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Purple bruise wrote:You dismiss his behaviour because he donates a fraction of the millions of dollars he has made to charitable (TAX DEDUCTABLE) organizations
Listen, when my kid was five years old I shelled out 60 bucks and bought him his first NFL jersey, a Randy Moss jersey.
He WAS one of the most , if not the most dynamic receivers ever to have played and I do not discount that fact what so ever. His criminal record and antics, to me anyway, has greatly tarnished my image of him. I guess that I am intitled to feel that way. Would I want one of my sons to grow up and be a super star NFL athelete, you bet I would. BUT if it meant that he behaved or conducted himself like Moss has then I would say hell no
To each there own.

I don't think Craig was being dismissive ofMoss' behavior. As he said, Moss is a complex character with both good and bad qualities. He was just pointing out some of the good and "balancing the scales" a little.

Purple bruise wrote:You dismiss his behaviour because he donates a fraction of the millions of dollars he has made to charitable (TAX DEDUCTABLE) organizations
Listen, when my kid was five years old I shelled out 60 bucks and bought him his first NFL jersey, a Randy Moss jersey.
He WAS one of the most , if not the most dynamic receivers ever to have played and I do not discount that fact what so ever. His criminal record and antics, to me anyway, has greatly tarnished my image of him. I guess that I am intitled to feel that way. Would I want one of my sons to grow up and be a super star NFL athelete, you bet I would. BUT if it meant that he behaved or conducted himself like Moss has then I would say hell no
To each there own.

As you well know I did not "dismiss" his behavior at all. Read my post. All your chest-thumping indignation over Randy Moss doesn't give you the right to confabulate inaccuracies about what I post here on this board.

As for Randy's time and money invested in charities, well, it may not impress you but I imagine some people are grateful that he does these things.

Honestly, I freely admit that Moss has often acted like an idiot and behaved reprehensibly. I was merely trying to point out that he's done some good things too, which indicates just what kind of complex personality he is. People often are multi-dimensional, or at least that's what I've found to be true about people from the experiences in my life.

And I stand by my admiration for his super-human feats on the field. Like I said, those are things that can't be taken away.

No chest thumping here. I was responding to your some what sarcastic remark "And not to mention that MEANY Moss' contributions to the Feed the Children Caravan, Smile Network for Children, Starlight Children foundation, plus donating clothing and food to needy families, among the other HORRIBLE ATROCITIES that he does"

You have your opinion and I have mine but these are a few of the things that shaped my opinion;
Minnesota Vikings wide receiver Randy Moss was arrested Tuesday evening by Minneapolis police for assaulting a downtown traffic control agent with his car and remains in custody, a spokeswoman for the Minneapolis Police Department said. The MPD's traffic control agent -- a city employee who is not a police officer -- was not seriously hurt in the 5:45 p.m. CST incident, said Cyndi Barrington, public information officer for the MPD. Barrington confirmed that Moss disobeyed an order from the agent and eventually pushed her down the street about 1/2 block using his car. In attempting to stop Moss' car from making an illegal turn, the agent was pushed off her feet by his maroon 2002 Lexus. At that point, Moss stopped his car as the agent called police for assistance.Moss was booked into jail for assault in the second degree, which is considered assault with a dangerous weapon, Barrington said. He has not been charged as of yet. Moss could be held in custody for up to 36 hours, Barrington said, if charged with a felony. However, a Hennepin County (Minn.) judge could set Moss' bail before that time.
On- and off-field trouble
Moss earned a full scholarship to Notre Dame in 1995 (his senior year of high school) before his involvement in a racially-motivated fight in which he kicked a white classmate on the ground. He was charged with two counts of battery. After spending three days in jail, Moss was allowed to defer the other 27 days until after his freshman year of college. He received a year's probation. Notre Dame declined his enrollment application.
Moss then went to Florida State. He was redshirted for the 1995 season but tested positive for marijuana the next spring and was dismissed from school.
In 1996, Moss and his girlfriend were both arrested after she was accused of attacking Moss' ex-girlfriend's car. Moss got into an argument and shoving match with Libby Offutt, now the mother of his two children. The two were charged with domestic battery, with the charges later dropped.In 1999, frustrated late in a playoff loss at St. Louis, Moss squirted an official with a water bottle. He was fined $40,000 by the NFL, which was later reduced to $25,000. That incident followed a $10,000 fine for verbally abusing an officiaIn 2000, the NFL fined Moss $25,000 for making contact with an official. He was later fined $30,000 for three taunting incidents and a preseason dress-code violation.In November 2001, the Vikings fined Moss $15,000 for verbally abusing corporate sponsors.
What a guy, sounds like kind of a meany to me and some of these things could be viewed as horrible atrocities.

Moss has a high nfl IQ. More talent than jerry rice. Just wonder how good if he gave it 100 % everytime

Purple bruise wrote:Yeah what a class act he is/was I started disrespecting him when he walked off the field at the Skin's game while the game was still going on. Some team mate Strange that the Patriots lost total interest in having him on the team and the way he sucked up to them while playing for the Vikings on that day in New England
and for more information and history of that classy act .
http://football.about.com/od/nationalfo ... antics.htm

Moss has always been honest to a fault. He's been misunderstood by a lot of people because he doesn't say the "right things" or "act the right way". Because he isn't two-faced enough for all the people who apparently need that illusion, he's gotten a whole lot of haters over the years.

Moss said stuff like he did when the Vikings signed him prior to playing New England because it didn't take him more than a week to realize how toxic an environment the locker room was under Brad Childress. That was basically his way of coming out and saying that. He probably knew that Zygi Wilf pushed for him, and he probably knew that Childress wasn't completely on board with it. As for the Redskins game when he walked off the field, lots of players do that same thing every year and get away with it. You can see them on the sidelines. 2 seconds + onsides kick run back for a touchdown? Doesn't happen very often. I actually can't remember that happening. Because it was Moss, the media made a huge deal about it because they knew plenty of suckers would pay attention. When more people read and talk about their articles and shows, they get promotions and make more money.

Honest players force changes when changes need to be made. Guys who "shut up and do their jobs" go down with the ship instead of standing up and saying "hey, the captain's been drinking non-stop for the past month!". The analogy holds true. If a coach isn't doing what needs to be done, you need to have at least one or two guys who will stand up and force that change to happen. If you don't, you end up crashing and burning, then rebuilding all over again. But you don't have the luxury of being able to promote a good coach earlier, make a trade before the deadline (and when your players are still worth something to some other team fighting for a playoff spot). Some fans get obsessed with the idea that all the players and coaches need to march in line to make anything happen...but that only happens with teams that were already doing well. If you have a team marching in line that is 3-12, that tells you that you've got a team that is fine with being terrible.

Nobody should be seen in absolutes, as in black and white. Moss, like all of us, has had good moments and not so good moments. Moss can be child-like, and that can manifest in occasions like squirting water on a ref and then giving a game ball to a child. Neither are huge deals, but reveals a small part of his nature.

We only get glimpses of professional players. And those come from the filter of the sports media. It's difficult to make an accurate assumption off of the sampling we get.

Moss is neither the best thing since sliced bread nor the worst thing since Jack the Ripper. He's just a person in a high profile position (for those of us that take an interest in the NFL). This back and forth is a lot like the debate in another thread about whether or not Percy Harvin is a cancer on the team or not. We're only guessing here, because we only have a small amount of data to form an opinion.

For the record, I think Harvin is a highly emotional player who wants to do the most he can to win. I think Moss is one of the most talented receivers to play the game but can be immature at times. And I have no idea whether I'd want either one of them as a neighbor.

Rus wrote:

Moss has always been honest to a fault. He's been misunderstood by a lot of people because he doesn't say the "right things" or "act the right way". Because he isn't two-faced enough for all the people who apparently need that illusion, he's gotten a whole lot of haters over the years.

Moss said stuff like he did when the Vikings signed him prior to playing New England because it didn't take him more than a week to realize how toxic an environment the locker room was under Brad Childress. That was basically his way of coming out and saying that. He probably knew that Zygi Wilf pushed for him, and he probably knew that Childress wasn't completely on board with it. As for the Redskins game when he walked off the field, lots of players do that same thing every year and get away with it. You can see them on the sidelines. 2 seconds + onsides kick run back for a touchdown? Doesn't happen very often. I actually can't remember that happening. Because it was Moss, the media made a huge deal about it because they knew plenty of suckers would pay attention. When more people read and talk about their articles and shows, they get promotions and make more money.

Honest players force changes when changes need to be made. Guys who "shut up and do their jobs" go down with the ship instead of standing up and saying "hey, the captain's been drinking non-stop for the past month!". The analogy holds true. If a coach isn't doing what needs to be done, you need to have at least one or two guys who will stand up and force that change to happen. If you don't, you end up crashing and burning, then rebuilding all over again. But you don't have the luxury of being able to promote a good coach earlier, make a trade before the deadline (and when your players are still worth something to some other team fighting for a playoff spot). Some fans get obsessed with the idea that all the players and coaches need to march in line to make anything happen...but that only happens with teams that were already doing well. If you have a team marching in line that is 3-12, that tells you that you've got a team that is fine with being terrible.

You might be "supposing" quite a lot and seem to believe that Moss has been honest to a fault Really I have no clue what that means in regards to his antics or behaviour. Plus this is quite hard for me to believe, "Honest players force changes when changes need to be made. Guys who "shut up and do their jobs" go down with the ship instead of standing up and saying "hey, the captain's been drinking non-stop for the past month!". The analogy holds true. If a coach isn't doing what needs to be done, you need to have at least one or two guys who will stand up and force that change to happen. If you don't, you end up crashing and burning, then rebuilding all over again. But you don't have the luxury of being able to promote a good coach earlier, make a trade before the deadline (and when your players are still worth something to some other team fighting for a playoff spot). Some fans get obsessed with the idea that all the players and coaches need to march in line to make anything happen...but that only happens with teams that were already doing well. If you have a team marching in line that is 3-12, that tells you that you've got a team that is fine with being terrible."
I usually understand and enjoy reading your takes on "things" but this seems to me quite difficult to follow your logic. You think that it is not that uncommon for players to walk off the field before a game is over when there is a chance to win. You do not think that a team is capable of winning by a sucessful on side kick with only seconds left? Did you watch the Denver playoff loss in the final seconds this year? Did you see any Raven Players leaving the field becauase the game seemed to be over? Games are won all of the time when things seem hopeless. There are countless examples.
I am glad that we are not all on the same page about a whole lot of issues, that would be quite boring. The topic here is THE CLASS ACT THAT IS RANDY MOSS and that to me is a joke. More appropriately my take would be what a classLESS act Moss is. I won't bore you with the reasons again why I feel this way but you can, if you want, read my prior posts. Squirting referees, "mooning fans", domestic violence, illegal drugs, playing when he wants, assaulting public officials etc etc. Yes in my opinion he is very very far removed from being a class act.

Randy is a complex character for sure. He has made mistakes that because of his position seem to be amplified by the press. But he is also a person who takes time to help kids with special needs and underprivileged. Problem is one "Ah Crap" moment seems to undo all the good things he does. While I don't condone the stuff he has been in trouble for, I do wonder, why is so amplified for him? The traffic cop incident is really the only thing he has ever been busted for since being in the NFL yet a lot of people view him as being a borderline criminal. Oh, yeah, he's smoked pot. Love him or hate him you cannot deny what he brought to the field. I think given the right team, the right coach, I think we will see Randy for a few more years.

The following is just an interesting take on Randy.

http://www.boston.com/sports/football/p ... se/?page=1

He will always be one of my favorites because he never sugar-coated anything, and it was always just Randy being Randy. Love that guy. Incredible athlete and such a peculiar but fascinating character.

SKOL

Moss a class act?

Not a chance. He quit on plays all the time. He ALWAYS disapeared in playoff and important games his whole career. He had a terrible attitude and a HUGE ego, Sadly, he could have the best and and would have broke all of Jerry Rice's individual records but Randy simply wasn't a winner and leader on the field because of his piss poor attitude

If you mean to judge him purely as a professional football player, then whether he is a class act is debatable.

However, his charitable giving and his unselfish willingness to help other players learn is definitely above reproach.

Given a choice of whether I value his football character or his personal character more... I am taking personal character. Every. Single. Time. He's no AD, but then, who is?

Not classy, as a persona. Classy, without doubt, as a person.

Dark wrote:Moss was an unbelievably good player, but I always remember him being a cancer off the field. Love the guy as a player, but not so much a person.

I know he caused much turmoil throughout the early part of his career but I certainly think he's matured to a point in which his attitude is now a non issue.

Some of his actions whilst on the Vikings were admittedly unacceptable but due to his sheer physical brilliance, became tolerable. Now I'm not defending this notion, quite the opposite, true superstars get away with far too much.

Would you agree that this is why Percy is likely to be shown the door? With AD, the team isn't so dependant on him.

Randy Moss was a great football talent. Cris Carter said he never really knew him years after he left. Randy's biggest problem was Randy. He never grew up. He did numerous stupid things on and off the field. That stunt over the buffett luncheon when he was reacquired by the Vikes was just plain stupid. Moss will make the HOF, but it won't be on the first ballot. MOSS WILL BE CALLED MANY THINGS BUT NOT A CLASS ACT! Peterson, Carter, Rice...Now those guys are CLASS ACTS! I would equate Moss with Daryl Strawberry. Fantastic physical ability minus character. I pick Daryl as an example because I've been a Met fan since 1968.

80 PurplePride 84 wrote: Other than the meter maid incident the rest is way over blown. I don't recall any domestic violence either. Do you have a link?

As for the rest of the incidents you listed:

Squirting Referees- Did we ever learn the context of that? Was it playful or just him being a dbag? If it's the latter I'm sure emotions within the game had something to do with it. Not that big of deal. It was water not acid.

Mooning Fans - Joe Buck is that you? Some people act like he actually dropped his pants. He just mimicked the motion of it. And he did as a jab at Packers fans who traditionally moon the visiting teams bus

illegal drugs - it was just weed and he was in college. Tons of college students smoke weed. It's a big deal and it isn't at the same time. Percy Harvin had the same issues and he is worshiped by Vikings fans. Without that problem he probably never falls to us in the draft. So it may have been a blessing in disguise for him and the Vikings.

Play when he wants to play - This was a problem and it's what sets him a part from Jerry Rice, but he must of wanted to play a lot given he's arguably the 2nd or 3rd greatest WR of all time.


Either way Moss is a complex individual. He's far and away not Mother Theresa and he's made his fair share of mistakes, but he's also not the total dbag the media portrays him as either. Other than Matt Birk (based mostly of one incident) I haven't heard one teammate say a bad thing about him.

The guys an enigma wrapped in a riddle.

Here is your link regarding domestic violence. the outcome to me was obvious, he paid her off to drop the chargers, as so often happens with these types of cases. As far as the drugs, yes is was pot but it was/is illegal. He admits to even today still using it. I could not care less about the pot use, it really to me is simply the fact that there were/are laws against it and he broke them. I am done with this topic of THE CLASS ACT THAT IS RANDY MOSS, like it or not, my belief is that although he was an outstanding player (when he chose to be) he certainly is NOT a class act.


http://www.boston.com/sports/football/p ... se_closed/

Purple bruise wrote: Here is your link regarding domestic violence. the outcome to me was obvious, he paid her off to drop the chargers, as so often happens with these types of cases. As far as the drugs, yes is was pot but it was/is illegal. He admits to even today still using it. I could not care less about the pot use, it really to me is simply the fact that there were/are laws against it and he broke them. I am done with this topic of THE CLASS ACT THAT IS RANDY MOSS, like it or not, my belief is that although he was an outstanding player (when he chose to be) he certainly is NOT a class act.


http://www.boston.com/sports/football/p ... se_closed/

You're entitled to your opinions and I welcome them, in fact you have provided a different perspective. As a Viking fan of just seven years, I will hold my hands up and admit that I have merely marvelled at the physical domination throughout highlight rolls, I was unaware of the extent to which he caused issues, though obviously I know that he's always been a character guy.

The 'class act' statement was in fact in reference to the current Randy, who I think has come on leaps and bounds from his former self. The penny finally dropped and he hasn't been surrounded by controversy in recent memory.