Michael Sam and the Vikings

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indianation65
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Re: Michael Sam and the Vikings

Post by indianation65 »

I don't actually see a need to congratulate anyone for a preference. Facing the possible heat for making an announcement, well, maybe (?).

...wisdom, I don't know.
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Re: Michael Sam and the Vikings

Post by Eli »

fiestavike wrote:I predict he will not be drafted. he brings way too much media attention with him. Just heard one of his advisers on NPR saying that he will have grounds for a lawsuit if he is not drafted and that he doesn't plan to be an "activist" at least until he is established as an NFL player. Good grief.
And he'll have grounds for a lawsuit if he's cut. And grounds if he's hazed. And etc. etc. etc.

The smart move would be to avoid him like he had the plague. That's especially true for the Vikings with the Kluwe thing going on.
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Re: Michael Sam and the Vikings

Post by mmvikes »

I predict Goodell finds a way to award a compensatory 4th rd pick to the Vikes and tells them to draft Sams to make the Kluwe problem go away
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Re: Michael Sam and the Vikings

Post by Mothman »

DanAS wrote:Absolutely not true, my friend. I want the social issues to be 100% out of the picture when it comes to the selection. I could make argument why they would suggest taking him, or not taking him, but those arguments interest and compel me a whole lot less than the football question.

Yes, he didn't play well at the Senior Bowl at linebacker. But that's one game. One. And I'm not convinced that someone with that build couldn't play in a 4-3.

Anyway, I'm just throwing this out. The dude has a body like Ray Lewis and he has demonstrated some mad skills when it comes to tackling guys with footballs in their hands. So I was wondering, why not a linebacker? If he has a shot at being a great LB and has an excellent chance of being dangerous pass rusher as a DE, maybe it's not crazy to spend a high third round pick on him. But I realize there are "ifs" in that sentence.

But please believe me, Jim. I am raising this because I want to improve the Vikes' defense, I respect what he has accomplished ON the field, and this "tweener" stuff has me wondering if he might be an undervalued commodity in the draft. The other stuff is extremely important to me but I would never compromise my team's quality just to make a sociological statement.
I have no problem at all believing you, Dan. Whether you and I agree on any given topic or not, I never doubt your sincerity.

As for Sam being a linebacker, he certainly has the right last name to play on the strong side. :) Seriously, I think whether he gets drafted by a team to play that position or not will depend heavily on that team's scheme and on how he looks at the combine and at his pro day. Any team that wants him to play LB and cover is going to want to see evidence of good coverage skills or at least a strong indication that those skills can be developed. Ultimately, unless he plays DE, I think he'll probably be a much better fit for a 3-4 team at LB than he would be a for a 4-3 team.

I do think he'll be drafted and find his way onto an NFL roster.
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Re: Michael Sam and the Vikings

Post by Mothman »

fiestavike wrote:I honestly find that almost inconceivable. What team do you think has a GM and coach with enough clout to take on that distraction? Patriots maybe. That's the end of my list. If he is drafted I predict it will be by the Patriots, but I really doubt it happens.
I don't think it's inconceivable at all, nor do I see the Pats as the only team who could make a choice like that. Seattle, SF, Denver, Pittsburgh ... heck, I think there are a quite a few teams who could do it and he's talented enough that I think someone will give him a chance. I also don't think he's a lawsuit waiting to happen.
Last edited by Mothman on Mon Feb 10, 2014 5:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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PurpleKoolaid
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Re: Michael Sam and the Vikings

Post by PurpleKoolaid »

Who gives a sh!t if he's gay or not? As long as he can play football.
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Re: Michael Sam and the Vikings

Post by KSViking »

I think if he has the talent to play at a NFL level, someone will draft him. But if he is just another one of these guys that you take a chance on in 6-7th rounds, then I predict most teams will stay away, for the reasons mentioned above. Distraction, law suit, accusations, hazing, ect. No team will want to deal with that over a low draft pick. If he had the skills of 1st, 2nd rounder, I don't think his sexual preference would make a huge deal to most teams, would be worth the potential risk and distractions. But everything I read/hear about (since there are about 10 articles on him already) is that he isn't really regarded as a good NFL prospect. I guess we will see/hear more about how he is doing as the Draft gets closer.
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Re: Michael Sam and the Vikings

Post by Tark10 »

This thread isn't worth a needle. You guys have gone entirely too long without a super bowl appearance.
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Re: Michael Sam and the Vikings

Post by Raptorman »

NextQuestion wrote: Hah, It's already a huge story but my hope is that it cools off around draft day.
Don't worry, some one will test positive and it will be leaked and Sam will be left by the wayside.
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Re: Michael Sam and the Vikings

Post by mondry »

J. Kapp 11 wrote: At the risk of sounding homophobic ... there is a reason NOT to pick him because he's gay. And it has nothing to do with whether a team accepts his lifestyle. It has to do with whether they want the media scrutiny that will accompany him.

Here's the scenario:

You have two linebacker prospects. They both grade out equally. Neither is a sure-fire star, but a mid-round project. It would be a tough choice no matter their sexual preference.

Player A will be the first openly gay player in NFL history if he's drafted. Player B is straight, or at least presumed so.

Who do you take?

If you take Player A, then you might as well set up the Big Top because the Media Circus is coming. Not only will they hound Player A about it every day, but also every player on the roster and every person in the front office. "What do you think?" "Do you accept an openly gay player?" "Has anyone given him a hard time?" "Have any players asked for a trade?" On and on it will go, ad nauseum, for as long as Player A is on the roster. It'll be Tim Tebow 2.0, only magnified about 100 times.

Take Player B, and nobody bats an eye. Just another fourth-round project.

Like it or not, "Do we want the distraction?" is a legitimate question. It would be naive to think that GMs and player personnel directors won't ask it. And while they'll never say it, I'm pretty sure that at least one team will pass on Sam for that very reason. Not sure I could blame them.

That being said, I salute Michael Sam for coming out now, rather than doing it after being drafted. That would be unfair to the team that drafts him.
That scenario doesn't match up with what I posted. If he's a 3rd round talent that slips into the 4th or 5th round (for whatever reason) we're not talking about two equal 4th round prospects. We're talking about a guy who grades as a 3rd rounder, vs a guy who grades out as a 4th rounder. Taking him in the 4th or 5th round is a value pick and that's why I'd hope they do it, despite the "circus".

Now I will say I personally don't even know where he's projected to go, maybe he is a fourth rounder, I have no idea. I made my post under the assumption that he would be an early / mid 3rd rounder so I apologize for not making that clear. With that said, I agree with everything you said about it, you're exactly right, if player A is a 82 rating and player B is an 82 rating but not publically gay you probably just go ahead and take player B. But that's likely why he WILL slide and become that "value pick" as far as player talent vs draft positioning.
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Re: Michael Sam and the Vikings

Post by NextQuestion »

The problem with passing on him because of the media frenzy...if this dude turns out to be an All Pro/HOF type of player (hey, who knows? Randle was UDFA) and teams/Vikings whiffed on him because of the sexuality. All players should be treated equal...if he can make an impact for a team...TAKE him. He's obviously talented to be co-DPOY in the SEC. He'll go somewhere
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Re: Michael Sam and the Vikings

Post by Pondering Her Percy »

I'd rather pass on him. We all know how the media is and this would probably be overly blown out of proportion. Plus, with the crap that Priefer is dealing with now, drafting Sam is just going to draw even more attention to that situation. I don't want anything to do with the guy to be honest. I'd already have him scratched off my draft board if I was a GM. I'm sure there are a fair share that already do and Spielman could be one of them.
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Re: Michael Sam and the Vikings

Post by dead_poet »

Is there any proof that a story is really that detrimental to an organization? Everybody's acting like because he'll get some press during training camp that it'll translate into losing games. Hey, remember that stupid story surrounding Te'o? We haven't heard a #### thing about that since, what, September? This will be a story from now until week 1 of the regular season. Honestly, who cares? If he's making tackles like a madman out there and doing his job well, what difference does it make?

I could care less about his sexuality. Can he play ball? Sure, homophobic guys in the locker room will be uncomfortable. Let them be uncomfortable. It's not like they won't perform on the field or be worried about the dude grabbing their butt in the huddle. His 20-year-old teammates at Missouri somehow handled it.
Mr. Sam said he began to wonder if he was gay in his early teens, though he had a girlfriend in high school. It was after he arrived at Missouri in 2009 that he realized for certain that he was gay. Teammates increasingly suspected as much, and some knew that he dated a man on the university’s swim team, but it never prevented Mr. Sam from being one of the most popular players on the team. He was known for his intensity on the field and his booming voice off it.

“When I first met him, you could be downstairs and you could hear Mike all the way on the second floor of the dorms,” said receiver L’Damian Washington, who met Mr. Sam on a recruiting trip and quickly became a close friend. “He’s just a loud guy. Everybody knows when Michael Sam is in the building.”
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/02/10/sport ... .html?_r=0
There's little doubt about that with Sam, who might not be a first-rounder but is considered the ninth-best defensive end in the draft according to CBSSports.com.

For the last few years, I've heard questions persist about whether the turbocharged NFL culture -- which often resorts to anonymous bashing through the media -- could handle a gay player. Mizzou showed it can be done. Perhaps a college football locker room is a different dynamic because players aren't paid, but it's still high-level football. Any Mizzou bigotry could have made the last six months mighty uncomfortable for Sam.

That doesn't seem to be the case here.
http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootbal ... -non-story

Zimmer strikes me as the type of guy that won't tolerate intolerance. If Sam isn't performing his responsibility, he'll get an earful of Zimmer. If a teammate is making loud, bigoted, intolerant remarks, he'll probably get an earful of Zimmer too. He seems like an equal-opportunity ####-kicker.

It wouldn't surprise me if we pass on him, given the Priefer/Kluwe deal, but that could be a shame. The guy seems to have legit talent. I wish him well wherever he ends up.
“Some people think football is a matter of life and death. I assure you, it's much more serious than that.” --- Bill Shankly
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Re: Michael Sam and the Vikings

Post by Eliot »

Being that I am from Kansas City, Missouri I have always been a huge Mizzou. I was hoping we would draft him before this whole thing came about. It's not like he is a bad player. He was our best player last season IMO and Kony Early (who played the other DE spot) is a potential top 10 pick. Micheal Sam was looking like a top 25 pick last month and lots of mock drafts had him that way. Then he was asked to play LB and wasn't used to it and succeed. I'm hearing the same stuff about him as I did another former Mizzou DE (Aldon Smith) and I would say he is having a good time minus the off the field stuff. The entire football team has known for years that he was gay. I think he would be a great leader for a huge Vikings team. Players being scared of playing with him is crazy. Just because he is gay doesn't mean he likes every guy, lol, he just wants to play football. I'm straight, does that mean I like every single girl (well I guess I am desperate). He is still a freaking boss and is my screensaver on my phone since the fumble in the cotton bowl. Please draft him vikings!


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Re: Michael Sam and the Vikings

Post by BGM »

The argument to stay away from Michael Sam because of the possibility of litigation if he gets cut is an absurdly weak argument. It hinges on the inaccurate characterization of a minority as avenging victim. Nothing in Michael Sam' s history points to that as a probability. He will rise or fall based upon his football ability. However, the insular nature of the NFL does not lend itself to change.

I find it ludicrous that locker rooms and meeting rooms create some k
ind of shield behind which employees may be treated ruinously by other players, coaches and management (verbal abuse, physical threats, the concussion scandal) as if they exist outside of social and workplace rules.

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