Sendejo Signs With Cleveland

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VikingsVictorious
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Re: Sendejo Signs With Cleveland

Post by VikingsVictorious » Sat Mar 21, 2020 10:32 pm

YikesVikes wrote:
Sat Mar 21, 2020 9:03 pm
VikingsVictorious wrote:
Sat Mar 21, 2020 8:14 pm

IMO retaining Rudy resulted pretty directly into 3 more wins last year plus the playoff win. Now it's possible if we had let him go whatever we did with the money would have resulted in some wins.
I hate these types of arguments. It's possible without Rudy, we are in better positions in all of those games where heroics aren't needed. Maybe his replacement wins on key 3rd downs that lead to points earlier in the game instead of 3 and outs. I do know that paying him 9 million is silly. He is the 4th best TE in the league and he is average.
Why are you just repeating what I already said. Here's a copy and paste from above. Now it's possible if we had let him go whatever we did with the money would have resulted in some wins.

Did you mean that he was the 4th highest paid TE in the league?

Rudy played very well for us last year and was worth every penny. Should we fault him for coming up with big plays in big times? I don't expect his game to have deteriorated. Odds are strong considering how well he played that we would not have done as well with a replacement.
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Re: Sendejo Signs With Cleveland

Post by Pondering Her Percy » Sat Mar 21, 2020 11:12 pm

YikesVikes wrote:
Sat Mar 21, 2020 7:25 pm
Pondering Her Percy wrote:
Sat Mar 21, 2020 6:42 pm


Nope pretty sure that’s not the case. And I thought weatherly played okay in 2018 but we also didn’t have odenigbo at the time. Anyone with a brain picks odenigbo over weatherly right now. No less weatherly got $12 mil+. Odenigbo cost under $1 million. But I guess I’m not allowed to say that letting weatherly walk was a smart decision and I don’t get why people are upset. Just staying in line with what the team does :roll:
Again, Im not upset about losing Weatherly. I am pointing out that no matter what the FO does, to you it is the right move. When the FO gives me good moves, I state that I think it was a good move. When they do not, I point out that it is a bad move. Our FO has made several egregiously bad moves for the last couple of years.

1. Waiting to reconstruct Hunter's deal means they were either unprepared or stupid.
2. Cutting Kline has left everyone baffled as to the end game.
3. Having Mac walk for 4 million is borderline negligence
4. Not having a trade worked out for Harris after knowing there were going to tag him.
Again, you need to read my posts a little closer. Go look at what I said regarding Kline when he was cut and go look at what I said regarding Alexander when he took that deal. I didn’t like either move. So again, don’t try to call me out or insult me when clearly you haven’t read enough of what I’ve posted. What I was saying in my original post was that Kline HIMSELF refused a pay cut and was released and was going off of what kapp said regarding Alexander. When both moves were initially made I was as baffled as anyone and was a fan of neither. I still don’t think I am.

But this is where I am telling you that not knowing all the info and thinking we know the reasoning behind this stuff is just a guessing game.

I still think someone hasn’t gotten out about Alexander because the deal makes zero sense.

And it was just corrected today that Kline ended up saving us more money than we initially thought and it was less of a dead money hit than we initially thought. Perfect example of waiting until you know the info before calling the GM a window licker.

As Hunter decision, hunters restructure is fresh today. Not sure why they chose to do that either but again, I’m guessing they have some sort of plan. Or maybe that was a last resort type move to clear cap. You don’t wanna kick everyone’s can down the road

As for Harris, I have no idea what you’re talking about. Very rarely does a team have a “plan in place” to franchise tag and trade a guy right off the bat. Most teams negotiate until the final hours, will lose out and be forced to either let walk or tag him. And do you understand how the tag works? He’s getting paid $11 mil under the tag. His annual worth is probably $14 million or more. Which means we’re currently getting him at a bargain. I’m glad they stuck to their guns and wanted a 2nd-3rd for him. He was arguably a top 3 safety in the nfl last year. They could’ve just let him go for peanuts but then you create a big hole. Where as tagging him, you fill the hole and fill it at an elite level.

Like you act like these guys just show up at work without a plan in place. I can bet you that’s not the case and doing what they did with Harris is a good thing as of right now, not bad. We’re keeping him at a bargain price or getting high picks for him. It’s a win-win

But when it’s all said and done, if you’re going to try and insult me, at least know what the heck I posted. Because you couldn’t have been more wrong and jumped to conclusion.
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Re: Sendejo Signs With Cleveland

Post by StumpHunter » Sat Mar 21, 2020 11:25 pm

VikingsVictorious wrote:
Sat Mar 21, 2020 10:32 pm
YikesVikes wrote:
Sat Mar 21, 2020 9:03 pm


I hate these types of arguments. It's possible without Rudy, we are in better positions in all of those games where heroics aren't needed. Maybe his replacement wins on key 3rd downs that lead to points earlier in the game instead of 3 and outs. I do know that paying him 9 million is silly. He is the 4th best TE in the league and he is average.
Why are you just repeating what I already said. Here's a copy and paste from above. Now it's possible if we had let him go whatever we did with the money would have resulted in some wins.

Did you mean that he was the 4th highest paid TE in the league?

Rudy played very well for us last year and was worth every penny. Should we fault him for coming up with big plays in big times? I don't expect his game to have deteriorated. Odds are strong considering how well he played that we would not have done as well with a replacement.
?

25th in yards among TEs last year. 35th most YPG.

He DID play very well in the red zone, and caught the 6th most TDs. That does provide value, but outside of the red zone he was one of the worst TEs in the NFL.
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Re: Sendejo Signs With Cleveland

Post by VikingsVictorious » Sat Mar 21, 2020 11:32 pm

StumpHunter wrote:
Sat Mar 21, 2020 11:25 pm
VikingsVictorious wrote:
Sat Mar 21, 2020 10:32 pm

Why are you just repeating what I already said. Here's a copy and paste from above. Now it's possible if we had let him go whatever we did with the money would have resulted in some wins.

Did you mean that he was the 4th highest paid TE in the league?

Rudy played very well for us last year and was worth every penny. Should we fault him for coming up with big plays in big times? I don't expect his game to have deteriorated. Odds are strong considering how well he played that we would not have done as well with a replacement.
?

25th in yards among TEs last year. 35th most YPG.

He DID play very well in the red zone, and caught the 6th most TDs. That does provide value, but outside of the red zone he was one of the worst TEs in the NFL.
You have your right to be wrong :lol: . Seriously though we see things very differently. I'm going by the eye test. I'm going by I watched the games and know what happened. I would guess your stats are true.
Last edited by VikingsVictorious on Sat Mar 21, 2020 11:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Sendejo Signs With Cleveland

Post by StumpHunter » Sat Mar 21, 2020 11:37 pm

VikingsVictorious wrote:
Sat Mar 21, 2020 11:32 pm
StumpHunter wrote:
Sat Mar 21, 2020 11:25 pm


?

25th in yards among TEs last year. 35th most YPG.

He DID play very well in the red zone, and caught the 6th most TDs. That does provide value, but outside of the red zone he was one of the worst TEs in the NFL.
You have your right to be wrong.
Got it. So with QBs, all that matters is stats, and with TEs, all that matters is play in big spots.
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Re: Sendejo Signs With Cleveland

Post by VikingsVictorious » Sat Mar 21, 2020 11:42 pm

StumpHunter wrote:
Sat Mar 21, 2020 11:37 pm
VikingsVictorious wrote:
Sat Mar 21, 2020 11:32 pm

You have your right to be wrong.
Got it. So with QBs, all that matters is stats, and with TEs, all that matters is play in big spots.
:lol: I figured you would come back with that. So perhaps we are both flip flopping a bit. There are lots of stats. Rudy got the job done. So did Cousins more often than not.
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Re: Sendejo Signs With Cleveland

Post by YikesVikes » Sun Mar 22, 2020 10:07 am

VikingsVictorious wrote:
Sat Mar 21, 2020 11:42 pm
StumpHunter wrote:
Sat Mar 21, 2020 11:37 pm

Got it. So with QBs, all that matters is stats, and with TEs, all that matters is play in big spots.
:lol: I figured you would come back with that. So perhaps we are both flip flopping a bit. There are lots of stats. Rudy got the job done. So did Cousins more often than not.
Guys in his price range are carrying offenses, Kelce etc. That's the point bits a horrible contract.
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Re: Sendejo Signs With Cleveland

Post by StumpHunter » Sun Mar 22, 2020 10:17 am

YikesVikes wrote:
Sun Mar 22, 2020 10:07 am
VikingsVictorious wrote:
Sat Mar 21, 2020 11:42 pm

:lol: I figured you would come back with that. So perhaps we are both flip flopping a bit. There are lots of stats. Rudy got the job done. So did Cousins more often than not.
Guys in his price range are carrying offenses, Kelce etc. That's the point bits a horrible contract.
Essentially he is a blocking TE on 80% of the field. He has value to the team, but probably more in the 4 million dollar range, not 9 million. 5 million extra isn't the reason we are in a terrible cap position, we are paying Diggs almost twice that much to not play for us, While Kline, Rhodes and Joseph are counting as twice as much to not play for us as well.

I would get over the Rudy contract. He is overpaid for his production on the field, but it really isn't that much, and what he does off the field more than makes up for it.
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Re: Sendejo Signs With Cleveland

Post by VikingsVictorious » Sun Mar 22, 2020 11:17 am

StumpHunter wrote:
Sun Mar 22, 2020 10:17 am
YikesVikes wrote:
Sun Mar 22, 2020 10:07 am


Guys in his price range are carrying offenses, Kelce etc. That's the point bits a horrible contract.
Essentially he is a blocking TE on 80% of the field. He has value to the team, but probably more in the 4 million dollar range, not 9 million. 5 million extra isn't the reason we are in a terrible cap position, we are paying Diggs almost twice that much to not play for us, While Kline, Rhodes and Joseph are counting as twice as much to not play for us as well.

I would get over the Rudy contract. He is overpaid for his production on the field, but it really isn't that much, and what he does off the field more than makes up for it.
At the time we were negotiating Rudy's extension I took a look at the contracts being signed by similar players. His deal was ballpark with those, but I did think we paid him just a bit more than we needed to for a bit longer than we needed to. Then he played so well for us last season that I became quite satisfied with his contract. I don't know how you decided that Rudy is deserving of nothing more than a $4 million contract. I seriously don't have a clue how you came up with that. Now I am quite certain you will do some kind of deep dive into stats and contracts and come up with some answer, but don't. I'm certain you will figure out some way to do it and I want to save you the trouble.
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Re: Sendejo Signs With Cleveland

Post by YikesVikes » Sun Mar 22, 2020 12:56 pm

StumpHunter wrote:
Sun Mar 22, 2020 10:17 am
YikesVikes wrote:
Sun Mar 22, 2020 10:07 am


Guys in his price range are carrying offenses, Kelce etc. That's the point bits a horrible contract.
Essentially he is a blocking TE on 80% of the field. He has value to the team, but probably more in the 4 million dollar range, not 9 million. 5 million extra isn't the reason we are in a terrible cap position, we are paying Diggs almost twice that much to not play for us, While Kline, Rhodes and Joseph are counting as twice as much to not play for us as well.

I would get over the Rudy contract. He is overpaid for his production on the field, but it really isn't that much, and what he does off the field more than makes up for it.
Thats not how dead cap money works. It is offset by the money freed up. So the 4mil dead is offset by the 14 million cleared. A bad contract is a bad contract. When you add Barr who is overpaid at about 5 million as well, that is 10 million and that my friend is a huge difference.
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Re: Sendejo Signs With Cleveland

Post by YikesVikes » Sun Mar 22, 2020 1:01 pm

VikingsVictorious wrote:
Sun Mar 22, 2020 11:17 am
StumpHunter wrote:
Sun Mar 22, 2020 10:17 am


Essentially he is a blocking TE on 80% of the field. He has value to the team, but probably more in the 4 million dollar range, not 9 million. 5 million extra isn't the reason we are in a terrible cap position, we are paying Diggs almost twice that much to not play for us, While Kline, Rhodes and Joseph are counting as twice as much to not play for us as well.

I would get over the Rudy contract. He is overpaid for his production on the field, but it really isn't that much, and what he does off the field more than makes up for it.
At the time we were negotiating Rudy's extension I took a look at the contracts being signed by similar players. His deal was ballpark with those, but I did think we paid him just a bit more than we needed to for a bit longer than we needed to. Then he played so well for us last season that I became quite satisfied with his contract. I don't know how you decided that Rudy is deserving of nothing more than a $4 million contract. I seriously don't have a clue how you came up with that. Now I am quite certain you will do some kind of deep dive into stats and contracts and come up with some answer, but don't. I'm certain you will figure out some way to do it and I want to save you the trouble.
Show me a TE with Rudy's production that paid was paid that last season.
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Re: Sendejo Signs With Cleveland

Post by VikingsVictorious » Sun Mar 22, 2020 1:06 pm

YikesVikes wrote:
Sun Mar 22, 2020 12:56 pm
StumpHunter wrote:
Sun Mar 22, 2020 10:17 am


Essentially he is a blocking TE on 80% of the field. He has value to the team, but probably more in the 4 million dollar range, not 9 million. 5 million extra isn't the reason we are in a terrible cap position, we are paying Diggs almost twice that much to not play for us, While Kline, Rhodes and Joseph are counting as twice as much to not play for us as well.

I would get over the Rudy contract. He is overpaid for his production on the field, but it really isn't that much, and what he does off the field more than makes up for it.
Thats not how dead cap money works. It is offset by the money freed up. So the 4mil dead is offset by the 14 million cleared. A bad contract is a bad contract. When you add Barr who is overpaid at about 5 million as well, that is 10 million and that my friend is a huge difference.
I was OK with us extending Rudy and I hated us swooping in at the last minute with a huge offer to retain Barr. Sure the Jets were offering a little bit more. We should have just let him go. It would have meant a 3rd round pick and 13.5 million of cap savings. If things don't work out so well for the Vikings this season and Barr is still playing at just an average level we can get out of his deal after this season for 7.8 million dead cap hit if I understand correctly.
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Re: Sendejo Signs With Cleveland

Post by VikingsVictorious » Sun Mar 22, 2020 1:27 pm

YikesVikes wrote:
Sun Mar 22, 2020 1:01 pm
VikingsVictorious wrote:
Sun Mar 22, 2020 11:17 am

At the time we were negotiating Rudy's extension I took a look at the contracts being signed by similar players. His deal was ballpark with those, but I did think we paid him just a bit more than we needed to for a bit longer than we needed to. Then he played so well for us last season that I became quite satisfied with his contract. I don't know how you decided that Rudy is deserving of nothing more than a $4 million contract. I seriously don't have a clue how you came up with that. Now I am quite certain you will do some kind of deep dive into stats and contracts and come up with some answer, but don't. I'm certain you will figure out some way to do it and I want to save you the trouble.
Show me a TE with Rudy's production that paid was paid that last season.
You have decided that Rudy wasn't worth the money we paid him. I have decided he was. That season is over and done with anyway so irrelevant. I see Rudy as slightly overpaid moving forward. YMMV.
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Re: Sendejo Signs With Cleveland

Post by fiestavike » Sun Mar 22, 2020 2:41 pm

VikingsVictorious wrote:
Sun Mar 22, 2020 1:27 pm
YikesVikes wrote:
Sun Mar 22, 2020 1:01 pm


Show me a TE with Rudy's production that paid was paid that last season.
You have decided that Rudy wasn't worth the money we paid him. I have decided he was. That season is over and done with anyway so irrelevant. I see Rudy as slightly overpaid moving forward. YMMV.
Rudolph contract is a disaster.
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Re: Sendejo Signs With Cleveland

Post by VikingsVictorious » Sun Mar 22, 2020 2:49 pm

fiestavike wrote:
Sun Mar 22, 2020 2:41 pm
VikingsVictorious wrote:
Sun Mar 22, 2020 1:27 pm

You have decided that Rudy wasn't worth the money we paid him. I have decided he was. That season is over and done with anyway so irrelevant. I see Rudy as slightly overpaid moving forward. YMMV.
Rudolph contract is a disaster.
You have your right to be wrong. :lol:
Seriously I do believe we are overpaying by maybe a mill or 2, but he sure came up big last year.
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