Saints investigated for "Bounty Program"

[VikingLord]

I agree, the bounty was stupid. However, I dont think they meant to injure players by playing dirty, just by playing mean and aggressive. Every defensive player dreams of a big, mean shot at an opposing player, if they say they dont, they are lying. Having a bounty was stupid, and Im sure they'll have to pay for it, as they should, but I dont think they played dirty at all.

If that is true, why do you think the NFL investigated in the first place? Do you think the league would mount an investigation like it did simply because a single team cried sour grapes after a tough loss?

Come on, purple guy, there had to be more to it than sour grapes. This type of thing could determine whether one guy can even coach in the league anymore (Williams) and would certainly tarnish his reputation, will probably have a significant effect on Sean Payton and Loomis, and could cost the Saints dearly in this upcoming draft. Those are not minor consequences brought about by one or two teams crying sour grapes because they got beat by a team that played clean, but aggressive, defense.

[HardcoreVikesFan]

Next I hope Golden Boy Brees gets pissed about his contract and forces his way out of New Orleans. That franchise can burn in hell for all I care.

[bigskyeric]

It's threads like this that makes me wish this Forum had a 'like' button similar to Facebook.

[44_viking]

Amazing!!!...Too bad the NFL and the refs didn't do something while the game was going on. I suppose they will just get a slap on the wrist now...I can't even tell how many non viking fans even thought the saints played a dirty game.

[purple guy]

If that is true, why do you think the NFL investigated in the first place? Do you think the league would mount an investigation like it did simply because a single team cried sour grapes after a tough loss?

Come on, purple guy, there had to be more to it than sour grapes. This type of thing could determine whether one guy can even coach in the league anymore (Williams) and would certainly tarnish his reputation, will probably have a significant effect on Sean Payton and Loomis, and could cost the Saints dearly in this upcoming draft. Those are not minor consequences brought about by one or two teams crying sour grapes because they got beat by a team that played clean, but aggressive, defense.

Again, the "bounty" part WAS wrong/illegal. BUT, IMO they didnt resort to dirty play to collect on a bounty. They did get a couple 15yd penalities, but that happens EVERY week in almost EVERY game, by that standard, every team is cheap and dirty. The NFL investigated because the bounty is illegal, even if it is collected with clean play on the field. I think they should be punished for having a bounty on players, but just because they had that, doesnt make their play on the field dirty. To me, its 2 separate issues. One the bounty, which is wrong. Two, their play on the field, which was just fine, IMO. If every team that got flagged for a 15yd penality is a cheap and dirty team, that is all 32 teams in the NFL. Heck, as stated, they are only 8th in the NFL in such penalities since this supposed bounty thing started.

1. They were wrong to issue bountys.
2. They played fair, aggressive, tough football, not dirty or cheap, unless every team in the NFL is also labeled the same way. IMO.

[purple guy]

They were flagged during the game, they were fined after the game. So not only did they have the illegal bounties that they will be punished for, but they repeatedly broke a rule called "unnecessary roughness" during the game. Not sure why some people are refusing to accept it...

So every player and team that gets a 15yd penality or a fine is a dirty player and a cheap team???? I disagree. The bounties were illegal, their play was no different than any other compitent D that is able to play tough and aggressive, something Frazier has no clue how to do. 15yd penalities and fines happen every week in the NFL. The ONLY thing they did wrong was have bounties, their play on the field was fine, 2 of the players who were supposedly targeted even agreed.

[purple guy]

LOL. Im done with this thread. The pouting and sour grapes from the Vikings being given an #### kickin is sickening. The Saints beat us fair and square. They were flagged a couple times, just like happens in every game. Its football. Since they had a bounty and they whooped the Vikings, they have to be cheap and dirty players. Losers always make excuses, well, Favre and Warner didnt, but...........................I assume the next time a Viking is flagged for 15yd U R penality, he will be a no good, dirty, cheap, POS that should be fined and cut asap.

[Demi]

The Saints beat us fair and square. They were flagged a couple times, just like happens in every game.

How liquored up were you for that game anyway? Hitting a QB after they hand the ball off isn't "good hard play". Hitting a QB low from behind on purpose isn't "good hard play". Hitting high/low isn't "good hard play". Why are you so hung up on "sour grapes"? We lost, great, it's over and done. That doesn't change what happened in the game.

But yeah, everyone including the NFL and fans of other teams are just focused on "sour grapes".

[purple guy]

How liquored up were you for that game anyway? Hitting a QB after they hand the ball off isn't "good hard play". Hitting a QB low from behind on purpose isn't "good hard play". Hitting high/low isn't "good hard play". Why are you so hung up on "sour grapes"? We lost, great, it's over and done. That doesn't change what happened in the game.

But yeah, everyone including the NFL and fans of other teams are just focused on "sour grapes".

I agree. I wasnt liquored up at all, I just can accept when the Vikings lose that it doesnt have to be a conspirocy. IMO, the Saints just played good aggressive D and the Vikings lost. Its football. Had the Vikings D done that to Brees Im sure it would have been just fine, Favre even mentioned that. Its tackle football, hits happen. And they did get flageed for some plays, you even mentioned it.

The fact they had bountys doesnt change what happened during the game either. Just because they broke the bounty rule doesnt automatically make every tackle the made cheap and dirty. IMO, we lost fair and square.

[bigskyeric]

Again, the "bounty" part WAS wrong/illegal. BUT, IMO they didnt resort to dirty play to collect on a bounty. They did get a couple 15yd penalities, but that happens EVERY week in almost EVERY game, by that standard, every team is cheap and dirty. The NFL investigated because the bounty is illegal, even if it is collected with clean play on the field. I think they should be punished for having a bounty on players, but just because they had that, doesnt make their play on the field dirty. To me, its 2 separate issues. One the bounty, which is wrong. Two, their play on the field, which was just fine, IMO. If every team that got flagged for a 15yd penality is a cheap and dirty team, that is all 32 teams in the NFL. Heck, as stated, they are only 8th in the NFL in such penalities since this supposed bounty thing started.

1. They were wrong to issue bountys.
2. They played fair, aggressive, tough football, not dirty or cheap, unless every team in the NFL is also labeled the same way. IMO.

To refresh you're memory. Lots of late hits. Hits after the flag is thrown. High/Lows, Pile drivers........ Many of which were never called http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6i1tkbcxIno

[purple guy]

^Again, its tackle football. You think they were cheap, I think the Saints played just fine. They were flagged for a couple, the ones they werent flagged for, no biggie, refs miss calls every game. You dont think the Vikings have ever benefitted from a non call???? Gimme a break.

[CalVike]

Wilbon said on PTI this is no big deal at all, because it's been going on for as long as there has been an NFL. IIRC, Billick's Ravens were accused of this not too long ago. It's disappointing to me the Saints resorted to this and that GM Loomis and Coach Payton turned a blind eye. What goes around comes around, hopefully the Saints lose draft picks and Williams is suspended. As for the 2010 NFCC, I'd prefer to let sleeping dogs lie and deal with this new information as an independant matter, separate from that horrible game. Go Vikes!

[J. Kapp 11]

^Again, its tackle football. You think they were cheap, I think the Saints played just fine. They were flagged for a couple, the ones they werent flagged for, no biggie, refs miss calls every game. You dont think the Vikings have ever benefitted from a non call???? Gimme a break.

Classic "point to bad behavior to justify other bad behavior" argument.

You're losing this argument hard, PG.

Nobody here said we lost the game because of dirty play. There were, however, certain plays, such as the first interception, that were influenced by dirty plays that weren't called. No matter what you say about the hit on Favre, the league issued fines, so it was illegal, by definition, something that 99% of the world knew the moment it happened. But just about every sane Vikings fan knows we lost the game because we turned the ball over six times and had a fairly crucial 12 men in the huddle penalty following a timeout.

The point here is that the entire bounty system is reprehensible. There's no place for it in football at any level, or in any other sport. As far as I'm concerned, the only sour grapes here is that I think just about any penalty the league levies on the Saints probably isn't severe enough.

[bigskyeric]

Not really. Thinking the Vikes lost because of dirty plays is asinine. Anyway who watch that game will tell you the Vikes shot themselves in the foot with the 5 or 6 turnovers or whatever it was, the most important being Favre's boneheaded INT after Clueless' 12 man formation.

The only excuse that could possibly hold any water are the questionable calls in overtime, but the game shoulda never been in OT to begin with.

Using "the other team played dirty" as an excuse for the loss is just stupid.

Really? So if if the refs had called the high/low hit, that would have lead to a first down...... that wouldn't have changed the outcome of the game? ok.

[PurpleHalo]

Eh. So they wanted to hit a QB or crush a WR, its football. No one will ever convince me they played dirty vs the Vikings in that game, ever. That is just sour grapes, IMO. They are turning the NFL into a 2 hand touch league, let em play.

It isn't sour grapes, they cheated, we all know it. Hitting the QB after a hand off, is this good football? Going high / low to intentionally get a QB from a big game, because you know you lose otherwise, this is good football, that is the spirit of the game? I knew it was happening, it was obvious, and Greg Williams should be banned from the NFL for life!