Next years QB

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J. Kapp 11
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Re: Next years QB

Post by J. Kapp 11 » Tue Feb 13, 2018 4:42 pm

Pondering Her Percy wrote:I think Cousins is definitely better than Case. At least from a consistency standpoint. We're judging Case off of a good year in a system that was fit for him. Cousins has played in more than one system and has excelled every year since 2015. Over 4000 yards each year, no more than 13 INTs in a year, nearly 30 TDs per year, no lower than a 93.9 rating, averaging 7.9 YPA and a 67% completion percentage. All very very good. And lets be honest, does anyone honestly see his play dipping with DeFilippo as an OC, the WRs and TE we have as well as a stud RB?? I dont see it as a possibility to be honest
Honestly, PHP, I don't think any of us realize what we have in DeFilippo.

Go to the OC thread and look at the video I posted there of DeFilippo talking about the FOUR red-zone TDs that Foles threw in the SAME GAME against the Giants. This video is also accessible through Vikings.com -- it's just easier to access in the OC thread. This guy REALLY knows offensive football. His breakdown of these four plays is epic. We're not talking about the lame video analysis you see on NFL Network or ESPN. This guy explains every route, every route option, keys to running the routes correctly, Foles' reads, what they expect the defense to do, what they do when the defense doesn't do what they expect, exactly where he expects Foles to put the ball ... everything. It's truly impressive. And that's just red-zone offense!

The other thing is just his passion and enthusiasm for this stuff. I wish I loved my job as much as this guy loves his. It's infectious.

There's another one on YouTube that breaks down Carson Wentz in the deep passing game. I haven't watched that one yet, but I will.

I am so optimistic for next season. I don't care who the QB is. If this guy is coaching him, he's going to do well.
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Re: Next years QB

Post by Mothman » Tue Feb 13, 2018 6:26 pm

808vikingsfan wrote:You can have an aggressive offense without an aggressive QB. Just need a good play caller. Foles and the Eagles come to mind. I don't consider Foles as a risky or aggressive QB.
He was certainly aggressive in the Super Bowl. :)

I see the point you're trying to make but I still think the mentality of the QB makes a difference. Any truly aggressive offense needs a QB who is to willing to make those aggressive plays. After all, most plays have more than one option and without a sufficiently aggressive mentality from the QB, we see check downs instead of touchdowns on plays where the latter was possible. An aggressive QB is willing to throw into a tight window or attempt a lower percentage throw that's open downfield and a less aggressive QB tends to be too willing to settle for the easy/safe throw. Whether it's possible to have an aggressive offense without an aggressive QB is really beside the point since the point is that an aggressive mentality from the QB makes a difference.
If the Vikings do keep Case, he needs to fix his accuracy issues. I think Thielen and Diggs were top 10 in contested catches. IMO, misplaced throws were the reason for a lot of these contested catches. An unlucky bounce or a better play by the defender and I can see Case easily doubling his INT count. Also, there were way too many missed opportunities left on the field this year because of these inaccurate passes.
I agree that he needs to improve his accuracy but the same would be true for Bridgewater, which is why I don't see much of a case (no pun intended) for keeping him over Keenum. Bradford's considerably more accurate but as we've said, he has other significant issues, mainly an inability to stay healthy.

Some of the contested catches you mentioned were due to the aggressive mentality I'm talking about. That stat's not necessarily a negative or a just a strike against Keenum's accuracy. It also reflects his willingness to trust his receivers to make a play on the ball. He was giving them chances and they were coming through for him. It's the same dynamic we saw with Favre and Rice in 2009 and it's a dynamic that was sorely missing in 2014-15.
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Re: Next years QB

Post by halfgiz » Tue Feb 13, 2018 6:41 pm

Here is what we know from the press: Teddy could end up signing with the Gaints or maybe Buffalo. Last resort maybe even the Browns....Wait he is going to be our starter. So many options.


Keenum is heading to Denver...Nope Cards. Wait we are going to sign him to a contract, never mind Keenum is getting tagged and then traded. Or maybe he is just getting tagged.

Sam is signing with us for a prove it deal. Wait we're cutting him...Sam is going to sign with the Cards.

QBs we could sign: Cousins, Tyrod Taylor, Bridgewater, Keenum, Foles and Bradford. :whistle:

Stay tune while we wait to see who we end up with.
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Re: Next years QB

Post by S197 » Tue Feb 13, 2018 6:47 pm

halfgiz wrote:Here is what we know from the press: Teddy could end up signing with the Gaints or maybe Buffalo. Last resort maybe even the Browns....Wait he is going to be our starter. So many options.


Keenum is heading to Denver...Nope Cards. Wait we are going to sign him to a contract, never mind Keenum is getting tagged and then traded. Or maybe he is just getting tagged.

Sam is signing with us for a prove it deal. Wait we're cutting him...Sam is going to sign with the Cards.

QBs we could sign: Cousins, Tyrod Taylor, Bridgewater, Keenum, Foles and Bradford. :whistle:

Stay tune while we wait to see who we end up with.
You forgot Brees. I'm not giving up on that dream yet!
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Re: Next years QB

Post by PurpleKoolaid » Tue Feb 13, 2018 6:57 pm

halfgiz wrote:Here is what we know from the press: Teddy could end up signing with the Gaints or maybe Buffalo. Last resort maybe even the Browns....Wait he is going to be our starter. So many options.


Keenum is heading to Denver...Nope Cards. Wait we are going to sign him to a contract, never mind Keenum is getting tagged and then traded. Or maybe he is just getting tagged.

Sam is signing with us for a prove it deal. Wait we're cutting him...Sam is going to sign with the Cards.

QBs we could sign: Cousins, Tyrod Taylor, Bridgewater, Keenum, Foles and Bradford. :whistle:

Stay tune while we wait to see who we end up with.
This is the 3rd or 4th time Ive heard Taylor mentioned as a QB the Vikings might get. I guess I see the Bills needing a QB as much as anyone and they were willing to let him go. He just isnt that good, or consistent.

Teddy scares me a bit, like Sam does, I dont see the Vikes keeping Teddy at all, unless hes a real cheap backup or they fail on signing another QB. Rick knows by now the value of a QB is worth every penny, so hopefully Case or Cousins are available. Even though i would LOVE to see what Teddy can do, I dont think its worth giving up next season for, unless we have a really good prospect as a backup. The time to strike is now.

So glad the talk for Foles seems to have died down. Why would the Vikings give up good draft picks for a QB who had a few hot games at the end of the season after a playoff berth was secured? Cause hes been nothing special at all, I'd much rather have Case.

I think the ultimate person to decide who is our QB will be Flip. He is the type of guy who loves to study QB's. He might even be a guy to draft us a good QB after we get a DT and guard.
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Re: Next years QB

Post by Dmizzle0 » Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:29 pm

Cousins can throw the ball at a higher velocity than Keenum but, I dont think he's is better than Bradford or Bridgewater except that you can argue that he's more durable.
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Re: Next years QB

Post by MrPurplenGold » Wed Feb 14, 2018 8:55 am


This lays out how it could be done. Of course it's dependent upon how close his estimates are to the actual fair market value of these player's contracts, but it appears the Vikings have the room to potentially get it done.

https://www.dailynorseman.com/2018/2/8/ ... qb-edition

This was a pretty good read. As you said though, there are a lot of assumptions on the contract numbers and it doesn't take into account that theilen has outperformed his contract.
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Re: Next years QB

Post by TeamChaplain » Wed Feb 14, 2018 9:00 am

First off let me say that I am truly excited to see what next season brings. The Vikes have just over $60 mil cap space. With that being said, I think they solidify their QB situation with signing Kirk Cousins, they'll rework Teddy's contract. Bradford or Keenum will go to the Giants to back up Eli. And then I think they'll focus on a big WR and a TE, continue to build the OLine and DLine and pick up a CB and Safety in FA. Right after the season, I was a big fan of bringing Keenum back as starter,but this makes more sense to me.
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Re: Next years QB

Post by Pondering Her Percy » Wed Feb 14, 2018 9:02 am

TeamChaplain wrote:First off let me say that I am truly excited to see what next season brings. The Vikes have just over $60 mil cap space. With that being said, I think they solidify their QB situation with signing Kirk Cousins, they'll rework Teddy's contract. Bradford or Keenum will go to the Giants to back up Eli. And then I think they'll focus on a big WR and a TE, continue to build the OLine and DLine and pick up a CB and Safety in FA. Right after the season, I was a big fan of bringing Keenum back as starter,but this makes more sense to me.
Big WR? I would say that's the last thing we need right now
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Re: Next years QB

Post by Pondering Her Percy » Wed Feb 14, 2018 9:04 am

Dmizzle0 wrote:Cousins can throw the ball at a higher velocity than Keenum but, I dont think he's is better than Bradford or Bridgewater except that you can argue that he's more durable.
You dont think Cousins is better than Bradford or Bridgewater?? Bradford is close to Cousins talent wise but Bridgewater?? Kirk Cousins is 50 times the QB Teddy is. And it's not even close
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Re: Next years QB

Post by Pondering Her Percy » Wed Feb 14, 2018 9:06 am

PurpleKoolaid wrote:
This is the 3rd or 4th time Ive heard Taylor mentioned as a QB the Vikings might get. I guess I see the Bills needing a QB as much as anyone and they were willing to let him go. He just isnt that good, or consistent.

Teddy scares me a bit, like Sam does, I dont see the Vikes keeping Teddy at all, unless hes a real cheap backup or they fail on signing another QB. Rick knows by now the value of a QB is worth every penny, so hopefully Case or Cousins are available. Even though i would LOVE to see what Teddy can do, I dont think its worth giving up next season for, unless we have a really good prospect as a backup. The time to strike is now.

So glad the talk for Foles seems to have died down. Why would the Vikings give up good draft picks for a QB who had a few hot games at the end of the season after a playoff berth was secured? Cause hes been nothing special at all, I'd much rather have Case.

I think the ultimate person to decide who is our QB will be Flip. He is the type of guy who loves to study QB's. He might even be a guy to draft us a good QB after we get a DT and guard.
I agree with all of this. I do not want Taylor either. And trust me, I've seen him play a lot living in NY. He's very inconsistent. Not bad but I dont trust him at all
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Re: Next years QB

Post by halfgiz » Wed Feb 14, 2018 11:05 am

I think the only reason Taylor 's name is in there...Supposedly Rick was giving him a hard look in the draft.

Sorry S197 for the Brees snub.

I'm anxious to see who we come up with for a quarterback.
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Re: Next years QB

Post by hardrock » Wed Feb 14, 2018 12:11 pm

Don't post much but with the qb choices we have, a Case will win a lot of games but it will take a Bradford to win it all.
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Re: Next years QB

Post by 808vikingsfan » Wed Feb 14, 2018 3:39 pm

Mothman wrote:
808vikingsfan wrote:You can have an aggressive offense without an aggressive QB. Just need a good play caller. Foles and the Eagles come to mind. I don't consider Foles as a risky or aggressive QB.
He was certainly aggressive in the Super Bowl. :)

I see the point you're trying to make but I still think the mentality of the QB makes a difference. Any truly aggressive offense needs a QB who is to willing to make those aggressive plays. After all, most plays have more than one option and without a sufficiently aggressive mentality from the QB, we see check downs instead of touchdowns on plays where the latter was possible. An aggressive QB is willing to throw into a tight window or attempt a lower percentage throw that's open downfield and a less aggressive QB tends to be too willing to settle for the easy/safe throw. Whether it's possible to have an aggressive offense without an aggressive QB is really beside the point since the point is that an aggressive mentality from the QB makes a difference.
If the Vikings do keep Case, he needs to fix his accuracy issues. I think Thielen and Diggs were top 10 in contested catches. IMO, misplaced throws were the reason for a lot of these contested catches. An unlucky bounce or a better play by the defender and I can see Case easily doubling his INT count. Also, there were way too many missed opportunities left on the field this year because of these inaccurate passes.
I agree that he needs to improve his accuracy but the same would be true for Bridgewater, which is why I don't see much of a case (no pun intended) for keeping him over Keenum. Bradford's considerably more accurate but as we've said, he has other significant issues, mainly an inability to stay healthy.

Some of the contested catches you mentioned were due to the aggressive mentality I'm talking about. That stat's not necessarily a negative or a just a strike against Keenum's accuracy. It also reflects his willingness to trust his receivers to make a play on the ball. He was giving them chances and they were coming through for him. It's the same dynamic we saw with Favre and Rice in 2009 and it's a dynamic that was sorely missing in 2014-15.
First, watching highlights of the SB, I didn't see Foles as being risky or aggressive on his completions. He did throw a couple into coverage but they were high and away, not really jump ball passes. Even his 1 int was a good throw. He was accurate and took what the defense gave him.

As far as an aggressive QB, I see what you're saying. I too would prefer a QB that takes chances on occasion and trusts his receivers to make a play. I'm just not sure if that's what this team needs, especially when this defense is not built to create turnovers. I think a more reserve but accurate QB with a good deep ball, along with an aggressive offensive attack would be more effective on this team. No one wants a QB that is afraid to pass downfield but I'd much rather have a QB use his safety valve than force a play. Check downs can help win the field position battle or keep the chains moving. Turnovers lose games. I look at Keenum as a shorter Favre with a weaker arm. He had a magical year in 2017. I just don't see him repeating his performance., especially with his accuracy issues and all the film the opposition has on him now. Having said that, he's the best option the team has of now. With an upgrade and added depth in the trenches, I think a Case led Vikings team has a good chance to make a run in the playoffs this year.

It would have been nice if the Vikings were able to get Smith at that price before signing with Washington. He might have worked well here.
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Re: Next years QB

Post by 808vikingsfan » Wed Feb 14, 2018 3:46 pm

Pondering Her Percy wrote:
Dmizzle0 wrote:Cousins can throw the ball at a higher velocity than Keenum but, I dont think he's is better than Bradford or Bridgewater except that you can argue that he's more durable.
You dont think Cousins is better than Bradford or Bridgewater?? Bradford is close to Cousins talent wise but Bridgewater?? Kirk Cousins is 50 times the QB Teddy is. And it's not even close
I'd take Cousins out of all them but 50 times better? Come on. Takes more than passing to make a good QB.

I can see Cousin's personality rub people the wrong way after a while.
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