Hunter to the Angels

[wang_chi7]

The Twins lost a good second baseman and center fielder this season already because of nothing else but revenue disparity. How can anyone say that is fair play?

It don't help that they have an awful owner. He only cares about profit and not having a good team. If someone who cared owned the team they would be in much better shape. We are talking about a guy who was practically begging to be contracted. Even if the revenue sharing was more balanced it wouldn't matter with him writing the checks. Unless they made a salary floor.

Hunter got an outragious deal anyways, any team no matter budget shouldn't have given him that kind of coin. His skills are the kind that drop dramatically after 30. He's 32 and dropping out of his prime and soon will be a 20 million a year role player.

He doesn't get on base, only hits a decent amount for power, and strikes out a lot and at the wrong times. Plus Anaheim already has 4 good outfielders. Reading on other boards, many of their fans just see it as a major waste. And they are right. Other teams would have fit him much better. But I can't blame him for taking the big long term deal. At 32 I'd be looking for that too, take the big money while its on the table.

[DanAS1]

The price did shock me. IIRC, his 2006 season was not as strong as 2007 and there was some question whether they would even pick up the option then. I do however agree completely about your point about getting nothing in return, though the team was pilloried for the Luis Castillo trade to do just that. I hope they get a king's ransom for Santana because his compensation will be in AROD territory and I cannot see the frugal Pohlad's paying the price.

The three certainties:

Death. Taxes. And Santana won't re-sign with the Twins.

[wang_chi7]

Apparently Yankees are talking about trading for Santana, I'm guessing many teams are in on it but they like to talk about their plans to create a stir. The talks are Santana for three top prospects. I've heard Twins are asking for Phil Hughes, Robinson Cano, and Jose Tabata. I'd hate to see him go, but that sounds like a really good deal. Hughes and Cano are two really good, young players. I don't know much about Tabata besides that he's a top minor league prospect (OF). This wouldn't be a bad deal at all as it would replace the hole in the rotation (with an obvious step down), give the team a top OF prospect (he's only a teenager and probably wouldn't join the club for a few years), and give the team a top second baseman.

If he goes anywhere, I really hope its not to New York. But, that deal is just too good to pass up. Unless somebody else offers a better deal, I would be satisfied with that trade. Assuming they don't pony up the dough to resign the man.

[PurpleMustReign]

Apparently Yankees are talking about trading for Santana, I'm guessing many teams are in on it but they like to talk about their plans to create a stir. The talks are Santana for three top prospects. I've heard Twins are asking for Phil Hughes, Robinson Cano, and Jose Tabata. I'd hate to see him go, but that sounds like a really good deal. Hughes and Cano are two really good, young players. I don't know much about Tabata besides that he's a top minor league prospect (OF). This wouldn't be a bad deal at all as it would replace the hole in the rotation (with an obvious step down), give the team a top OF prospect (he's only a teenager and probably wouldn't join the club for a few years), and give the team a top second baseman.

If he goes anywhere, I really hope its not to New York. But, that deal is just too good to pass up. Unless somebody else offers a better deal, I would be satisfied with that trade. Assuming they don't pony up the dough to resign the man.

Well, since they don't have to pay Hunter, the should be able to afford Santana. They still have Morneau and Mauer, and a good looking young rotation. It will be interesting to see if they sign Morneau to a long term deal now, as well as Santana.

[wang_chi7]

Well, since they don't have to pay Hunter, the should be able to afford Santana. They still have Morneau and Mauer, and a good looking young rotation. It will be interesting to see if they sign Morneau to a long term deal now, as well as Santana.

Pohlad is still the owner, I really doubt he gets resigned. Maybe they can hold onto the M&M boys, but who knows?

[Demi]

25 million for Santana. Payroll was 75 million next year. No way you can make that work for a guy who only plays once every 5 days...

[wang_chi7]

25 million for Santana. Payroll was 75 million next year. No way you can make that work for a guy who only plays once every 5 days...

They did recently offer 93 mil for 5 years (18.6 per), that may not be the exact figure, but its close. He declined, I'm guessing the money/year wasn't as much of an issue as the length. I'm sure he's looking 7 years minimum. The team needs to get it figured out, they have a new stadium in a couple years that will increase revenue for at least the duration of the contract. But if they can't get it done, find him a new home and grab up a couple young major leaguers and a prospect or two.

[DanAS1]

They did recently offer 93 mil for 5 years (18.6 per), that may not be the exact figure, but its close. He declined, I'm guessing the money/year wasn't as much of an issue as the length. I'm sure he's looking 7 years minimum. The team needs to get it figured out, they have a new stadium in a couple years that will increase revenue for at least the duration of the contract. But if they can't get it done, find him a new home and grab up a couple young major leaguers and a prospect or two.

It's now been reported that not only is Santana on the trading block, but so is Nathan. Fire sale, folks. They'll try to build a team around a first basemen and an oft-injured catcher (really, most catchers are oft-injured catchers). Oh yeah -- and a pitcher coming off a very serious injury.

If I lived in Minnesota, I'd feel like a total sucker for my taxpayer money going to build a stadium for Mr. Polhad and his descendents.

[VikingMachine]

It's now been reported that not only is Santana on the trading block, but so is Nathan. Fire sale, folks. They'll try to build a team around a first basemen and an oft-injured catcher (really, most catchers are oft-injured catchers). Oh yeah -- and a pitcher coming off a very serious injury.

If I lived in Minnesota, I'd feel like a total sucker for my taxpayer money going to build a stadium for Mr. Polhad and his descendents.

Have you or does anyone know what the revenue is for this team? I am just curious as its a business. As much as we as fans dont want to see that end of it, its a reality. If they cant at least break even with Santana and Nathan in the fold then I suppose it makes sense to trade them. I think this is really about economics more than anything.

[wang_chi7]

Have you or does anyone know what the revenue is for this team? I am just curious as its a business. As much as we as fans dont want to see that end of it, its a reality. If they cant at least break even with Santana and Nathan in the fold then I suppose it makes sense to trade them. I think this is really about economics more than anything.

With the new stadium they almost surely will be able to afford Santana, Mauer, and Morneau. Nathan is getting up there in age and his stock will never be higher, they should trade him for a 3B, DH, or OF. Neshek should be a heck of a closer.

But with Pohlad, the team will likely lose Santana, Nathan, and maybe possibly keep the M&M boys.

Where did you hear Nathan was on the block Dan? I saw an article I think in the Pioneer Press proposing a trade to Boston including Silva, Nathan, Santana, and some others for Papelbon, one of their young starters, Ellsbury, Pedrioa, and some other people. Seemed like a great trade, except Silva is a free agent and Boston wouldn't go for it.

[DanAS1]

Where did you hear Nathan was on the block Dan? I saw an article I think in the Pioneer Press proposing a trade to Boston including Silva, Nathan, Santana, and some others for Papelbon, one of their young starters, Ellsbury, Pedrioa, and some other people. Seemed like a great trade, except Silva is a free agent and Boston wouldn't go for it.

It was either on ESPN.com or CNN.com today.

[wang_chi7]

Caught Tim Kirkjan (sp?) on ESPN, who is pretty knowledgeable. Couple notes:

Boston, both New Yorks, and Anaheim in running for Santana. Mets probably don't have the means to do it, Boston ultimately won't give up Ellsbury and Bucholz (which are needed). That probably leaves the Yankees and the wanna-be West Coast Yankees.

Joe Nathan will likely stay a Twin. Very small chance he moves because Hunter was already lost, Santana is a little over 50-50 gone (they may try keeping him if they think they can win this year), and:

Delmon Young is coming to the Twins for Matt Garza and Juan Rincon. Its a 6 player trade and he didn't say who the rest of the guys were. But sounded like it was about finished the way he was talking. I like it, Young can hit and he would fill a major hole in the OF. The Twins desperately need a bat and this is it. He also is very young. Has a temper, but maybe Gardy can work that out.

EDIT: http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=3131988

There's the trade, Bartlett would be swapped for Brendan Harris (SS) which is an improvement. Sounds like a solid deal. We'd also get OF prospect Jason Pridle. I've heard the name, but would have to look him up to see what his skills are.

TB is also going after Troy Percival, sounds like they are ready to win now.

[Minniman]

It don't help that they have an awful owner. He only cares about profit and not having a good team. If someone who cared owned the team they would be in much better shape. We are talking about a guy who was practically begging to be contracted. Even if the revenue sharing was more balanced it wouldn't matter with him writing the checks. Unless they made a salary floor.

While I believe the situation stinks, I am placing blame on the system which is unfair and not good for any team sport. You consistantly refuse to do so, which is your prerogative, but I disagree with your conclusion.

Pohlad has often allowed his team salaries to go over the team revenue available, but you are blaming Pohlad for not spending his own money on players that have inflated salaries from overspending large market teams. You state that Pohlad would not spend even if he had the money from revenue sharing, which you cannot prove in any way because it is an theoretical abstraction.

There should be revenue sharing; there should be a cap, and the players association would require a salary floor in exchange for that. It would be the best for the game and the best for the Twins.

[VikingMachine]

While I believe the situation stinks, I am placing blame on the system which is unfair and not good for any team sport. You consistantly refuse to do so, which is your prerogative, but I disagree with your conclusion.

Pohlad has often allowed his team salaries to go over the team revenue available, but you are blaming Pohlad for not spending his own money on players that have inflated salaries from overspending large market teams. You state that Pohlad would not spend even if he had the money from revenue sharing, which you cannot prove in any way because it is an theoretical abstraction.

There should be revenue sharing; there should be a cap, and the players association would require a salary floor in exchange for that. It would be the best for the game and the best for the Twins.

Well said and I agree!

[Demi]

Have you or does anyone know what the revenue is for this team? I am just curious as its a business.

Here's what I found on one site that is percent of revenue to actual payroll:
79% Washington Nationals
79% Chicago White Sox
74% New York Yankees
70% Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim
67% Toronto Blue Jays
66% Detroit Tigers
62% Minnesota Twins
60% Houston Astros
60% Boston Red Sox
59% Los Angeles Dodgers
59% St Louis Cardinals
57% San Francisco Giants
56% New York Mets
56% Atlanta Braves
55% Chicago Cubs
53% Oakland Athletics
53% Philadelphia Phillies
52% Milwaukee Brewers
51% Seattle Mariners
49% Baltimore Orioles
48% Cincinnati Reds
48% Texas Rangers
47% San Diego Padres
45% Kansas City Royals
44% Arizona Diamondbacks
43% Pittsburgh Pirates
40% Cleveland Indians
32% Tampa Bay Devil Rays
31% Colorado Rockies
15% Florida Marlins

That is for 2005/2006

The operating income for 2005 was -.5 million. Compared to a net operating income of 10.8 million for the Yankees (despite their payroll)

From what I could find, most years the only reason the twins aren't in the red is because of the revenue sharing. Twins team value went up 38 million from 2005 to 2006, and from the article that was before the stadium deal.

As much as I'd love to pile on Pohlad, only the Marlins and Royals have a lower revenue. Yet the twins have a higher payroll then 11 other teams. Obviously losing Hunter, Santana, and whoever else should change the numbers up. We'll have to wait and see.