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 Johnny Manziel 
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Post Re: Johnny Manziel
dead_poet wrote:
PROSPECT PROFILE: JOHNNY MANZIEL

http://www.sportsonearth.com/article/67 ... ny-manziel

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Having to throw as many passes as he did, it's also impressive that Manziel throws few, if any, passes that defenders can get their hands on. Of the top five quarterbacks I have evaluated so far (Derek Carr, Blake Bortles, Bridgewater, Zach Mettenberger and Manziel), he has the lowest error/interception rate of any of them. Not only does Manziel have the passing skills to succeed in the NFL, but his ability to lead his team and carry them on his back to comebacks consistently has been incredible.


Khalil Mack: http://www.sportsonearth.com/article/67 ... -nfl-draft
Teddy Bridgewater: http://www.sportsonearth.com/article/67 ... ft-profile
Anthony Barr: http://www.sportsonearth.com/article/67 ... h-prospect


Thanks for the links!

This quote from the Manziel profile is interesting:

Quote:
One issue that I found very concerning on film and addressed with NFL people is Manziel's tendency to vacate the pocket out the back, which rarely works in the NFL and can lead to major errors. He will need to become much more consistent stepping up in the pocket to avoid deep pressure if he hopes to become a successful NFL passer.


Thu Jan 30, 2014 2:02 pm
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Post Re: Johnny Manziel
Mothman wrote:
dead_poet wrote:
PROSPECT PROFILE: JOHNNY MANZIEL

http://www.sportsonearth.com/article/67 ... ny-manziel

Quote:
Having to throw as many passes as he did, it's also impressive that Manziel throws few, if any, passes that defenders can get their hands on. Of the top five quarterbacks I have evaluated so far (Derek Carr, Blake Bortles, Bridgewater, Zach Mettenberger and Manziel), he has the lowest error/interception rate of any of them. Not only does Manziel have the passing skills to succeed in the NFL, but his ability to lead his team and carry them on his back to comebacks consistently has been incredible.


Khalil Mack: http://www.sportsonearth.com/article/67 ... -nfl-draft
Teddy Bridgewater: http://www.sportsonearth.com/article/67 ... ft-profile
Anthony Barr: http://www.sportsonearth.com/article/67 ... h-prospect


Thanks for the links!

This quote from the Manziel profile is interesting:

Quote:
One issue that I found very concerning on film and addressed with NFL people is Manziel's tendency to vacate the pocket out the back, which rarely works in the NFL and can lead to major errors. He will need to become much more consistent stepping up in the pocket to avoid deep pressure if he hopes to become a successful NFL passer.


That's concerning, and I have a hard time believing it's a habit he'll be able to correct. He's never had to, as it's always worked. I think to some degree it still will. But it is a concern.

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Thu Jan 30, 2014 2:37 pm
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Post Re: Johnny Manziel
dead_poet wrote:
That's concerning, and I have a hard time believing it's a habit he'll be able to correct. He's never had to, as it's always worked. I think to some degree it still will. But it is a concern.


I agree.

Did you notice that at the end of the Mack piece, Lande wrote;

Quote:
He will be competing directly with Jadeveon Clowney and Anthony Barr to be the first defensive end/pass rusher selected, and if he performs well over the next three months, I believe he has a chance to be the first one selected.


That struck me as odd since I don't really see Mack as a defensive end or primarily as a pass rusher. Maybe he would be used in that capacity on a 3-4 team but I see him as a true NFL outside linebacker.

I confess, at this point, if the Vikings don't end up selecting a QB with the #8th pick but end up using it, I'm hoping they'll draft Mack.


Thu Jan 30, 2014 3:28 pm
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Post Re: Johnny Manziel
Mothman wrote:
dead_poet wrote:
That's concerning, and I have a hard time believing it's a habit he'll be able to correct. He's never had to, as it's always worked. I think to some degree it still will. But it is a concern.


I agree.

Did you notice that at the end of the Mack piece, Lande wrote;

Quote:
He will be competing directly with Jadeveon Clowney and Anthony Barr to be the first defensive end/pass rusher selected, and if he performs well over the next three months, I believe he has a chance to be the first one selected.


That struck me as odd since I don't really see Mack as a defensive end or primarily as a pass rusher. Maybe he would be used in that capacity on a 3-4 team but I see him as a true NFL outside linebacker.

I confess, at this point, if the Vikings don't end up selecting a QB with the #8th pick but end up using it, I'm hoping they'll draft Mack.


This team has greater needs than a LB.. Hopefully if they can't get a QB at 8 then they will trade up to get one or trade back for more picks and a 2nd round qb.

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Thu Jan 30, 2014 4:28 pm
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Post Re: Johnny Manziel
Purple bruise wrote:
This team has greater needs than a LB..


Not many (other than QB) and at that point in the draft, I think it makes sense to select for talent/potential impact not just need.

When was the last time the Vikings had a genuine impact player, a real difference-maker, at linebacker? I can't even remember but I think Mack could be that kind of player.


Thu Jan 30, 2014 4:47 pm
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Post Re: Johnny Manziel
Mothman wrote:
Purple bruise wrote:
This team has greater needs than a LB..


Not many (other than QB) and at that point in the draft, I think it makes sense to select for talent/potential impact not just need.

When was the last time the Vikings had a genuine impact player, a real difference-maker, at linebacker? I can't even remember but I think Mack could be that kind of player.


I agree 100% on Mack. I would be ecstatic if he lasts to #8 and unless someone like Bridgewater drops, I think Spielman would have to be out of his mind to pass on a guy like that.

One other comment in regards to what Bruise said - #8 in a draft is not about filling a need. It's about finding a top-flight talent even if the team already has decent production at a spot. Think about when the Vikes drafted AD. They already had good production at RB out of Chester Taylor. They certainly could have skipped RB in that draft and focused on filling another position of greater immediate need. But the draft is like a box of chocolates (sorry for the Forrest Gump reference, but it fits). It gives what it gives, and teams that take what it gives even if they've already got that particular type of chocolate are going to be happier in the end than teams that ignore what the draft giveth and choose mystery chocolate based on immediate needs. As much as the Vikes may need a QB, where they sit in this draft it just isn't going to be in the box by the time they get to pick.

Let's see if Forrest, err..., Spielman, learned his lesson with Ponder.


Fri Jan 31, 2014 3:22 pm
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Post Re: Johnny Manziel
I agree completely. Mack seems like a very special talent and I would be thrilled if the Vikings drafted him. But, for some reason I am hungry for chocolate.

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Fri Jan 31, 2014 6:47 pm
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Post Re: Johnny Manziel
Johnny Foolsball is a clown. The Vikes shouldn't touch him with a 10 yard pole. Here is a typical JFF play. Clean pocket, wide open receiver on the slant to the left and he decides to run into his O-Lineman for no reason. He doesn't know how to play QB. This backyard football junk he does every play will not fly in the NFL.

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Fri Jan 31, 2014 9:03 pm
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Post Re: Johnny Manziel
MythBuster wrote:
Johnny Foolsball is a clown. The Vikes shouldn't touch him with a 10 yard pole. Here is a typical JFF play. Clean pocket, wide open receiver on the slant to the left and he decides to run into his O-Lineman for no reason. He doesn't know how to play QB. This backyard football junk he does every play will not fly in the NFL.


Interesting that he threw for a TD in your "Typical JFF (sic)" play!


Sat Feb 01, 2014 3:48 pm
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Post Re: Johnny Manziel
Pretty in depth scouting report on Manziel: http://www.thesidelineview.com/scouting ... ny-manziel

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Post Re: Johnny Manziel
Ideally you want high character to go along with high caliber skills, and I just do not like this guy! But I have to say from Youtube (I know that kills my credibility) he seems like the best qb in the draft by a long shot. And after a few years with boring Leslie Frazier, I almost want some defiant fire on the Vikes sidelines. I know we'll get plenty of that with Zimmer though. I like his instincts and touch on the football, it's pretty. Now can he mature under Zimmer, or does he have so much ego from the rich family, big contract, and friendships with Jay-Z and Drake that if things don't go his way he bails. I just don't know, but I DEFINITELY don't want the next Ponder or Gabbert.


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Post Re: Johnny Manziel
ESPN - Brett Favre tells USA Today Sports that QB Johnny Manziel reminds him of a "young Brett Favre"

:D

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Post Re: Johnny Manziel
dead_poet wrote:
Pretty in depth scouting report on Manziel: http://www.thesidelineview.com/scouting ... ny-manziel


I thought the scouting report was pretty spot on and highlighted a lot of the concerns with Manziel. I wasn't a fan of the last paragraph though:

Quote:
Ultimately, if Johnny Manziel wants to succeed as an NFL quarterback, he will have to learn to be more consistent beating teams from the pocket. He will have to become more consistent reading defenses, going through his progression, beating blitzes by hitting hot receivers, improve his accuracy from the pocket by setting his feet and stepping into his passes, and lastly after he does take off and run, slide to protect himself. If he is able to do those things, he can have a ton of success in the NFL.


So basically, not be Johnny Manziel. I think whoever takes him has to believe in his unconventional style and that it will translate to the NFL, not try to make him into a player he isn't. You want a pocket passer, go draft a pocket passer. Manziel is unconventional, it's what makes him so good and so scary at the same time. I'm not saying you can't tweak his mechanics or his style a little to be more suited for the NFL but trying to remold him into something he's not would be a mistake. You either believe in the "magic" and draft the guy, or you don't and you pass. The last thing you want to do is take the gun away from the gunslinger.


Wed Feb 19, 2014 9:38 pm
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Post Re: Johnny Manziel
S197 wrote:
dead_poet wrote:
Pretty in depth scouting report on Manziel: http://www.thesidelineview.com/scouting ... ny-manziel


I thought the scouting report was pretty spot on and highlighted a lot of the concerns with Manziel. I wasn't a fan of the last paragraph though:

Quote:
Ultimately, if Johnny Manziel wants to succeed as an NFL quarterback, he will have to learn to be more consistent beating teams from the pocket. He will have to become more consistent reading defenses, going through his progression, beating blitzes by hitting hot receivers, improve his accuracy from the pocket by setting his feet and stepping into his passes, and lastly after he does take off and run, slide to protect himself. If he is able to do those things, he can have a ton of success in the NFL.


So basically, not be Johnny Manziel. I think whoever takes him has to believe in his unconventional style and that it will translate to the NFL, not try to make him into a player he isn't. You want a pocket passer, go draft a pocket passer. Manziel is unconventional, it's what makes him so good and so scary at the same time. I'm not saying you can't tweak his mechanics or his style a little to be more suited for the NFL but trying to remold him into something he's not would be a mistake. You either believe in the "magic" and draft the guy, or you don't and you pass. The last thing you want to do is take the gun away from the gunslinger.


Spot on. Teach Kal-El about our ways, but don't take away his cape.

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Wed Feb 19, 2014 9:40 pm
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Post Re: Johnny Manziel
ESPN - Johnny Manziel at combine: "I'm probably one of the most competitive people on the face of this earth"

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Post Re: Johnny Manziel
All you who hated on me for calling JFB a shrimp? He is now officially listed at 5'11''. 3 inches shorter then even I am. No way in heck he sees over his linemen. No wonder he runs around like a chicken with his head cut off. He makes ponder look like a giant.


Fri Feb 21, 2014 3:11 pm
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Post Re: Johnny Manziel
Funkytown wrote:
ESPN - Johnny Manziel at combine: "I'm probably one of the most competitive people on the face of this earth"


Overall, I think Johnny had a great press conference. He said all of the right things. He spoke with confidence. You can tell that he's passionate, hardworking, a team player, etc.

Whether most of what he said was "coached" or not, he comes off as a genuine person ready to become a professional. I actually came away a bit impressed.

It seems as if a small percentage of people are rooting against this kid and want him to fail. He has to know that, and I think it's just another thing to push him. All of the criticism against his style of play, size, off-the-field stuff, attitude, etc. is just going to make him work that much harder to prove everyone wrong. I think if he keeps (gets?) his head on straight, he'll have one of the best work ethics in the NFL. He is far too confident (cocky?) to fail; he's going to work his butt off to be successful at the next level. And quite frankly, that's the kind of guy I want at QB, someone who is never satisfied and constantly tries to get better. I didn't gather that from you-know-who, and I want it.

I'm not big on college football, and I really only start paying attention to the draft and whatnot after the season, and about now is really when I learn about everyone, but I have to say, if he's there at 8, I hope the Vikings strongly consider grabbing him. No one questions his talent, and all of those other "negative" things are only going to push him. Basically, I think all of the criticism could be a positive thing for him, in a way. I'm rooting for the guy, and I think he'll be exciting to watch wherever he ends up. It'll just be that much easier to root for him if he's wearing that purple. :D

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Fri Feb 21, 2014 3:13 pm
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Post Re: Johnny Manziel
PurpleKoolaid wrote:
All you who hated on me for calling JFB a shrimp? He is now officially listed at 5'11''. 3 inches shorter then even I am. No way in heck he sees over his linemen. No wonder he runs around like a chicken with his head cut off. He makes ponder look like a giant.


Have you ever heard of Drew Brees or Russell Wilson, the shrimpy, Super-Bowl winning quarterbacks?

Ideally, they'd all be a bit taller, but I think Brees and Wilson have proven that a team can win--and win big--with a shorty at quarterback. I don't understand that criticism when two of the recent QBs to help their team win a Super Bowl were, indeed, shrimpy.

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Post Re: Johnny Manziel
Funkytown wrote:
PurpleKoolaid wrote:
All you who hated on me for calling JFB a shrimp? He is now officially listed at 5'11''. 3 inches shorter then even I am. No way in heck he sees over his linemen. No wonder he runs around like a chicken with his head cut off. He makes ponder look like a giant.


Have you ever heard of Drew Brees or Russell Wilson, the shrimpy, Super-Bowl winning quarterbacks?

Ideally, they'd all be a bit taller, but I think Brees and Wilson have proven that a team can win--and win big--with a shorty at quarterback. I don't understand that criticism when two of the recent QBs to help their team win a Super Bowl were, indeed, shrimpy.


I object to this repeated use of the words "shrimp" and "shrimpy" to describe those of us shorter than 5' 11". We are not "shrimpy". We are vertically challenged individuals. :)

As for Manziel, everything about him from his height to his style of play is in contrast to the conventional wisdom regarding what it takes for a QB to succeed in the NFL. He's an unorthodox QB and the team that drafts him will know that and will know they are rolling the dice on an unconventional player, hoping his knack for the game and his intangibles will make him a pro success.


Fri Feb 21, 2014 4:14 pm
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Post Re: Johnny Manziel
Mothman wrote:

I object to this repeated use of the words "shrimp" and "shrimpy" to describe those of us shorter than 5' 11". We are not "shrimpy". We are vertically challenged individuals. :)


Okay, short stuff. :D

I am 5'0". Don't talk to me about short. :lol: Pretty bad when elementary kids are taller than you. :D Female or not, 5 foot even is pretty darn short. I don't hate it, though. And heck, just another reason to root for this guy. Woohoo shorties! :point:

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Fri Feb 21, 2014 4:33 pm
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Post Re: Johnny Manziel
Funkytown wrote:
Okay, short stuff. :D


That's a low blow!

Get it? Low blow...

Quote:
I am 5'0". Don't talk to me about short. :lol: Pretty bad when elementary kids are taller than you. :D Female or not, 5 foot even is pretty darn short. I don't hate it, though. And heck, just another reason to root for this guy. Woohoo shorties! :point:


My niece is 5' tall too. When I was in college I dated a girl (also in college, before any of you wise guys crack a joke) who was 4'11.5"! It really bugged her that she was under 5' tall.

Oh... and um... something about Johnny Manziel!


Fri Feb 21, 2014 4:41 pm
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Post Re: Johnny Manziel
Mothman wrote:
Funkytown wrote:
Okay, short stuff. :D


That's a low blow!

Get it? Low blow...



I'm sorry, shortcake. ;)

Anyways, I don't think Johnny's size is a big deal. It comes as no surprise, and like he said, he plays like he is ten feet tall. :D

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Post Re: Johnny Manziel
This thread has turned into a Short Persons Support Group! :lol:

It's a good thing playing QB in the NFL is not like getting on a roller coaster. All that matters is what you DO on the field, and Manziel has done a lot.


Manziel is kind of a litmus test for me for posters here--those that hate him, almost always without substantial or logical reasons to support that position--are folks whose takes I almost NEVER agree with. Those that AT THE VERY LEAST recognize his serious talent, even while pointing to potential translation problems of his style to the NFL, well, I usually read their posts with more attention! :P (whether it's about JFB or not).


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Post Re: Johnny Manziel
Texas Vike wrote:
This thread has turned into a Short Persons Support Group! :lol:


Hey, little people have to stick together. :lol:

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Post Re: Johnny Manziel
Texas Vike wrote:
This thread has turned into a Short Persons Support Group! :lol:

It's a good thing playing QB in the NFL is not like getting on a roller coaster.


:rofl: Can you imagine? They should have one of those painted "You must be THIS tall to go this ride" signs set up at the combine when they're measuring the height of players.

Quote:
Manziel is kind of a litmus test for me for posters here--those that hate him, almost always without substantial or logical reasons to support that position--are folks whose takes I almost NEVER agree with. Those that AT THE VERY LEAST recognize his serious talent, even while pointing to potential translation problems of his style to the NFL, well, I usually read their posts with more attention! :P (whether it's about JFB or not).


That makes sense.

Considering what he's accomplished in college, I don't see why anyone would just hate him or write off his chances to succeed in the NFL before he's even been drafted. That sort of attitude never makes sense to me.

Then again, sometimes, I read posts and wonder if the people making them are just watching games in a parallel universe and posting from there or if they have an NFL season that plays out in their heads. It's like the real thing but there are distinct differences!


Fri Feb 21, 2014 5:21 pm
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Post Re: Johnny Manziel
Nothing against short people. Its just when I posted before on this a whole bunvha of people jumped down my throat, told me I was making it up, etc. Ticks me off when they down own up to it. Being short isn't a plus in drafting a QB. It just isn't. Neither is drafting a 150 pound NT. It wont work.


Fri Feb 21, 2014 6:18 pm
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Post Re: Johnny Manziel
PurpleKoolaid wrote:
Nothing against short people. Its just when I posted before on this a whole bunvha of people jumped down my throat, told me I was making it up, etc. Ticks me off when they down own up to it. Being short isn't a plus in drafting a QB. It just isn't. Neither is drafting a 150 pound NT. It wont work.


That analogy is a bit extreme. Manziel isn't 3 foot 8.

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Post Re: Johnny Manziel
frosted21 wrote:
PurpleKoolaid wrote:
Nothing against short people. Its just when I posted before on this a whole bunvha of people jumped down my throat, told me I was making it up, etc. Ticks me off when they down own up to it. Being short isn't a plus in drafting a QB. It just isn't. Neither is drafting a 150 pound NT. It wont work.


That analogy is a bit extreme. Manziel isn't 3 foot 8.



It would be cool if he was... like having Tyrion Lannister at QB!


Fri Feb 21, 2014 6:44 pm
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Post Re: Johnny Manziel
Mothman wrote:
frosted21 wrote:
PurpleKoolaid wrote:
Nothing against short people. Its just when I posted before on this a whole bunvha of people jumped down my throat, told me I was making it up, etc. Ticks me off when they down own up to it. Being short isn't a plus in drafting a QB. It just isn't. Neither is drafting a 150 pound NT. It wont work.


That analogy is a bit extreme. Manziel isn't 3 foot 8.



It would be cool if he was... like having Tyrion Lannister at QB!


:rofl:

WINTER IS COMING!!! (VALHALLA IS TOO)

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Fri Feb 21, 2014 7:18 pm
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Post Re: Johnny Manziel
It would be interesting to know what Rick Spielman, Norv Turner and the Vikings think about Manziel. Would they pass on him if he were available at no. 8? I wouldn't be amazed if they did.


Sat Feb 22, 2014 3:43 pm
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