
Lose-lose.
KAM has now failed in his first two big moves as GM and is off to a really rough start. Dude better nail the draft or he might not make it 3 years.
Right, the worst part is he has a no trade clause.
Bingo. Kirk is and always will be about Kirk. Expect more of the same mediocrity or worse.
Re: Cousins Extended
Posted: Sun Mar 13, 2022 10:27 pm
by Maelstrom88
A lot of people will be eating crow after this year. Kirk is going to have a career year if they shore up the middle offensive line. Kirk was playing under one of the worst coaches in the league prior to this year. This QB draft sucks, Mond is unknown to this brain trust, next year's QB won't have to be rushed out there as a rookie (if they draft one).
Re: Cousins Extended
Posted: Sun Mar 13, 2022 10:30 pm
by CharVike
Thaumaturgist wrote: ↑Sun Mar 13, 2022 9:43 pm
40for60 wrote: ↑Sun Mar 13, 2022 9:29 pm
Right, the worst part is he has a no trade clause.
Bingo. Kirk is and always will be about Kirk. Expect more of the same mediocrity or worse.
Don't you think people should be about themselves? Nobody will hand you anything. You might get a chance. A no trade clause can be signed off by the player. Wilson had a no trade clause and so does Watson. I guess they are about themselves also. Kirk was given an opportunity when he was drafted in the 4th round and he made the most of it. Do you think that was just handed to him? I guess he just sat around clubbing it every night and did nothing. Punched in and was the first to punch out. IMO he worked hard and showed something in camp that allowed him to make the team. He started a game his 1st year for an injured RG ME and kept the season alive. If he didn't care about himself or the team or winning that never would have happened. Give the guy some credit for making himself what he is. I'm sure many threw better talent out the window like RG ME. He's still trying to get back in and keeps getting cut. Sloter keeps trying and can't make it. I'll give Kirk credit he was told you might be a backup some day when he was going through the draft process. If our defense continues to suck we don't have a chance. Very few look at that part.
Re: Cousins Extended
Posted: Sun Mar 13, 2022 11:22 pm
by J. Kapp 11
CharVike wrote: ↑Sun Mar 13, 2022 10:30 pm
Thaumaturgist wrote: ↑Sun Mar 13, 2022 9:43 pm
Bingo. Kirk is and always will be about Kirk. Expect more of the same mediocrity or worse.
Don't you think people should be about themselves? Nobody will hand you anything. You might get a chance. A no trade clause can be signed off by the player. Wilson had a no trade clause and so does Watson. I guess they are about themselves also. Kirk was given an opportunity when he was drafted in the 4th round and he made the most of it. Do you think that was just handed to him? I guess he just sat around clubbing it every night and did nothing. Punched in and was the first to punch out. IMO he worked hard and showed something in camp that allowed him to make the team. He started a game his 1st year for an injured RG ME and kept the season alive. If he didn't care about himself or the team or winning that never would have happened. Give the guy some credit for making himself what he is. I'm sure many threw better talent out the window like RG ME. He's still trying to get back in and keeps getting cut. Sloter keeps trying and can't make it. I'll give Kirk credit he was told you might be a backup some day when he was going through the draft process. If our defense continues to suck we don't have a chance. Very few look at that part.
First of all, many people recognize that the defense needs fixed. That’s the whole point of not wanting so much tied up in the quarterback … no money to fix the defense.
Yes, every person should do the most they can for themselves and their family. I don’t begrudge Cousins that.
But pro sports are just a different animal. Major League Baseball just raised the minimum salary to $750,000. I can’t even imagine making that much money. NBA players on the end of the bench make millions. Example … Otto Porter Jr. averages 20 minutes per game and makes $2.4 million. Jonathan Kuminga makes $5.5 million … he’s 19 years old.
Now look at NFL quarterbacks. Most starters who are not on their rookie deals make north of $20 million a year. Chicago paid its backups $16 million in 2021. Chase Daniel has more than $28 million in career earnings … he has exactly two wins. If you make $60,000 per year, you’d have to work 100 years to equal the money Nick Foles made last year. It’s insane.
So the question I have for Cousins is this: Do you want to win a Super Bowl, or do you want to win the negotiation? Three times now, he’s shown us his answer. He’s a smart guy. He knows the more the Vikings spend on him, the less they have to build a winner. It appears he doesn’t care.
By the time his contract expires, Kirk Cousins will have made $231 million for his career. You and I can’t even fathom what that means. It’s generational wealth. Cousins’ great grandchildren will still be benefiting from it. How much is enough, Kirk?
In some ways, I guess Cousins deserves congratulations. He’s the greatest negotiator in NFL history.
Re: Cousins Extended
Posted: Sun Mar 13, 2022 11:31 pm
by Maelstrom88
Cousins would have made more on the open market. He is a top 10 QB. Those guys get paid big.
Re: Cousins Extended
Posted: Mon Mar 14, 2022 5:52 am
by StumpHunter
Maelstrom88 wrote: ↑Sun Mar 13, 2022 11:31 pm
Cousins would have made more on the open market. He is a top 10 QB. Those guys get paid big.
He would have gotten nothing on the open market since he is not a free agent.
In 2023 though, you have to ask yourself, would NE, KC, or another well run franchise pay Kirk more than 35 million fully guaranteed if they were looking for a QB?
Or would it be a team like the Jets?
Re: Cousins Extended
Posted: Mon Mar 14, 2022 5:59 am
by Foreman44
Foreman44..Maybe talking crazy here,
How much of this decision was forced on them. Cousins can play football, win games when a defense plays. But will he be the man if you are down 17 points and have to put the team upon his back. Like Brady,Rodgers, Russell, Mahones, etc.. I don’t think so.
How much was forced on the Vikings when Denver signed Russell. I believe talk of Washington having interest. But they are out. Watson a ? Mark. Maybe Indianapolis?
Maybe they felt Couples is there best shot, like it or not.
Maybe nothing I said makes sense.
We definitely need to fix our o line, and build a solid defense
I
fiestavike wrote: ↑Sun Mar 13, 2022 8:33 pm
J. Kapp 11 wrote: ↑Sun Mar 13, 2022 8:29 pm
I am man enough to say it.
I. Was. Wrong.
Did not see this coming. Not at all. But now I’m seeing images of KOC with his signed Kirk Cousins Redskins jersey in a shadow box (wait … I can’t say the “R” word, can I?), complete with a note calling KOC the best coach ever in the whole wide world. I guess KOC wasn’t kidding. He really does like Kirk.
What stuns me is that Cousins actually agreed to a somewhat team-friendly deal … although with another fully guaranteed contract.
OK Mr. O’Connell. Now we’re gonna see just how much of a quarterback whisperer you are.
I still remain unconvinced that Mark Wilf, Zygi Wilf, or Kwesi know what the hell they are doing when it comes to football.
Re: Cousins Extended
Posted: Mon Mar 14, 2022 6:10 am
by StumpHunter
For the "every person should be looking out for themselves" crowd, not everyone should be doing that and most people do not do that. On top of that, making the most money you can is not always the best thing for a person and there are other factors that should go into where you decide to work.
My guess is that most of the people who write here could make more money at another job than the one they currently work at, bit stick with their current position out of loyalty, because they like the people they work with or because they just really like their current job. Not everyone chases dollars in their careers, and the fact is, most don't.
Re: Cousins Extended
Posted: Mon Mar 14, 2022 6:55 am
by Maelstrom88
StumpHunter wrote: ↑Mon Mar 14, 2022 5:52 am
Maelstrom88 wrote: ↑Sun Mar 13, 2022 11:31 pm
Cousins would have made more on the open market. He is a top 10 QB. Those guys get paid big.
He would have gotten nothing on the open market since he is not a free agent.
In 2023 though, you have to ask yourself, would NE, KC, or another well run franchise pay Kirk more than 35 million fully guaranteed if they were looking for a QB?
Or would it be a team like the Jets?
The Saints, Broncos (pre-Wilson), Bucs, Colts, Redskins, Steelers, and Seahawks probably would off the top of my head.
Re: Cousins Extended
Posted: Mon Mar 14, 2022 6:57 am
by Maelstrom88
Kirk was offered more money by the Jets.
Re: Cousins Extended
Posted: Mon Mar 14, 2022 7:24 am
by CharVike
J. Kapp 11 wrote: ↑Sun Mar 13, 2022 11:22 pm
CharVike wrote: ↑Sun Mar 13, 2022 10:30 pm
Don't you think people should be about themselves? Nobody will hand you anything. You might get a chance. A no trade clause can be signed off by the player. Wilson had a no trade clause and so does Watson. I guess they are about themselves also. Kirk was given an opportunity when he was drafted in the 4th round and he made the most of it. Do you think that was just handed to him? I guess he just sat around clubbing it every night and did nothing. Punched in and was the first to punch out. IMO he worked hard and showed something in camp that allowed him to make the team. He started a game his 1st year for an injured RG ME and kept the season alive. If he didn't care about himself or the team or winning that never would have happened. Give the guy some credit for making himself what he is. I'm sure many threw better talent out the window like RG ME. He's still trying to get back in and keeps getting cut. Sloter keeps trying and can't make it. I'll give Kirk credit he was told you might be a backup some day when he was going through the draft process. If our defense continues to suck we don't have a chance. Very few look at that part.
First of all, many people recognize that the defense needs fixed. That’s the whole point of not wanting so much tied up in the quarterback … no money to fix the defense.
Yes, every person should do the most they can for themselves and their family. I don’t begrudge Cousins that.
But pro sports are just a different animal. Major League Baseball just raised the minimum salary to $750,000. I can’t even imagine making that much money. NBA players on the end of the bench make millions. Example … Otto Porter Jr. averages 20 minutes per game and makes $2.4 million. Jonathan Kuminga makes $5.5 million … he’s 19 years old.
Now look at NFL quarterbacks. Most starters who are not on their rookie deals make north of $20 million a year. Chicago paid its backups $16 million in 2021. Chase Daniel has more than $28 million in career earnings … he has exactly two wins. If you make $60,000 per year, you’d have to work 100 years to equal the money Nick Foles made last year. It’s insane.
So the question I have for Cousins is this: Do you want to win a Super Bowl, or do you want to win the negotiation? Three times now, he’s shown us his answer. He’s a smart guy. He knows the more the Vikings spend on him, the less they have to build a winner. It appears he doesn’t care.
By the time his contract expires, Kirk Cousins will have made $231 million for his career. You and I can’t even fathom what that means. It’s generational wealth. Cousins’ great grandchildren will still be benefiting from it. How much is enough, Kirk?
In some ways, I guess Cousins deserves congratulations. He’s the greatest negotiator in NFL history.
One team a year wins a Super Bowl. Do you think they were the only players that wanted to win it. This year the Bengals didn't care and that's why they lost? I'm sure you played sports and people go out there and try to win. Even in armature golf they play to win and I played that type of stuff in my life with money on the line. This is the career that these people choose. Very few people make it to the NFL. They all are paid well compared to the average person. Yes 231 million is off the charts. I'm sure there are people worth billions who think how can someone live on only 230 million. I don't know why a fan would get pissed at any athlete trying to make as much as they can. Our guy Cook is making a ton. Are people pissed at actors? How about surgeons? They make money. The Bengals signed one of our former 1st round bust draft picks Trae Waynes in FA. It hasn't worked out the way they had hoped. Signing FA stiffs isn't the answer. Having nothing at QB isn't either. I stopped watching baseball when the world series was cancelled in 1994. The players said they don't give a #### about the world series. That's true. They want the money and I don't blame them. The NFL is entertainment. IMO I'm glad we signed Cousins he gives us the best shot at winning. The haters will say he sucks and doesn't care about winning. Deshaun Watson has a career record of 28-25-0. He don't care either and he makes good money. He has a no trade clause. But he's not a loser with that record. There's other losers out there also.
Re: Cousins Extended
Posted: Mon Mar 14, 2022 7:29 am
by StumpHunter
Maelstrom88 wrote: ↑Mon Mar 14, 2022 6:55 am
StumpHunter wrote: ↑Mon Mar 14, 2022 5:52 am
He would have gotten nothing on the open market since he is not a free agent.
In 2023 though, you have to ask yourself, would NE, KC, or another well run franchise pay Kirk more than 35 million fully guaranteed if they were looking for a QB?
Or would it be a team like the Jets?
The Saints, Broncos (pre-Wilson), Bucs, Colts, Redskins, Steelers, and Seahawks probably would off the top of my head.
Considering one of those teams has already refused to pay Cousins that type of money and one is starting Tom Brady next season, I am not sure how accurate that list is.
I also think you are conflating a need for a QB with a willingness to overpay for one that doesn't actually make the team better.