Well, No Vikings in playoffs, so who you think now? Who advances to Super Bowl?

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S197
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Re: Well, No Vikings in playoffs, so who you think now? Who advances to Super Bowl?

Post by S197 » Mon Jan 21, 2019 8:38 pm

Mothman wrote:
Mon Jan 21, 2019 6:58 pm
S197 wrote:
Mon Jan 21, 2019 1:28 pm
All I'm saying is give credit where it's due, and for NE it was the OL and their backs. I really wish we could find a FB like Develin. I give BB a lot of credit for constantly staying innovative and getting that team to the SB so many times. But the Brady love fest just makes no sense to me. Hes obviously one of the best, but not yesterday.
I give BB a lot of credit too but personally, I thought Brady illustrated exactly why he's the best yesterday. Late in the game, with the Super Bowl on the line, he made clutch throws, converted crucial third downs and the directed scoring drives that ultimately helped his team win. He did it on the road, in a very loud stadium and even some of the big runs the Pats had on those scoring drives came on audibles because he correctly read the defense and changed the play. The OL and RBs obviously deserve more credit on those plays but he was the proverbial "field general" the team needed in that situation, as he's been throughout his career. He's certainly had better games but regardless of how he did statistically, when his team needed him to come up big so they could return to the Super Bowl, he delivered. I believe it's that quality more than any other that's made him such a great and admired player. His ability to come through again and again in the biggest games and moments is almost preternatural. It's the quality the Vikes need Cousins to develop.
That's true, he has a lot of intangibles that don't show up on the stat sheets like audibles and defense recognition. I think some of those kill audibles were simply reversing the direction of the play rather than a completely different playcall but that's just my speculation. Romo seemed to allude to it and he was on fire with his accuracy.

I don't mind giving Brady credit it's just the amount he gets compared to the rest of the team. The Patriots had 170+ yards rushing and gave up zero sacks. Some of that is Brady but the majority was the line and scheme. Also he only lead that game winning drive thanks to a bogus roughing call and getting bailed out of a game ending interception. He also had a lot of throws that while catchable, were behind his receiver. At least two to Patterson and Edelman. I guess what I'm getting at is the clutch factor that's getting attributed to him was also due to a fair amount of luck and solid play from his teammates.
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J. Kapp 11
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Re: Well, No Vikings in playoffs, so who you think now? Who advances to Super Bowl?

Post by J. Kapp 11 » Mon Jan 21, 2019 10:04 pm

Mothman wrote:
Mon Jan 21, 2019 6:55 pm
I take no satisfaction at all in the no-call against the Rams. It's bad for the sport.
Nobody seemed to care when we got hosed 9 years ago in the same building. And when people talk about Bountygate now, they speak of it as though the penalties handed down to Payton, Williams, Vilma, et. al. were a joke. So I take plenty of satisfaction.

I would take even more satisfaction if the Saints never won another game. Seeing as how that's pretty much unrealistic, I'd settle for them returning to their former status as the Aints, the laughing stock of the NFL, as they were for the first 40 years of their history.
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Re: Well, No Vikings in playoffs, so who you think now? Who advances to Super Bowl?

Post by Mothman » Mon Jan 21, 2019 11:25 pm

S197 wrote:
Mon Jan 21, 2019 8:38 pm
That's true, he has a lot of intangibles that don't show up on the stat sheets like audibles and defense recognition. I think some of those kill audibles were simply reversing the direction of the play rather than a completely different playcall but that's just my speculation. Romo seemed to allude to it and he was on fire with his accuracy.

I don't mind giving Brady credit it's just the amount he gets compared to the rest of the team. The Patriots had 170+ yards rushing and gave up zero sacks. Some of that is Brady but the majority was the line and scheme. Also he only lead that game winning drive thanks to a bogus roughing call and getting bailed out of a game ending interception. He also had a lot of throws that while catchable, were behind his receiver. At least two to Patterson and Edelman. I guess what I'm getting at is the clutch factor that's getting attributed to him was also due to a fair amount of luck and solid play from his teammates.
I understand. QBs often receive an inordinate amount of credit for team accomplishments.
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Re: Well, No Vikings in playoffs, so who you think now? Who advances to Super Bowl?

Post by VikingPaul73 » Tue Jan 22, 2019 8:50 am

Mothman wrote:
Mon Jan 21, 2019 6:55 pm
I take no satisfaction at all in the no-call against the Rams. It's bad for the sport.

The awful no-call and the inability to resolve an obvious mistake with instant replay reminded me of this infamous play:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E8gCDIQ7_Nw

Different circumstances but another decisively bad call.
I get what you’re saying Mothman- but to me, the integrity of the sport was lost years ago, so what’s another black eye? I now look at it solely as entertainment; somewhere between a fair, pure, competitive competition and the WWE. To be enjoyed while drinking beers with friends and not to be taken too seriously like I used to take it.

And yes, I found the expression on Payton’s face extremely entertaining 😀
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Re: Well, No Vikings in playoffs, so who you think now? Who advances to Super Bowl?

Post by mansquatch » Tue Jan 22, 2019 10:12 am

Mothman wrote:
Mon Jan 21, 2019 6:55 pm
I take no satisfaction at all in the no-call against the Rams. It's bad for the sport.

The awful no-call and the inability to resolve an obvious mistake with instant replay reminded me of this infamous play:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E8gCDIQ7_Nw

Different circumstances but another decisively bad call.
To me the most damning thing on the league is the fact that the official blew calls that caused a team to likely lose in one of the most important games of the year in the exact same place that officials blew calls that caused a(our) team to lose in one of the most important games of the year 9 years ago. In the exact same building to boot! It was poetic for all vikings fans that this time Sean Payton was on the receiving end.

To me, the mere fact that all the networks now have a former official at beck and call to interpret NFL rules during broadcast is, IMO, an indication of a problem. If the game rules are so complicated that it takes a lawyerly level of expertise to interpret them, then how can any reasonable person expect a team of guys to successfully enforce the rules properly on the fly at the speed in which the NFL game is played? Let alone the fact that to anyone watching, the way the game rules are enforced in the playoffs is different than during the regular season. (The secondary gets away with more, it has been that way for years.) We also have what is now an annual crap show in the first four games of the season where they "experiment" with how they are going to call their new rules.

But apparently we need 200 pages of rules on what constitutes of catch and what is and is not "roughing the passer". (Or you know, staring at him with too much ill intent.)
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Re: Well, No Vikings in playoffs, so who you think now? Who advances to Super Bowl?

Post by indianation65 » Tue Jan 22, 2019 2:53 pm

I've about had it with my Saints buddies going on and on about how they were robbed.

I do not remember the game from '09. If anyone would care to take a moment and jot down the plays that showed the Vikes getting screwed, I'd appreciate it. I need to ammo. Otherwise, go Rams!

I loathe NE as much as NO and GB.

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Re: Well, No Vikings in playoffs, so who you think now? Who advances to Super Bowl?

Post by J. Kapp 11 » Tue Jan 22, 2019 3:55 pm

indianation65 wrote:
Tue Jan 22, 2019 2:53 pm
I've about had it with my Saints buddies going on and on about how they were robbed.

I do not remember the game from '09. If anyone would care to take a moment and jot down the plays that showed the Vikes getting screwed, I'd appreciate it. I need to ammo. Otherwise, go Rams!

I loathe NE as much as NO and GB.

...wisdom
Watch this. It'll give you a pretty good idea.

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Re: Well, No Vikings in playoffs, so who you think now? Who advances to Super Bowl?

Post by J. Kapp 11 » Tue Jan 22, 2019 4:01 pm

mansquatch wrote:
Tue Jan 22, 2019 10:12 am
To me, the mere fact that all the networks now have a former official at beck and call to interpret NFL rules during broadcast is, IMO, an indication of a problem. If the game rules are so complicated that it takes a lawyerly level of expertise to interpret them, then how can any reasonable person expect a team of guys to successfully enforce the rules properly on the fly at the speed in which the NFL game is played?
This is a great point.

IMO, the problem is that officials are part-time. That is truly mind-boggling. According to Forbes, the NFL generated more than $13 billion in revenue in 2016 (be sure to say "billion" in your best Donald Trump voice). THIRTEEN BILLION. Yet the officials are part-time. They're lawyers and plumbers and school teachers doing the NFL on the weekends. It's insane!

Here's my solution. It's two-pronged.
1. Hire full-time officials.
2. Make all plays reviewable, including penalties. Put them on the same challenge/booth review program as we have now.

Somebody needs to do something. Even though I couldn't care less about the stupid Saints, the officiating was at an all-time level of suckitude this entire season.
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Re: Well, No Vikings in playoffs, so who you think now? Who advances to Super Bowl?

Post by indianation65 » Tue Jan 22, 2019 6:21 pm

Appreciation for the refresher. IN65

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Re: Well, No Vikings in playoffs, so who you think now? Who advances to Super Bowl?

Post by S197 » Tue Jan 22, 2019 8:14 pm

Games are not won or lost on a single play. It's heartbreaking to have bad calls go against you but chances are if you lost, there's other breakdowns that happened as well. The Saints game was different to me due to Bountygate. That's a whole different thing. Paying to intentionally hurt players goes above and beyond a bad call. And it's for that reason I'll never have any sympathy for Sean Payton and in fact revel in his misery.
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Re: Well, No Vikings in playoffs, so who you think now? Who advances to Super Bowl?

Post by VikingPaul73 » Tue Jan 22, 2019 8:49 pm

indianation65 wrote:
Tue Jan 22, 2019 2:53 pm
I've about had it with my Saints buddies going on and on about how they were robbed.

I do not remember the game from '09. If anyone would care to take a moment and jot down the plays that showed the Vikes getting screwed, I'd appreciate it. I need to ammo. Otherwise, go Rams!

I loathe NE as much as NO and GB.

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Are these guys your friends? :smilevike:

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Re: Well, No Vikings in playoffs, so who you think now? Who advances to Super Bowl?

Post by Bowhunting Viking » Wed Jan 23, 2019 4:02 pm

S197 wrote:
Tue Jan 22, 2019 8:14 pm
Games are not won or lost on a single play. It's heartbreaking to have bad calls go against you but chances are if you lost, there's other breakdowns that happened as well. The Saints game was different to me due to Bountygate. That's a whole different thing. Paying to intentionally hurt players goes above and beyond a bad call. And it's for that reason I'll never have any sympathy for Sean Payton and in fact revel in his misery.
PERFECTO!!!! You just said it perfectly my friend. I realize some have a different view of the whole 09 game and that's cool, cuz we all have that right.
But to me, I felt all the bad calls that went against us was really bad. We should never have been in the position to have had to go into OT for that game.
The way that the Saints D just pounded the living crap outta Favre, and several shots were so late it was past ridiculous, that made it a double whammy.
BUT.. when the whole Bountygate issue came to light, and the evidence was right there in audio of that pc of garbage Greg Williams imploring his D to, in his own words , cut the head off the snake... that was the Trifecta.
Yes it was a horrible no call Sunday. It is another stain on the condition of the officiating in the NFL. I always have said I hate it when a bad call does in fact cause a team to ultimately lose a game. I agree that no one play loses an entire game. But in reality, it CAN dictate the final outcome.
I'm a huge UFC fan also, and like Dana White always says " Don't put the fight in the hands of the judges".
I've seen some horrible decisions at the end of fights. So it does happen in every sport.
But after what happened with the Vikings in 09 I could give a crap about all that.
Peyton and the Saints were on the receiving end of it this time, and due to his arrogance and the whole Bountygate deal, I cannot find it in my heart to feel 1 drop of remorse for him.
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Re: Well, No Vikings in playoffs, so who you think now? Who advances to Super Bowl?

Post by The negotiator » Wed Jan 23, 2019 7:48 pm

J. Kapp 11 wrote:
Mon Jan 21, 2019 10:04 pm
Mothman wrote:
Mon Jan 21, 2019 6:55 pm
I take no satisfaction at all in the no-call against the Rams. It's bad for the sport.
Nobody seemed to care when we got hosed 9 years ago in the same building. And when people talk about Bountygate now, they speak of it as though the penalties handed down to Payton, Williams, Vilma, et. al. were a joke. So I take plenty of satisfaction.

I would take even more satisfaction if the Saints never won another game. Seeing as how that's pretty much unrealistic, I'd settle for them returning to their former status as the Aints, the laughing stock of the NFL, as they were for the first 40 years of their history.
Curious question? Where is Roger Goodell on this flagrant no call. For the mega millions he makes every year, it seems to me he could have weighed in with something. Is he breathing or passed on and I missed it. As much as I agree with your feeling on the Saints, he could have stepped up and said “hey Saints fans, sorry about the no call PI. The refs are human and they make mistakes. We are constantly trying to make our calls consistent and fair.” Not a word, crickets! A real missed opportunity to step up and make an apology statement on behalf of the NFL. That’s what great leaders do and he’s not one of them. smh
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Re: Well, No Vikings in playoffs, so who you think now? Who advances to Super Bowl?

Post by Dmizzle0 » Wed Jan 23, 2019 10:38 pm

He would have to address the Rams fans for missed calls too right?
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Re: Well, No Vikings in playoffs, so who you think now? Who advances to Super Bowl?

Post by The negotiator » Thu Jan 24, 2019 5:47 am

Dmizzle0 wrote:
Wed Jan 23, 2019 10:38 pm
He would have to address the Rams fans for missed calls too right?
No, because the Rams won. I’m just saying this no call, in one of the most watched games of the year, which cost a team being in the Super Bowl, deserved some comment from the league commissioner. There are a lot of blown calls, as many on here have clearly articulated. But this one was egregious. His comments could have gone a long ways in defusing the rage and conspiracy theories which have surfaced since that game. The no call was bad enough, but the silence from the leagues top man is deafening.
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