Teddy Bridgewater 2017 season activation scenarios

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Re: Teddy Bridgewater 2017 season activation scenarios

Post by 808vikingsfan » Thu Sep 28, 2017 7:44 pm

Purple Martin wrote: Ponder has started only 36 games. He's widely regarded as being a poor QB yet he has more TDs/game than Teddy.

There was clear progression in the eyes of some, not at all clear that it was nearly enough in the eyes of many others. He never topped 14 TDs in a season. In his first year he did it in 12 games. In his 2nd year it took him 16. Where's the progress?
Then Bradford came in and got 20 in 15 games with an even worse O-line than Teddy had. Bradford as a whole is rarely considered to be any more than slightly above average.

I think it was cold for both teams, and one of those teams plays in a dome. ????

Did Teddy out-duel Wilson? In what way? Not in statistics. Not in yards. Not in first downs. Not in score. Not in Wins.

Teddy had a nice pass and a nice 2 minute drill last year. In preseason. Preseason. Pretty sure both were against backups.

I'm not sure what your point is, but if its that Teddy showed some improvement I'll grant you that. He showed some tantalizing moments and flashes of intangibles too, but they were just that, moments and flashes. My point when I jumped in here was that he is not an above average QB. That's what his tangibles have shown so far. Could he improve? Maybe. And he'd have to improve just to get to "above average".
11-5. Find another Vikings QB that led his team to 11 or more wins. You won't find much.
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Re: Teddy Bridgewater 2017 season activation scenarios

Post by Purple Martin » Fri Sep 29, 2017 12:35 pm

808vikingsfan wrote:

11-5. Find another Vikings QB that led his team to 11 or more wins. You won't find much.
He didn't lead he stayed out of the way and avoided big mistakes (mostly by avoiding any risks-which is also why we lost the Seahawk game in our own stadium). How can you call being at or near the bottom of the league offensively "leading"? We were 31st in passing. Only one team had fewer passing touchdowns in 2015. :ripple:

He helped us get to the playoffs the same way Ponder did, by avoiding mistakes and handing off to Peterson, and Teddy had the advantage of a great defense. Even Ponder had 18 TDs when AP was breaking records and carrying us to the playoff loss in 2012. But neither of them were good enough to win a single playoff game, even if Ponder had played.
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Re: Teddy Bridgewater 2017 season activation scenarios

Post by 808vikingsfan » Fri Sep 29, 2017 1:42 pm

Purple Martin wrote: He didn't lead he stayed out of the way and avoided big mistakes (mostly by avoiding any risks-which is also why we lost the Seahawk game in our own stadium). How can you call being at or near the bottom of the league offensively "leading"? We were 31st in passing. Only one team had fewer passing touchdowns in 2015. :ripple:

He helped us get to the playoffs the same way Ponder did, by avoiding mistakes and handing off to Peterson, and Teddy had the advantage of a great defense. Even Ponder had 18 TDs when AP was breaking records and carrying us to the playoff loss in 2012. But neither of them were good enough to win a single playoff game, even if Ponder had played.
I guess stats are more important to you than wins. That's fine.

Peterson played for the Vikings for several years. Again, count how many times the Vikings won 11 or more games during this period.
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Re: Teddy Bridgewater 2017 season activation scenarios

Post by PurpleMustReign » Fri Sep 29, 2017 1:45 pm

Teddy did not win 11games. Why does everyone want to give him credit for 11 wins, but not for the season before when he won only 6 or whatever. I hear everyone say it is a team game yet they want to give him credit for the 11 wins. Christian Ponder did not win 10 games in 2012, the Vikings did as a team.

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Re: Teddy Bridgewater 2017 season activation scenarios

Post by dead_poet » Fri Sep 29, 2017 2:18 pm

Purple Martin wrote: Ponder has started only 36 games. He's widely regarded as being a poor QB yet he has more TDs/game than Teddy.

There was clear progression in the eyes of some, not at all clear that it was nearly enough in the eyes of many others. He never topped 14 TDs in a season. In his first year he did it in 12 games. In his 2nd year it took him 16. Where's the progress?
Then Bradford came in and got 20 in 15 games with an even worse O-line than Teddy had. Bradford as a whole is rarely considered to be any more than slightly above average.

I think it was cold for both teams, and one of those teams plays in a dome. ????

Did Teddy out-duel Wilson? In what way? Not in statistics. Not in yards. Not in first downs. Not in score. Not in Wins.

Teddy had a nice pass and a nice 2 minute drill last year. In preseason. Preseason. Pretty sure both were against backups.

I'm not sure what your point is, but if its that Teddy showed some improvement I'll grant you that. He showed some tantalizing moments and flashes of intangibles too, but they were just that, moments and flashes. My point when I jumped in here was that he is not an above average QB. That's what his tangibles have shown so far. Could he improve? Maybe. And he'd have to improve just to get to "above average".
Nice cherry picking stats. Teddy has Ponder beat in nearly every significant statistical category over their first two seasons. And just using your eyes, it's night and day when comparing the two.

Where's the progress? Completion percentage, interception rate, adjusted yards/attempt, QBR. That was in the face of being pressured the most out of any quarterback in 2015 (46.9%). Think about that. He was pressured on nearly every other throw. And yet he still improved on his rookie year. Imagine if he wasn't playing behind the league's worst offensive line. To take that a step further, he was pressured more than any other team of PFF's (I know) rankings in the last decade. When he gets time, he's incredibly accurate.

I'm not saying Teddy destroyed Wilson in that playoff game. But a supposedly terribly Teddy played as good or better (no INTs despite one from Wilson) and nearly even other stats. So yes, given turnovers, Teddy played better and led the Vikings down the field in less than two minutes in the 4th quarter only to have Blair yank a chip-shot for the win.

Yes, moments and flashes. You're dismissing them but they're important for a young quarterback. They're indicative of growth! Which is my larger point of this whole thing that so many people seem to either ignore absentmindedly or choose to ignore. It is not fair to judge Teddy's second year starting to Sam's 8th. Sam's first two seasons were statistically inferior to Teddy's. Meaning? Sam DEVELOPED. As many quarterbacks do! Why is it so hard for some people to comprehend that Teddy has (sigh...had?) the chance to do the same? Teddy's 2015 should not represent the cap in who he could be as a starting quarterback. Yet some are like, "Nope. That's his ceiling. He's a backup."

:wallbang:

Yes, he has to improve. I was incredibly confident we would've seen even more growth last year before the injury. Now? Who the heck knows. But those moments and flashes have to start somewhere. Soon, they could be even more consistent. He was already one of the best in the 4th quarter. Now that his weapons are more mature and the line has improved...he could succeed even more (provided his leg doesn't fall off or something).
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Re: Teddy Bridgewater 2017 season activation scenarios

Post by 808vikingsfan » Fri Sep 29, 2017 2:24 pm

PurpleMustReign wrote:Teddy did not win 11games. Why does everyone want to give him credit for 11 wins, but not for the season before when he won only 6 or whatever. I hear everyone say it is a team game yet they want to give him credit for the 11 wins. Christian Ponder did not win 10 games in 2012, the Vikings did as a team.

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I didn't say he won 11 games by himself. He led the Vikings to win 11 games. He was an integral part of a team that won 11 games. My argument is he was one of the key reasons they won the North in 2015.
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Re: Teddy Bridgewater 2017 season activation scenarios

Post by PurpleKoolaid » Fri Sep 29, 2017 4:28 pm

Purple Martin wrote: He didn't lead he stayed out of the way and avoided big mistakes (mostly by avoiding any risks-which is also why we lost the Seahawk game in our own stadium). How can you call being at or near the bottom of the league offensively "leading"? We were 31st in passing. Only one team had fewer passing touchdowns in 2015. :ripple:

He helped us get to the playoffs the same way Ponder did, by avoiding mistakes and handing off to Peterson, and Teddy had the advantage of a great defense. Even Ponder had 18 TDs when AP was breaking records and carrying us to the playoff loss in 2012. But neither of them were good enough to win a single playoff game, even if Ponder had played.
Man, SMH for Teddy. When have you EVER seen him get the time both Case and Sam have gotten this year? Thats right, never. Luckily he can make plays outside the pocket. Teddy will never have a 'strong' arm, but he deserves a good chance to show us what he has after he gets well. The only bad thing about Teddy I can see if have 2 QBs with injury problems. But Sam loses that battle hands down. 2 major surgeries and now a bruise on the same knee? I think as long as Sam is healthy theres no QB controversy, but if he wants big money after this year, and doesnt prove anything other then hes injury prone, he may have to find another team, and theres goes a first RD pick with him.
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