StumpHunter wrote: ↑
Wed Jan 13, 2021 9:08 am
Lots of teams had injuries this season. The actual teams loaded with talent got by with the other pieces they had in place, the Vikings went 7-9 despite only playing 7 games against teams with a winning record.
Ehhh, let not act like these injuries were no big deal. Name me one team in the NFL that lost FOUR out of the five best players on their defense. And that also had inexperienced rookies starting all year at corner. You can't, dont even bother trying. And dont bother going there with the whole "winning record" garbage. It's your favorite argument. The 0-13 Jets beat two teams that are currently still in the playoffs. That alone shows your winning record argument doesnt mean shi* in the end. Anybody can beat anybody on any given day.
I can go back to prior to 2019 and point to multiple threads where you were 100% on board with letting Barr walk in FAs. Now he is a massive part of this defense? Hunter being out was indeed a HUGE part of our defense struggling and it is almost like this team isn't so loaded with talent that we can afford to miss him. We had pretty much everyone for game 1 but Hunter, and the D looked then like it did in week 17.
I was 100% on board for letting Barr walk due to price tag and I also wanted to draft Vosean Joseph who ended up flopping anyways. However, this season not having Barr showed me how vital he is to this defense. Barr has missed games before, Wilson has filled in, played decent and then Barr is eventually back. I wasnt opposed to letting him walk and drafting one to save some money. However, this was the first time he's been out for an entire season practically. Pair that with seeing how pathetic Wilson is all year against the run and then Kendricks being out, it showed just how important those two are to our defense
Do you think some of the 6th and 7th rounders will actually make the team at the start of the season this year? Any GM can say yes when another team wants to trade up with them and accumulate picks. Any team can trade a 5th this year for a 4th next. It isn't a unique skill Spielman has acquired. Whether or not it is a good thing to do is determined by whether or not we get players that make us a SB contender with the picks picked up. Success in the draft is not how many picks are acquired. Never has been.
I never said it was? That was YV trying to blow what I said out of proportion. But the reason behind mentioning the 27 picks, which I thought I made quite obvious but clearly not, was that it is basic math and this is exactly what I like about Spielman in terms of drafting.
Being the teacher I am and the fact I love teaching math, I'll even turn it into a percentage word problem for you....
Over the next 2 years, if the Chicago Bears have 14 draft picks (which is your basic, average amount of draft picks over a 2 year span) and the Minnesota Vikings have 27 draft picks (nearly double), which team has the better chance of acquiring more draft "hits" in that 2 year time span?
Answer: The Minnesota Vikings by about 48%
THAT is why I like his approach. Simply playing the odds. It's not because I think he has some type of unique skill.....
Putting aside JJ, what rookie was not a liability on the field this year? The oft injured Dantzler I guess, who benefitted greatly from our first round pick leaving his guy open all game, and QBs never needing to even look his way. Cleveland was one of the worst pass blocking guards in the NFL, Gladney was one of the worst cover corners and Wonnum sucked against the run late, and was a very inconsistent pass rush to top it off.
lol dude come on....so what, the only way you're going to give a draft pick credit now is if he breaks records like Justin Jefferson did? Well I can tell you they dont come often.
And wow, you cant stand Spielman that much to the point you have to say that Dantzler was only good because Gladney left his guy open all the time? WOW is that a reach if I've ever seen one. The shi* some of you guys come up with just to try and prove a point just kills me.
https://thevikingage.com/2021/01/09/min ... e-class/5/
Actually read this write up regarding our draft class. I'm not too sure what you were looking at with many of these guys.
-Your attempt at Dantzler was just flat out poor.
-Gladney is another excellent tackler that showed a ton of improvement coverage wise in the 2nd half of the year.
-Cleveland was a big part of the turn around we had mid season. Cleveland needs to improve in pass blocking but his main problem is over setting (mainly because we stupidly have him play on the opposite side and completely different position than he's use to). I dont know what we're going to do with Reiff (trade him in the best option) but we need to get Cleveland over at LT. Not trying him there in week 17 was absolutely stupid.
-If you dont think Wonnum showed potential than I'm not sure what to tell you. Not that this is saying much but he was probably our best pass rusher for most of the year. Andre Patterson was pushing for us to draft this kid. I trust the best DL coach in the NFL's opinion over a disgruntled fans opinion on a message board. No offense but it's true.
-I dont care what anyone says about James Lynch, I'm still a fan and fault Zimmer more than anything not finding a way to at least give him some legitimate time somewhere along the line. Like even against Detroit, in a meaningless game, we continue to trot out Stephen and Johnson and give Lynch 3 total snaps....like why? The guy clearly has some pass rush ability if he's getting 13+ sacks in a season at Baylor as a DT. I mean he played 8 snaps against Seattle and sacked Wilson. Clearly Zimmer's obsession with Stephen has continued.
-Dye made some flashy plays once in a great while but wasnt overly impressed here.
-Hand was an excellent value in the 5th round if you ask me. I said early on in the year that I wasnt to see him get in the game. Of course Zim only puts him in by default like he does every rookie but I think he showed well at years end, especially for a 5th rounder.
-Beyond that I would just say Metellus looked like a solid special teamer. Not sure about safety because Harris and Smith played all year.
I am not happy the team won 7 games, which is why I want the GM and HC gone. If I were happy with this season, I would be defending the GM.
So you werent happy with the 2017 or 2019 season? Because I dont ever remember you defending Spielman...like...ever.
Ya know, just because the Vikings won 7 games doesnt mean everyone should automatically get fired. I feel like that is everyones favorite word on here. "Fired" or "cut". Because the second anyone makes a mistake or bad move, those are the words coming out of mouths.
This excuse that the Vikings were THIS close to winning 10 games ignores the fact the Vikings where THIS close to winning 1 game this season. Against Houston Watson hit his guy in the hands in the end zone for what could have been a game tying TD. Against GB a missed PI was key in ending a GB drive that could have put GB ahead to win the game. Against Chicago Foles had a guy wide open on an easy pass to put the Bears ahead and he overthrew him. Carolina was a missed FG gave us a win and we had to go to OT to beat the Jaguars. Even week 17 it took a phantom roughing the passer call to ensure a win against Detroit. The fact is, we were closer to drafting in the top 10 than we were to making the playoffs if we play the "what if" game.
No, no. You're missing the point. The Vikings won SEVEN games with a PRACTICE SQUAD defense. The only legitimate starting experience we had on that defense by years end was Smith and Harris (who didnt play well this year partly due to how much he was being asked to do).
The defense for a good chunk of the year was:
That might not look like a massive difference but it is a MASSIVE difference. No less the difference between these players. Hunter compared Jalyn Holmes (who started all year and didnt record a single sack), Todd Davis compared to Eric Kendricks, Troy Dye compared to Anthony Barr and Jaleel Johnson compared to Michael Pierce. That is the definition of "night and day". We had no pass rush, weak LBs, etc. and then to top it off, you're leaving your corners who have never played an NFL down prior to this season on an island.
So like I said, a practice squad defense and they still won 7 games. It's not like this defense was healthy and playing terrible this year and we have to start up a rebuild. With those guys back in the fold, they win those tight games no doubt. This team probably had no right winning 7 games this year given what they had on defense by years end. Yet they still did. Adding those players back on the team adds more wins and more wins results in playoffs.