Dalvin Cook

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Dalvin Cook

Post by RandyMoss84 » Thu Apr 09, 2020 7:47 pm

Dalvin said he is the best running back in the NFL and is set to receive a huge contract extension, how can Dalvin be the best running back in the NFL if he keeps getting hurt? I have mixed feelings about Cook getting a huge contract extension since he could not stay healthy, thoughts?
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Re: Dalvin Cook

Post by VikingsVictorious » Thu Apr 09, 2020 8:04 pm

RandyMoss84 wrote:
Thu Apr 09, 2020 7:47 pm
Dalvin said he is the best running back in the NFL and is set to receive a huge contract extension, how can Dalvin be the best running back in the NFL if he keeps getting hurt? I have mixed feelings about Cook getting a huge contract extension since he could not stay healthy, thoughts?
He stayed mostly healthy last year and was very good but faded down the stretch. I would be happy with him at $8 million a year and could probably live with us extending him at $10 million a year, but would not like a lot of guaranteed money in the deal. That won't get it done. So If I were the GM I would get what I could for him and let him go.
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Re: Dalvin Cook

Post by Pondering Her Percy » Thu Apr 09, 2020 9:10 pm

VikingsVictorious wrote:
Thu Apr 09, 2020 8:04 pm
RandyMoss84 wrote:
Thu Apr 09, 2020 7:47 pm
Dalvin said he is the best running back in the NFL and is set to receive a huge contract extension, how can Dalvin be the best running back in the NFL if he keeps getting hurt? I have mixed feelings about Cook getting a huge contract extension since he could not stay healthy, thoughts?
He stayed mostly healthy last year and was very good but faded down the stretch. I would be happy with him at $8 million a year and could probably live with us extending him at $10 million a year, but would not like a lot of guaranteed money in the deal. That won't get it done. So If I were the GM I would get what I could for him and let him go.
Cook is what makes this offense go. I think he is a top 3 back in the NFL. There really isnt anything he cant do. In no way would I be looking to trade him. You dont give up on a guy of his talent this early because of "injury concerns". Because if he ends up staying healthy for the next 5 years and we trade him, we look like morons.

I feel like since we lost so much in FA, so many fans are like, "yeah lets trade this guy and that guy too". We have 12 draft picks right now. Trading Cook and Harris would then force us to draft these postions in a few weeks on top of everything else. We're opening unnecessary holes by getting rid of elite talent and taking a giant gamble that we will find a replacement even somewhat near the same talent. If made these trades, we could end up with 15+ picks. What are we going to do when 2024 rolls around? You guys think we lost a lot now, 2024 is going to be a debacle.
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Re: Dalvin Cook

Post by RandyMoss84 » Thu Apr 09, 2020 9:26 pm

Pondering Her Percy wrote:
Thu Apr 09, 2020 9:10 pm
VikingsVictorious wrote:
Thu Apr 09, 2020 8:04 pm

He stayed mostly healthy last year and was very good but faded down the stretch. I would be happy with him at $8 million a year and could probably live with us extending him at $10 million a year, but would not like a lot of guaranteed money in the deal. That won't get it done. So If I were the GM I would get what I could for him and let him go.
Cook is what makes this offense go. I think he is a top 3 back in the NFL. There really isnt anything he cant do. In no way would I be looking to trade him. You dont give up on a guy of his talent this early because of "injury concerns". Because if he ends up staying healthy for the next 5 years and we trade him, we look like morons.

I feel like since we lost so much in FA, so many fans are like, "yeah lets trade this guy and that guy too". We have 12 draft picks right now. Trading Cook and Harris would then force us to draft these postions in a few weeks on top of everything else. We're opening unnecessary holes by getting rid of elite talent and taking a giant gamble that we will find a replacement even somewhat near the same talent. If made these trades, we could end up with 15+ picks. What are we going to do when 2024 rolls around? You guys think we lost a lot now, 2024 is going to be a debacle.
Vikings do not need to replace Cook in a few weeks if he gets traded, Mattison can replace Cook
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Re: Dalvin Cook

Post by Pondering Her Percy » Thu Apr 09, 2020 9:52 pm

RandyMoss84 wrote:
Thu Apr 09, 2020 9:26 pm
Pondering Her Percy wrote:
Thu Apr 09, 2020 9:10 pm


Cook is what makes this offense go. I think he is a top 3 back in the NFL. There really isnt anything he cant do. In no way would I be looking to trade him. You dont give up on a guy of his talent this early because of "injury concerns". Because if he ends up staying healthy for the next 5 years and we trade him, we look like morons.

I feel like since we lost so much in FA, so many fans are like, "yeah lets trade this guy and that guy too". We have 12 draft picks right now. Trading Cook and Harris would then force us to draft these postions in a few weeks on top of everything else. We're opening unnecessary holes by getting rid of elite talent and taking a giant gamble that we will find a replacement even somewhat near the same talent. If made these trades, we could end up with 15+ picks. What are we going to do when 2024 rolls around? You guys think we lost a lot now, 2024 is going to be a debacle.
Vikings do not need to replace Cook in a few weeks if he gets traded, Mattison can replace Cook
Refer to the other post where I talked about this. You're saying Mattison can replace Cook and that you dont want to extend Cook because he is "injury prone". Yet Mattison has only been in the league one year and missed 3 games this year, which was less than Cook missed. And Cook had 193 more touches than Mattison did. So how is anyone suppose to believe Mattison can replace Cook based off that evidence?
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Re: Dalvin Cook

Post by cmoss84 » Thu Apr 09, 2020 10:32 pm

I think it comes down to the RBs in this draft. If you think the top 2 or 3 backs are elite, maybe you trade Cook and get his replacement on a new rookie contract.
The way they break down, why not have a revolving door of young, cheap RBs and spend $ on OL/DL?

What are everyone's thoughts on Swift/Dobbins/others?

*I do like Mattison, but prefer him as a stellar backup
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Re: Dalvin Cook

Post by S197 » Fri Apr 10, 2020 1:55 am

Cook is an incredible player but I’m not a fan of giving RBs big contracts. Who has that worked out well for?

This is going to be a really challenging offseason. No rookie camp, OTAs will probably be cancelled, even training camp isn’t a guarantee. All of that against a backdrop of a team that is losing a ton of vets and will need to rely on rookies and 2nd year players. Season seems like a sunk cost to me. Even under optimal conditions Zimmer hasn’t been able to produce back to back winning seasons. Suddenly he’s going to do it with those headwinds? Seems unlikely to me. This is the season to rebuild and reassess.
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Re: Dalvin Cook

Post by fiestavike » Fri Apr 10, 2020 4:39 am

S197 wrote:
Fri Apr 10, 2020 1:55 am
Cook is an incredible player but I’m not a fan of giving RBs big contracts. Who has that worked out well for?

This is going to be a really challenging offseason. No rookie camp, OTAs will probably be cancelled, even training camp isn’t a guarantee. All of that against a backdrop of a team that is losing a ton of vets and will need to rely on rookies and 2nd year players. Season seems like a sunk cost to me. Even under optimal conditions Zimmer hasn’t been able to produce back to back winning seasons. Suddenly he’s going to do it with those headwinds? Seems unlikely to me. This is the season to rebuild and reassess.
I totally agree. There is no point mortgaging the future for what is looking like an increasingly LOOOOOONG shot in 2020. First, that means not re-signing Cook, because its going to cost way too much. As you said, signing RBs to huge contracts is a mistake. Ditto for Harris. Not worth what he's seeking. Second, that means exploring what you can get for them. It might be best to take the production this year and then get compensatory picks. Teams tend to like their picks more than they do players who are seeking expensive deals. The worst case scenario is that these guys are on the roster in 2021, unless they sign very team friendly deals.
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Re: Dalvin Cook

Post by VikingsVictorious » Fri Apr 10, 2020 6:45 am

S197 wrote:
Fri Apr 10, 2020 1:55 am
Cook is an incredible player but I’m not a fan of giving RBs big contracts. Who has that worked out well for?

This is going to be a really challenging offseason. No rookie camp, OTAs will probably be cancelled, even training camp isn’t a guarantee. All of that against a backdrop of a team that is losing a ton of vets and will need to rely on rookies and 2nd year players. Season seems like a sunk cost to me. Even under optimal conditions Zimmer hasn’t been able to produce back to back winning seasons. Suddenly he’s going to do it with those headwinds? Seems unlikely to me. This is the season to rebuild and reassess.
We are currently on three winning seasons in a row.
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Re: Dalvin Cook

Post by Pondering Her Percy » Fri Apr 10, 2020 7:18 am

fiestavike wrote:
Fri Apr 10, 2020 4:39 am
S197 wrote:
Fri Apr 10, 2020 1:55 am
Cook is an incredible player but I’m not a fan of giving RBs big contracts. Who has that worked out well for?

This is going to be a really challenging offseason. No rookie camp, OTAs will probably be cancelled, even training camp isn’t a guarantee. All of that against a backdrop of a team that is losing a ton of vets and will need to rely on rookies and 2nd year players. Season seems like a sunk cost to me. Even under optimal conditions Zimmer hasn’t been able to produce back to back winning seasons. Suddenly he’s going to do it with those headwinds? Seems unlikely to me. This is the season to rebuild and reassess.
I totally agree. There is no point mortgaging the future for what is looking like an increasingly LOOOOOONG shot in 2020. First, that means not re-signing Cook, because its going to cost way too much. As you said, signing RBs to huge contracts is a mistake. Ditto for Harris. Not worth what he's seeking. Second, that means exploring what you can get for them. It might be best to take the production this year and then get compensatory picks. Teams tend to like their picks more than they do players who are seeking expensive deals. The worst case scenario is that these guys are on the roster in 2021, unless they sign very team friendly deals.
Harris is a top 3 safety in the NFL. He definitely has the best ball skills in the league IMO. I dont blame him one bit for his asking price. He deserves every bit of it.

What's way too much for Cook? He was a top RB in the league last year. He proved to be fairly healthy this year and now we're going to let him walk or trade him? Seems very premature if you ask me.

I also dont get how giving Cook and Harris contracts is "mortgaging the future"? I feel like so many fans did nothing but complain this offseason because we let so many guys walk in FA and didnt really sign anyone in FA outside of Pierce. Yet now fans arent even willing to pay our own, no less two players that are in the top 5 at their position. Maybe even top 3. Like, not resigning our own free agents and taking a back seat in regards to outside free agents, does nothing but give us more money in the future to pay the younger and BETTER players on our roster like Cook and Harris. Not guys like Waynes, Alexander, Kearse, Griffen, Weatherly, etc. By no means were those guys bad. Many were good players.

But if you give me a list of:

Cook
Harris
Waynes
Alexander
Kearse
Griffen
Weatherly
Sendejo

and said pick 2 you'd like to give long term deals to, I'd pick Cook and Harris every day of the week and twice on weekends. We cant just sit back and not spend any money and let everyone walk or trade them. We need to continue to build through the draft and re-sign out top young players. What mortgages the future is trying to trade away all our best players. If we trade those guys, that means we would have traded Anthony Harris, Dalvin Cook and Stefon Diggs all in one offseason. I'm sorry but that is asinine
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Re: Dalvin Cook

Post by StumpHunter » Fri Apr 10, 2020 7:35 am

fiestavike wrote:
Fri Apr 10, 2020 4:39 am
S197 wrote:
Fri Apr 10, 2020 1:55 am
Cook is an incredible player but I’m not a fan of giving RBs big contracts. Who has that worked out well for?

This is going to be a really challenging offseason. No rookie camp, OTAs will probably be cancelled, even training camp isn’t a guarantee. All of that against a backdrop of a team that is losing a ton of vets and will need to rely on rookies and 2nd year players. Season seems like a sunk cost to me. Even under optimal conditions Zimmer hasn’t been able to produce back to back winning seasons. Suddenly he’s going to do it with those headwinds? Seems unlikely to me. This is the season to rebuild and reassess.
I totally agree. There is no point mortgaging the future for what is looking like an increasingly LOOOOOONG shot in 2020. First, that means not re-signing Cook, because its going to cost way too much. As you said, signing RBs to huge contracts is a mistake. Ditto for Harris. Not worth what he's seeking. Second, that means exploring what you can get for them. It might be best to take the production this year and then get compensatory picks. Teams tend to like their picks more than they do players who are seeking expensive deals. The worst case scenario is that these guys are on the roster in 2021, unless they sign very team friendly deals.
Signing most RBs to big contracts is a huge mistake. There are some who are super durable and produce every year who aren't, though. Giving AP all that money years ago was a good decision. When the Titans finally pony up for Henry that will be a good decision.

I don't think Cook falls into that worth a big extension category, but only because of the durability. On the other hand, if he has 4-5 more years like 2019 he definitely is.
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Re: Dalvin Cook

Post by Pondering Her Percy » Fri Apr 10, 2020 8:27 am

StumpHunter wrote:
Fri Apr 10, 2020 7:35 am
fiestavike wrote:
Fri Apr 10, 2020 4:39 am


I totally agree. There is no point mortgaging the future for what is looking like an increasingly LOOOOOONG shot in 2020. First, that means not re-signing Cook, because its going to cost way too much. As you said, signing RBs to huge contracts is a mistake. Ditto for Harris. Not worth what he's seeking. Second, that means exploring what you can get for them. It might be best to take the production this year and then get compensatory picks. Teams tend to like their picks more than they do players who are seeking expensive deals. The worst case scenario is that these guys are on the roster in 2021, unless they sign very team friendly deals.
Signing most RBs to big contracts is a huge mistake. There are some who are super durable and produce every year who aren't, though. Giving AP all that money years ago was a good decision. When the Titans finally pony up for Henry that will be a good decision.

I don't think Cook falls into that worth a big extension category, but only because of the durability. On the other hand, if he has 4-5 more years like 2019 he definitely is.
That's the thing. Sure you have to consider the injuries but like I mentioned before, I have a hard time buying into the "injury prone" label. Dalvin Cook could very well have 4-5 more healthy years. Or he could miss another 20 games. It's the chance you take. Out of the 2 "bigger" injuries he suffered, the only one that would worry me as a GM is the hamstring. The ACL can happen to anyone. Derrick Henry is one of the most durable backs in the NFL but he could just as easily blown his knee out day 1 of training camp. No less players recover from those much better than they use to years ago. Soft tissue injuries can linger for a while.

Either way, I think by trading him or letting him walk after a breakout year like he just had, is absolutely crazy. Given his talent, you 100% take the chance that he stays healthy. If he was an average player that is easily replaceable, sure let him go. But to find a RB that is just as good running the ball as he is catching out of the backfield and add in his elusiveness, it's much harder to find than you think. I love Mattison but I dont think Mattison is Dalvin Cook either. Cook is a special talent.
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Re: Dalvin Cook

Post by VikingsVictorious » Fri Apr 10, 2020 8:29 am

Pondering Her Percy wrote:
Fri Apr 10, 2020 7:18 am
fiestavike wrote:
Fri Apr 10, 2020 4:39 am


I totally agree. There is no point mortgaging the future for what is looking like an increasingly LOOOOOONG shot in 2020. First, that means not re-signing Cook, because its going to cost way too much. As you said, signing RBs to huge contracts is a mistake. Ditto for Harris. Not worth what he's seeking. Second, that means exploring what you can get for them. It might be best to take the production this year and then get compensatory picks. Teams tend to like their picks more than they do players who are seeking expensive deals. The worst case scenario is that these guys are on the roster in 2021, unless they sign very team friendly deals.
Harris is a top 3 safety in the NFL. He definitely has the best ball skills in the league IMO. I dont blame him one bit for his asking price. He deserves every bit of it.

What's way too much for Cook? He was a top RB in the league last year. He proved to be fairly healthy this year and now we're going to let him walk or trade him? Seems very premature if you ask me.

I also dont get how giving Cook and Harris contracts is "mortgaging the future"? I feel like so many fans did nothing but complain this offseason because we let so many guys walk in FA and didnt really sign anyone in FA outside of Pierce. Yet now fans arent even willing to pay our own, no less two players that are in the top 5 at their position. Maybe even top 3. Like, not resigning our own free agents and taking a back seat in regards to outside free agents, does nothing but give us more money in the future to pay the younger and BETTER players on our roster like Cook and Harris. Not guys like Waynes, Alexander, Kearse, Griffen, Weatherly, etc. By no means were those guys bad. Many were good players.

But if you give me a list of:

Cook
Harris
Waynes
Alexander
Kearse
Griffen
Weatherly
Sendejo

and said pick 2 you'd like to give long term deals to, I'd pick Cook and Harris every day of the week and twice on weekends. We cant just sit back and not spend any money and let everyone walk or trade them. We need to continue to build through the draft and re-sign out top young players. What mortgages the future is trying to trade away all our best players. If we trade those guys, that means we would have traded Anthony Harris, Dalvin Cook and Stefon Diggs all in one offseason. I'm sorry but that is asinine
I was going to give you a thumbs up until the last 4 words. Even if you're right that's too insulting. I'm in favor of retaining Harris at a reasonable contract. I think that would be $11 million a year or less. Because of how badly large contracts to RBs have been working out $10 million a year is the max I would find acceptable for Cook.We will see how it all works out in the end.
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Re: Dalvin Cook

Post by StumpHunter » Fri Apr 10, 2020 10:14 am

Pondering Her Percy wrote:
Fri Apr 10, 2020 8:27 am
StumpHunter wrote:
Fri Apr 10, 2020 7:35 am


Signing most RBs to big contracts is a huge mistake. There are some who are super durable and produce every year who aren't, though. Giving AP all that money years ago was a good decision. When the Titans finally pony up for Henry that will be a good decision.

I don't think Cook falls into that worth a big extension category, but only because of the durability. On the other hand, if he has 4-5 more years like 2019 he definitely is.
That's the thing. Sure you have to consider the injuries but like I mentioned before, I have a hard time buying into the "injury prone" label. Dalvin Cook could very well have 4-5 more healthy years. Or he could miss another 20 games. It's the chance you take. Out of the 2 "bigger" injuries he suffered, the only one that would worry me as a GM is the hamstring. The ACL can happen to anyone. Derrick Henry is one of the most durable backs in the NFL but he could just as easily blown his knee out day 1 of training camp. No less players recover from those much better than they use to years ago. Soft tissue injuries can linger for a while.

Either way, I think by trading him or letting him walk after a breakout year like he just had, is absolutely crazy. Given his talent, you 100% take the chance that he stays healthy. If he was an average player that is easily replaceable, sure let him go. But to find a RB that is just as good running the ball as he is catching out of the backfield and add in his elusiveness, it's much harder to find than you think. I love Mattison but I dont think Mattison is Dalvin Cook either. Cook is a special talent.
He might very well be worth the gamble, I agree.

One thing I wanted point out is that when I refer to durability, I am not really calling Cook injury prone. There are very few RBs who can survive a 16 game season as the workhorse back. The human body just isn't built to handle that kind of punishment. If you are paying a guy that much money it is to be a workhorse back. Can Cook be that type of back for the next 3-4 years? He certainly has the talent to be that type of back, but I don't think we know how durable he is yet. Next year will answer a lot of those questions, with him coming off a season with a large number of carries.

Another thing I want to point out in favor of Cook, is that not all 1K yard seasons are the same. A RB picking up 1k while every defense is focused on stopping him is way more valuable than a RB picking up 1K yards as the 3rd or 4th focus of the defense. So while we might find a back or combination of backs who can get close to the yards Cook can, that doesn't mean that RB or RBs are having the same impact as Cook has.
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Re: Dalvin Cook

Post by RandyMoss84 » Fri Apr 10, 2020 11:34 am

VikingsVictorious wrote:
Fri Apr 10, 2020 6:45 am
S197 wrote:
Fri Apr 10, 2020 1:55 am
Cook is an incredible player but I’m not a fan of giving RBs big contracts. Who has that worked out well for?

This is going to be a really challenging offseason. No rookie camp, OTAs will probably be cancelled, even training camp isn’t a guarantee. All of that against a backdrop of a team that is losing a ton of vets and will need to rely on rookies and 2nd year players. Season seems like a sunk cost to me. Even under optimal conditions Zimmer hasn’t been able to produce back to back winning seasons. Suddenly he’s going to do it with those headwinds? Seems unlikely to me. This is the season to rebuild and reassess.
We are currently on three winning seasons in a row.
8-7-1 is a winning season?
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