Mike Zimmer

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PurpleMustReign
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Mike Zimmer

Post by PurpleMustReign » Sun Dec 30, 2018 7:13 pm

Put aside the offensive struggles for the point of this post. I Don't want to hear it.

I'm going to talk defense. You know, Mike Zimmer's specialty, and the reason he was brought in here. I keep hearing how he is a defensive coach and he's not responsible for the offense because of that. So... let's talk about what he IS responsible for.
They have good stats... but when the game, or season, is on the line, they are undisciplined, unaggressive, and slow. They stop everyone on 3rd down... well, the Bears, in the second most important game in Mike Zimmer's career, made almost 70% of them. They allowed 200 yards in the first half. Look at the two most important games in Zimmer's tenure here... last year's NFC Championship Game, and today. The defense didn't play their game. They didn't show up to do what they are paid to do. If this is Mike Zimmer's bread and butter, and if this is the excuse people make when they talk about the reason for keeping him here, then they should show up when they are needed. And don't tell me "they kept the team in the game" because they really didn't. They didn't stop Chicago when they needed to, and they didn't stop Philadelphia when they needed to. So, what is the point of keeping Zimmer here? What has he shown that makes anyone think there is a chance for him to get his team ready for an important game?
I don't get it. I don't understand why the Vikings can never hire a good coach. I am absolutely done with Mike Zimmer and Rick Spielman. I hope the Wilfs agree because it is time for a change.
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Re: Mike Zimmer

Post by VikeFanInEagleLand » Sun Dec 30, 2018 7:30 pm

I'm not sure it's so much the defensive game plan or calls than it is not having the guys mentally ready for these games. Look, the fact of the matter is stats, and numbers don't matter much of the time. Athleticism isn't everything. It's the mental and emotional parts of the game that separate winners from losers. Zimmer hasn't shown that he can mentally or emotionally be prepared to coach or have his players mentally or emotionally prepared to play.
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Re: Mike Zimmer

Post by PurpleMustReign » Sun Dec 30, 2018 7:34 pm

VikeFanInEagleLand wrote:
Sun Dec 30, 2018 7:30 pm
I'm not sure it's so much the defensive game plan or calls than it is not having the guys mentally ready for these games. Look, the fact of the matter is stats, and numbers don't matter much of the time. Athleticism isn't everything. It's the mental and emotional parts of the game that separate winners from losers. Zimmer hasn't shown that he can mentally or emotionally be prepared to coach or have his players mentally or emotionally prepared to play.
I agree. And that is literally the head coach's job. And he can't do it, and has proven thst he can't do it.
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Re: Mike Zimmer

Post by Maelstrom88 » Sun Dec 30, 2018 7:38 pm

He is the Marvin Lewis of the NFC. Just good enough to not get fired but will never win the big one.
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Re: Mike Zimmer

Post by PurpleMustReign » Sun Dec 30, 2018 7:39 pm

Maelstrom88 wrote:
Sun Dec 30, 2018 7:38 pm
He is the Marvin Lewis of the NFC. Just good enough to not get fired but will never win the big one.
I hope wilf/spielman are smarter than the Cincinnati owners and GM.
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Re: Mike Zimmer

Post by VikeFanInEagleLand » Sun Dec 30, 2018 7:42 pm

To reiterate what I mean about stats, it has seemed to me that Zimmers defenses have never really impressed me to the level of what the stats have dictated. One of the reasons that it is said that defense wins championships is because defenses are much more consistent and reliable than a good offense. They aren't as up and down. A good defense plays well during the season and throughout a playoff run. But notice that Viking defenses don't do that. It seems the defense is a mirage that is revealed in big games. I wasn't being too critical of Zimmer until that first Bears game this year. That was also a big game at the time, and the Vikings coaching staff was coming off a bye week. An EXTRA week for this dominate defense to prepare against a rookie QB. This so called complicated blitz scheme that Zimmer runs should confuse a rookie QB shouldn't it? Well....it didn't. The team looked just as unprepared for that game as any game this season. My doubts grew by leaps and bounds about Zimmer from that point. I'm not saying that he should be gone, but he is definitely skating on thin ice.
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Re: Mike Zimmer

Post by PurpleMustReign » Sun Dec 30, 2018 7:47 pm

Yes. And that's why I always say thst stats are just noise. Show me a defense thst gets a stop when it matters. Show me a defense that shows up for the big game and #### a team down in a must win game. That's what I want. I don't care if they gave up 1600 yards all year, if they can't or don't get the needed stop, it doesn't matter.
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Re: Mike Zimmer

Post by purplehaze » Sun Dec 30, 2018 7:49 pm

I am kinda sick of Zim's lack of fire in press conferences. I have posted this in the past about Chilli. Something along this line is what we should have heard from Zim today. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tie0tz7jGDI
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Re: Mike Zimmer

Post by Mothman » Sun Dec 30, 2018 7:50 pm

VikeFanInEagleLand wrote:
Sun Dec 30, 2018 7:42 pm
To reiterate what I mean about stats, it has seemed to me that Zimmers defenses have never really impressed me to the level of what the stats have dictated. One of the reasons that it is said that defense wins championships is because defenses are much more consistent and reliable than a good offense. They aren't as up and down. A good defense plays well during the season and throughout a playoff run. But notice that Viking defenses don't do that. It seems the defense is a mirage that is revealed in big games. I wasn't being too critical of Zimmer until that first Bears game this year. That was also a big game at the time, and the Vikings coaching staff was coming off a bye week. An EXTRA week for this dominate defense to prepare against a rookie QB. This so called complicated blitz scheme that Zimmer runs should confuse a rookie QB shouldn't it? Well....it didn't. The team looked just as unprepared for that game as any game this season. My doubts grew by leaps and bounds about Zimmer from that point. I'm not saying that he should be gone, but he is definitely skating on thin ice.
Remember, Trubisky is in his second season (not that it undermines your point).
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Re: Mike Zimmer

Post by PacificNorseWest » Sun Dec 30, 2018 7:53 pm

As far as I'm concerned, he's got two more seasons given that this entire regime is now tied to Kirk Cousins. That's basically the remaining window for most the defensive and offensive personnel anyway. Zimmer is the coach and Cousins is the quarterback. We're stuck with both for better or worse. It is what it is. They're blowing it all up in 2 years anyway if they don't get to the Super Bowl by 2021, so they both either figure it out or not...I'm not putting energy into something THEY get paid millions for.
Last edited by PacificNorseWest on Sun Dec 30, 2018 7:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Mike Zimmer

Post by S197 » Sun Dec 30, 2018 7:56 pm

Defenses don't win championships anymore, look at the flags that were thrown today, were any of those roughing calls? We're in the fantasy football era, I may sound like a broken record but it's just the way it is and it's time to adapt. You can't have an elite defense when you literally can't touch anyone! Settle for decent and focus on offense. Let Barr AND Richardson walk, we can't afford either.

Also, something is wrong with Linval, I would bet a huge sum of money it comes out this offseason he was playing injured. He was getting blocked one on one and that never happens. Which brings me to another gripe about the draft, we came out with no NT! You have Jaleel, who is really a 3-tech pass rusher, Richardson (3-tech), Tom Johnson (3-tech), and Holmes who is undersized. The closest we had was Parry who didn't even make the team to start. So Linval has to keep his hurt self out there and the defense gets gashed.

It's as baffling as the way we approached the guard situation, but OP wants to talk defense so I'll save that for another thread. And this is not hindsight, this was day after draft issues I brought up. Isn't this roster composition 101? Have a backup for your starter? I don't know how a guy who can draft guys like Diggs and Hunter go from looking like a guru to total dumbass.
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Re: Mike Zimmer

Post by MikethePurple » Sun Dec 30, 2018 7:57 pm

I haven't been very active on the board or involved in the back and forth regarding Zimmer these past couple seasons but I'll say that I was a general supporter of his. The defenses have been very good over the years he has been here and the team has been relatively successful. However, I'll say after this game, he should go. This team has a good amount of talent and they once again do not show up for an extremely important game. The O-line is a complete disaster, specifically pointing towards the guards. Cousins made a lot of mistakes this season and has a part of the blame, but putting him behind this O-line was just a disaster waiting to happen. But back to the main point, he clearly has not been able to get his teams to show up for big games, and that is on the head coach. I also, have been somewhat satisfied for the relative success but another game to put on the case of his continued failure in big games, he should go. Also, given the timing that he only has one year left on his contract and traditionally coaches do not coach their last year without an extension, timing is there. He needs to go.
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Re: Mike Zimmer

Post by Mothman » Sun Dec 30, 2018 8:10 pm

MikethePurple wrote:
Sun Dec 30, 2018 7:57 pm
I haven't been very active on the board or involved in the back and forth regarding Zimmer these past couple seasons but I'll say that I was a general supporter of his. The defenses have been very good over the years he has been here and the team has been relatively successful. However, I'll say after this game, he should go. This team has a good amount of talent and they once again do not show up for an extremely important game. The O-line is a complete disaster, specifically pointing towards the guards. Cousins made a lot of mistakes this season and has a part of the blame, but putting him behind this O-line was just a disaster waiting to happen. But back to the main point, he clearly has not been able to get his teams to show up for big games, and that is on the head coach. I also, have been somewhat satisfied for the relative success but another game to put on the case of his continued failure in big games, he should go. Also, given the timing that he only has one year left on his contract and traditionally coaches do not coach their last year without an extension, timing is there. He needs to go.
Excellent point about the timing. If they're going to replace him (and Spielman, who also has one year left on his deal), this is a logical time to do it. 5 years is a fair window in which to evaluate a coach. 7 years is a fair window in which to evaluate a GM, especially a GM who has played a very significant role at the top of the organization for over a decade now.

Zimmer and Spielman will probably be in MN next year but after a disappointing end to a disappointing season, I wouldn't be surprised if the Wilfs decided to move on and replace both of them. They certainly shouldn't extend either contract.
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Re: Mike Zimmer

Post by PurpleMustReign » Sun Dec 30, 2018 8:14 pm

Someone mentioned in the game Thread about Zimmer possibly quitting. I would not be surprised if this happens. If you look at him and his demeanor this year compared to previous years the fire was not there. The extra excitement was not there. He looked tired, he looked defeated, and he looked lost. Something he never look like before. I like him as a person and think you did a good job building the great defense but it was a defense that did not show up when it mattered it did not compliment its offense. It will be a very interesting offseason. Again.
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Re: Mike Zimmer

Post by vikeinmontana » Sun Dec 30, 2018 8:24 pm

In its simplest form I watch this team and give the D so much credit because they’re on the field 80% of the game because our offenses ineptitude. That is tough on any defense.

That said, I completely agree. At some point, tired, on the field a ton, injuries, anything.....you simply MUST find a way to make a play on 3rd down! It doesn’t have to be every time. But it sure as hell better be more than 1-2 times in a game.

My simple take is I might be more bummed about our D because they’re supposed to be great! Our offense was lousy but I kind of expected them to be average. I thought our defense would be dominant.

I realize this isn’t rational. It takes 3 phases to win. All three let us down this season. But I too was very frustrated with our defense and I don’t know how anyone could be super happy with any aspect of this team tonight!
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