Bears game Dec. 20

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Re: Bears game Dec. 20

Post by Bowhunting Viking » Sun Dec 20, 2020 6:18 pm

Boon wrote:
Sun Dec 20, 2020 4:44 pm
I've come to terms with this team . It is what it is. I wont see them hoist a trophy in my lifetime and its pretty much set in stone
If u read my signature at the bottom u will see that I am right there with ya brother. I turned 56 this past October, I have been a die hard Vikes fan since I was old enough to know what football was. I have seen alot , most of actually, things on my bucket list happen. This is one that I have just Pine for for years!! I thought of the tattoo design that I was gonna get on my arm from shoulder down to my wrist showing my allegiance to the Vikes and my absolute joy that I felt if we would ever win a SB.
I inherited a case if artery disease from my mom's side and have had 2 stupid heart attacks, my 1st one at 26 and my 2nd one at 41. Fortunately I am still doing well and am in pretty good shape, but I know that it can happen again at any time and tomorrow isn't promised. I feel like I am living on borrowed time and really want to know what it's like to be a fan if the Super Bowl champions. The years we came so close 98, 08, a few yrs ago the Miracle season, and then all those damn SB losses as a kid all still cause me pain and agony when I think about them or see them referenced. I really thought a few yrs ago we finally had the team and got a few missing pieces to finally get there. And I really thought Zimmer could bring a coaching style to help get there.
Well.... WRONG!!!!
So honestly I am just about ready to tap out, realize I will be dead before I see it and just accept it and quit wishing for it and expecting that it will happen. Just start trying to not to have any expectations and enjoy the wins and accept the stupid losses.
It's like fate has just made up its mind that the Vikings are not gonna be Super Bowl champs .. EVER.
Now I say all this because I'm pissed off at the outcome today and of the whole season in general. I will be back at it next year dreaming that we will hoist the trophy at the end of the season.
But right now I am with you buddy and just give up.
I am definitely not excited about spending Christmas day witnessing what I expect to happen against that team that I absolutely hate and their jerk crybaby fat headed coach Payton.
Sorry about the negativity but I can't find any other emotion about the Vikings at the moment.
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Re: Bears game Dec. 20

Post by VikeFanInEagleLand » Sun Dec 20, 2020 6:20 pm

Boon wrote:
Sun Dec 20, 2020 4:53 pm
RandyMoss84 wrote:
Sun Dec 20, 2020 4:51 pm


It is funny that when Zimmer was hired, everyone was saying that Zimmer will being home a Superbowl championship and 7 years and counting, it has not happened and they are wrong so far
Nobody was saying that. Calm down
I think you're the one who needs to calm down. What the Vikings did today or this year has no bearing on what they will do for the rest of your lifetime.
Last edited by VikeFanInEagleLand on Sun Dec 20, 2020 6:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Bears game Dec. 20

Post by VikeFanInEagleLand » Sun Dec 20, 2020 6:43 pm

How I see it....

The Viking's are young and we knew that this was probably going to be a transitional year. That, along with injuries has shown most of the year along the OL, and the defense. But both gained experience and I saw improvement throughout the year. As a fan that was once super critical of Cousins ability to lead us to a championship, I can say that he won me over this year. That is not to say that I still don't have concerns. In today's game, there were flashes of the old Kirk that did all the things that the old Kirk did...staring down his receiver, standing like a statue in the pocket with no sign of an internal clock, unwillingness to take a deep shot, even if that means a contested catch. But like I said, there were only flashes and today's loss doesn't way heavily on his shoulders.

The defense played well at times today, but some credit has to be given to Chicago as they executed well today. Yes, there were times when the defense faltered, but overall I'm not going to be too critical for this banged up, inexperienced unit.

Cook & Jefferson along with Thielen looked like the stars that they are.

For the third time this year, I lay most of the blame today on the coaching. The play calling was horrific at times. And the call to go for it from your own 35 at the end of the first half was inexcusable. (plus the play call was terrible). How many times does Zimmer have to do this before he learns his lesson. If not for the free FG ZImmer gave to the Bears on that call, the Vikings would have been trying to get in FG range at the end instead of being forced to score a TD.

Where once, Cousins was the root of my concerns and frustrations with this team, it now lies with the coaching staff.

I'm not giving up. I'll go into next year with hope. I see this team as having the talent needed. If we can stay healthier, and can win in spite of the coaching, maybe a Super Bowl?
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Re: Bears game Dec. 20

Post by VikingLord » Sun Dec 20, 2020 7:32 pm

Here's another observation on review. This one involves Cousins. Does anyone else get the sense that Cousins is hesitating to pull the trigger the last 3-4 games?

He didn't get great protection today for sure, but I counted several plays where he had time to read the field and let it fly, and on several of the plays it seemed like he had a receiver open, but for whatever reason he just didn't let it go. He was under a lot of pressure in the early part of the season and didn't get a lot of time to survey the field. Then in the middle part of the season when the Vikings seemingly turned things around it seemed like Cousins was letting it fly. And then as the team pulled back to .500 and started having success it almost seems like his mentality has changed and he's trying to consciously avoid making mistakes.

Whatever it is, it's not working well for him. He's not necessarily making mistakes per se, but he's not making nearly as many big plays or being as effective. This is especially true once the Vikings get into the red zone.

I'm not down on Cousins. I've defended him for the most part and I think he's played pretty well since the poor start to the season. I don't think he's the main problem with the team right now, or the main reason the team lost today or last week against the Bucs.

But he isn't playing loose, and as a result the explosive pass plays have virtually dried up.

It probably doesn't matter much now as I don't think the Vikings will make the playoffs, but if the Vikings can't get consistency out of Cousins next year and they can't push the ball through the air to the middle and deep areas of the field, I don't think this team can take the next step that I expect them to take. Having Cook is great. Assuming the defense gets some key players back and plays much better is great. But if Cousins can't keep it loose and keep defenses honest because he's hesitating to test them, I don't see how the Vikings overall can get beyond being a 1st or 2nd round playoff team.

He's got to play loose. Not reckless, but loose. Take some chances and be willing to have it go against him.
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Re: Bears game Dec. 20

Post by HardcoreVikesFan » Sun Dec 20, 2020 7:43 pm

Imagine having Mitchel Trubisky and Matt Nagy consistently out-coach and destroy your defense year-in and year-out.

What a pathetic franchise. 1-5 against Matt Nagy. 1-5. The Bears were dead and we gave them life.
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Re: Bears game Dec. 20

Post by TSonn » Sun Dec 20, 2020 7:59 pm

VikingLord wrote:
Sun Dec 20, 2020 7:32 pm
Here's another observation on review. This one involves Cousins. Does anyone else get the sense that Cousins is hesitating to pull the trigger the last 3-4 games?

He didn't get great protection today for sure, but I counted several plays where he had time to read the field and let it fly, and on several of the plays it seemed like he had a receiver open, but for whatever reason he just didn't let it go. He was under a lot of pressure in the early part of the season and didn't get a lot of time to survey the field. Then in the middle part of the season when the Vikings seemingly turned things around it seemed like Cousins was letting it fly. And then as the team pulled back to .500 and started having success it almost seems like his mentality has changed and he's trying to consciously avoid making mistakes.

Whatever it is, it's not working well for him. He's not necessarily making mistakes per se, but he's not making nearly as many big plays or being as effective. This is especially true once the Vikings get into the red zone.

I'm not down on Cousins. I've defended him for the most part and I think he's played pretty well since the poor start to the season. I don't think he's the main problem with the team right now, or the main reason the team lost today or last week against the Bucs.

But he isn't playing loose, and as a result the explosive pass plays have virtually dried up.

It probably doesn't matter much now as I don't think the Vikings will make the playoffs, but if the Vikings can't get consistency out of Cousins next year and they can't push the ball through the air to the middle and deep areas of the field, I don't think this team can take the next step that I expect them to take. Having Cook is great. Assuming the defense gets some key players back and plays much better is great. But if Cousins can't keep it loose and keep defenses honest because he's hesitating to test them, I don't see how the Vikings overall can get beyond being a 1st or 2nd round playoff team.

He's got to play loose. Not reckless, but loose. Take some chances and be willing to have it go against him.
Good observation. I think it has to do with Zimmer's overall philosophy which gives us a very little room for error each game for a victory - and that sliver gets even smaller with each mistake. Tough to play loose when you feel like you've already lost the game with an INT in the first quarter.
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Re: Bears game Dec. 20

Post by Bowhunting Viking » Sun Dec 20, 2020 8:08 pm

Ok I have a little more time to calm down a bit and not look thru mad pissed off eyes. Lol. I still love my Vikings and always will and will always be rooting for them to get to The Promised Land.
I read some of the above posts and some of your comments and observations about Cousins. I will add a few things.
I will say that I am happy in the fact that Kirk has really, for about the past 5 or 6 wks , and especially the past few games, has really been showing some fire , emotion and some attitude. He finally has seemed to let go a little and let his anger show. Not lose your mind and your cool anger that makes you completely get off track. But competitive anger. One good example was today when we had to burn a timeout because we didn't get the play called in in time. You could see him really upset and he yelled " Get the play in" or something close to that. Also when they were trying to get the play off and Irv screwed up and didn't get set in time. I think that they had a play call that Kirk really felt would work , and Smith messing it up by not getting set screwed it up. At least that's the way I interpreted things.
In the past in situations like that he would be just kinda go with it, show no emotion and actually be sorta robotic. I for one am glad to finally see him showing some real emotion out there.
VL you brought up about the way Kirk seems to be too cautious and afraid to pull the trigger on passes. I agree on that, but I also kinda sense something else with that. And somebody on the game chat kinda seemed to sense it also when they said Kirk just seems kinda off like something is wrong.
Well, maybe it's just me, but by the eye test , it seems like Cousins almost looks like on some of his passes he is delivering the ball differently, kinda like he is having to add more to his throwing motion to get the ball off. It just looked different and kinda weird today. Maybe I was just seeing things. But I just felt like when he would throw, when he brought his arm to the top of his motion, it just looked like he was trying to put more on the ball and forcing it. Almost like he was hurt, not at full strength, so he had to force it.
I don't know, like I said , maybe it was just my imagination. But it just didn't look like normal passing motion and delivery. That coupled with the fact that he really didn't attempt any real deep passes to speak of, it just made feel like maybe something is wrong that is making him more apprehensive to let it fly.
Maybe I am all wrong. Maybe just looking for an excuse for my grief lol. But something just didn't seem right with him today. And as I said, someone mentioned it during the chat, so I thought maybe I'm not just seeing things.
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Re: Bears game Dec. 20

Post by S197 » Sun Dec 20, 2020 9:00 pm

I mentioned this in the chat but when is the last time Cousins has called an audible? Or made a protection change? Someone mentioned it was the same with Teddy, so it could be a Zimmer thing but it’s very odd to see a QB make elite money and not take command of the offense pre-snap.

I’m starting to think part of the issue is that while individually, Rick, Zimmer and Cousins are pretty good at their respective jobs, they’re a poor fit together. Zimmer is a run first, ball control type of coach. A philosophy you don’t really need to break the bank on a QB for. I think this is why he really loved Teddy, he was the perfect game manager. Kirk has a great arm but poor pocket presence and they make him stand back there and take constant pressure because Rick simply can’t draft even a modestly decent pass blocking line. At best he’s found some ok run blockers but if you look at almost every playoff team this year, their OL strength is in pass protection. The 3 teams where that isn’t the case (Seahawks, Ravens, Bills) all have mobile QBs.

The point is we’re supposed to be building a team not just bringing in a mishmash of parts and cramming them together. This is why I don’t think it works without getting rid of them all. If they get rid of Zimmer, is Rick suddenly going to learn how to draft a line that can pass protect? People are too focused on individual accomplishments. The reason this team stalls all the time is the team is setup to look good on paper but totally uncomplimentary and the powers that be are totally oblivious to this.
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Re: Bears game Dec. 20

Post by 9man » Sun Dec 20, 2020 9:31 pm

Something was definitely off today. Did anyone notice the play where Cousins missed JJ in the end zone and JJ cursed him out? “F*** Kirk! Throw the football!” Kirk seemed hesitant on many plays.
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Re: Bears game Dec. 20

Post by TSonn » Sun Dec 20, 2020 10:39 pm

9man wrote:
Sun Dec 20, 2020 9:31 pm
Something was definitely off today. Did anyone notice the play where Cousins missed JJ in the end zone and JJ cursed him out? “F*** Kirk! Throw the football!” Kirk seemed hesitant on many plays.
I'm pretty sure if JJ saw that Kirk was running right (for his life) and throwing left he probably wouldn't have been upset with Kirk. Only 2 guys in the league make that throw more often than they miss - the rest probably don't even get as close as Kirk did.
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Re: Bears game Dec. 20

Post by RandyMoss84 » Sun Dec 20, 2020 11:19 pm

Boon wrote:
Sun Dec 20, 2020 4:53 pm
RandyMoss84 wrote:
Sun Dec 20, 2020 4:51 pm


It is funny that when Zimmer was hired, everyone was saying that Zimmer will being home a Superbowl championship and 7 years and counting, it has not happened and they are wrong so far
Nobody was saying that. Calm down
Not here but on Facebook, I remember there were a bunch of fans saying Zimmer will bring us a Superbowl championship when he got hired
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Re: Bears game Dec. 20

Post by Bowhunting Viking » Mon Dec 21, 2020 5:29 am

9man wrote:
Sun Dec 20, 2020 9:31 pm
Something was definitely off today. Did anyone notice the play where Cousins missed JJ in the end zone and JJ cursed him out? “F*** Kirk! Throw the football!” Kirk seemed hesitant on many plays.
On PFT there was an article last night about JJ doing that. He was pretty pissed that so much was being made of it. JJ said, and the Vikings actually retweeted it later, " I am definitely no diva. You (referring to the media) guys like to make this stuff more than what it is"
I love that. Kid doesn't want to be seen as a diva.
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Re: Bears game Dec. 20

Post by J. Kapp 11 » Mon Dec 21, 2020 7:20 am

RandyMoss84 wrote:
Sun Dec 20, 2020 11:19 pm
Boon wrote:
Sun Dec 20, 2020 4:53 pm


Nobody was saying that. Calm down
Not here but on Facebook, I remember there were a bunch of fans saying Zimmer will bring us a Superbowl championship when he got hired
Well, I remember a long, eloquent article about Zimmer in Sports Illustrated (I believe). Wasn't when he was first hired, but fairly shortly thereafter. It cited all these guys who said they'd pretty much die for the guy, and how he builds relationships and a football family. I can't find it right now, but I remember it well because it influenced my thinking a lot.

There was another one before the 2017 season that also painted Zimmer in a very positive light regarding relationships with players and team building. Seems amazing now amid the claims that he bullies people.
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Re: Bears game Dec. 20

Post by chicagopurple » Mon Dec 21, 2020 9:25 am

Interesting to see that the effects of Purple Kool Aid wear off almost immediately after seeing our decrepit organization get beaten by a miserable franchise like Da Bears. Make no excuses, the Bears have no real QB, are easily rattled into losing games, and have a very flawed Head Coach......yet, they are still better then this miserable incarnation of the once mighty Purple People Eaters. JJ is very likely to leave this team out of frustration with a poor and out of touch Coach and an incapable QB. Much like Diggs, I would not blame him. What superstar receiver would waste their talent on Cousins and Zim, or a GM who cant build an OL? This team will continue to spin its wheels and go nowhere with Zim, Cousins, & Speilman. But I dont think the Wilfs really care as long as they are making their money.
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Re: Bears game Dec. 20

Post by VikingLord » Mon Dec 21, 2020 2:13 pm

TSonn wrote:
Sun Dec 20, 2020 10:39 pm
9man wrote:
Sun Dec 20, 2020 9:31 pm
Something was definitely off today. Did anyone notice the play where Cousins missed JJ in the end zone and JJ cursed him out? “F*** Kirk! Throw the football!” Kirk seemed hesitant on many plays.
I'm pretty sure if JJ saw that Kirk was running right (for his life) and throwing left he probably wouldn't have been upset with Kirk. Only 2 guys in the league make that throw more often than they miss - the rest probably don't even get as close as Kirk did.
Very tough throw to make.

I'm not seeing what Cousins is seeing, but my main criticism of him on that play was when he cocked the ball back and looked like he was going to let it go, only to pull it back and then start to roll out. I'm not sure if that is what JJ was referring to, but it probably was.

In effect, JJ wanted the ball to come out on his initial break, but Cousins hesitated for whatever reason. As a result, Cousins had to escape the pocket and throw on the move, which then made the resulting throw much more difficult than it would have been had Cousins simply let it fly initially.
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