Winfield Jr's Funny Post About Saints

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VikingPaul73
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Re: Winfield Jr's Funny Post About Saints

Post by VikingPaul73 » Thu Jan 21, 2021 8:37 am

I agree 1 year is too soon and I agree that the different systems and surrounding talent had an impact on their respective performances (I tried to address this point in counterpoint #1 above)

That said, if you could trade Gladney for Winfield straight up right now - would you?
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Re: Winfield Jr's Funny Post About Saints

Post by J. Kapp 11 » Thu Jan 21, 2021 9:39 am

VikingPaul73 wrote:
Thu Jan 21, 2021 8:37 am
I agree 1 year is too soon and I agree that the different systems and surrounding talent had an impact on their respective performances (I tried to address this point in counterpoint #1 above)

That said, if you could trade Gladney for Winfield straight up right now - would you?
Great question.

Yes, I would.

This has more to do with Winfield than it does with Gladney. Winfield has football instincts that can't be taught. To me, Gladney has the potential to be a good player, but Winfield has the potential to be great. Gladney was still a rookie at the end of the season. Winfield, like Justin Jefferson, had long since graduated from being a rookie.

I suppose the analytics crowd won't like that answer. Too bad. If one year is too soon, and if differing systems play into it, and everything that's been said here, then the only thing left is the eye test.
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Re: Winfield Jr's Funny Post About Saints

Post by VikingLord » Thu Jan 21, 2021 10:19 am

VikingPaul73 wrote:
Thu Jan 21, 2021 8:37 am
I agree 1 year is too soon and I agree that the different systems and surrounding talent had an impact on their respective performances (I tried to address this point in counterpoint #1 above)

That said, if you could trade Gladney for Winfield straight up right now - would you?
Yes.

I would have drafted Winfield if I were Spielman, but I think after he tagged Harris and let the starting CBs all go, he backed himself into a corner (...bad pun...) and took Gladney.

I'm still hopeful Gladney pans out, but I liked Winfield more coming out and if I had to say it I would predict he'll have the more productive pro career by a lot.

But it is too early to know that so I'm also hopeful I'm wrong about Gladney and he turns into an all-world pro CB.
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Re: Winfield Jr's Funny Post About Saints

Post by VikingPaul73 » Thu Jan 21, 2021 1:08 pm

Great points both!!!
And VL actually that was a pretty good pun :rofl: :rofl:


It brings up an interesting point. Since the idea should be to build through the draft and plug holes in FA, shouldn’t the draft be before FA begins ??
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Re: Winfield Jr's Funny Post About Saints

Post by chicagopurple » Thu Jan 21, 2021 2:42 pm

In the end, none of this makes any real difference till we have a powerful top tier OL and DL......its not sexy but its the unavoidable foundation which we totally lack.......
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Re: Winfield Jr's Funny Post About Saints

Post by S197 » Thu Jan 21, 2021 7:08 pm

VikingPaul73 wrote:
Thu Jan 21, 2021 8:37 am
I agree 1 year is too soon and I agree that the different systems and surrounding talent had an impact on their respective performances (I tried to address this point in counterpoint #1 above)

That said, if you could trade Gladney for Winfield straight up right now - would you?
In hindsight? I'd be more interested in hearing who wouldn't take Jr over Gladney.
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Re: Winfield Jr's Funny Post About Saints

Post by RandyMoss84 » Sat Jan 23, 2021 11:36 am

VikingLord wrote:
Thu Jan 21, 2021 10:19 am
VikingPaul73 wrote:
Thu Jan 21, 2021 8:37 am
I agree 1 year is too soon and I agree that the different systems and surrounding talent had an impact on their respective performances (I tried to address this point in counterpoint #1 above)

That said, if you could trade Gladney for Winfield straight up right now - would you?
Yes.

I would have drafted Winfield if I were Spielman, but I think after he tagged Harris and let the starting CBs all go, he backed himself into a corner (...bad pun...) and took Gladney.

I'm still hopeful Gladney pans out, but I liked Winfield more coming out and if I had to say it I would predict he'll have the more productive pro career by a lot.

But it is too early to know that so I'm also hopeful I'm wrong about Gladney and he turns into an all-world pro CB.
You just like Winfield more just because his dad played for our Vikings, if his dad never played for the Vikings, you would not like Winfield more
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Re: Winfield Jr's Funny Post About Saints

Post by VikingLord » Sat Jan 23, 2021 7:02 pm

RandyMoss84 wrote:
Sat Jan 23, 2021 11:36 am
VikingLord wrote:
Thu Jan 21, 2021 10:19 am


Yes.

I would have drafted Winfield if I were Spielman, but I think after he tagged Harris and let the starting CBs all go, he backed himself into a corner (...bad pun...) and took Gladney.

I'm still hopeful Gladney pans out, but I liked Winfield more coming out and if I had to say it I would predict he'll have the more productive pro career by a lot.

But it is too early to know that so I'm also hopeful I'm wrong about Gladney and he turns into an all-world pro CB.
You just like Winfield more just because his dad played for our Vikings, if his dad never played for the Vikings, you would not like Winfield more
From what I recall pre-draft, there were a few reasons I liked Winfield and a few reasons why I thought he'd slide farther than he should. Of the reasons I liked him, one was I saw him play more in college than the typical college prospect because he played for the Gophers. I didn't just see highlight clips and read pre-draft evals on him as is typical for most players entering the draft. Another reason I liked him coming out was his pedigree, not necessarily because his dad played for the Vikings, but because his dad played pro ball for a long time and as a very productive player. Yeah, it didn't hurt that his dad played for the Vikings, but even if he hadn't played for the Vikings but had still had a long, productive pro career, that would have been in Winfield's favor. The last reason I liked him was because he was considered an on-field leader and high character person. I value that because I think on field player leadership matters a lot, perhaps more than coaching, especially in critical situations where the pressure is on.

As to why I felt he would slide farther than he should based on his college production, it was all about his physical stats. He is a bit on the smaller side, and for some reason pro scouts still put a lot of value on height and weight and strength even if the tape indicates that doesn't matter as much. It might matter at some positions more than safety, but Winfield's play, when taken by itself, merited a 1st round grade.

Of course, I can't prefer Winfield in a vacuum, so why would I prefer Winfield over Gladney?

Well, IIRC, Gladney was more of a "potential" guy coming out. He had more of the "measurables", but less of the consistent production. Gladney was a guy who could "develop". He was competitive on the field, seemed willing to tackle against the run, and made some nice plays, but he lacked consistency and I never read anything about his on-field leadership or character (positive or negative, but generally when there isn't anything to say it indicates at the very least the person is not an on-field leader). That doesn't mean he's a negative guy or will be a distraction, but just that he's unlikely to be the guy in the defensive huddle who is holding his teammates accountable as well as himself. Seems to me the Vikings have been plagued by a lack of defensive leadership for several seasons now, so if Gladney doesn't improve that and Winfield does, all things considered I'd go with Winfield.

Anyway, believe what you want, but Winfield is likely to prove himself to be the better draft pick of the two.
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