Alexander to Bengals

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fiestavike
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Re: Alexander to Bengals

Post by fiestavike » Thu Mar 19, 2020 3:10 pm

S197 wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 3:01 pm
So basically our secondary is gutted, our pass rush is down 2 large contributors, our OL is somehow worse and we lost one of the biggest weapons on offense.

But we have draft picks and Cousins so no one panic!
Yep...and we franchised Harris. :banana:
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Re: Alexander to Bengals

Post by VikingsVictorious » Thu Mar 19, 2020 3:21 pm

J. Kapp 11 wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 1:40 pm
VikingsVictorious wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 1:17 pm


Losing Bailey is no big deal. I believe Vedvik is available.
Seriously Bailey had a forbath type year for us. Missed too many XPs, but very good on FGs. Hope he sticks around if the price is reasonable of course.
Disagree. Dan Bailey had a near Pro Bowl season for us. Hit 27-of-29, including 3-of-3 from 50+.

Weird as it sounds, this might be salary based. Bailey only made $1 million in salary last year, but he also made an additional $1 million by making 90% or more of his kicks (he hit 93%). With the Vikings still mired in cap hell, they may well be looking to the kicker position as a place to save money.

By the way, there's a reason Kaare Vedvik is available, and I'm guessing it has to do with being traded twice and getting cut by the third team in less than a month.
You notice I transitioned from Vedvik to seriously. Vedvik was meant as a joke. I don't see any disagreement between us on Bailey. I loved Forbath here. He and Bailey both had bad XP stats, but FGs count triple so I'm a big fan of both. 90% of kicking is 110% mental.
Last edited by VikingsVictorious on Thu Mar 19, 2020 3:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Alexander to Bengals

Post by VikingsVictorious » Thu Mar 19, 2020 3:23 pm

VikingsVictorious wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 3:21 pm
J. Kapp 11 wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 1:40 pm

Disagree. Dan Bailey had a near Pro Bowl season for us. Hit 27-of-29, including 3-of-3 from 50+.

Weird as it sounds, this might be salary based. Bailey only made $1 million in salary last year, but he also made an additional $1 million by making 90% or more of his kicks (he hit 93%). With the Vikings still mired in cap hell, they may well be looking to the kicker position as a place to save money.

By the way, there's a reason Kaare Vedvik is available, and I'm guessing it has to do with being traded twice and getting cut by the third team in less than a month.
You notice I transitioned from Vedvik to seriously. Vedvik was meant as a joke. I don't see any disagreement between us on Bailey. I loved Forbath here. He and Bailey both had bad XP stats, but FGs count triple so I'm a big fan of both.
90% of kicking is 110% mental.
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Re: Alexander to Bengals

Post by S197 » Thu Mar 19, 2020 3:31 pm

VikingsVictorious wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 3:21 pm
J. Kapp 11 wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 1:40 pm

Disagree. Dan Bailey had a near Pro Bowl season for us. Hit 27-of-29, including 3-of-3 from 50+.

Weird as it sounds, this might be salary based. Bailey only made $1 million in salary last year, but he also made an additional $1 million by making 90% or more of his kicks (he hit 93%). With the Vikings still mired in cap hell, they may well be looking to the kicker position as a place to save money.

By the way, there's a reason Kaare Vedvik is available, and I'm guessing it has to do with being traded twice and getting cut by the third team in less than a month.
You notice I transitioned from Vedvik to seriously. Vedvik was meant as a joke. I don't see any disagreement between us on Bailey. I loved Forbath here. He and Bailey both had bad XP stats, but FGs count triple so I'm a big fan of both. 90% of kicking is 110% mental.
Bailey just resigned on a 3 year deal.
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Re: Alexander to Bengals

Post by Pondering Her Percy » Thu Mar 19, 2020 3:43 pm

halfgiz wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 12:17 pm
Pondering Her Percy wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 12:03 pm


It can be a concern I guess but at the same time, we simply didn’t have the money to bring these guys back. It’s not like we’re sitting with $50 million in cap and just letting them walk. We’re operating on pennies at this point
Don't even get me gone on that...
Mac was a need we should have been able to afford. Problem was he was ready to leave, from what I heard.

Alexander: 1 of 5 CBs to play 500 snaps and not commit a penalty in 2019
Well yeah someone like Alexander we could afford but something like Waynes’ contract we couldn’t. And for all we know, they could still be trying to resign griffen.

And idk where you heard he was ready to leave
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Re: Alexander to Bengals

Post by Pondering Her Percy » Thu Mar 19, 2020 3:47 pm

fiestavike wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 3:10 pm
S197 wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 3:01 pm
So basically our secondary is gutted, our pass rush is down 2 large contributors, our OL is somehow worse and we lost one of the biggest weapons on offense.

But we have draft picks and Cousins so no one panic!
Yep...and we franchised Harris. :banana:
Who cares about Harris? Just because they tagged him doesn’t mean he won’t eventually get a deal from us. Or we trade him for picks we don’t know. And who are the two contributors in terms of pass rush? Griffen and who? And don’t say weatherly because he ended up being DE #4 this year behind odenigbo. And rightfully so because odenigbo was much better
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Re: Alexander to Bengals

Post by Rhodes Closed » Thu Mar 19, 2020 4:02 pm

Pondering Her Percy wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 3:47 pm
fiestavike wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 3:10 pm


Yep...and we franchised Harris. :banana:
Who cares about Harris? Just because they tagged him doesn’t mean he won’t eventually get a deal from us. Or we trade him for picks we don’t know. And who are the two contributors in terms of pass rush? Griffen and who? And don’t say weatherly because he ended up being DE #4 this year behind odenigbo. And rightfully so because odenigbo was much better
I'm trying to think here.

Since we have Michael Pierce, I imagine the starting line is gonna be something along the lines of: Odenigbo, Pierce, Mata'afa, and Hunter.

Does anyone honestly really have much objection to that? Heck, say we get Griffen back. Then it's: Griffen, Pierce, Mata'afa, and Hunter.

That's still quite a Defensive Line if you ask me. :confused:
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Re: Alexander to Bengals

Post by S197 » Thu Mar 19, 2020 4:18 pm

Pondering Her Percy wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 3:47 pm
fiestavike wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 3:10 pm


Yep...and we franchised Harris. :banana:
Who cares about Harris? Just because they tagged him doesn’t mean he won’t eventually get a deal from us. Or we trade him for picks we don’t know. And who are the two contributors in terms of pass rush? Griffen and who? And don’t say weatherly because he ended up being DE #4 this year behind odenigbo. And rightfully so because odenigbo was much better
Weatherly stepped up big time when Griffen was out, he's shown he can handle a large amount of snaps. He also rotated in at DT, which took away from his DE snaps but not his contribution to the team.

I'm not saying he's irreplaceable but it is another hole. Ifeadi looks promising but is he ready for full time? This is a guy Zimmer cut, twice. Hercules came on strong then spent the 2nd half of the year inactive. Weatherly was the #3 DE for the majority of his career here. These other guys, not so much.
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Re: Alexander to Bengals

Post by fiestavike » Thu Mar 19, 2020 4:23 pm

S197 wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 4:18 pm
Pondering Her Percy wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 3:47 pm


Who cares about Harris? Just because they tagged him doesn’t mean he won’t eventually get a deal from us. Or we trade him for picks we don’t know. And who are the two contributors in terms of pass rush? Griffen and who? And don’t say weatherly because he ended up being DE #4 this year behind odenigbo. And rightfully so because odenigbo was much better
Weatherly stepped up big time when Griffen was out, he's shown he can handle a large amount of snaps. He also rotated in at DT, which took away from his DE snaps but not his contribution to the team.

I'm not saying he's irreplaceable but it is another hole. Ifeadi looks promising but is he ready for full time? This is a guy Zimmer cut, twice. Hercules came on strong then spent the 2nd half of the year inactive. Weatherly was the #3 DE for the majority of his career here. These other guys, not so much.
Weatherly is a significant loss. I wish him well in Carolina, along with Teddy.
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Re: Alexander to Bengals

Post by Pondering Her Percy » Thu Mar 19, 2020 4:31 pm

S197 wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 4:18 pm
Pondering Her Percy wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 3:47 pm


Who cares about Harris? Just because they tagged him doesn’t mean he won’t eventually get a deal from us. Or we trade him for picks we don’t know. And who are the two contributors in terms of pass rush? Griffen and who? And don’t say weatherly because he ended up being DE #4 this year behind odenigbo. And rightfully so because odenigbo was much better
Weatherly stepped up big time when Griffen was out, he's shown he can handle a large amount of snaps. He also rotated in at DT, which took away from his DE snaps but not his contribution to the team.

I'm not saying he's irreplaceable but it is another hole. Ifeadi looks promising but is he ready for full time? This is a guy Zimmer cut, twice. Hercules came on strong then spent the 2nd half of the year inactive. Weatherly was the #3 DE for the majority of his career here. These other guys, not so much.
Odenigbo played 52 less snaps than weatherly and racked up 7 sacks compared to weatherlys 3. And FWIW, odenigbo had a 74.3 grade according to pff. Where weatherlys was a 50.4. That’s how different their play was. If we can’t find a #3-4 DE late in the draft, as an UDFA, or as a cheap free agent, I’d be shocked. Weatherly is an easy replacement. Especially when Patterson is our DL coach.
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Re: Alexander to Bengals

Post by Pondering Her Percy » Thu Mar 19, 2020 4:36 pm

fiestavike wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 4:23 pm
S197 wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 4:18 pm


Weatherly stepped up big time when Griffen was out, he's shown he can handle a large amount of snaps. He also rotated in at DT, which took away from his DE snaps but not his contribution to the team.

I'm not saying he's irreplaceable but it is another hole. Ifeadi looks promising but is he ready for full time? This is a guy Zimmer cut, twice. Hercules came on strong then spent the 2nd half of the year inactive. Weatherly was the #3 DE for the majority of his career here. These other guys, not so much.
Weatherly is a significant loss. I wish him well in Carolina, along with Teddy.
No he is not. Look at his numbers compared to Odenigbo. Odenigbo was the better DE, by a large margin. Weatherly was decent in 2018 before Odenigbo broke out but he was the lesser player of the two by quite a bit. He slowly started to catch weatherly in snaps by years end. Either way, both were 7th round picks. So I’m not understanding why this is such a big loss when we are excellent at getting production out of DEs
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Re: Alexander to Bengals

Post by S197 » Thu Mar 19, 2020 5:55 pm

Pondering Her Percy wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 4:31 pm
S197 wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 4:18 pm


Weatherly stepped up big time when Griffen was out, he's shown he can handle a large amount of snaps. He also rotated in at DT, which took away from his DE snaps but not his contribution to the team.

I'm not saying he's irreplaceable but it is another hole. Ifeadi looks promising but is he ready for full time? This is a guy Zimmer cut, twice. Hercules came on strong then spent the 2nd half of the year inactive. Weatherly was the #3 DE for the majority of his career here. These other guys, not so much.
Odenigbo played 52 less snaps than weatherly and racked up 7 sacks compared to weatherlys 3. And FWIW, odenigbo had a 74.3 grade according to pff. Where weatherlys was a 50.4. That’s how different their play was. If we can’t find a #3-4 DE late in the draft, as an UDFA, or as a cheap free agent, I’d be shocked. Weatherly is an easy replacement. Especially when Patterson is our DL coach.
I thought PFF is meaningless? Or does it depend on whether it supports the narrative or not? Like I said, he's not replaceable but he and Griffen do mean additional holes. Maybe Ifeadi can fill one spot but I'm wary, a guy who's that good rarely gets cut twice.

It's hard to argue at this point our pass rush is better right now than last year when all we did is lose bodies. The draft will likely tell if we can make up the deficit or not. Rick better really hit one out of the park, I think his job depends on it.
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Re: Alexander to Bengals

Post by Pondering Her Percy » Thu Mar 19, 2020 6:59 pm

S197 wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 5:55 pm
Pondering Her Percy wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 4:31 pm


Odenigbo played 52 less snaps than weatherly and racked up 7 sacks compared to weatherlys 3. And FWIW, odenigbo had a 74.3 grade according to pff. Where weatherlys was a 50.4. That’s how different their play was. If we can’t find a #3-4 DE late in the draft, as an UDFA, or as a cheap free agent, I’d be shocked. Weatherly is an easy replacement. Especially when Patterson is our DL coach.
I thought PFF is meaningless? Or does it depend on whether it supports the narrative or not? Like I said, he's not replaceable but he and Griffen do mean additional holes. Maybe Ifeadi can fill one spot but I'm wary, a guy who's that good rarely gets cut twice.

It's hard to argue at this point our pass rush is better right now than last year when all we did is lose bodies. The draft will likely tell if we can make up the deficit or not. Rick better really hit one out of the park, I think his job depends on it.
When did I ever once say PFF is meaningless? Pretty sure you got the wrong guy. And never did I say Griffen isn’t a loss. I’ve been specifically talking about Odenigbo. And at the same time, griff is also still out there and we’ve had discussions with him so I’m not ruling that out.

As for Odenigbo, he was cut because he was raw coming out and we were deep at the position. You hear about guys all the time bounce around the league or get cut and then eventually carve out a role somewhere. Like just because he was cut his first two years in the league doesn’t mean he doesn’t have a shot of becoming a good player.

But the big kicker is that odenigbo was able to get more sacks in one year than weatherly got in his entire career. No less odenigbo played 50+ less snaps than weatherly did this year.

And to add onto that, odenigbo was averaging 10.5 snaps a game in the first 8 weeks of this year. By week 9 until years end, he was averaging 22.4 snaps a game. That is a gigantic jump. And he had a very productive year given the time he was able to get out there. A #3- #4 DE is very easy to find and there is no reason we can’t find one that does the same thing weatherly did and more
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Re: Alexander to Bengals

Post by 808vikingsfan » Thu Mar 19, 2020 7:09 pm

fiestavike wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 4:23 pm
S197 wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 4:18 pm


Weatherly stepped up big time when Griffen was out, he's shown he can handle a large amount of snaps. He also rotated in at DT, which took away from his DE snaps but not his contribution to the team.

I'm not saying he's irreplaceable but it is another hole. Ifeadi looks promising but is he ready for full time? This is a guy Zimmer cut, twice. Hercules came on strong then spent the 2nd half of the year inactive. Weatherly was the #3 DE for the majority of his career here. These other guys, not so much.
Weatherly is a significant loss. I wish him well in Carolina, along with Teddy.
Sad. Teddy getting a great opportunity but not much being talked about here. I'd start a thread but I'm guessing how toxic it will turn here.

Go Teddy. I wish you nothing but the best in Carolina. Glad a team is believing in you and giving you a chance.
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Re: Alexander to Bengals

Post by PacificNorseWest » Thu Mar 19, 2020 8:29 pm

Mothman wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 11:20 am
VikingsVictorious wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 10:55 am


This loss cuts the deepest with me, because I was expecting us to retain Mac all along and think he was worth at 6 Million a year. Killer.
It's not a good sign that the team is losing so much "home-grown" young talent. Ideally, when trying to build, you want to be able to draft, develop and then keep talented players in their prime. What does it say about the Vikes that Waynes, Alexander, Diggs, Weatherly and Kearse are all moving on (Diggs via trade) after their first 4 or 5 years with the team?
It was brought up elsewhere with me, but instead of just losing a few pieces we all figured would happen, it now appears like a half-way rebuild. Still enough talent to compete, all the while getting younger, either by force or choice.

It could be worse than Hill and Hughes, I suppose, but so much uncertainty.
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